Hugo Chavez moves out of Presidential Palace to make room for flood victims

[IronEastBloc]

Call it a publicity stunt, call it propaganda, call it what you want--I don't know any other world leader who'd do this.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-11974818


Venezuela's Chavez to move into Gaddafi tent


Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez says he is going to govern temporarily from a tent so that families made homeless by recent floods can take refuge in his office.

Mr Chavez said he would have a Bedouin tent given to him by the Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi put up in the garden of the presidential palace.
Twenty-five families are already living in the palace after losing their homes.
The floods have made more than 100,000 people homeless across the country.
"Put up Gaddafi's gift," said Mr Chavez during a visit to a refuge for flood victims close to the Miraflores palace in Caracas.
"You can install it in the garden at Miraflores because I'm going to move into the tent. We can put some beds in my office."
Mr Chavez is an admirer of Col Gaddafi, who lives in a huge Bedouin tent in Libya, and brought one with him when he visited Venezuela last year.
The Venezuelan leader has been personally supervising relief efforts in response to the floods.


The worst rains in a decade have caused widespread destruction and killed more than 30 people.
Some of the worst damage has been in poor hillside neighbourhoods of Caracas, where landslides have swept away precarious houses.
Mr Chavez has promised a massive home-building programme, and on Friday appointed culture minister Francisco Sesto to the new role of minister for reconstruction in Caracas.
Neighbouring Colombia and much of Central America have also suffered from one of their worst May-November rainy seasons in decades.

[RadioRaheem84]

Amazing. Yes, you're right, no other head of State would ever do this.

[piet11111]

Has he been doing other things to house the homeless like nationalise hotels to house them ?

[scarletghoul]

Has he been doing other things to house the homeless like nationalise hotels to house them ?

CARACAS, Venezuela – President Hugo Chavez said Sunday that he would force privately owned hotels to help shelter tens of thousands of Venezuelans who have left their homes due to floods and mudslides caused by weeks of torrential rains. "I want the tourism hotels," Chavez said during a visit to the coastal state of Miranda. He said his government would pay for flood victims to remain at the hotels until the rains subside. "We will occupy them under lease."
Chavez also announced that his government would build apartments near Simon BolivarInternational Airport, the country's largest and busiest airport, and other residential complexes inside El Avila National Park, a mountainous swath of land separating Caracas from the coast.
He lashed out at the opposition, which has criticized the government's handling of the floods. He said wealthy Venezuelans have done little to help ease the effects of the floods.
"You people from the upper class should have already offered your golf courses to set up tents" for those driven from their homes, he said.http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101206/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_venezuela_floods

[piet11111]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101206/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_venezuela_floods

Well nationalizing those hotels would have been better but he is doing really well for as far as i can tell.

[gorillafuck]

That's kind of funny considering that he was being criticized for being in the Presidential Palace when he initially started housing them. And now he's not in it anymore.

[Sosa]

That's kind of funny considering that he was being criticized for being in the Presidential Palace when he initially started housing them. And now he's not in it anymore.

Why is there a presidential garden in the first place? lol thats what the haters would say

[Burn A Flag]

I think I would faint if a US president camped out on the white house lawn and let poor people stay in the white house!

[Ninel]

I think I would faint if a US president camped out on the white house lawn and let poor people stay in the white house!
Can I ask why that is?

[Burn A Flag]

Because I would be very suprised.:rolleyes:

[red cat]

Chavez probably lurks here and came across the thread with posters criticizing him for living in a palace. :lol:

[Robocommie]

Why is there a presidential garden in the first place? lol thats what the haters would say

Douchebag lives in a bedouin tent, must be nice. :p

[Spawn of Stalin]

Hmm, strange, there is a distinct lack of cynical bastards in this topic. Oh Hugo...

[The Vegan Marxist]

I think I would faint if a US president camped out on the white house lawn and let poor people stay in the white house!

Only time I would ever truly walk up to President Obama and shake his hand in absolute respect.

