Pro Sports Players Unions and the Left

[Lee Van Cleef]

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/11_06/b4214058410168.htm

The NFL Players Union's contract with the owners expires March 3. The owners are currently aiming to take back some of the money they lost from agreeing to raise the salary cap in 2006.

Should the left support professional athletes in labor disputes?

Part of me says yes, because speaking in material terms, players only get paid so much because the demand is there for their services. Therefore, the players should strive to receive the highest salary that they can in exchange for their highly-valued skills; even if that value is inflated by the market. On the other hand, of course, that's just ridiculous in the face of the overwhelming struggles of deprived, exploited workers around the world.

Your thoughts? Does this really even matter, or is the question purely academic?

[FreeFocus]

It's an irrelevant issue to me. I don't believe that the rich are working class. Some athletes - for example, MMA fighters - who aren't paid a lot and often have to cover their own medical expenses, training costs, etc, might have a case, but they're still trying to make it big and once that happens, they won't care an iota about others' struggles.

Highly paid NBA and NFL athletes are making more money than I would make in 100 lifetimes. To argue that we have the same class interests is asinine.

[Permanent Revolutionary]

I have to agree. Football players (American and European) are wage laborers, but the top ones aren't part of the working class, cause they're payed obscene amounts of money.
MMA fighters and pro wrestlers are the ones we should support for example. They're not payed as much, and have no union or medical benefits.

[erupt]

Should the left support professional athletes in labor disputes?

Your thoughts? Does this really even matter, or is the question purely academic?
I'm gonna have to say no support over a certain income bracket. American baseball, football, basketball, soccer, tennis, and golf all pay great. The "job" is not beneficial to society, either, so I have a few issues there.
It does matter, because of all the money wasn't spent on sports, it could go to use locally.

[redasheville]

Hey guys, NFL owners are notoriously greedy, and the vast majority of pro-atheletes have a very short career and don't ever get rich. Remember class isn't determined by how much money you make? What is the income bracket at which you stop sympathizing with someone in a labor dispute?

Also, if there is a lock out, thousands of concession workers will also be out of work, many of whom are unionized through UNITE HERE.

Which side are you on?

[KC]

Hey guys, NFL owners are notoriously greedy, and the vast majority of pro-atheletes have a very short career and don't ever get rich. Remember class isn't determined by how much money you make? What is the income bracket at which you stop sympathizing with someone in a labor dispute?

Just because there is a labor dispute doesn't mean we should bow down to it. What about cop unions?

[gorillafuck]

Things like the NHL strike some years hurt the normal workers for the team/league who clean shit up and do tasks and don't make much money. I don't support it.

[What Would Durruti Do?]

Things like the NHL strike some years hurt the normal workers for the team/league who clean shit up and do tasks and don't make much money. I don't support it.

It wasn't a strike, it was a lockout. The owners locked out the players because they were losing too much money on salaries. The lockout ended when the players agreed to a salary cap.

Anyway, I support it. Only the star players make tons of money. Think about the guy that sits on the bench and barely gets paid at all and loses his job the next season. The average football career is only like 2 or 3 years I believe and lots of football players end up running out of money later in life and living very low class lifestyles, same for any sport I'm sure.

[Queercommie Girl]

What do you get if you put one communist in a room? A party.


What do you get if you put two communists in a room? Three splinter groups.

That's quite funny...:lol:

[Princess Luna]

In America pro-Football, Basketball, and Baseball players get payed millions of dollars of year and are treated like living gods by the media , so they don't need a fucking union.

Just because there is a labor dispute doesn't mean we should bow down to it. What about cop unions?
To be fair your average street cop does not make that much money , has a very risky job , and not all of them are racist power hungry assholes, some of them do it because they actually want to help society, so i think we should support a cop union. Also supporting a cop union could get them on our side.

[Sensible Socialist]

Anyone who has not read Dave Zirin should do so now. He is a socialist sportswriter and gives great insights on these issues.

