Turkomans dead in kirkuk

[IPkurd]

[LINK]http://www.hurriyetim.com.tr/haber/0,,[email protected]~305115,00.asp[LINK]

turkomens think kirkuk is turkish :angry: its always been kurish until saddam moved arabs there and the turks moved turkomens there (thier is not much evidence for this but its true) and i surpose saddam moved turkomens there aswell :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

now im waiting for highway star to make a rediculous comment aobut turkey

[Dhul Fiqar]

How's this for a substitute:

Fuck Turkey.

;)

--- G.

[IPkurd]

Thats what i think of turkey all the time (although i was born in turkey) and until a kurdistan is formed im from turkey..........dame it

[Dhul Fiqar]

Kurdistan is Kurdistan. Palestine is Palestine.

Just because Turkey and Israel are occupying and slaughtering the inhabitants of these countries (and have pressured the world into not recognizing them as states) doesn't mean they don't exist, so in fact you were not born in Turkey, just under occupation :)

Inshallah, there will be both a free Kurdistan and a free Palestine in our lifetime, and the issue will no longer be of relevance.

Ma3a salama

--- G.

[IPkurd]

Inshallah are you muslim and a commie? or is that the only turkish/arabic you know :D
anyway i try to feel that i come from kurdistan but i guess the other kurds around make me feel diffrent

[highway star]

[/QUOTE]its always been kurish
hey it isnt kurdish or turkish or arabic or americans.there r turkish,kurdish and ... can live together.people can live together.but in there most people turkish and kurdish.heyyyyyyyy guys.what r doing?kurds and turks r brothers.but other countries forced us fight .
and dhul fiqar:r u stupid?u cant show turkey like israel.ok.i agree the government and AKP isnt good.we must do the revulation we must kick religionioists and militarist from this country.but turks and kurds have same problems now in turkey.but now kurds in north iraq and talabani,barzani r dogs of usa forces.fuck'em all!


-where r u from dhul?-

[IPkurd]

turks and kurds are brothers but, the turk/turkomens hate the kurds and the kurds hate the turks, this is because turkish goverment influences turks 2 discriminate agaisnt us and the turk goverment helps/aids/makes the turkomans do bad things in north iraq (south kurdistan). also kurdsih groups do the as but the turks were the first to fuck with us so we should fuck the turks back. <_<

[Deniz Gezmis]

Turks have always been claiming what does not belong to them.

[hawarameen]

turks and kurds brothers????
fuck that crap. i hate turkey and everything it stands for. we are their brothers when it suits them. no brother of mine would shoot me if i speak kurdish, he wouldnt rape our women, he wouldnt exploit me and he certainly wouldnt deny my existence.

kurds have no brothers, we have no friends but the mountains we use to hide from attacks by turkey and iraq.

who forced us to fight HS? who makes the policy for turkey? a TURKISH prime minister thats who, not any other country. when turkey opresses kurds in their own country who is to blame but the turkish government?
did the US or UK make it illeagal to speak kurdish? would they shoot you if you spoke kurdish? did they ban kurdish names and schools?
HS YOU ARE THE STUPID ONE, turkey is very much like israel, get educated.

IPKURD - you were born in KURDISTAN

[IPkurd]

The turkish goverment is controld by the powerful amry not really the prime minister, an amry general in turkey is more powerful then the prime minister. This is why the voteing in the contry has always not been fair.
hawarameen- i no i was born kurdistan but im dont no much of my language and i have lived just about all my life in england, but i still feel very much kurdish :)
what part of kurdistan where you born in

[Finality]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2003, 03:29 PM
The turkish goverment is controld by the powerful amry not really the prime minister, an amry general in turkey is more powerful then the prime minister. This is why the voteing in the contry has always not been fair.
Unfortunately, this is very true. The military is extremely powerful within Turkey. Turkey is not really a democracy, it is only so when it suits the purposes of propoganda.

[Dhul Fiqar]

I&#39;m with Hawar on this one :)

To answer the questions posed, I am a honkey, a cracker, a whitebread, a... well, you get the idea. But I have connections with Palestine, have some friends there that I have visited and it had a big impact on me. I read the Quran and etc., but I would not consider myself a Muslim for obvious reasons.

I was just trying to express solidarity with the Kurdish and Palestinian people, many of whom are religious :)

--- G.

[Severian]

OK, first of all, Iraqi Turkomens are not Turks from Turkey. They are not collectively responsible for everything the Turkish government does.

They are individual human beings with rights.

Regardless of what the demography of Kirkuk may have been in the past, it is not OK for the KDP and PUK to commit ethnic cleansing in order to gain/regain a Kurdish majority in the city. Nor is it in the interests of working people to support an ethnically pure Kurdish northern Iraq.

Self-determination, an independent and united Kurdistan, yes. Expelling everyone who&#39;s not Kurdish, trampling on the rights of the Arab and Turkmeni minorities of northern Iraq, no.

Let&#39;s keep in mind who&#39;s leading this campaign against Turkmeni and Arabs. The leaders of the KDP and PUK. Two capitalist-nationalist parties with completely corrupt, venal leaderships that have always been willing to sell the Kurdish struggle to the highest bidder.

They worked with Turkey against the Kurdish Workers Party (PKK.) One of them, the KDP, even accepted aid from Saddam to gain advantage in its factional conflict with the PUK. In turn, the PUK was aided by Iran, which also suppresses its own Kurdish population.