[synthesis]

Does anyone know who specifically these people are or how they were chosen? Since over a hundred thousand people were displaced by the floods, I wouldn't rule out the possibility that there's more to this story than sheer presidential magnanimity. I would be very surprised if any of the 25 families were not at least political supporters of Chavez.

[Coggeh]

Call it a publicity stunt, call it propaganda, call it what you want--I don't know any other world leader who'd do this.
How charitable. Is it so amazing that another human being would move out of a palace given to them to let flood victims have refuge? And yes it is a publicity stunt.

[Crux]

Only time I would ever truly walk up to President Obama and shake his hand in absolute respect.
I bet. Wait, what "truly"? You've done so falsely?

[IronEastBloc]

How charitable. Is it so amazing that another human being would move out of a palace given to them to let flood victims have refuge? And yes it is a publicity stunt.

cynical asshole! you're just in time. we were wondering where you were. :rolleyes:

[Crux]

Being an admirer of Colonel Gaddafi is not a good thing. Unless you mean his hats. But still yeah good thing done by Chavez. Oh and IronEastBlock, don't you feel at least a little bit hysterical? Because I think you're pretty hysterical.

[scarletghoul]

People underestimate the significance of 'publicity stunts'. It shows clearly the ideological principles and orientation of the Chavez movement. Other world leaders would not even have thought of letting homeless people live in the palace. In this 'publicity stunt', Chavez literally places homeless people at the highest office of political power and glory. We can debate whether his concrete political actions match the ideology of this move (I would argue that they do), but the ideological forces and implications of this are important in themselves. The people are being invited into the pinnacle of political power, the palace is not some majestic royal thing above the common people, it is the peoples' palace. This sends a message to the people that the state is theirs.

[synthesis]

It shows clearly the ideological principles and orientation of the Chavez movement

Bourgeois reformism?

[scarletghoul]

ok synthesis thanks for taking the time to address and debate my point rather than just responding with a useless opportunistic 2-word post

wait

[synthesis]

What do you mean? I think the symbolism you mentioned is typical of bourgeois reformism.

[Nolan]

Does anyone know who specifically these people are or how they were chosen? Since over a hundred thousand people were displaced by the floods, I wouldn't rule out the possibility that there's more to this story than sheer presidential magnanimity. I would be very surprised if any of the 25 families were not at least political supporters of Chavez.

It is simply a political stunt. Those that are staying in the palace are probably not displaced people at all, but PSUV members posing as refugees.

[Sosa]

It is simply a political stunt. Those that are staying in the palace are probably not displaced people at all, but PSUV members posing as refugees.

:laugh:

[synthesis]

I'm not saying it's just a PR move. Should I not be thinking critically, however, when the head of state of a capitalist country announces to the world the bottomless depth of his altruism?

[Crux]

Seriously I am more worried by the "Chavez moves into a tent because he thinks Gaddafi is cool"-part.

[The Vegan Marxist]

Seriously I am more worried by the "Chavez moves into a tent because he thinks Gaddafi is cool"-part.

There's a difference between "thinking he's cool" and respecting Gaddafi for choosing to live in a tent rather than some palace.

[The Vegan Marxist]

It is simply a political stunt. Those that are staying in the palace are probably not displaced people at all, but PSUV members posing as refugees.

I seriously hope you were joking. Because this is by far one of the most ignorant bullshit I've heard against Chavez and the PSUV.

[synthesis]

I seriously hope you were joking

I'm pretty sure he was.


There's a difference between "thinking he's cool" and respecting Gaddafi for choosing to live in a tent rather than some palace.

To be fair, Bedouin tents are a little different from "take your suburban and get in touch with nature" tents.

https://www.routestravel.com/uploads/images/Bedouin%20tent.jpg

[Wanted Man]

Sheltering people and building houses? What a populist reformist jerk. If he were a real communist he would let them starve until the spontaneous worldwide revolution occurs. They can't harbour illusions in bourgeois reformism when they're dead.