It's easy to look at professional sports players and scoff at their wealth. For good reasons, it can be argued, we should. But their income is not the point. In the battle between players and owners, the owners are so, so, so much worse than the players. Most are billionares (if the team isn't owned by a massive corporation) who use their wealth to fund aggressive right-wingers in both politics and in the social sphere. While players are millionares, these men make them look like the poorest of the poor. Many will argue that it should not be a choice of the lesser of two evils, but my further reasons will show why we must choose a side.

As it is, professional sports have completely turned against the average consumers. Decades ago, almost anyone could attend a sports game and see players who made the same salaries they did take the field and compete. Now, however, only a small segment is economically privileged enough to attend a game. This is something we must fight. Teams are owned by horrible billionares (Dick Devos, Donald Sterling) whose actions have ramifications far outside the stadium. Fighting against them is a way to make progress on a variety of fronts.

Lastly, we must have the end-goal in mind. As Dave Zirin has argued, sports teams should be publically owned. As we pay for the stadiums that owners use to enhance their own wealth, we should have control over them. No leftists can deny that the public ownership of sports franchises can do much more good for communities. If you want an example, look to the Green Bay Packers. Owned by community members, with many of the funds going to local charities and community projects. With the public having control over the billions of profits generated by sports teams, many worthwhile differences can be made.

In the end, I would guess it is much harder for a non-sports fan to see the value in associating with what they would call "overpaid men who play with balls." I understand that line of thinking, but the battle must be viewed in a wider lense. This is a fight that allows us to challenge the hegemony of billionares over many aspects. Fight owners in the sports arena, and you can challenge the evangelical Christian wing (Dick Devos), you can challenge slum lords (Donald Sterling), you can challenge racism (Dan Snyder and the Redskins), and many other issues that the sports owners have a hand in.

And, for a moment, consider that many sports stars do not come from backgrounds of affluence. Many are foreign-born into poverty. While they do make millions of dollars, for many it was the only escape. It's not right to completely demean someone for making that life decision. If we align with sports players, we can voice our views to a large segment of the population that has not heard them, or is wary of them. tha

[Sensible Socialist]

Anyway, I support it. Only the star players make tons of money. Think about the guy that sits on the bench and barely gets paid at all and loses his job the next season. The average football career is only like 2 or 3 years I believe and lots of football players end up running out of money later in life and living very low class lifestyles, same for any sport I'm sure.
This is a great point. NFL stars, in particular, have rising suicide rates and prescription drug abuses. Many former MLB stars, who used steroids at the urging of owners, are in very poor health. Owners, who create a false atmosphere of intense competition and "do or die" attitutes, are to blame.

[RedHal]

yeah yeah we all know the owner's are scum. but lol at caring about millionaire athletes. When you make that much money, you really don't have the same interests as the working class. Get your head out of theory for a while and come back to reality.

As for millionaire athletes who go broke after their playing careers, I have absolutely no sympathy for them. If they didn't live such a disgustingly lavish lifestyle, they could have lived comfortably for the rest of their lives. Being from poor inner city backgrounds is no excuse.

[NoOneIsIllegal]

The Industrial Worker had recent issues debating whether or not Pro-Athletes (specifically the NFL) are workers or not. I think you can read past articles on .PDF format on www.iww.org (http://www.iww.org) I recommend reading both viewpoints.

I think both sides have good points, but I think I side with the "Athletes are workers" side, no matter how much wealth they make (or don't make). The NFL is just one of many Football leagues. As much as people think of (American) Football as either college or NFL, there are more than that. There are plenty of minor leagues and different associations where players play the game for a very low wage compared to NFL players. These players perform entertainment that is back-breaking and the career is often 2-5 years; However, during these very short few years, these people gain lifelong injuries, resulting in very expensive medical bills.

However, the other side has very good arguments (the NFL union isn't really a workers union, they make a lot of money, etc.)
I think the issue shouldn't be so general and encompassing; I think unions should discussed and applied to certain leagues, not the sport in general.

[gestalt]

Glad someone else mentioned Dave Zirin.

This is an issue where there are rational arguments on both sides.