Then both of them signed up for Uncle Sam&#39;s invasion of Iraq, even though the Kurdish struggle stood to gain nothing from this.

Why nothing? Because de facto independence had been achieved thanks to the conflict between Baghdad and Washington. Once that conflict is ended, it is now in Washington&#39;s interest to have the strongest, most centralized possible regime in Baghdad. Just as they supported Saddam before. It&#39;s no longer in Washington&#39;s interest to protect Kurdish autonomy.

Certainly Washington has no intention of allowing Kurdish independence. Or Iraqi independence, even.

So the KDP and PUK leaders are following in the footsteps of the Kosova Liberation Army: giving all hope of independence, becoming nothing but bootlickers and satraps of the new colonial master....as long as they get to continue enriching themselves, and do a little ethnic cleansing while they&#39;re at it.

[IPkurd]

Severian-ok its bad to kill innocent people but those kurdish citys were full kurdish citys and we just want our homes and land back hopefully in a peaseful manner which isnt happening. you&#39;ve got to see it in our eyes that we took shit from just about every country around us so you can see why we wanna give a little shit back.
Barzani and Talibani are bastards and they are not willing to work together just fight eachother because both think they are better then the other. they helped the turk goverment on the PKK issue which is even more sick concidering there fighting the same cause just on diffrent political ideollgies<--spelt worng i no.


Severian what do you think of the PKK statement that they will stop there ceasefire if the turk army keeps on attacking pkk areas of turkey, do you think another struggle should go ahead? well i do but i think we will lose very quickly because some members of pkk have givin themself to the turks because of the new law (pardon law) and the pkk funding would probaly be very low because of many reasons (kurdish drug mafia&#39;s have stopped funding pkk after apo&#39;s arrest and might not fund them this time round, it will take long to establish monet making schemes etc etc)

[the apricot]

First, I&#39;d like to salute all who have an rebellious soul against the authorities that lead people to live under the conditions that were programnmed by the emperialists..

I was hoping i would find a place where it&#39;s possible to focus on the concepts not offending people that have different point of views.. But I unfortunately observe here that some people still have biases and need to acquire broader overviews.

As a half-blood Kurd and Turk, I suggest some of you to take a look at the Turks and the Kurds&#39; situations in the region and realize the game being played on the future of these &#39;brother&#39; people.

Being unaware of the situation, people&#39;s unconscious comments based on socialist literature must not be the way towards the people&#39;s brotherhood.

Turkey, or Israel or any other country&#39;s actions should not concern us. That&#39;s not they way for people who struggle to find out a way to ease the effects of the long-lasting wars.

Regards

[IPkurd]

the apricot- we cant go from persicuion, genocide, rape and other evils&#39;s to brotherhood, well atleast not in the next 1o years.
and were are you from what country you live in?
and would you want an independant kurdistan to be formed?

[FistFullOfSteel]

"support all countries fighting against U.S"

[hawarameen]

i am not suporting the ethnic cleansing of turkomen or arabs in kirkuk.
what i strongly support is the rights of those hundreds of thousands who were thrown out of cities like kirkuk and who were forced to live in camps for as long as 20 years to be able to go back to their homes.

and i want to emphasise THEIR homes. by this i mean the house they were thrown out of, or at the very least be given homes in the city they were evicted from.
i understand that very many of the turkomen and arabs that were given houses that belonged to kurds and the tens of thousands of pounds and cars etc.. had little choice but if arabs and turkomen wish to leave, then they shouldnt be stopped

[Vanzetti]

(So sorry if I am confusing you.. I just changed my username from &#39;the apricot&#39; to &#39;Vanzetti&#39;)

I think I have to first introduce myself a bit. I was born and grew up in Ýstanbul as the son of a Kurdish father and Turkoman mother in 1979.

Turkey or Israel or the USA theirselves alone are not what we must show hatred. I dont care for my ethnic origin and I dont find you right to insult my country. Many people including myself dont support all the actions made by these countries.

All I believe is that all the human beings have the right to live in humane way. What I love are my country and my people not the politicians o the soldiers.

You may have thought that the reason why I think so is the fact that I am a half blood Kurds and Turk. My nationality is not a thing that I myself have chosen. It is something people get by birth and I never see any reasoning on insulting a country. Since I think this is an immature matter I am stopping here to talk over thiðs subject.

Peace
Vanzetti

[Severian]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2003, 05:41 PM
i am not suporting the ethnic cleansing of turkomen or arabs in kirkuk.
what i strongly support is the rights of those hundreds of thousands who were thrown out of cities like kirkuk and who were forced to live in camps for as long as 20 years to be able to go back to their homes.

and i want to emphasise THEIR homes. by this i mean the house they were thrown out of, or at the very least be given homes in the city they were evicted from.

Yes, compensation is necessary, and maybe even returning property. Some organized way to determine what property rightfully belongs to who, etc.

That&#39;s not what the KDP and PUK are actually doing, though. Nor is it the kind of policy that can come from the general "Fuck All Turks" attitude expressed in this thread.


i understand that very many of the turkomen and arabs that were given houses that belonged to kurds and the tens of thousands of pounds and cars etc.. had little choice but if arabs and turkomen wish to leave, then they shouldnt be stopped

Y&#39;know, that&#39;s what the Israeli state says too, that the Palestinian refugees left "voluntarily."