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hatzel
23rd December 2010, 20:08
As I'm currently busying myself with lots of Bahá'í-related activities and inter-faith dialogue and all that, I thought I'd post this one up. Mainly because the Bahá'í Faith isn't present on the 'Which religion do you follow?' poll, for whatever reason, which I found somewhat surprising. I wonder if there might even be one or two Bahá'ís here on RevLeft, but if they're not, I wonder if anybody has an opinion of the faith (by which I mean specifically this faith, rather than just all faiths), good or bad. For those of you unaware of the nature of the Bahá'í Faith, my local Bahá'í community give the following overview of the 13 so-called 'principles' of the faith, complete with a quote to elaborate:


1. The oneness of mankind

"It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country and mankind its citizens." - Bahá'u'lláh



2. The oneness of religion

"All these divisions we see on all sides, all these disputes and opposition, are caused because men cling to ritual and outward observances, and forget the simple, underlying truth. It is the outward practices of religion that are so different, and it is they that cause disputes and enmity--while the reality is always the same, and one. The Reality is the Truth, and truth has no division. Truth is God's guidance, it is the light of the world, it is love, it is mercy. These attributes of truth are also human virtues inspired by the Holy Spirit." - `Abdu'l-Bahá



3. Independent investigation of truth

"Furthermore, know ye that God has created in man the power of reason, whereby man is enabled to investigate reality. God has not intended man to imitate blindly his fathers and ancestors. He has endowed him with mind, or the faculty of reasoning, by the exercise of which he is to investigate and discover the truth, and that which he finds real and true he must accept." - `Abdu'l-Bahá



4. The progress revelation of religion

Bahá'ís view religion as a progressive, evolutionary process which needs to be updated as humanity evolves mentally, socially, and spiritually. Every so often a new Prophet is sent to humanity to update religion to the current needs of mankind. These Prophets bring essentially the same spiritual message to mankind; in a form that meets the needs of the people of Their time. Therefore, God progressively reveals His teachings for humanity through a series of divine educators that become the founders of the world's great religions. Among these religions are the Bahá'í Faith, Buddhism, Christianity, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, and Zoroastrianism. Bahá'ís believe that Bahá'u'lláh is the latest in the succession of Messengers of God.



5. Religion as a source of unity

"He sets forth a new principle for this day in the announcement that religion must be the cause of unity, harmony and agreement among mankind. If it be the cause of discord and hostility, if it leads to separation and creates conflict, the absence of religion would be preferable in the world." - `Abdu'l-Bahá



[B]6. Harmony between religion, science and reason

"Religion and science are the two wings upon which man's intelligence can soar into the heights, with which the human soul can progress. It is not possible to fly with one wing alone! Should a man try to fly with the wing of religion alone he would quickly fall into the quagmire of superstition, whilst on the other hand, with the wing of science alone he would also make no progress, but fall into the despairing slough of materialism." - `Abdu'l-Bahá



7. Peaceful consultation as a means for resolving differences

In the Bahá'í Faith, difference of opinion is not squelched, in fact it is encouraged. "The shining spark of truth cometh forth only after the clash of differing opinions." (`Abdu'l-Bahá) However, differences of opinion can be expressed in a way that doesn't humiliate another human being. The Bahá'í principle of consultation requires that an individual be detached from his or her opinions and always be open to the truth, from whoever or wherever it comes from.



8. An international auxiliary language

"It behoveth the sovereigns of the world may God assist them or the ministers of the earth to take counsel together and to adopt one of the existing languages or a new one to be taught to children in schools throughout the world, and likewise one script. Thus the whole earth will come to be regarded as one country." - Bahá'u'lláh



9. Universal education

"Unto every father hath been enjoined the instruction of his son and daughter in the art of reading and writing and in all that hath been laid down in the Holy Tablet. He that bringeth up his son or the son of another, it is as though he hath brought up a son of Mine; upon him rest My Glory, My Loving-Kindness, My Mercy, that have compassed the world." - Bahá'u'lláh



10. The elimination of all forms of prejudice

"...again, as to religious, racial, national and political bias: all these prejudices strike at the very root of human life; one and all they beget bloodshed, and the ruination of the world. So long as these prejudices survive, there will be continuous and fearsome wars." - `Abdu'l-Bahá



11. Equality of men and women

"To accept and observe a distinction which God has not intended in creation is ignorance and superstition. The fact which is to be considered, however, is that woman, having formerly been deprived, must now be allowed equal opportunities with man for education and training. There must be no difference in their education. Until the reality of equality between man and woman is fully established and attained, the highest social development of mankind is not possible." - `Abdu'l-Bahá



