Being a teenager in a corporate-driven world

[Octopus]

I'd like some advice on living as a teenager and as a communist, as well as to ask some questions which have been bothering me for a long time.

Firstly, could anyone provide me with examples of corporate exploitation of the working classes in their own specific country? This probably sounds like a stupid question but I'm constantly asked this and I never feel my argument carries much strength. Secondly, what the fuck do I wear! I almost feel hypocritical wearing clothes brought from the retail shops as they obviously exploit the third world populations, so where do you get your clothes from?

Is it acceptable to conform in order to gain happiness at this age, even if it is just an illusion?

I apologize if I sound very ignorant, but I am learning after all.

[Broletariat]

First of all, if an employee employer relationship exists, so does exploitation. This comic gives a basic outline to the "why's" of this, but I, or someone else, can elaborate if necessary.

http://i357.photobucket.com/albums/oo18/Dolgoff/ed4a754f.png

Secondly, the clothes you wear do not matter. That is a wardrobe choice. Our goal is to overthrow Capitalism and instill Communism, how do your consumer choices affect this at all?

With this kind of thinking, the implicit assumption is that we can simply boycott Capitalism away, this is not so at all. If you do not participate in the market you will be FORCED to participate in the market, see Grenada and various other countries who decided to resist the market.

I'm not sure what you mean by "conforming" exactly. Unless your peers have some sort of twisted animal torturing thing or random bullying of people, I'd say it's okay to "conform," so long as you can retain your own autonomy.

[electro_fan]

Don't worry about what clothes you are wearing, you are, like it or not, part of the capitalist system no matter what you do, and i think that companies that promote "fair trade" and the like can frequently be worse, or act in exactly the same way as companies that don't have such a policy, as well as the fact that these clothes are often prohibitively expensive

so basically, just chill out and do what you can and don't beat yourself up over things, the economic strucutre of society isn't your fault, and "opting out" isn't an option for most people, nor should it be, because what good are you doing if you go to live in a cave or something

[Octopus]

Ah, thank you've made me a lot more comfortable in knowing that! I just felt I'd be criticise if I told people I was against capitalism and then wore the brands of capitalism, however your points are very true! And by conform, I do only mean to normal life in this society, and not to somehow become attached from it all!

I still need to read up on many things before I make sense completely of my ideals, there are so many interesting ideologies on the left I find it sometimes hard to discover one for myself.

[Sensible Socialist]

It would be impossible to hold yourself to high ideals while living in the global capitalist system. Doing so would be such a burden on yourself that you probably wouldn't be as productive as you would if you bought from capitalist sources. Don't beat yourself up about it; there is nothing you can do.

But there are several "less exploitative" places you can buy clothes from. Still capitalism, but if you can support places with strong unions and good track records of workers rights, it will be for the best. And the best part is you don't have to spend $30 on a shirt and $50 on a pair of pants, just because it has the [insert corporate brand] name on it.

[Amphictyonis]

Our goal is to overthrow Capitalism and instill Communism, how do your consumer choices affect this at all?



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[electro_fan]

what i would say is don't take anyones word for anything on this forum, look around here, look around other left-wing and anarchist forums and websites, talk to people you know about different groups and see what they opinions are , most of all go along to a few meetings of different groups or or single issue campaigns till you work out your views properly and what you think. buy some books too.

to be honest, i'd also recommend NOT joining something which requires a very high level of commitment like the organisation i am in which requires putting hours of going to demos, paper selling, and whatever else in every week, at least not straight away unless you're really sure about it, as it's a massive thing, and you are a teenager and need to go and experience life for yourself, you also have school, exams, etc to get through too. it's very easy to get really involved in something and then get completely burnt out and disillusioned, especially if you haven't thought about these things properly, or you don't have the confindence to ask questions about things you disagree with (or think you disagree with) which often happens. when you're that age, i dont mean to be patronising but it's a time for exploring all sorts of things, not just political views, but other stuff in life

also, if you do get involved in a group, don't be afraid to say no to stuff, as at the end of the day they don't want comrades being burnt out or other parts of their life suffering, and they will understand if they are worth shit

good luck whatever you decide, anyway :)

[RojoBandera]

'Ey, I'm also in your situation. What I've found so far is that thinking for yourself and not being afraid act on that goes a long way.

