Palestinian plight in northern Lebanon refugee camps!

[ComradeMan]

Palestinian plight in northern Lebanon refugee camps

It is sometimes controversially said that Palestinian refugees in Lebanon live in worse conditions than those during the Israeli occupation in Gaza.
There is no better place to witness and document the plight of Lebanon's refugees than Nahr al-Bared...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12138075


...


Devil and deep blue sea?

[Che a chara]

Disgusting that these Palestinians are refused the right to return to their homeland. International law and human rights once again shat on.

[ComradeMan]

It's sad that people often forget how shit the Palestinian's treatment in some other countries is too. The same countries that then blurt out all this rhetoric against Israel. There's a lot of hypocrisy.

[ComradeMan]

well its a good reason to promote their right of return.
do you agree ?

I've never argued for anything other than a single-state solution with equal rights of self-determination for all citizen groups.

[Palingenisis]

well its a good reason to promote their right of return.
do you agree ?

I do.

Stolen land must be returned. Basic ethics....Do comrademan and KrimKrams agree?

[ComradeMan]

I do.

Stolen land must be returned. Basic ethics....Do comrademan and KrimKrams agree?

Do you agree too then that the Middle-Eastern Jews who were rounded up, murdered and driven to Israel from Islamic and/or Arabic nations such as Iraq would also have a right to return or compensation from the said nations?

[Palingenisis]

you didnt answer the question about palestinian ror.

I have ComradeMan on ignore.

But two wrongs make a right...Not!

Ive been to Israel...Its a frightening society...And the idea that its an oasis of sanity among evil, mad Muslims is both a lie and incredibly racist.

[ComradeMan]

you didnt answer the question about palestinian ror.

I did- and I've answered before- look up the single state solution in the meantime.

Now, what about my question?

[#FF0000]

It's sad that people often forget how shit the Palestinian's treatment in some other countries is too. The same countries that then blurt out all this rhetoric against Israel. There's a lot of hypocrisy.

Er, I don't think anyone hating on Israel's also going on about how great Egypt is about Palestinians. In fact everyone I've known to be critical of Israel has also been extremely critical of Egypt for how they treat the refugees.

[ComradeMan]

What's "interesting" about this thread is that the plight of the Palestinians outside of Israel is used as a critique of Israel. Whether Israel were or were not the worst regime in history it would still be no justification for the abuse of human rights and blatant discrimination against Palestinian refugees in other countries, especially in some, supposedly, "pro-Palestinian" cause nations. Asylum seekers/refugees suffer a lot and the host countries in Europe for example are often criticised, Italy being no exception, with often little mention of the country left behind.

Freepalestine's comment, that this is more reason to support the right of return for the Palestinians to Israel-Palestine completely ignores the issue at hand in this very moment of their treatment in other nations. Just for once perhaps these other nations should be under the microscope for their role, both present and historical, in the issue.

Sorry Best Mod, but I have to disagree with you on your point. In the real world I have noticed that a lot of people are completely oblivious to the rough deal that the Palestinians have in other nations, in which a whole generation has been born- yet often have few or little rights... based on their ethnicity.

Disappointing responses I must say.

[Robert]

In the real world I have noticed that a lot of people are completely oblivious to the rough deal that the Palestinians have in other nations, in which a whole generation has been born- yet often have few or little rights... based on their ethnicity.

Count me in ... I never read or heard a news story about the plight of Palestinians in Egypt. I'm not proud of that, but it's a fact.:(

[ComradeMan]

Count me in ... I never read or heard a news story about the plight of Palestinians in Egypt. I'm not proud of that, but it's a fact.:(

They are treated like shit and denied the full rights of citizenship- as refugees. Arab-Israelis also have the problem that they cannot travel to or from or work in those countries because they are "Israelis". If a Muslim Arab-Israeli wanted to go to Mecca on pilgrimage the only way is through Jordan and not using passports.

[freepalestine]

Freepalestine's comment, that this is more reason to support the right of return for the Palestinians to Israel-Palestine completely ignores the issue at hand in this very moment of their treatment in other nations. Just for once perhaps these other nations should be under the microscope for their role, both present and historical, in the issue.

Sorry Best Mod, but I have to disagree with you on your point. In the real world I have noticed that a lot of people are completely oblivious to the rough deal that the Palestinians have in other nations, in which a whole generation has been born- yet often have few or little rights... based on their ethnicity.