12. The abolition of the extremes of wealth and poverty

"O Ye Rich Ones on Earth! The poor in your midst are My trust; guard ye My trust, and be not intent only on your own ease." (Bahá'u'lláh) "We see amongst us men who are overburdened with riches on the one hand, and on the other those unfortunate ones who starve with nothing; those who possess several stately palaces, and those who have not where to lay their head. Some we find with numerous courses of costly and dainty food; whilst others can scarce find sufficient crusts to keep them alive. Whilst some are clothed in velvets, furs and fine linen, others have insufficient, poor and thin garments with which to protect them from the cold. This condition of affairs is wrong and must be remedied. Now the remedy must be carefully undertaken. It cannot be done by bringing to pass absolute equality between men." - `Abdu'l-Bahá



13. Universal peace and security

"The time must come when the imperative necessity for the holding of a vast, an all- embracing assemblage of men will be universally realized. The rulers and kings of the earth must needs attend it, and, participating in its deliberations, must consider such ways and means as will lay the foundations of the world's Great Peace amongst men. Such a peace demandeth that the Great Powers should resolve, for the sake of the tranquillity of the peoples of the earth, to be fully reconciled among themselves. Should any king take up arms against another, all should unitedly arise and prevent him. If this be done, the nations of the world will no longer require any armaments, except for the purpose of preserving the security of their realms and of maintaining internal order within their territories." - `Abdu'l-Bahá

As a good few of these principles might overlap with leftist principles, I wonder what support there would be around here for the active defence of such a faith, even if not actively promoting its growth...

Die Neue Zeit
24th December 2010, 00:13
Count me in (defense against religious bigotry and state repression, and not promoting growth).

hatzel
27th December 2010, 14:53
Well, I wouldn't actively promote its growth, either...

...in fact, I don't think even Bahá'ís promote its growth. For some reason I think it's forbidden in the faith to actively seek new members, and instead they can only sit around and wait until people come and ask them questions, and then they can answer the questions. But the whole Jehovah's Witnesses-esque approaching people isn't done. I think. I'll look that up sometime, for 'proof'...

sosialisti
28th December 2010, 00:08
Bahá'ís have been doing same kind of door-to-door teaching campaigns what Jehovah's Witnesses are doing.

Also this quote from "Mahatma Gandhi and the Baha'is: Striving towards a Nonviolent Civilization" (published by Baha'i Publishing Trust of India) could give some more perspective on Bahá'ís relation to social activism:

"In contrast, Bahá'ís have had a century-long history of obedience to even extremely
oppressive and unjust governments. Bahá'ís have never engaged in any
form of organized civil disobedience."

Rafiq
28th December 2010, 00:24
Wow.

This religion probably makes more sense than any other.

hatzel
28th December 2010, 01:54
Bahá'ís have been doing same kind of door-to-door teaching campaigns what Jehovah's Witnesses are doing.

Hmm...I'm not surprised, as I was thinking that Bahá'u'lláh, from what I understand, pretty much did exactly that on a world scale, but my local community told me that the 'independent investigation of truth' idea extended even as far as this. Letting people independently come across the faith, rather than teaching it to them as fact. But maybe that's just as excuse, and my local people are just too lazy to get off their bums and start telling people about the Faith :rolleyes:



EDIT:

Okay, it's mentioned here (http://www.bromleybahai.org.uk/about-baha-is/principles/): 'Bahá'ís do not preach or try to convert others'

I realise that this gives away the vital information of which Bahá'í community I live nearest to, but hey, I'm one of a few hundred thousand, I don't think anybody will find me from that gem of information...

Die Neue Zeit
28th December 2010, 03:13
Bahá'ís have been doing same kind of door-to-door teaching campaigns what Jehovah's Witnesses are doing.

Also this quote from "Mahatma Gandhi and the Baha'is: Striving towards a Nonviolent Civilization" (published by Baha'i Publishing Trust of India) could give some more perspective on Bahá'ís relation to social activism:

"In contrast, Bahá'ís have had a century-long history of obedience to even extremely oppressive and unjust governments. Bahá'ís have never engaged in any form of organized civil disobedience."

That's worse than Gandhi's own reputation.

Robert
28th December 2010, 04:27
It's based on mysticism so it cannot coexist with communism. But communism isn't going anywhere so it doesn't matter.

On a more positive note, both members of the wonderful 70's duo, Seals & Croft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seals_and_Crofts), are "of" the Bahá'í religion. According to Wiki, they have been public advocates of the faith. I don't see how that squares with the policy against proselytization, but anyway ....

I think you can hear a little peace, love and harmony in their ... well, their harmonies! Very honest and good music. To the extent their faith helped produce this music, I am all for it. I don't mean to hijack your post, but these are the most prominent Bahá'ís that I know., and their music has meant a lot to a whole lot of people. And that word sure is a pain to type.

BthCLLO-PY0

ComradeMan
2nd January 2011, 17:46
Isn't the Bahai faith very intollerant of issues around homosexuality however?

Sexual relationships are permitted only between a husband and wife, and thus premarital (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premarital) and homosexual (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual) sex are forbidden

They also sound very puritanical on some issues:-



Bahá'ís are forbidden to drink alcohol (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcoholic_beverage) or to take drugs, unless prescribed by doctors.
Gambling (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambling) is forbidden.
Fanaticism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanaticism) is forbidden.
Adherence to ritual (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ritual) is condemned, with the notable exception of the obligatory prayers.
Abstaining from partisan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partisan_%28political%29) politics.