[thesadmafioso]

I would usually mention how Lenin was once a teenager in a capitalistic society, and how that did not prevent him from leading the Bolsheviks to power in 1917. Yes it was an underdeveloped tsarist Russia, but the same concept of living under undesirable conditions is still relevant regardless. But yeah, most everything said in regards to the ineffectualness of trying to avoid capitalism entirely and the irrelevance of such a line of questioning is also quite good advice as well.

[Sixiang]

Firstly, could anyone provide me with examples of corporate exploitation of the working classes in their own specific country? This probably sounds like a stupid question but I'm constantly asked this and I never feel my argument carries much strength.
A great example is the comic that was already posted by Broletariat.


Secondly, what the fuck do I wear! I almost feel hypocritical wearing clothes brought from the retail shops as they obviously exploit the third world populations, so where do you get your clothes from?
If you really worry about it a lot, you can do research on clothing companies to see how they treat their workers and what not. You have to wear something. You could make your own clothes if you wanted, but you have to learn to knit and sew. That takes time, but it's up to you. I buy practically all of my clothes, books, and other knick-knacks from thrift stores. Mostly because it's a lot cheaper to buy there, but also because of the wide variety and I know that at least the money is going towards some sort of charity thing and not some big corporate fat cat's wallet. However, if I happen to get some clothes for my birthday from my family and they happen to be from Old Navy, then I'm not going to beat myself up about it and burn them or something.


Is it acceptable to conform in order to gain happiness at this age, even if it is just an illusion?
Just because capitalism sucks doesn't mean that you can't be happy. You can be happy. I'm a little confused by what you mean when you say conform.

[Rafiq]

I'd like some advice on living as a teenager and as a communist, as well as to ask some questions which have been bothering me for a long time.

Firstly, could anyone provide me with examples of corporate exploitation of the working classes in their own specific country? This probably sounds like a stupid question but I'm constantly asked this and I never feel my argument carries much strength. Secondly, what the fuck do I wear! I almost feel hypocritical wearing clothes brought from the retail shops as they obviously exploit the third world populations, so where do you get your clothes from?

Is it acceptable to conform in order to gain happiness at this age, even if it is just an illusion?

I apologize if I sound very ignorant, but I am learning after all.



I'll number your questions and answer them accordingly.

1. It's not that conditions are bad, in a specific country, however, understand that whenever a capitalist makes profit over a workers labour, this is exploitation.

For example, when a worker produces something, this creates value, and the capitalist, who does nothing, sucks the surplus value from the worker.

Put it this way, if a Capitalist pays you 15$ a day and he gets 50$ off of the product you produced, you are paying him 35 bucks a day.

2. Wear whatever you like. Don't feel like you're being a hypocrite. There isn't much we can do, besides, it's not like you stop wearing any clothes will end Capitalism.

3. Do not apologize, this is learning after all. We don't judge if you aren't as knowledgeable as everyone else.

So, I recommend going into chat to get your questions answered. That's what I used to do :thumbup1:

[Amphictyonis]

I would usually mention how Lenin was once a teenager in a capitalistic society, and how that did not prevent him from leading the Bolsheviks to power in 1917. Yes it was an underdeveloped tsarist Russia, but the same concept of living under undesirable conditions is still relevant regardless. But yeah, most everything said in regards to the ineffectualness of trying to avoid capitalism entirely and the irrelevance of such a line of questioning is also quite good advice as well.


"The Cultural Shift Of Socialim" (your blog). You think everyone in advanced capitalist nations will simply let some 'vanguard' take over the state before any cultural shift happens? There must be a mass movement in order for a revoloution in advanced capitalist nations (and hence anywhere) to be successful- where would a mass movement be born of if not a cultural shift? How can this cultural shift take place whilst everyone is immersed in capitalist culture?

Do you see the dilemma? And in Lenins time material conditions were nothing like we see in 21'st century advanced capitalist nations. It was precisely bad material conditions which led the peasants/farmers/workers in Russia to revolt not ideology alone as you seem to be wishing to happen in the west. Some vanguard, students and or young kids in the suburbs aret leading any revolution in the advanced capitalist nations with pure ideology at the base of it. Workers will revolt when material conditions decline so forgive me if I don't celebrate out of control consumerism. It's our job to spread socialist ideology as material conditions are declining.