.lol.why a pro-zionist would support the rights of palestinian refugees in lebanon is ironic,what about the palestinians in palestine?you should acknowledge why palestinians are refugees in the first place -
if you think palestinian groups ' are doing nothing'about palestinian refugees in jordan or lebanon etc,then youre wrong.
the right of return is the only way to solve the refugee situation

[#FF0000]

Sorry Best Mod, but I have to disagree with you on your point. In the real world I have noticed that a lot of people are completely oblivious to the rough deal that the Palestinians have in other nations, in which a whole generation has been born- yet often have few or little rights... based on their ethnicity.

People might be ignorant and oblivious of it but that doesn't make them hypocrites for not knowing while being critical of Israel. If they sat there and said "man egypt and lebanon treat Palestinians so well" then they'd be hypocrites.

[ComradeMan]

People might be ignorant and oblivious of it but that doesn't make them hypocrites for not knowing while being critical of Israel. If they sat there and said "man egypt and lebanon treat Palestinians so well" then they'd be hypocrites.

Of course it does. First and foremost is the plight of the Palestinian people and seeing as about 5 million are exiled, a substantial number, anyone with the genuine interests of the Palestinian people at heart ought to be informed of the situation of 5 million of them.

You can't separate these issues I'm afraid.

[ComradeMan]

lol.why a pro-zionist would support the rights of palestinian refugees in lebanon is ironic,what about the palestinians in palestine?you should acknowledge why they are refugees in the first -
if you think palestinian groups are doing nothing about palestinian refugees in jordan or lebanon then youre wrong.
the right of return is the only way to solve the refugee situation

Pro Zionist?

One state solution with equal rights of self-determination for all.

Does that make me a Zionist? Don't think so...

What are Palestinian groups doing about the abuse of basic human rights and treatment of the refugees in exile?

[Rafiq]

More light should be shed upon the history of the palestinians in Lebanon.

Actually, many villagers in Lebanon worked with the invading IDF in the 1980's to combat the Palestinians in the area.

The same villagers in Lebanon who call "Death to the Jews" were the same ones that were going to the border to get free meals and fruits from Jewish farmers...

Source: Relatives who lived during the civil war.

[freepalestine]

Pro Zionist?

One state solution with equal rights of self-determination for all.

Does that make me a Zionist? Don't think so...

?
answer these questions.

do you support ror of all palestinians?

do you support a nonzionist 'one state' of both settlers and palestinians?

[Rafiq]

answer these questions.

do you support ror of all palestinians?

do you support a nonzionist 'one state' of both settlers and palestinians?


To impose my opinion on this thread, I support an "Einstein-Style" solution to the problem.

One state that is governed equally by both the Palestinians and Israelis, no Jewish state nor an Arab state...

To be unrealistic, I would support a Socialist state in this situation, governed by the Jewish, Arab, and all other workers.

[ComradeMan]

answer these questions.

do you support ror of all palestinians?

do you support a nonzionist 'one state' of both settlers and palestinians?

That is generally known as the one-state solution/single state (sometimes the bi-national state) solution.:rolleyes:

[freepalestine]

More light should be shed upon the history of the palestinians in Lebanon.

Actually, many villagers in Lebanon worked with the invading IDF in the 1980's to combat the Palestinians in the area.

.yeh well thats a different topic altogether,the phalange,guardians of the cedar were fascists armed byand allied to the zionists.(many of the warcriminals of their leadership are in exile inisreal )

as for the south lebanese army SLA they were basically a part of the terrorist isreali army....
but there was also the leftist side of lebanon in the civil war(exclu amal later in the 80s)who sided with palestine

[ComradeMan]

Many Arab/Bedouin serve in the IDF too.

[Palingenisis]

Many Arab/Bedouin serve in the IDF too.

Ive answered this before...During the Irish Tan/War of Independence 20 per cent of the Black and Tans were Irish Roman Catholic...That didnt stop them from being what they were.

Many is an exageration...And those who are are conscripted or forced by poverty to join up....Go to Israel...Please...It will blow for niave racism to pieces and show you who KrimKrams really is.

[Rafiq]

yeh well thats a different topic altogether,the phalange,guardians of the cedar were fascists armed byand allied to the zionists.(many of the warcriminals of their leadership are in exile inisreal )

as for the south lebanese army SLA they were basically a part of the terrorist isreali army....
but there was also the leftist side of lebanon in the civil war(exclu amal later in the 80s)who sided with palestine

All of the theocrats were anti-palestinian (Hezbollah included).

The Fascist Kataeb and rival SSNP were both Anti-Palestinian.

The only ones who weren't politically against the Palestinians were the Communists.