On one hand professional athletes (at least the minority in the major sporting leagues) exist in an income bracket far removed from the average worker in the developed world, much less the exploited workers elsewhere, and their unions generally amount to a labor aristocracy. Unless they have the general acumen of Lenny Dykstra, they then invest those earnings in a variety of ways and become a member of the parasitic class.

However, a sizeable portion of professional athletes play for league minimum pay (still in the six figures and in the top 10% of wage earners), but class is a relationship to the means of production not the arbitrary and ever-changing bourgeois definition by income. The value their activities produce is much greater than their salaries. Additionally, their labor produces a measure of social wealth, employment for the community, tax revenue for beneficial government programs, etc.

If nothing else, the most relevant argument to support the players is that a lockout would have devastating effects on team, stadium, tourism, hospitality, etc. workers in every NFL urban center.

[redasheville]

Just because there is a labor dispute doesn't mean we should bow down to it. What about cop unions?

Are you serious? If you are, let me know when football players become armed thugs of the state and then you might have a valid point.

[Sensible Socialist]

yeah yeah we all know the owner's are scum. but lol at caring about millionaire athletes. When you make that much money, you really don't have the same interests as the working class. Get your head out of theory for a while and come back to reality.
When many players have been born into extreme poverty and have overcome discrimination of all forms, they certainly know what it is like.


As for millionaire athletes who go broke after their playing careers, I have absolutely no sympathy for them. If they didn't live such a disgustingly lavish lifestyle, they could have lived comfortably for the rest of their lives. Being from poor inner city backgrounds is no excuse.
Players only began to make "mega-bucks" in recent times. And even if you view them with disdain, why not fight for public control of sports franchises to end the cycle of rising salaries? I don't see how scoffing at them changes a damn thing.

[Bardo]

We, the players of the NFL demand higher wages and better working conditions! Gold and platinum does not meet our needs. We demand diamonds! Millionaire athletes of the world unit!

[Meridian]

It's an irrelevant issue to me. I don't believe that the rich are working class. Some athletes - for example, MMA fighters - who aren't paid a lot and often have to cover their own medical expenses, training costs, etc, might have a case, but they're still trying to make it big and once that happens, they won't care an iota about others' struggles.
Not to mention the less mainstream professional gaming industry, where there is a rapidly growing audience and market but still generally very unhealthy/bad conditions for players. A bit off topic though, sorry.

[southernmissfan]

The injuries and lifestyle of professional athletes usually leads to significantly lower lifespan, with additional risk of addiction to painkillers. Not to mention, their career productivity is limited to only a few years, after which most have no marketable skills or are unable to hold a job due to injuries or health problems.

I understand the most visible players are multi-millionaires and live lavish lifestyles, but the issue isn't as clear cut and simple.

And I also recommend Dave Zirin.

[What Would Durruti Do?]

I don't understand why so many people think football players deserve to be exploited by McDonald's or Wal-Mart or wherever they work once their playing career is over just because they were paid to entertain people for a couple years. How does that make any sense?

Professional sports unions have done a lot of good things, such as forcing all current players to donate parts of their salaries to retired players so they can actually feed their families. I think in some cases they even require the owners themselves to finance retirement funds for their former players.

Yes, a small minority of professional sports players are rich and make enough money to stay rich their entire lives, but as someone who is friends with multiple professional athletes you must be completely retarded to think they all have such good situations.

[erupt]

I'm surprised at the amount of defense for the athletes. After they retire, many of them manage to slip into the media somehow; they're either sportscasters, sports writing columnists, sometimes actors/actresses.
Rather than rambling on about it, I'll sum my point up; whatever the person went to school for while playing pro-Ball should be something for some to fall back on. For those picked straight from high school, if they somehow get it bad economically or physically, it should be up to the NFL, or whatever sports association, to help them out. I will admit, compared to the players' salaries, the whole monopoly of sports and the guys in the suits, as usual, make much, much more dough.
For the average, "unknown" players," the NFL should take care of them in case of any economic situations, or physical ones.
Of course, they won't, because it'll cost 'em money.

[redasheville]

yeah yeah we all know the owner's are scum. but lol at caring about millionaire athletes. When you make that much money, you really don't have the same interests as the working class. Get your head out of theory for a while and come back to reality.