When college tuition is raised we see revolt in the streets, when WTO comes into town we see revolt in the streets but not until everyone is being (obviously) attacked by capitalism in some way will we see a revolution/mass movement. Obviously everyone IS being attacked by capitalism (if you're a wage slave) but what do you think keeps people 'happy' with their wage slavery? Why are so many workers docile in advanced capitalist nations? Is it teh capitalist culture? The dumbed down violent cheesy movies, the super-sized happy triple cheese burger kids meals? The fucking platinum plated I-pods? The droves of millions of humans of whom since birth have been inoculated with one big advertisement?

Your wants have been created for you- you needs manufactured and the way to achieve these generated false needs has been lain out in front of us. WAGE SLAVERY. Sure some of us see the trap but the reason so many millions don't is simple- they're immersed in the reality capitalism creates. They are immersed in 'the matrix'- trapped in a sort of false consciousness. The way to break this spell isn't going to be through 85 cent cheeseburgers and a fetish for designer clothes.


Most of you on here are very young so you'll cringe in anger at the things I'm saying because you are the most immersed. Call me a "lifestylist" if you will but I'm an anti capitalist consumerism materialist.

[thesadmafioso]

"The Cultural Shift Of Socialim" (your blog). You think everyone in advanced capitalist nations will simply let some 'vanguard' take over the state before any cultural shift happens? There must be a mass movement in order for a revoloution in advanced capitalist nations (and hence anywhere) to be successful- where would a mass movement be born of if not a cultural shift? How can this cultural shift take place whilst everyone is immersed in capitalist culture?

Do you see the dilemma? And in Lenins time material conditions were nothing like we see in 21'st century advanced capitalist nations. It was precisely bad material conditions which led the peasants/farmers/workers in Russia to revolt not ideology alone as you seem to be wishing to happen in the west. Some vanguard, students and or young kids in the suburbs aret leading any revolution in the advanced capitalist nations with pure ideology at the base of it. Workers will revolt when material conditions decline so forgive me if I don't celebrate out of control consumerism. It's our job to spread socialist ideology as material conditions are declining.

When college tuition is raised we see revolt in the streets, when WTO comes into town we see revolt in the streets but not until everyone is being (obviously) attacked by capitalism in some way will we see a revolution/mass movement. Obviously everyone IS being attacked by capitalism (if you're a wage slave) but what do you think keeps people 'happy' with their wage slavery? Why are so many workers docile in advanced capitalist nations? Is it teh capitalist culture? The dumbed down violent cheesy movies, the super-sized happy triple cheese burger kids meals? The fucking platinum plated I-pods? The droves of millions of humans of whom since birth have been inoculated with one big advertisement?

Your wants have been created for you- you needs manufactured and the way to achieve these generated false needs has been lain out in front of us. WAGE SLAVERY. Sure some of us see the trap but the reason so many millions don't is simple- they're immersed in the reality capitalism creates. They are immersed in 'the matrix'- trapped in a sort of false consciousness. The way to break this spell isn't going to be through 85 cent cheeseburgers and a fetish for designer clothes.


Most of you on here are very young so you'll cringe in anger at the things I'm saying because you are the most immersed. Call me a "lifestylist" if you will but I'm an anti capitalist consumerism materialist.

How is misinterpreting and distorting the context of my writing relevant to this topic, exactly? I would be more than happy to discuss this in a more appropriate environment if you would like, but I feel any connection between what was written in that piece and this topic is tentative as best.

[The American]

I face the same dilemma, but as of late I buy whatever clothes are cheapest, and my indifference to my image has grown and I look like a scraggly mess but oh well.
I feel buying fair trade clothes/food just prolongs the exploitation, and it allows capitalists to say, "Look, the workers lives aren't that bad they're getting paid $1.50 a day instead of $1!"
I'm not saying we shouldn't seek to improve the lives of workers, I just think fair trade stuff is "band-aids on a cancer patient" and like Slavoj Zizek says, we think buying fair trade or environmentally friendly products buys our redemption from the consumerist lifestyle that we just bought into, and it doesn't really affect anything.