[Rafiq]

Many Arab/Bedouin serve in the IDF too.

That's true.

Although that's widely known, some may call it common knowledge.

The Israeli situation is not merely "Jews vs. Arabs". It's more complex than that.

[Palingenisis]

The Israeli situation is not merely "Jews vs. Arabs". It's more complex than that.

Have you any idea of what life is like Arab (or Hellenic) "Israelies"?

[freepalestine]

All of the theocrats were anti-palestinian (Hezbollah included).

The Fascist Kataeb and rival SSNP were both Anti-Palestinian.

The only ones who weren't politically against the Palestinians were the Communists.sources.

hezbollah have always sided with palestinians-ssnp have always sided with palestinians,at least when the syrians did side with the PLO.

-------------------
as for bedouin and druze arabs who are in the iof.yeh maybe they join for economic reasons the christian arabs and muslim arabs arent conscripted.the only palestinians in isreal who arent drafted into the iof

[Rafiq]

Have you any idea of what life is like Arab (or Hellenic) "Israelies"?

Don't get me started.

I have more connections with Arab Israelis than you ever will.

I know exactly how life is in the Racist elements in the Israeli society.

[Rafiq]

sources.

hezbollah have always sided with palestinians-ssnp have always sided with palestinians,at least when the syrians did side with the PLO.
there was also the nasserites,and other leftist groups-and the druze psp.

also recalling statements by the Isreali allies ,the fascist kataib ,GoC etc"wipe all the palestinians out because they are all communists..."

-------------------
as for arabs and others who are in the iof.yeh maybe because of economic reasons in the case of some bedouins who are are persecuted community under the isreali state-
as for the druze they are mixed up community-although many are against the zionist state-and seeing it for how it treats em.economically they are oppressed,unless cannon fodder.
and they are 3rd class citizens.
ah well i'll'leave it for conrademan to say how unracist and civilised the isreali state is.



Well, my grandfather lived during the Lebanese civil war, and I have met many Arabs who have.

The Hezbollah were against the Palestinians.

The SSNP fascists were always against the palestinians as well.

I don't know your sources, but I recall the ssnp participated in the murdering of many young palestinians, betraying them, discriminating against them, ect.

[freepalestine]

Well, my grandfather lived during the Lebanese civil war, and I have met many Arabs who have.

The Hezbollah were against the Palestinians.

The SSNP fascists were always against the palestinians as well.

I don't know your sources, but I recall the ssnp participated in the murdering of many young palestinians, betraying them, discriminating against them, ect.
ive never heard of hezbollah(who i'm no fan of,politically)being against the palestinians.
and ive not heard of ssnp being against palestinians-also they arent fascists.theyre nationalists although i know many of ssnp who class themselves as leftists-marxists.
remember the lines in the lebanon conflict was mainly around the rightist v "leftist" .

the main ,real fascists are the phalange,plus other rightists ,still the main antipalestinian elements TODAY in lebanon,ironically the pro-isreali elements also.;)

[Rafiq]

ive never heard of hezbollah(who i'm no fan of,politically)being against the palestinians,thats why they differed from AMAL ,the battle of the camps etc.
and ive not heard of ssnp being against palestinians-also they arent fascists.they talk bollocks some of em,with talk of syria,palestine,jordan etc-
although i know many of ssnp who class themselves as leftists-marxists.
remember the lines in the lebanon conflict was mainly around the rightist v "leftist" .

the main ,real fascists are the phalange .and the antipalestinian elements TODAY in lebanon,ironically the pro-isreali elements.;)

Not really. I recall the ssnp fought with Communists many times.

The fight in Lebanon was not a "Left vs. Right" fight, it was a "Left vs Left Right Left vs Right rightvs right ect. ect.".

And the Syrian social Nationalist Party is nothing near Marxist, and neither are their members.

First off, take a look at their flag:

http://www.ouwet.com/wp-content/lb7Dssnp.gif


http://www.vaticanassassins.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Flag-Nazi.jpg


What kind of Marxists are these?

Read up on some Antoun Saadeh, and than you'll figure out that both the phalange and the ssnp were Fascists.

They are Lebanon' s official, "National Socialist" party.

[Rafiq]

Can I ask why they chose that flag?

[freepalestine]

Can I ask why they chose that flag?it symbolises a crescent and the cross apparently.
also i'd prefer it if you took yer nazi flag down .


heres about the ssnp according to wikipedia..