As for millionaire athletes who go broke after their playing careers, I have absolutely no sympathy for them. If they didn't live such a disgustingly lavish lifestyle, they could have lived comfortably for the rest of their lives. Being from poor inner city backgrounds is no excuse.

I'd like to know what this poster means by "poor inner city backgrounds". In post civil rights era media discourse that is code for black.

[Jimmie Higgins]

I think the shit will really hit the fan the next time there is a labor dispute in pro-sports. After the Superbowl, the local news here had a story about how the unions were going to cause the Superbowl not to happen next year, they literally said something like: "a union dispute will take away this American tradition".

The ruling class always goes for the easiest targets first and attacking the unions of athletes or Hollywood writers is an easy way to divide and conquer because some of those people are very well paid compared to us (compared to the people who employ them, they do not make that much). Ironically the bosses will use misdirected class-anger to make low-paid workers hate high-paid workers rather than their common enemy.

How people see athletes and Hollywood and their respective unions seeps into how people see unions in general. If the right is allowed to get away with blaming sports players and their unions for fans being gouged (and city budgets for that matter) then it is a short jump of logic to go from arguing against "high-payed" athletes to "high-paid" entitlement-rich public sector workers.

[Metacomet]

I'm gonna have to say no support over a certain income bracket. American baseball, football, basketball, soccer, tennis, and golf all pay great. The "job" is not beneficial to society, either, so I have a few issues there.
It does matter, because of all the money wasn't spent on sports, it could go to use locally.


Playing soccer in the states doesn't pay great overall, just saying............they had a labor dispute last year and gave into the league.

[Tablo]

Professional athletes are workers too. Just because they often make a lot of money doesn't change that fact. I'm not going to waste my time on helping with pro-athlete salary disputes though.

[ChrisK]

Well, in 2007 the median NFL salary was around $740,000, which over an average of a four year career is not that much. The idea that NFL stars are all millionaires comes from a media myth that they make all the money and the owners make very little. Athletes very much deserve our support.

The worst example is MMA. While top fighters can make around a million per fight, the majority make shit money (some are as low as a few hundred dollars in very low ranking organizations), and get no medical benefits. They need to unionize for both health and monetary means.

An interesting side note is that a couple of years ago I was listening to Eddie Goldman's MMA radio program when he and Frank Shamrock discussed why unionizing would be so important. Goldman and Shamrock spent the beginning of the program talking excitedly about the Chicago factory take-over. They support us, we ought to do the same for them.

[ChrisK]

Also, read a People's History of Sports by David Zirin.

[KurtFF8]

Well, in 2007 the median NFL salary was around $740,000, which over an average of a four year career is not that much. The idea that NFL stars are all millionaires comes from a media myth that they make all the money and the owners make very little. Athletes very much deserve our support.

The worst example is MMA. While top fighters can make around a million per fight, the majority make shit money (some are as low as a few hundred dollars in very low ranking organizations), and get no medical benefits. They need to unionize for both health and monetary means.

An interesting side note is that a couple of years ago I was listening to Eddie Goldman's MMA radio program when he and Frank Shamrock discussed why unionizing would be so important. Goldman and Shamrock spent the beginning of the program talking excitedly about the Chicago factory take-over. They support us, we ought to do the same for them.

Thanks. I was wondering about this, I have heard that the majority of NFL players aren't millionaires and that this is a myth.

[NoOneIsIllegal]

The worst example is MMA. While top fighters can make around a million per fight, the majority make shit money (some are as low as a few hundred dollars in very low ranking organizations), and get no medical benefits. They need to unionize for both health and monetary means.
Jeff Monson, MMA and anarchist, has a good interview on youtube where he touches on this subject. A lot of athletes take life-sustaining injuries for shit pay; Even when some make decent money, it's for a small amount of time, whereas the pain and outrageous medical bills will last the rest of their lives...

In recent years, a lot of minor leagues and associations have been propping up. These leagues don't hand out million dollar contracts, not even hundred-thousand dollar contracts. They're breaking their backs for pay they can make working at an office! That's messed up.