But as I buy my clothes from Target, and I'm almost positive they use sweat-shops, I would be quite the hypocrite to demonize buying consumerist products. So my advice is to buy clothes when you need them, but not with extravagance, every time I see someone with a pair of jeans that cost 400 dollars that I could get for 5 dollars I get almost sickened. :tongue_smilie:

[Broletariat]

I feel buying fair trade clothes/food just prolongs the exploitation, and it allows capitalists to say, "Look, the workers lives aren't that bad they're getting paid $1.50 a day instead of $1!"
This is an excellent point, the worst slave owner is a kind one.

[Octopus]

Where I am there are absolutely no groups what so ever, infact, i'm one of the only ones in my entire school with proper left wing views, most of them are apathetic or are so brainwashed by the right wing tabloids they like the nationalist parties.

[Luisrah]

You must never forget that you are a worker too (I suppose), and it is of no use to think ''Hey, atleast I am not exploited by the capitalists!'', or ''I won't buy things that resulted from exploitation''. The products you will buy instead will probably cost more, and if you don't buy them, someone else will, because people have to choose cheaper in order to have everything they need (food, clothes, home, etc)

You must also never forget that you, like me and everyone else are victims of this system, and it is not making a commune somewhere in the world with 150 people that will get the sympathy of the rest of the world to go socialist (like the utopian socialists did, if I'm not mistaken)
After all, the proletariat would never liberate itself from the bourgeoisie if it was not a victim of it (who wants to change what's good?)

[electro_fan]

Where I am there are absolutely no groups what so ever, infact, i'm one of the only ones in my entire school with proper left wing views, most of them are apathetic or are so brainwashed by the right wing tabloids they like the nationalist parties.

this can change though, when i was a teenager i was a very right wing religious zionist. Don't write people off is what i'm saying

[Sensible Socialist]

This is an excellent point, the worst slave owner is a kind one.
Tell that to the slave. I'm a little tired of people using the lives of workers, actually people, to foward an ideological agenda.

[Broletariat]

Tell that to the slave. I'm a little tired of people using the lives of workers, actually people, to foward an ideological agenda.
You say this as if we're not all workers here.

You also appear to be ignoring the injustices inherent in even a "friendly" form of Capitalism. I'd rather be working towards Communism in poor conditions than be struggling to make people see why we should bother.

[Sensible Socialist]

You say this as if we're not all workers here.

You also appear to be ignoring the injustices inherent in even a "friendly" form of Capitalism. I'd rather be working towards Communism in poor conditions than be struggling to make people see why we should bother.
You would rather workers suffer more? We should be doing two things:

1) Helping workers achieve balance and a level of decent living in their lives.

2) Fighting for an end to capitalism

The two are no mutally exclusive. If I was a destitute worker, I would be pretty pissed if I knew people were intentionally refusing to help me now, and instead opting to pursue a farther goal.

I won't play with workers lives in a dangerous way. If I know of a way to improve their conditions now, I will.

[Broletariat]

You would rather workers suffer more? We should be doing two things:

1) Helping workers achieve balance and a level of decent living in their lives.

2) Fighting for an end to capitalism

The two are no mutally exclusive. If I was a destitute worker, I would be pretty pissed if I knew people were intentionally refusing to help me now, and instead opting to pursue a farther goal.

I won't play with workers lives in a dangerous way. If I know of a way to improve their conditions now, I will.
Again, you're speaking as if "the workers" are some sort of outside force. They're not, we ARE a part of the workers.

I'm arguing that "friendly" capitalism is more harmful than "cruel" capitalism in the long run.

This isn't really anything more than an observation as there are no courses of action I can see that we should take based on this knowledge.

[Sensible Socialist]

Again, you're speaking as if "the workers" are some sort of outside force. They're not, we ARE a part of the workers.

I'm arguing that "friendly" capitalism is more harmful than "cruel" capitalism in the long run.

This isn't really anything more than an observation as there are no courses of action I can see that we should take based on this knowledge.
Because the original basis for this was fair trade, I'm mostly referring to 3rd-world, agricultural or garmet workers. People in horrid conditions that make U.S. capitalism look amazing.