1961 - 1975

In 1961 the party launched an abortive coup attempt in Lebanon, resulting in renewed proscription and the imprisonment of many of its leaders.[21] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-20) In prison the SSNP militants read and discussed politics and reconsidered their ideology, coming under the influence of Marxism (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Marxism) and other left-wing ideas.[citation needed (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)] By the beginning of the 1970s, the party had undergone a considerable ideological transformation, and was seen as decidedly left-wing and no longer deeply inimical to pan-Arab nationalism. These ideological turns, however, resulted in splits, and there are now two rival groups laying claim to Saadeh's mantle.[citation needed (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]
[edit (http://www.revleft.com/w/index.php?title=Syrian_Social_Nationalist_Party&action=edit&section=7)] Lebanese Civil War

Main article: Lebanese Civil War (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Lebanese_Civil_War)

With the outbreak of the Lebanese Civil War in 1975, SSNP militias fought alongside the nationalist and leftist forces, against the Phalangists and their right-wing allies. An important development followed with the renewal of contact between the party and its former bitter enemy, the Syrian Baath Party.[citation needed (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]
After the Israeli invasion of Lebanon (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/1982_Lebanon_War) in 1982 and subsequent rout of the leftist forces, a number of the leftist organizations regrouped to engage in resistance to the Israeli occupation. Along with the Lebanese Communist Party, the Communist Action Organization, and some smaller leftist groups, the SSNP played a prominent role in this. One of the best-known early actions of the resistance was the killing of two Israeli soldiers in the Wimpy Cafe on west Beirut's central Rue Hamra by party member Khalid Alwan. The party continues to commemorate this date. The FBI (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/FBI) blames them for the assassination of Bachir Gemayel (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Bachir_Gemayel) in 1982.[22] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-21)
In 1983 the party joined the Lebanese National Salvation Front (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Lebanese_National_Salvation_Front) established to oppose the abortive accord with Israel signed by Gemayel's brother and successor Amine Gemayel (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Amine_Gemayel).[citation needed (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]
Some party members were willing to sacrifice their lives through suicide attacks (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Suicide_attack) in resistance against Israel (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Israel), the first being in 1985.[23] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-gambetta-22) A party member Sana'a Mehaidli (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Sana%27a_Mehaidli), who martyred (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Martyr) herself at age 16 against an Israeli checkpoint in Lebanon (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Lebanon), is considered "the progenitor of all female martyrs for the Palestinian cause".[23] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-gambetta-22) Diego Gambetta (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Diego_Gambetta) says that they can't be considered a terrorist organization (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Terrorist_organization) because they only act against military targets, and that they should be considered a guerrilla (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Guerrilla) organization.[23] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-gambetta-22)
The Israelis hit the SSNP hard since the group was highly active in the Lebanese National Resistance. They bombed one of their main headquarters in the Bekaa Valley (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Bekaa_Valley) after the kamikaze operation of Malek Wehbe (http://www.revleft.com/w/index.php?title=Malek_Wehbe&action=edit&redlink=1). The Israeli intelligence also played a major role in dividing the party in 1987 (official division of the SSNP) and assassinating most of its prominent leaders such as Habib Keyrouz (http://www.revleft.com/w/index.php?title=Habib_Keyrouz&action=edit&redlink=1) who was a popular leader among SSNP students, SSNP comrades and board members also known as "oumana". Not to mention that Keyrouz was a very close politician to President Hafez al-Assad (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Hafez_al-Assad).

[Devrim]

hezbollah have always sided with palestinians-ssnp have always sided with palestinians,at least when the syrians did side with the PLO.


The Hezbollah were against the Palestinians.

As far as I am aware Hezbollah was always pro-Palestinian. That doesn't mean that there were never any clashes between them and the PLO or other Palestinian factions, but there was certainly nothing major.

I don't really see how it would have been possible for Hezbollah to engage the PLO. Hezbollah was formed at some point in the early 1980s certainly no earlier than 1982. The exact date is unclear as it started with people who were actually in Amal referring to themselves as the Party of God before there was a distinct organisation. The PLO was forced out of Beirut in 1982 after the Israeli seige. Although there were some PLO members left behind, mainly in the North, they weren't there in significant numbers nor were these Shia, and therefore Hezbollah strongholds.

The confusion may arise from the fact that Hezbollah came out of Amal and Amal was deeply involved in fighting with the Palestinians. Indeed one of the main points in the split was the attitude towards the palestinian movement.

Regarding the Syrians, Syria was always against the PLO and had its own Palestinian factions. It came into military conflict with the PLO after it occupied Lebanon in 1976.

