Die Neue Zeit
16th January 2011, 06:15
http://www.frontline.in/stories/20110128280212600.htm
I'll skip to parts near the end, because I find the three-capitals thesis interesting:
In your book, you make the distinction between orthodox Marxism's analysis of what is happening to the global capitalist economy and the world systems approach, while indicating that both are important. Can you elaborate on where you see the difference between the two?
This has been developed further in my next book From Empires to Imperialism. Capitalism can be defined in two ways, either it is a mode of production or it is a system. For example, if it is a mode of production then the key aspect of it is the possibility of exploiting wage labour. If it is a system where the key element is accumulation (and, by the way, Karl Marx gives enough material for both definitions), you can accumulate through exploiting non-wage labour, slave/serf labour.
It was a very important correction that was made by Michael Pokrovsky, a great Russian historian, that there are two types of capital as well: production/industrial capital and trade capital. Trade capital has a model of accumulation that does not necessarily need much of wage labour, while industrial capital can only exploit wage labour, otherwise it is not capital. In that sense, the real division is within capitalism, because there are two types of capital.
Today they are interconnected; we do not have corporations that are purely trade corporations and purely production corporations, there are both. But still, even within these corporations, one or the other function is dominant. In that sense, neoliberalism is exactly the domination of the trade function of capital. And my point of view is that this contradiction just reflects the reality. It is not the contradiction within Marxist analysis; it is the contradiction within the reality of capitalism that Marxist analysis reflects. The only point is that we have to make it conscious. So we have to say there is a contradiction within these two aspects.
Where would you see the role of global finance capital in this?
The aspect that was absent in Pokrovsky's analysis, which I tried to fix and recently came to the conclusion which I am still working on, is that finance capital makes alliances with one or another type of capital, thus making this particular kind of capital dominant. So, at one point, when trade capital is dominant and doing well then financial capital goes into the trade capital, disinvesting the production very often.
But then, once this model goes into crisis, the financial capital that is the most flexible element moves back into alliance with production/industrial capital, and thus fluctuates. In that sense, financial capital can become hegemonic; it controls and shifts the alliances.
My understanding of the current crisis is that at some point the alliance between the trade function of capital and financial capital will be somehow weakened. And financial capital will move back to supporting more productive forms of capital, which will also mean a return to some kind of neo-Keynesian approach. However, the point is whether it will work out. When you move from one form of capitalism to another, opportunities open up for an attempt to go beyond capitalism; it is not just about transforming the world but to propose and successfully practise some non-capitalist or post-capitalist solutions.
They appear repeatedly during specific moments of crisis when the balance of forces within capitalism fades, such as the Russian Revolution, the situation after the Second World War, and later specifically in Latin America when the revolution happened in Venezuela. It was possible because the crisis started in Latin America before it started elsewhere. Latin America, however, was left alone because the United States was busy dealing with the geopolitics of the Middle East [West Asia]. So, these are specific moments where the balance of forces shift and alternatives are needed anyhow. The model currently running is unsustainable and needs change. There is always an opportunity that during this change you can go beyond capitalism.
In the language of Capital, Kagarlitsky mentions M-M' (finance capital), C-M-C' and M-C-M' (trade capital), and M-C...P...-C-M' (industrial capital).
I'll skip to parts near the end, because I find the three-capitals thesis interesting:
In your book, you make the distinction between orthodox Marxism's analysis of what is happening to the global capitalist economy and the world systems approach, while indicating that both are important. Can you elaborate on where you see the difference between the two?
This has been developed further in my next book From Empires to Imperialism. Capitalism can be defined in two ways, either it is a mode of production or it is a system. For example, if it is a mode of production then the key aspect of it is the possibility of exploiting wage labour. If it is a system where the key element is accumulation (and, by the way, Karl Marx gives enough material for both definitions), you can accumulate through exploiting non-wage labour, slave/serf labour.
It was a very important correction that was made by Michael Pokrovsky, a great Russian historian, that there are two types of capital as well: production/industrial capital and trade capital. Trade capital has a model of accumulation that does not necessarily need much of wage labour, while industrial capital can only exploit wage labour, otherwise it is not capital. In that sense, the real division is within capitalism, because there are two types of capital.
Today they are interconnected; we do not have corporations that are purely trade corporations and purely production corporations, there are both. But still, even within these corporations, one or the other function is dominant. In that sense, neoliberalism is exactly the domination of the trade function of capital. And my point of view is that this contradiction just reflects the reality. It is not the contradiction within Marxist analysis; it is the contradiction within the reality of capitalism that Marxist analysis reflects. The only point is that we have to make it conscious. So we have to say there is a contradiction within these two aspects.
Where would you see the role of global finance capital in this?
The aspect that was absent in Pokrovsky's analysis, which I tried to fix and recently came to the conclusion which I am still working on, is that finance capital makes alliances with one or another type of capital, thus making this particular kind of capital dominant. So, at one point, when trade capital is dominant and doing well then financial capital goes into the trade capital, disinvesting the production very often.
But then, once this model goes into crisis, the financial capital that is the most flexible element moves back into alliance with production/industrial capital, and thus fluctuates. In that sense, financial capital can become hegemonic; it controls and shifts the alliances.
My understanding of the current crisis is that at some point the alliance between the trade function of capital and financial capital will be somehow weakened. And financial capital will move back to supporting more productive forms of capital, which will also mean a return to some kind of neo-Keynesian approach. However, the point is whether it will work out. When you move from one form of capitalism to another, opportunities open up for an attempt to go beyond capitalism; it is not just about transforming the world but to propose and successfully practise some non-capitalist or post-capitalist solutions.
They appear repeatedly during specific moments of crisis when the balance of forces within capitalism fades, such as the Russian Revolution, the situation after the Second World War, and later specifically in Latin America when the revolution happened in Venezuela. It was possible because the crisis started in Latin America before it started elsewhere. Latin America, however, was left alone because the United States was busy dealing with the geopolitics of the Middle East [West Asia]. So, these are specific moments where the balance of forces shift and alternatives are needed anyhow. The model currently running is unsustainable and needs change. There is always an opportunity that during this change you can go beyond capitalism.
In the language of Capital, Kagarlitsky mentions M-M' (finance capital), C-M-C' and M-C-M' (trade capital), and M-C...P...-C-M' (industrial capital).