If capitalism can be overthrown, friendly capitalism will have been the better option. Workers will have suffered less painful effects of their economic enslavement. "Cruel" capitalism only results in more pain for workers, and I don't see who would want that.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

The Edelweiss Pirates were only teenagers.

Seriously, being a teenager in a capitalist society is the same as living in a capitalist society generally. You finish school, go out into the world, and that shift, whatever it is you're waiting for, well . . . it never comes. Capitalist society infantilizes all of us - reduces us to pathetic, emotionally crippled, dependents of capital and state.

How do you survive as a teenager in a capitalist society? Don't settle for survival! Be the protagonist of yr own life story. Start living, or get on with dying!

[Apoi_Viitor]

I feel buying fair trade clothes/food just prolongs the exploitation, and it allows capitalists to say, "Look, the workers lives aren't that bad they're getting paid $1.50 a day instead of $1!"
I'm not saying we shouldn't seek to improve the lives of workers, I just think fair trade stuff is "band-aids on a cancer patient" and like Slavoj Zizek says, we think buying fair trade or environmentally friendly products buys our redemption from the consumerist lifestyle that we just bought into, and it doesn't really affect anything.

I can't stand when communists have viewpoints like this... Buying fair trade products isn't "putting band-aids on a cancer patient". Buying fair trade products have real tangible effects for the workers who benefit from it. The argument that we should force workers into greater suffering because it might lead to a faster structural change in the capitalist system, is so inhumane and so despicable I seriously wonder why you decided to become a communist... I question the ethics of any comrade on the radical left who opposes 'ethical consumerism' (like that bastard Slavoj Zizek), because many times it seems they ultimately don't give two shits about the suffering of the masses.

Search "charity" on the searchbar and you'll find threads full of 'communists' who desire that we prolong and extend the suffering of the masses just because it might increase the chances of them becoming radical leftists.

We need to face the facts. Communism isn't coming anytime soon, so we should try and do whatever we can to improve the lives of those who are suffering now. Fair Trade isn't simply giving a worker 1.50 dollars instead of 1.00 dollar, and only a deliberate liar would say something like that... It's a fact that there are some companies that give more to charity, extract less profits from their workers, etc. and when we support companies such as those it "really does affect something".

[The American]

I can't stand when communists have viewpoints like this... Buying fair trade products isn't "putting band-aids on a cancer patient". Buying fair trade products have real tangible effects for the workers who benefit from it. The argument that we should force workers into greater suffering because it might lead to a faster structural change in the capitalist system, is so inhumane and so despicable I seriously wonder why you decided to become a communist... I question the ethics of any comrade on the radical left who opposes 'ethical consumerism' (like that bastard Slavoj Zizek), because many times it seems they ultimately don't give two shits about the suffering of the masses.

Search "charity" on the searchbar and you'll find threads full of 'communists' who desire that we prolong and extend the suffering of the masses just because it might increase the chances of them becoming radical leftists.

We need to face the facts. Communism isn't coming anytime soon, so we should try and do whatever we can to improve the lives of those who are suffering now. Fair Trade isn't simply giving a worker 1.50 dollars instead of 1.00 dollar, and only a deliberate liar would say something like that... It's a fact that there are some companies that give more to charity, extract less profits from their workers, etc. and when we support companies such as those it "really does affect something".

You're incredibly naive if you think Starbucks gives the extra profits from you buying overpriced coffee to the Ethiopian coffee farmers. Even if the companies did give the profits to the workers, how much more could they possibly make? No one wants to prolong the suffering of workers, but paying a little more for coffee isn't going to free the workers from oppression.

[Apoi_Viitor]

You're incredibly naive if you think Starbucks gives the extra profits from you buying overpriced coffee to the Ethiopian coffee farmers. Even if the companies did give the profits to the workers, how much more could they possibly make? No one wants to prolong the suffering of workers, but paying a little more for coffee isn't going to free the workers from oppression.

Starbucks isn't even an example of fair trade.

But anyways, the point isn't to magically free the workers from all oppression, it's to make improvements to their lives - and fair trade does that. Remember that just because you can't change everything, doesn't mean you can't change anything...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/mar/12/ethicalliving.lifeandhealth

Besides, I could list of the top of my head a few companies that give at least 10% of their profits to charity. That's certainly not just "a little more"...

