Who is Castro, really?

[SaddestYear1981]

Hello, all. I truly believe that communism is the ideal form of government, and feel strongly about righting wrongs oneself, through revolution if necessary. I would like to find out more about Fidel Castro (both sides of the argument), because I am under informed. My grandfather tells of a woman who was tortured by people under him, who was permanently mentally ill. I know little more than that, although Cuba definitley does not seem to be a communist country to me.

[CubanFox]

Fidel and Che Guevara went on an execution binge after they took over. Was this woman a chivato (informant for the Batista regime) or did she otherwise work for Batista?

[bluerev002]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2003, 12:53 PM
Cuba definitley does not seem to be a communist country to me.
Why so?

[Eastside Revolt]

LL

[Eastside Revolt]

for some reason I cant post a link.

[Deniz Gezmis]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2003, 08:53 PM
Cuba definitley does not seem to be a communist country to me.
Cuba is Socialist. Not Communist.

[Fidelbrand]

Originally posted by Death+Sep 3 2003, 03:06 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Death @ Sep 3 2003, 03:06 AM)
[email protected] 2 2003, 08:53 PM
Cuba definitley does not seem to be a communist country to me.
Cuba is Socialist. Not Communist. [/b]
Yup.
Fidel always aspire his country to run on a socialist scale.

[RebeldePorLaPAZ]

I know communism and socialism are similar but what makes them diffrent??? It&#39;s been bugging me for a while. I like socialism better but I never really could defend that because I dont know the defrence. Can somebody tell me the main diffrences so I can back myself up :P im such an idiot, lol

[commieboy]

in sixth grade social studies i was tought this, "Capitalism is when anyone can own their own business or service. Socialism is when the citizens and the government both own businesses. Communism is when the government owns all businesses." that&#39;s all they tell us and we give examples of countries who have capitalism and socialism and communism...America was cappie, Italy was Socialist, and the USSR and Cuba* were communist.

*And the teacher made it very clear that Cuba was commie. This was before i was into all of this stuff, so i didn&#39;t take much notice. :cuba: :castro: :che: :hammer: :marx:

[Comrade Ceausescu]

cuba is communist.period.

[Sovietski Soyuz]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2003, 10:33 PM
I know communism and socialism are similar but what makes them diffrent??? It&#39;s been bugging me for a while. I like socialism better but I never really could defend that because I dont know the defrence. Can somebody tell me the main diffrences so I can back myself up :P im such an idiot, lol
Don&#39;t confuse "Democratic Socialism" with Marxian Socialism.

I believe commieboy is talking about Democratic Socialism. Marxian Socialism is the transition phase between Capitalism and Communism. Cuba is obviously not yet a classless, stateless society, therefore they are socialist. It is common for the West to call socialist states "communist."

[Fidelbrand]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2003, 12:35 AM
cuba is communist.period.
still? :o

Castro declared at the Environmental talk in Rio De Jinero 1992 that "The threats of communism is over , and more resources should be used for environmental protection , rather than financing arms~"

[FistFullOfSteel]

hes a good man...helping the poor

[RebeldePorLaPAZ]

yea i thought that socialism was more loose when it came to owning busnesses. but thanks, now im sure

[YKTMX]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2003, 12:35 AM
cuba is communist.period.
Cuba is classless? Well, fuck me sideways.

[chamo]

I believe commieboy is talking about Democratic Socialism. Marxian Socialism is the transition phase between Capitalism and Communism. Cuba is obviously not yet a classless, stateless society, therefore they are socialist. It is common for the West to call socialist states "communist."

Cuba could never be described as evolving along a Marxian path as it was never fully industrialised before the revolution, as never was any other Socialist/"Communist" country.

[synthesis]

This is all such fucking nonsense. I would suggest all of you to go to marxists.org and read up on the subjects in question (as well as &#39;historical materialism&#39;).


"Capitalism is when anyone can own their own business or service. Socialism is when the citizens and the government both own businesses. Communism is when the government owns all businesses." that&#39;s all they tell us and we give examples of countries who have capitalism and socialism and communism...America was cappie, Italy was Socialist, and the USSR and Cuba* were communist. Your post didn&#39;t tell us whether or not you still believe this horse-shit.

For everyone&#39;s information...

Capitalism is when the means of production (essentially, the means of producing wealth) are in private hands. The means of production are anything from mines and harbors to assembly lines and computer networks. Capitalism in Marxist theory also generally entails &#39;industrialization.&#39;

The class that owns these means of production is called the &#39;bourgeoisie.&#39; Pronounced: boo-jwa-zee

The class that operates these means of production (i.e. employed by the bourgeoisie) is called the &#39;proletariat.&#39; Pronounced as it looks.

More commonly, the bourgeoisie is called the &#39;capitalist class&#39;, the &#39;industralist class&#39;, or the &#39;plutocracy.&#39; The proletariat is referred to as the &#39;working class.&#39;

Marx postulated that as technology grew in efficiency, the bourgeoisie would need to employ fewer workers. Eventually, unemployment would spiral out of control and the proletariat would revolt. As a class, the proletariat would take control of their society and have democratic control of the means of production. This is &#39;socialism.&#39; Also called the &#39;Dictatorship of the Proletariat.&#39; During socialism, the proletariat uses all means necessary to suppress the bourgeoisie and its sympathizers.

Eventually, as resistance to socialism fades and eventually disappears, the state withers away as it is no longer necessary and man reverts to classless society. This stateless, classless society is called &#39;communism&#39;

Seen?

Now, we reach Leninism. Leninism is the theory that the proletariat will never revolt by itself and thus needs an elite vanguard to fight its revolution. All twentieth-century nations calling themselves socialist were Leninist, including Cuba.