[Nolan]

I seriously hope you were joking. Because this is by far one of the most ignorant bullshit I've heard against Chavez and the PSUV.

Are you denying Chavez is a corrupt dictator?

[Diello]

To be fair, Bedouin tents are a little different from "take your suburban and get in touch with nature" tents.

https://www.routestravel.com/uploads/images/Bedouin%20tent.jpg

I want one of those!

[Spawn of Stalin]

What do you mean? I think the symbolism you mentioned is typical of bourgeois reformism.
I don't think it's particularly "typical" of anything, at least nothing I know of. When was the last time you heard of a palace-dwelling politician giving up his home is favour of a tent, for the benefit of others?

It is simply a political stunt. Those that are staying in the palace are probably not displaced people at all, but PSUV members posing as refugees.
It's a bourgeois conspiracy! Lies promoted by Venezuelan imperialism!

What's next? People going to start saying this was a reactionary move because "it doesn't bring the workers any closer to owning the means of production":trotski::trotski::trotski::marx::reda:. Fuck off.

[IronEastBloc]

Are you denying Chavez is a corrupt dictator?

I'm so sick of this fucking drivel I hear from everyone nowadays... maybe he isn't a communist politician, but slowly he is seeing the light; a dictator though? how the hell was he a dictator? he's won every election he's ever been up for, internationally observed by OAS and the EU.

Now can you prove he's a dictator like you said?

[Crux]

What's next? People going to start saying this was a reactionary move because "it doesn't bring the workers any closer to owning the means of production":trotski::trotski::trotski::marx::reda:. Fuck off.
Barking around the wrong tree are we?

[Nolan]

Damn, I'm surprised you people didn't catch that one.

[IronEastBloc]

Damn, I'm surprised you people didn't catch that one.


...so it was sarcasm?

[Spawn of Stalin]

Barking around the wrong tree are we?
Perhaps a little, though one can hardly blame me, the amount of flak Chavez takes for his progressive actions (no matter how small) greatly outweighs the amount he takes for the actual genuine mistakes he makes. It's almost as if people have come to terms with the fact that he is only human, he is only one man and that nobody is a perfect socialist, so instead they concentrate on denouncing his small gestures, and criticising the fact that these gestures needed to be made in the first place, as if everything was his fault. But like I said, he is only a man.

[synthesis]

Sheltering people and building houses? What a populist reformist jerk. If he were a real communist he would let them starve until the spontaneous worldwide revolution occurs. They can't harbour illusions in bourgeois reformism when they're dead.

I'm all in favor of capitalist politicians allowing displaced families into the Presidential Palace. I'm not in favor of it being used as a PR maneuver and I'm not in favor of communists tripping over themselves to hero-worship the man.

[Imposter Marxist]

Damn, I'm surprised you people didn't catch that one.

You have produced many lawls for me, thus, you shall be rewarded with rep.

[~Spectre]

It's been said already but this is definitely confirmation that Chavez reads Revleft. Good work everyone.

[Outinleftfield]

The Capitalist United States would never respond that well to a disaster. Example, Katrina.

[Outinleftfield]

I posted about this. http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/TLEQHB9L3B34C2VCT (http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/TLEQHB9L3B34C2VCT)

This is a news forum site where anyone can post. There's a lot of people from all over the political field on here, but mostly mainstream. Hope some people will support me here.

[Black Sheep]

This begs the question 'why did he move in the presidential palace to begin with'
There must have been homeless people before the flood, and if not, there must have been people living in far worse conditions than average.

[Cane Nero]

This begs the question 'why did he move in the presidential palace to begin with'
There must have been homeless people before the flood, and if not, there must have been people living in far worse conditions than average.

These recent rains, which were one of the worst in a decade, drew media attention to Venezuela.
So Huguito just joined the useful to the pleasant ....