Devrim

[Milk Sheikh]

I have ComradeMan on ignore.

But two wrongs make a right...Not!

Ive been to Israel...Its a frightening society...And the idea that its an oasis of sanity among evil, mad Muslims is both a lie and incredibly racist.

Would you like to share your experiences with us? It'll give us an idea of what Israel is all about.

[Frosty Weasel]

I live in Israel/Palestine and I can tell you right now it isn't as bad Palingenisis is making it out to be, at least in the part Jerusalem where I live.

Sure, Palestinians are largely treated like second class citizens and are generally treated like shit. But not all segments of Israeli society are hellbent on the destruction of the Palestinian people. Just yesterday I went to the store and outside there were several Israeli and Muslim children playing together on the playground. Arab mothers were laughing together with some Jewish mothers and even shopped together in the grocery store. The neighborhood I live in is predominantly more liberal than other neighborhoods, so you'll see more of this.

Although I haven't been anywhere near Gaza, so I can't give any first hand experiences, I have traveled to cities like Bethlehem and Ramallah. In Ramallah I actually felt safer than in Jerusalem, and food prices were generally less expensive than in Jerualem (A can of tuna costs $4.00 here...)

Bethlehem had some of the nicest people I've met in this country, although I did have the misfortune of being hassled by a group of Palestinian youths who mistook me for an Israeli, but left me alone and apologized once I started speaking Arabic to them.

Now in the surrounding countries where I have first hand accounts I can tell you that the situation is much worse. I'm sad to say that the pan-Arab rhetoric around Palestinian solidarity is largely false. In Lebanon the government bars Palestinians from serving in high level jobs and largely restricts them to service sector jobs like taxis and fast food. They can't own land which further restricts them to slums and the decades old refugee camps. Jordan is much of the same, although demographically Palestinians make up 60%+ of its population, effectively creating a 40% Jordanian privileged class while making the Palestinians a second class. In Egypt, where many consider themselves to be Egyptian first, some see the Palestinians as Arab inferiors.

Hell. Even my boss who is Palestinian complains about how Palestinians are treated terribly everywhere, even in countries that supposedly support them.

[ddof5]

i do not see why the jews must give tghis land back. first of all those "refugees" left on their own, no one forced them to leave, that is why 20% of Israel's population is arab.

second, why where those arabs occupying jewish land to begin with?

third, why dont the arabs give compensation to the 1 million jews they kicked out of their countries?

[Che a chara]

i do not see why the jews must give tghis land back. first of all those "refugees" left on their own, no one forced them to leave, that is why 20% of Israel's population is arab.

second, why where those arabs occupying jewish land to begin with?

third, why dont the arabs give compensation to the 1 million jews they kicked out of their countries?

Eh ? left on their own accord ? what rubbish. They were displaced to make way for settlers and forced out during the war. And how the hell did you come to the conclusion that it is 'Jewish land' ? What supremacist bullshit, and how were they "occupying" when they lived there legally and owned their own homes which have since been taken off them ?

[Dimentio]

Do you agree too then that the Middle-Eastern Jews who were rounded up, murdered and driven to Israel from Islamic and/or Arabic nations such as Iraq would also have a right to return or compensation from the said nations?

Of course, but as I understood it there was hardly any massacres. There were probably some riots, which then were blown out of proportions. Sephardic Jews are also treated as second class citizens in Israel. In the 1950's, Sephardic children in Israeli orphanages were even exposed for radioactive guinea pig testing, which gave some of them serious illnesses (Norway did similar experiments on children of German origin).

[ComradeMan]

Of course, but as I understood it there was hardly any massacres. There were probably some riots, which then were blown out of proportions. Sephardic Jews are also treated as second class citizens in Israel. In the 1950's, Sephardic children in Israeli orphanages were even exposed for radioactive guinea pig testing, which gave some of them serious illnesses (Norway did similar experiments on children of German origin).

The Farhud Pogrom- Kingdom of Iraq
June 1-2, 1941
175 Jews killed, 1000 injured and 900 Jewish homes destroyed.
By 1951, understandably, 80% of Iraqi Jewry had left, the majority for Israel- that's about 110,000 people, thus signalling the end of an historic community that had existed for two and a half millenia.