No disrespect intended to Bahai people but I don't see anything here particularly "leftist" at all, this could be said of other religions too, I know.

Abstaining from politics is intriguing however.

sosialisti
2nd January 2011, 21:19
About the Bahá'í Faith and homosexuality you can read more from website gaybahai.net

Sir Comradical
2nd January 2011, 22:23
It's relatively more civilised than the Abrahamic faiths owing to its syncretic embrace of every single religious deity/figure in history - they embrace the teachings of Jesus, Mohammad, Moses, Krishna, Buddha etc. But seriously what's the point? The best of their religion boils down to being nice to people while they still retain many of the reactionary views of Christianity and Islam with regards to homosexuals. Secondly their faith teaches them to be obedient to the government which means they end up supporting the status-quo. They want an end to inequality without actually fighting for it or getting involved in politics. lol.

Palingenisis
2nd January 2011, 22:39
Count me in (defense against religious bigotry and state repression, and not promoting growth).

Why? The promotion of their issues particularly by zionists is being used to build public opinion for an Imperialist attack on Iran.

Robert
3rd January 2011, 01:20
Why? The promotion of their issues particularly by zionists is being used to build public opinion for an Imperialist attack on Iran.

Strangest post ever. Well done.:thumbup1:

ComradeMan
3rd January 2011, 08:50
Why? The promotion of their issues particularly by zionists is being used to build public opinion for an Imperialist attack on Iran.

Hey Zionists eat halva too- let's boycott halva and denounce anyone who enjoys the tasty Middle-Eastern treat.

Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_Iran#Religious_affiliations)
2% Non-Muslim minorities include Zoroastrians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrians_in_Iran), Jews (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_Jews), Bahá'ís (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bah%C3%A1%27%C3%AD_Faith), Mandeans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandean), Christians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian) and Yarsan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yarsan). The Bahá'í Faith (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bah%C3%A1%27%C3%AD_Faith), Iran's largest religious minority with a population around 300 000, is not officially recognized, and has been persecuted during its existence in Iran. Since the 1979 revolution the persecution of Bahá'ís (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Bah%C3%A1%27%C3%ADs) has increased with executions, the denial of civil rights and liberties, and the denial of access to higher education and employment.

I guess it just serves them right... how dare they go outside the "mainstream"....

sosialisti
13th January 2011, 20:10
"You'll recall that the U.S. was 'dragged' into WWII with the attack on Pearl Harbor. Our boys were sleeping off Saturday night while the enemy schemed -- but America soon woke up. So when you see the U.S. in Cambodia or in Vietnam -- or when you see America's young men in Lebanon, or knocking around in the Balkans -- 'please, will you be quiet and let God do His work!'"
- Glenford Mitchell
Retired Member of the Universal House of Justice
Baha'i Faith

Sir Comradical
14th January 2011, 03:06
"You'll recall that the U.S. was 'dragged' into WWII with the attack on Pearl Harbor. Our boys were sleeping off Saturday night while the enemy schemed -- but America soon woke up. So when you see the U.S. in Cambodia or in Vietnam -- or when you see America's young men in Lebanon, or knocking around in the Balkans -- 'please, will you be quiet and let God do His work!'"
- Glenford Mitchell
Retired Member of the Universal House of Justice
Baha'i Faith

As I said earlier, they end up supporting the status quo.

Twin City Lines
11th February 2011, 22:44
Bahais are militantly anti-racist and have a history of explicitly promoting interracial marriages. They were some of the first people to challenge the laws against such in the southern USA. They at least deserve credit for doing something positive.

Das war einmal
11th February 2011, 22:49
It's a sect really. The followers try to tie all previous religions together. pre-marriage sex is prohibited and they are told not to meddle with politics at all.

Sinister Cultural Marxist
12th February 2011, 04:03
They're also ruthlessly persecuted in Iran

Sosa
16th February 2011, 07:47
They hold some reactionary views, like mentioned earlier, their stance against homosexuality

Widerstand
16th February 2011, 10:32
"You'll recall that the U.S. was 'dragged' into WWII with the attack on Pearl Harbor. Our boys were sleeping off Saturday night while the enemy schemed -- but America soon woke up. So when you see the U.S. in Cambodia or in Vietnam -- or when you see America's young men in Lebanon, or knocking around in the Balkans -- 'please, will you be quiet and let God do His work!'"
- Glenford Mitchell
Retired Member of the Universal House of Justice
Baha'i Faith

Of course a similar quote could've been spit out by just about every other American Politician and doesn't prove fuck all, but hey.


It's a sect really. The followers try to tie all previous religions together. pre-marriage sex is prohibited and they are told not to meddle with politics at all.

Oh my, poor Krimskrams here seems to be going to hell then.


They're also ruthlessly persecuted in Iran

Well then fuck those reactionaries!