[Volcanicity]

The Capitalist United States would never respond that well to a disaster. Example, Katrina.
Not just the US but any any Capitalist country.It's about time even the most rabid anti-chavist give's him and Venezuela the credit they deserve.

[Wanted Man]

I'm all in favor of capitalist politicians allowing displaced families into the Presidential Palace. I'm not in favor of it being used as a PR maneuver and I'm not in favor of communists tripping over themselves to hero-worship the man.

Good for you, son.

How is it even "being used as a PR maneuver"? The only thing I can gather from the article is that he announced it. What an awful man!


This begs the question 'why did he move in the presidential palace to begin with'

Umm, to work perhaps?

[theAnarch]

Are you denying Chavez is a corrupt dictator?
No more than Enver Hoxha:D

In Hugo's defence they were building houses and nationalizing unused apeartment buildings before this.

Qudaffi isnt some revolutionary leader, but as far as governments in Africa go, Libya's is better than most.

[Cane Nero]

Umm, to work perhaps?
Of course, Chavez can not work without a palace and all the privileges within it.

[Fulanito de Tal]

I don't care if he let those people stay in the palace as a publicity stunt, because he gets sexually aroused by it, or because a demon in a nightmare told him that if he didn't he would be tortured. He let those people stay there and those are families that are being assisted through a crisis. Shit...if only leaders would get boners/wet everytime they did something to advance leftist politics, we'd be much further and sexier.

He's done more for the left than I have accomplished, so I'll pay him a little respect...but not through a paypal, visa, or mastercard account :lol:

[Wanted Man]

Of course, Chavez can not work without a palace and all the privileges within it.

He could, but why move out of a location that's already there, where all the presidents have worked for decades? What, just to make some kind of empty statement for you? I bet if the government moved to some grey office block, people would still be here condemning it as a populist move.

[synthesis]

Good for you, son.

How is it even "being used as a PR maneuver"? The only thing I can gather from the article is that he announced it. What an awful man!

I don't respect people who do charitable things in order to tell everyone else about it.

[Cane Nero]

He could, but why move out of a location that's already there, where all the presidents have worked for decades?

Could use the palace as a tourist spot maybe.



What, just to make some kind of empty statement for you? I bet if the government moved to some grey office block, people would still be here condemning it as a populist move.

No my friend, you misunderstand. I oppose privileges.
The money spent on these privileges could be used in social interests. And, of course, maintaining this palace should not cost cheap.

[Black Sheep]

He could, but why move out of a location that's already there, where all the presidents have worked for decades? What, just to make some kind of empty statement for you? I bet if the government moved to some grey office block, people would still be here condemning it as a populist move.
Wonderful double standards, wonderful!

I have no idea about the presidential palace in venezuela, but:
Moving out of the palace in case of flood, suggests that the palace has lots of room and space, fitting to house the elite in a class based society.
Now considering a delegate communist management group, it would be logical to say that they would choose not to establish their "base of operations" in a fucking palace, but to find a place more suitable spacially to the work they'll be doing, and utilize the palace in a better way.Like, house the homeless,turn it into a restaurant, a museum, i don't know.

That's all i was saying, and you made a pathetic rationalization, because it made Venezuelan leadership look bad.
For fuck's sake!

[Bardo]

As mentioned earlier in the thread, I can't imagine a US president taking in a single homeless person into the White House. Let alone camping out so that multiple families can occupy the house. He would be too busy preparing a speech about how unkind and unfair Chavez is to his own people.


And yes it is a publicity stunt.

Who cares? In the US a presidential publicity stunt is walking around a bad neighborhood for a half hour while shaking hands with the locals before getting back into the limo to leave them in the dust.

[Burn A Flag]

Seriously, this is supposed to be a leftists forum. Doesn't that mean we should be supporting progressive forces critically? Sure, Chavez may not be a hard line Hoxhaist and some of us may have a problem with that. However, just because you don't like certain things about his government doesn't mean you can't praise the progressive changes in Venezuela, like the huge reduction in poverty rates and greater women's rights. If we tear everyone we dislike one thing about apart, there isn't going to be much of a left in the world.