[Widerstand]

Fair Trade? More like Fair Exploitation.

So what if some companies contribute to Charity? Charity largely is an imperialist/neo-colonialist tool to stifle development in Third World countries (a fact that has even reached the social democrat feelgood leftists (http://www.amazon.com/Road-Hell-Ravaging-Effects-International/dp/0743227867) by now), not to say completely unfit to actually improve living standards there.

There may be a few (VERY FEW) "fair trade" projects actually worth supporting, but usually because of their involvement in local struggle (eg. Zapatista coffee collectives), not because their workers get two cents more per hour.

[ZeroNowhere]

Tell that to the slave. I'm a little tired of people using the lives of workers, actually people, to foward an ideological agenda.No, it's perfectly accurate. A 'good capitalist' will have a lower rate of profit, and therefore the more 'good capitalists', the more susceptible the economy is to crises, because the economy is run on and for capital. Crises, I'm sure you're aware, aren't particularly pleasant for the slaves.


If capitalism can be overthrown, friendly capitalism will have been the better option. Workers will have suffered less painful effects of their economic enslavement. "Cruel" capitalism only results in more pain for workers, and I don't see who would want that.We had 'friendly capitalism'. Then we had a crisis, and then we didn't have friendly capitalism any more, because more profits were necessary. As it happens, even this wasn't enough, certainly compared with the World Wars, and the economy hasn't really undergone a sustained recovery since it went down the drain in the 70s.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

Rather than worrying about whether or not what you're buying is ethical in the context of capitalism, ask whether or not what you're buying is of practical value in waging social war against the existing order. That's ethical consuming! :laugh:

[Rafiq]

Because the original basis for this was fair trade, I'm mostly referring to 3rd-world, agricultural or garmet workers. People in horrid conditions that make U.S. capitalism look amazing.

If capitalism can be overthrown, friendly capitalism will have been the better option. Workers will have suffered less painful effects of their economic enslavement. "Cruel" capitalism only results in more pain for workers, and I don't see who would want that.

Sorry, but not all of us here are workers.

I'm in high school. Does that make me a worker? Letting those damn teachers extract my educational surplus value, Students of the world unite!

Understand that some of us could be writers, journalists, students, ect.

[Adil3tr]

I'd like some advice on living as a teenager and as a communist, as well as to ask some questions which have been bothering me for a long time.

Secondly, what the fuck do I wear! I almost feel hypocritical wearing clothes brought from the retail shops as they obviously exploit the third world populations, so where do you get your clothes from?

Is it acceptable to conform in order to gain happiness at this age, even if it is just an illusion?

I apologize if I sound very ignorant, but I am learning after all.

If you don't buy the clothes, the kids making them won't be much better off. Start learning, make your own conclusions, but realize that collective action and changing the entire system will actual create change, not personal stands. You can still do that for some things, like walmart and mcdonalds, though.
Have fun, comrade!










Sincerely, Another teenage communist

[Widerstand]

Sorry, but not all of us here are workers.

I'm in high school. Does that make me a worker? Letting those damn teachers extract my educational surplus value, Students of the world unite!

Understand that some of us could be writers, journalists, students, ect.

As if these were magically exempt from horrid social situations such as lack of social securities, precarity, etc.?

[Apoi_Viitor]

Fair Trade? More like Fair Exploitation.

And?


So what if some companies contribute to Charity? Charity largely is an imperialist/neo-colonialist tool to stifle development in Third World countries (a fact that has even reached the social democrat feelgood leftists (http://www.amazon.com/Road-Hell-Ravaging-Effects-International/dp/0743227867) by now), not to say completely unfit to actually improve living standards there.

Fuck you Paul Newman, stop stifling development in the third world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newman's_Own


There may be a few (VERY FEW) "fair trade" projects actually worth supporting, but usually because of their involvement in local struggle (eg. Zapatista coffee collectives), not because their workers get two cents more per hour.

...I posted in article before on how fair trade is a little more beneficial to workers than simply 'giving them two cents more per hour'...

[Amphictyonis]

I'd like some advice on living as a teenager and as a communist, as well as to ask some questions which have been bothering me for a long time.