Anti-Jewish riots involving the loss of life also took place in Libya in 1945, in Yemen in 1947 and in Egypt, Morocco and Iraq in 1948. At the same time, independent Arab countries began to encourage Jewish emigration to Israel.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands#Expulsions_of_Jews_u nder_British_Mandate_for_Palestine
Ya'akov Meron. "Why Jews Fled the Arab Countries" (http://www.meforum.org/article/263), Middle East Quarterly, September 1995.
Jews in Grave Danger in All Moslem Lands, The New York Times, May 16, 1948, quoted in Was there any coordination between Arab governments in the expulsions of the Middle Eastern and North African Jews? (http://www.jimena.org/faq/faq.htm#3) (JIMENA (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/JIMENA))
www.justiceforjews.com/pr_oct_23_07.pdf (http://www.justiceforjews.com/pr_oct_23_07.pdf) (PDF)

Bahrain
Bahrain (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Bahrain)'s tiny Jewish community, mostly the Jewish descendants of immigrants who entered the country in the early 1900s from Iraq, numbered 600 in 1948. In the wake of the November 29, 1947 U.N. Partition vote (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine), demonstrations against the vote in the Arab world were called for December 2–5. The first two days of demonstrations in Bahrain saw rock throwing against Jews, but on December 5 mobs in the capital of Manama (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Manama) looted Jewish homes and shops, destroyed the synagogue, beat any Jews they could find, and murdered one elderly woman.[60] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-59)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands#Expulsions_of_Jews_u nder_British_Mandate_for_Palestine
^ (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_ref-59) Stillman, 2003, p. 147.

Egypt
In 1948, approximately 75,000 Jews lived in Egypt (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Egypt). About 100 remain today, mostly in Cairo (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Cairo). In June 1948, a bomb exploded in Cairo's Karaite quarter, killing 22 Jews. In July 1948, Jewish shops and the Cairo Synagogue were attacked, killing 19 Jews.[2] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-Schwartz-1) Hundreds of Jews were arrested and had their property confiscated. The 1954, the Lavon Affair (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Lavon_Affair) served as a pretext for further persecution of Egyptian Jews. In October 1956, when the Suez Crisis (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Suez_Crisis) erupted, 1,000 Jews were arrested and 500 Jewish businesses were seized by the government. A statement branding the Jews "enemies of the state" was read out in the mosques of Cairo and Alexandria. Jewish bank accounts were confiscated and many Jews lost their jobs. Lawyers, engineers, doctors and teachers were not allowed to work in their professions. In 1967, Jews were detained and tortured, and Jewish homes were confiscated.[2] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-Schwartz-1)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands#Expulsions_of_Jews_u nder_British_Mandate_for_Palestine
Schwartz, Adi (Janruary 4, 2008). "All I Wanted was Justice" (http://www.adi-schwartz.com/israeli-arab-conflict/all-i-wanted-was-justice/). Haaretz (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Haaretz). http://www.adi-schwartz.com/israeli-arab-conflict/all-i-wanted-was-justice/ (http://www.adi-schwartz.com/israeli-arab-conflict/all-i-wanted-was-justice/).

Libya
In 1948, about 38,000 Jews lived there.[32] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-Avneri-31)[79] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-78) A series of pogroms started in Tripoli (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Tripoli) in November 1945; over a period of several days more than 130 Jews (including 36 children) were killed, hundreds were injured, 4,000 were left homeless, and 2,400 were reduced to poverty. Five synagogues in Tripoli and four in provincial towns were destroyed, and over 1,000 Jewish residences and commercial buildings were plundered in Tripoli alone.[80] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-79) The pogroms continued in June 1948, when 15 Jews were killed and 280 Jewish homes destroyed.[81] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-80)

Between the establishment of the State of Israel in 1948 and Libyan independence in December 1951 over 30,000 Libyan Jews emigrated to Israel. In 1967, during the Six-Day War (http://www.revleft.com/wiki/Six-Day_War), the Jewish population of 4,000 was again subjected to pogroms in which 18 were killed, and many more injured. The Libyan government "urged the Jews to leave the country temporarily", permitting them each to take one suitcase and the equivalent of $50. In June and July over 4,000 traveled to Italy, where they were assisted by the Jewish Agency. 1,300 went on to Israel, 2,200 remained in Italy, and most of the rest went to the United States. A few scores remained in Libya.[82] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-81)[83] (http://www.revleft.com/vb/#cite_note-82)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands#Expulsions_of_Jews_u nder_British_Mandate_for_Palestine
Avneri, 1984, p. 276.
Stillman, 2003, p. 155-156.
Stillman, 2003, p. 145.
Harris, 2001, pp. 149-150.
Harris, 2001, pp. 155-156.
Simon, 1999, pp. 3-4.
Harris, 2001, p. 157.