The problem with Leninism, aside from its obvious consequence of totalitarianism, is that it only ever works in societies that are less than fully industrialized, which Marx postulated was the only state of society that could ever truly produce socialism. Third World nations like Cuba, Russia, and China were susceptible to Leninist revolt because the capitalist state was not strong enough to maintain a sufficient military.

Since the nations in question had never truly reached Marx&#39;s ideal breeding grounds for socialism, they inevitably fall back into a form of capitalism more advanced than the one that had preceded the revolution. This was the case with Russia and China and will undoubtedly, although I wish it were not so, be the case with Cuba.

Socialist revolt is only truly socialist when undertaken by the entire class rather than an elite vanguard.

Seen?

Y&#39;all are welcome to PM me with questions.

[Droes lee]

aah and can you say me wath the defenition is of faschism ? i&#39;m struggeling with that defenition

[synthesis]

Fascism as it is used today essentially means totalitarian, or an all-powerful State. This usage is far too generic and ahistorical when applied to people like Hitler and Stalin, who were certainly not fascists by the way Mussolini put it.

Essentially, Mussolini envisioned a return to the glorious days of the ancient Roman Empire for his weakened Italy. That is where the word Fascist comes from, the Romans used a &#39;fasces&#39; (an axe bundled with sticks) to symbolize power, I believe.

Neither Hitler nor Stalin were really Fascist, for although they did share certain attributes of Fascism - totalitarianism and war-glorification tend to be the two most often cited - they did not the economic system of Fascism, which was corporatism. As Mussolini put it, Fascism is a mixture of state and corporate power, much like America today.

The pejorative Fascist actually applies a great deal to W. Bush, much more so than to Hitler or Stalin.

Mussolini was actually not very racist and certainly not anti-Semitic. I will admit to having trouble seeing his reign as actually &#39;evil&#39;; &#39;inept&#39; is more the word. He failed miserably at both imperialist ventures into Africa and restoring the Italian economy. He was even, for the most part, a failed totalitarian.

Hope that clarified matters for you.

[Marxist in Nebraska]

interesting definition...

[Droes lee]

thanx for the explenation i knew what it was but i couldent define it...

[synthesis]

Originally posted by Marxist in [email protected] 12 2003, 07:57 PM
interesting definition...
Do you disagree with something?

[Alejandro C]

Fidel Castro is to say the least a very interesting man.

some personal things about him- been married a couple of times, has lots of kids. he was born to a semi-wealthy family in cuba. went to the best schools in cuba (jesuit schools actually ha HA&#33;) and became a lawyer at Habana university where he also became a radical. with a bunch of other radical students he organized the storming of the Moncado barracks on july 26 of &#39;53. this was a complete faliure and he was arrested. he somehow managed to get only extradited instead of executed, which was a damn amazing feat considering the very brutal nature of the man in charge- batista. he is exiled to mexico where he starts organizing an invasion. here he meets che. a group of 60(?) some guerillas leave mexico in 56 aboard a small boat-granma. they are met on the beach by batista troups and only 12 members survive. these 12 including fidel, camillo cienfuegos, raul castro, and che go on to organize local resistance in east cuba. they eventually take control of the government newyears day of 59. after that the major events all center around the US. the embargo starts in oct. of 60 after fidel nationalizes american businesses. bay of pigs is 61(?) and cuban missile crisis is 63. Fidel tries to export the revolution to many latin american countries and some african countries. all of these fail due mostly to a US paranoia over &#39;another cuba&#39; in the early 90&#39;s cuba suffers heavily after the collapse of the soveit union. this was called the &#39;special period&#39; and fidel called all cubans to make heavy sacrifices. a common joke at the time was
fidel comes on the radio and says there is good news and bad news. the good news is that we all have to eat rocks now, the bad news is that there is a shortage of rocks. &#39; that pretty much sums up cuban life. the government provides food and jobs but the jobs don&#39;t pay enough and the food is not enough. major improvements were made quickly in the revolution, however, and from the 70&#39;s on cuba became an anomoly in latin america with a literacy rate that is now at 98, as well as life expectancy rates and infant mortality rates that match the US - which is unheard of in Latin america.

to those of you who are a little confused about the ism that is cuba i can assure of this
it is fidelist
what he says goes. and also its hard to classify because raul instituted a policy in 94 (?) that allowed a dollar market to exist and allowed special dollar stores to open up that would only take american dollars. this has created a dual economy- the cuban peso and the american dollar competing. which in my mind is a dissaster. tourism grew even more rampant because everyone could now spend the dollar and would do anything for it.


the saddest victim of the revolution comes from this- the rampant prostitution that now exists in Habana. All of Fidel&#39;s gains are nothing compared to this tragedy. Fidel has tried to curb it, but considering the supreme power he has, there is alot more he could do.


anyway, from shit i&#39;ve been hearing it seems that if a democrat is elected next year the embargo might be lifted which would be a tremendous victory for the cuban people.

Embargos always hurt the people not the governments. How stupid of my government to think that this embargo is hurting fidel who has been in power for almost 50 years. we are responsible for the missery of the cuban people. fidel also must share some of this responsibility, but i feel it is on our heads. its sinister.

also fidel is a hell of a speaker. he thinks nothing of making 7 hour speeches every week. i understand that he speaks an average of 5 hours every day, not just conversations but actual speeches to foreigners, or tourists, or his people. he is an amazing man with an amazing will.

[FistFullOfSteel]

okay thx for the info

[Fidelbrand]

Fidel is simpy a great man ... long speeches~~~~~~ ;)

[FistFullOfSteel]

and usa cant get him :P

[Fidelbrand]

Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2003, 05:23 PM
and usa cant get him :P
in her (U.S.) big wet dreams~~ :D