Firstly, could anyone provide me with examples of corporate exploitation of the working classes in their own specific country? This probably sounds like a stupid question but I'm constantly asked this and I never feel my argument carries much strength. Secondly, what the fuck do I wear! I almost feel hypocritical wearing clothes brought from the retail shops as they obviously exploit the third world populations, so where do you get your clothes from?

Is it acceptable to conform in order to gain happiness at this age, even if it is just an illusion?

I apologize if I sound very ignorant, but I am learning after all.

Go buy a Che shirt made by 7 year old Indonesians. Have diamonds put in your teeth which came from mines in Africa where people slave at the end of a gun barrel. Make sure to buy 2 gas guzzling SUV's made in China by 14 year old midgets. Pay an undocumented non union painter to paint murals of Lenin on your SUV's and ask him if any of his friends can be your house keeper, then, make sure to buy 200 dollar shoes made by more 12 year old girls which only cost 15 cents to make but the workers get paid 1.00 an hour. What sort of profit margin is that? It would also be nice if you throw away your cell phone every year so you can buy the latest model which was made in a factory in China where workers actually died making them. http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE64Q14420100527. Then you can go to university and drink 5 dollar cups of coffee made by people making 7 dollars an hour which on;y covers about 30% of the cost of living in the US. Make sure to rebel rouse about being a communist for a few years until you graduate and join the work force only to leave all of that "silly ideology" behind. That's what you should do :) That will end capitalism.

[scourge007]

Go buy a Che shirt made by 7 year old Indonesians. Have diamonds put in your teeth which came from mines in Africa where people slave at the end of a gun barrel. Make sure to buy 2 gas guzzling SUV's made in China by 14 year old midgets. Pay an undocumented non union painter to paint murals of Lenin on your SUV's and ask him if any of his friends can be your house keeper, then, make sure to buy 200 dollar shoes made by more 12 year old girls which only cost 15 cents to make but the workers get paid 1.00 an hour. What sort of profit margin is that? It would also be nice if you throw away your cell phone every year so you can buy the latest model which was made in a factory in China where workers actually died making them. http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE64Q14420100527. Then you can go to university and drink 5 dollar cups of coffee made by people making 7 dollars an hour which on;y covers about 30% of the cost of living in the US. Make sure to rebel rouse about being a communist for a few years until you graduate and join the work force only to leave all of that "silly ideology" behind. That's what you should do :) That will end capitalism.

There's no need to be sarcastic. He's just asking for advice since he's a teenaged communist living in a capitalistic/materialistic society. For all you know he'll shake the MTV life style one day.

[Amphictyonis]

There's no need to be sarcastic. He's just asking for advice since he's a teenaged communist living in a capitalistic/materialistic society. For all you know he'll shake the MTV life style one day.

The sarcasm wasn't necessarily meant for him or to be rude- more funny. I've been having a heated discussion concerning capitalist generated consumerism with a few old time posters on here :)

[scourge007]

The sarcasm wasn't necessarily meant for him or to be rude- more funny. I've been having a heated discussion concerning capitalist generated consumerism with a few old time posters on here :)
Oh ok. It's good to use humor to blow off steam after a heated debate.:D

[Rafiq]

As if these were magically exempt from horrid social situations such as lack of social securities, precarity, etc.?

Hold on there, I didn't say the social situations were positive.

I just pointed out not all of us are Workers.

[Sensible Socialist]

Sorry, but not all of us here are workers.

I'm in high school. Does that make me a worker? Letting those damn teachers extract my educational surplus value, Students of the world unite!

Understand that some of us could be writers, journalists, students, ect.
What are you talking about? I stated I was referring mainly to workers in 3rd world countries. Is there something you take offense to there?

[Rafiq]

What are you talking about? I stated I was referring mainly to workers in 3rd world countries. Is there something you take offense to there?

My mistake, I accidentally replayed and quoted you instead of this fellow:



Again, you're speaking as if "the workers" are some sort of outside force. They're not, we ARE a part of the workers.

I'm arguing that "friendly" capitalism is more harmful than "cruel" capitalism in the long run.

This isn't really anything more than an observation as there are no courses of action I can see that we should take based on this knowledge.