Just a little selection for you there.

[freepalestine]

..... generally less expensive than in Jerualem (A can of tuna costs $4.00 here...)

....... camps. Jordan is much of the same, although demographically Palestinians make up 60%+ of its population, effectively creating a 40% Jordanian privileged class while making the Palestinians a second class. In Egypt, where many consider themselves to be Egyptian first, some see the Palestinians as Arab inferiors.....(????)

Hell. Even my boss who is Palestinian.lol..


i do not see why the jews must give tghis land back. first of all those "refugees" left on their own, no one forced them to leave, that is why 20% of Israel's population is arab.

second, why where those arabs occupying jewish land to begin with?

third, why dont the arabs give compensation to the 1 million jews they kicked out of their countries?lol


[B]The Farhud.....................op the palestinians i n lebanon???


-and the bahais?-ah well.

http://www.palestineremembered.com/Articles/General/Story2126.html




.

[gorillafuck]

First off, take a look at their flag:

http://www.ouwet.com/wp-content/lb7Dssnp.gif

*Nazi flag*

What kind of Marxists are these?
That's a terrible argument, a flag doesn't make someone fascists just because it bears somewhat of a resemblance to the flag of Nazi Germany. I don't actually know anything about the group your talking about though, they might be fascists. But not because of their flag.


Now in the surrounding countries where I have first hand accounts I can tell you that the situation is much worse. I'm sad to say that the pan-Arab rhetoric around Palestinian solidarity is largely false. In Lebanon the government bars Palestinians from serving in high level jobs and largely restricts them to service sector jobs like taxis and fast food. They can't own land which further restricts them to slums and the decades old refugee camps. Jordan is much of the same, although demographically Palestinians make up 60%+ of its population, effectively creating a 40% Jordanian privileged class while making the Palestinians a second class.
This is a very serious problem, it's not discussed enough (though contrary to what ComradeMan says, it's not like it's never ever discussed).

[Dimentio]

I live in Israel/Palestine and I can tell you right now it isn't as bad Palingenisis is making it out to be, at least in the part Jerusalem where I live.

Sure, Palestinians are largely treated like second class citizens and are generally treated like shit. But not all segments of Israeli society are hellbent on the destruction of the Palestinian people. Just yesterday I went to the store and outside there were several Israeli and Muslim children playing together on the playground. Arab mothers were laughing together with some Jewish mothers and even shopped together in the grocery store. The neighborhood I live in is predominantly more liberal than other neighborhoods, so you'll see more of this.

Although I haven't been anywhere near Gaza, so I can't give any first hand experiences, I have traveled to cities like Bethlehem and Ramallah. In Ramallah I actually felt safer than in Jerusalem, and food prices were generally less expensive than in Jerualem (A can of tuna costs $4.00 here...)

Bethlehem had some of the nicest people I've met in this country, although I did have the misfortune of being hassled by a group of Palestinian youths who mistook me for an Israeli, but left me alone and apologized once I started speaking Arabic to them.

Now in the surrounding countries where I have first hand accounts I can tell you that the situation is much worse. I'm sad to say that the pan-Arab rhetoric around Palestinian solidarity is largely false. In Lebanon the government bars Palestinians from serving in high level jobs and largely restricts them to service sector jobs like taxis and fast food. They can't own land which further restricts them to slums and the decades old refugee camps. Jordan is much of the same, although demographically Palestinians make up 60%+ of its population, effectively creating a 40% Jordanian privileged class while making the Palestinians a second class. In Egypt, where many consider themselves to be Egyptian first, some see the Palestinians as Arab inferiors.

Hell. Even my boss who is Palestinian complains about how Palestinians are treated terribly everywhere, even in countries that supposedly support them.

It is evidently clear that the Arab countries are not only generally oppressing their own populations but also are intolerant against refugees (something which not only Palestinians but also Iraqis have experienced). Pro-zionists tend to use that to justify Israel.

No one has claimed that Israel wants to physically annihilating the Palestinians. Rather, they hope that the Palestinians either would leave or just assimilate and accept a position as second class citizens.

[Rafiq]

That's a terrible argument, a flag doesn't make someone fascists just because it bears somewhat of a resemblance to the flag of Nazi Germany. I don't actually know anything about the group your talking about though, they might be fascists. But not because of their flag.


That flag was purposely designed to resemble the Nazi flag.

They are Fascists. That's like saying group with a red hammer&sickle flag is not Socialist. It is obvious.