[Black Sheep]

Seriously, this is supposed to be a leftists forum. Doesn't that mean we should be supporting progressive forces critically? Sure, Chavez may not be a hard line Hoxhaist and some of us may have a problem with that. However, just because you don't like certain things about his government doesn't mean you can't praise the progressive changes in Venezuela, like the huge reduction in poverty rates and greater women's rights. If we tear everyone we dislike one thing about apart, there isn't going to be much of a left in the world.
That's what we're doing, we critically support.

Saying 'but look at these good things he's done, hurray!!' when presented with negatives, is not critically supporting.

[The Vegan Marxist]

Why do people even bother with the ultra-leftists on this forum? Obviously they're going to oppose Chavez no matter what. If he was to have given away the palace for the homeless, people would still cry "populist". I say let them grovel in their own sectarian bullshit and go about our own way. Obviously, those of us who support Chavez, realizes the importance in this news, along with the rest of the great things that's taken place in Venezuela. So just leave these people alone, because they're obviously not going to change their mind.

[Black Sheep]

Obviously they're going to oppose Chavez no matter what.
That is just pathetic and juvenile,and an attempt to evade a point made.
Thank you for proving the point i made.

[The Vegan Marxist]

That is just pathetic and juvenile,and an attempt to evade a point made.
Thank you for proving the point i made.

Really? Because all I've seen you people do is criticize him, even when he makes huge successes, such as this.

[synthesis]

huge successes, such as this.


Hugo Chavez moves out of Presidential Palace...

:confused:

[Black Sheep]

Really? Because all I've seen you people do is criticize him, even when he makes huge successes, such as this.
Who are the 'we people' exactly?And why does it matter what you have seen us do?

Huge successes such as this? Moving out of the presidential palace due to a flood is a huge success?WOW you blow my mind.
You are willing to alter the standards entirely when it comes to your favorite regime huh?

And i thought that communism implied rationality,reason and critical thinking.
I congratulate you.

[The Vegan Marxist]

I find it amazing that you find key words in a sentence and then completely take out the point of our arguments out of context. Nice way of showing that your reporting is just as reliable as Fox News. The importance isn't that he left the palace, but rather that he took the choice of letting people who are dying in his country by terrible weather into the palace, instead of himself.

[Luisrah]

It's very cool of him, but I would expect no less from someone with that type of ideology.

Although it's nothing even major.
The first president of Portugal didn't live in the palace, but lived in a house next to it and paid for it with his own money. He had no secretary, concilours or whatever, and he was advised to get a car for transportations, he accepted, but on the condition that he would pay for it. He wasn't even a leftist.

So although some people come and start saying that there shouldn't be a palace at all, let's not make the man god, because what he did was just a bit of what anyone with his conscience is obligated to do.

[Black Sheep]

The importance isn't that he left the palace, but rather that he took the choice of letting people who are dying in his country by terrible weather into the palace, instead of himself.

So it's important that he offered the palace to the people who needed shelter and decent living environment in the case of the flood ,

and it's anticommunist super-leftist anarcho-kiddyism to suggest that he should have offered the palace to the people who needed shelter and a decent living environment in the case of no flood.

WOw, natural destructions speed up the egalitarianist distribution?

[Milk Sheikh]

Chavez has a heart of gold; not many people in authority would ever considering doing a thing like that.

[DecDoom]

This made my week. Way to go, Chavez! :thumbup:

Out of curiosity, has any other leader ever done this before?

[Amphictyonis]

China should take notes:

http://www.revleft.com/vb/google-s-satellite-t146679/index.html

[IndependentCitizen]

Can I ask why that is?
Really.....:confused:

[synthesis]

I find it amazing that you find key words in a sentence and then completely take out the point of our arguments out of context.

You called it a "huge success." I call it a guy moving out of a palace.