[ComradeMan]

lol...

I don't see what your issue is with the Farhud pogrom and the other things- nor do I see what "lol" funny about it. But I suppose you don't care about dead Jews....

If anything you ought to see how they contribute to the situation at hand- but then I wouldn't expect anything more than parroting from you at the best of times and you've been shown up here too by a Lebanese member to be talking out of your ass already.

You're like a one trick pony that doesn't do its trick very well.

[freepalestine]

.... see what "lol" funny about it. But I suppose you don't care ...]neither did the isreali mossad .i believe they planted bombs in iraq.

also read this http://www.palestineremembered.com/Articles/General/Story2126.html

.

[Rafiq]

]neither did the isreali mossad .i believe they planted bombs in iraq.

also read this http://www.palestineremembered.com/Articles/General/Story2126.html



lol

What's so funny?

Pardon me if I'm not Nationalist enough for you to be called Lebanese.

EDIT* Actually I'm a Zionist Jew in disguise to tarnish the arab name. I am not really Lebanese, I am a Zionist who wants to make it seem like I am one! :ohmy:

But seriuosly, my mom is Iranian, and just recently found she has a tiny bit of kurdish blood.

Plus I was born in the US... So I don't know what ethnicity I am.

[Rafiq]

I changed my politics once.

Big deal?

What are you going on about who?

You at least mentioned this once in pm, what are you trying to say?

[Rafiq]

Why'd you just remove that post?

AND you just edited your post with yo usaying "lol" when comrademan said I was Lebanese....

This is some Stalinist falsification of history conspiracy shit going on!

[ddof5]

Eh ? left on their own accord ? what rubbish. They were displaced to make way for settlers and forced out during the war. And how the hell did you come to the conclusion that it is 'Jewish land' ? What supremacist bullshit, and how were they "occupying" when they lived there legally and owned their own homes which have since been taken off them ?

no, actually the refugees did leave when the arabs told them they would "drive the jews into the sea", if Israel did kick out the arabs, Israel would not have 20% of its population as arabs.

and how is saying that it is jewish land "supremacist", it is jewish land, the jews have lived on that land for thousands of years, it is their homeland. the arabs are indeginous to the arab peninsula. why is it when the jews were in Europe, everyone told them to "go back to palestine"

[#FF0000]

i do not see why the jews must give tghis land back. first of all those "refugees" left on their own, no one forced them to leave, that is why 20% of Israel's population is arab.

Aaaand they're treated as second class citizens, and not all of them were able to keep their homes. Your ignorance is really stunning. I mean, you've heard of the IDF bulldozing homes, right? You've heard of bombs in Gaza, right?


second, why where those arabs occupying jewish land to begin with?
Er, some of the palestinian/arab cities have been then since well before the 7th century. People have lived in Palestine this entire time. What makes it "Jewish land"?


third, why dont the arabs give compensation to the 1 million jews they kicked out of their countries?It's pretty stupid that you're talking about all arabs here when people talking about the Israel-Palestine conflict are talking about people from a specific area.


it is jewish land, the jews have lived on that land for thousands of years, it is their homeland

Which is why the people who founded Israel came over from Europe to do it, I guess. :mellow:

[ComradeMan]

Why'd you just remove that post?

AND you just edited your post with yo usaying "lol" when comrademan said I was Lebanese....

This is some Stalinist falsification of history conspiracy shit going on!

If you're not Lebanese I apologise, I gained the impression you were connected with Lebanon from some other posts. Nevertheless, you seem to know about Lebanon and the situation there.

As for the rest, Freepalestine does nothing else but post endless whole articles from the Electronic Intifada in the main highlighting Israel this or Zionist that.

I notice Freepalestine has not posted much on the alleged involvement of the Palestinian Islamic Army with the attacks on Coptic Christians that were in the news recently.;)

[Rafiq]

If you're not Lebanese I apologise, I gained the impression you were connected with Lebanon from some other posts. Nevertheless, you seem to know about Lebanon and the situation there.

As for the rest, Freepalestine does nothing else but post endless whole articles from the Electronic Intifada in the main highlighting Israel this or Zionist that.

I notice Freepalestine has not posted much on the alleged involvement of the Palestinian Islamic Army with the attacks on Coptic Christians that were in the news recently.;)

Well, I have half lebanese blood, so you could say I am Lebanese.

Anyway, I sense the bias that freepalestine has on the situation.

If you're going to give us news on the Middle East, you should include EVERYTHING and not just one-sided articles that contribute only to your cause.