Dictatorship of the Proletariat

[JerryBiscoTrey]

Can someone explain this in simple terms? I have a basic idea of what it is but i still get confused by this. Also, would this limit freedom at all?

Thanks!

[Conscript]

As the name implies, it is a post-revolutionary system in which the working class runs things and fights those who would change that. Yes, it would limit freedom, for the latter. Perhaps you can explain what you are confused about?

And hello from a fellow new jersey comrade :)

[JerryBiscoTrey]

As the name implies, it is a post-revolutionary system in which the working class runs things and fights those who would change that. Yes, it would limit freedom, for the latter. Perhaps you can explain what you are confused about?

And hello from a fellow new jersey comrade :)

Well i am just so used to the brainwashing "history class" idea of a dictator being one who limits the freedom of those he is dictating over, etc.

Yes hello comrade! We'll have to converse at a future date about Chris Christie but i dont want to get off topic ;)

[Conscript]

Well i am just so used to the brainwashing "history class" idea of a dictator being one who limits the freedom of those he is dictating over, etc.

Yes hello comrade! We'll have to converse at a future date about Chris Christie but i dont want to get off topic ;)

They almost have it right, except liberals refuse to acknowledge that a class can have a dictatorship. Two birds with one stone for them with that tactic, they get to romance to the proletariat about their 'great men' (like Reagan), and demonize the 'great men' of their enemy (like Stalin)! It's pretty stupid. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_man_theory)

Don't even get me started on Chris Christie ;)

[El Rojo]

the dictatorship of the proletariat = the dictatorship of the huge majority over the tiny minority, therefore cannot be considered the same as a conventional dictatorship (or at least i think so)

shit, loo at our current electoral turnouts in the west. the dict. of the proles is more democratic in a representative democratic sense

[Q]

To understand the "dictatorship of the proletariat", you'll need to recognize we currently live in the "dictatorship of the bourgeoisie". It expresses a class hegemony.

[ZeroNowhere]

The best article online on the subject currently is probably this one (http://www.marxisthumanistinitiative.org/alternatives-to-capital/karl-marx-the-state.html). It's quite easy to understand, but does a good job locating Marx's comments on the dictatorship of the proletariat within his overall analysis of the state. Essentially, the dictatorship of the proletariat is the enforcement of the interests of the proletariat, and hence of the expropriation of the expropriators, during revolution. In Marxian terminology, it is the enforcement of the particular interest of the proletariat as the general interest; I could explain this if you feel that the above article isn't clear enough, but I think that it does well enough in general.

[4 Leaf Clover]

Dictatorship of the Proletariat means that Proletariat takes all political power in pursuing it's ideas , continues prosecution of all counter-revolutionary elements , and takes sole responsibility for establishing socialism

[Manic Impressive]

To understand the "dictatorship of the proletariat", you'll need to recognize we currently live in the "dictatorship of the bourgeoisie". It expresses a class hegemony.

That is almost word for word what I was gonna say:thumbup:

[Stranger Than Paradise]

I think Dictatorship OF the proletariat has always been misunderstood.

I think it would more exact to say dictatorship BY the proletariat.

It is the stage after revolution that Marx explained. A stage where Capitalist reaction is repressed to ensure the victory of the revolution, by which point Communism can begin to be established and society will become "the administration of things" which will no longer constitute the need for a state.

Anarchists agree with a transitional phase towards Communism also, Anarchists usually differ from Marx in Marx's belief in this transitional phase constituting the need for a state.

[JerryBiscoTrey]

Oh okay so the dictatorship isnt necessarily one person? Or is it?

haha sorry if these questions are stupid i just feel like theyre important

[ZeroNowhere]

In fact, the reason why the term was used, as Hal Draper has demonstrated, was primarily to contradict the Blanquists. The Blanquists essentially advocated the 'educational dictatorship' of a small minority over the proletariat in order to achieve revolution. Hence, in periods where Blanquists were at large, Marx and Engels used the term 'dictatorship of the proletariat' to stress that they were in fact in favour of the rule of the proletariat as a whole, rather than simply a small minority at its head. In fact, Engels specifically contrasts the two here: "From Blanqui's assumption, that any revolution may be made by the outbreak of a small revolutionary minority, follows of itself the necessity of a dictatorship after the success of the venture. This is, of course, a dictatorship, not of the entire revolutionary class, the proletariat, but of the small minority that has made the revolution, and who are themselves previously organized under the dictatorship of one or several individuals."


A correspondent of the New York World sent in a longish dispatch about the banquet (“The Reds in Session”) with a considerable summary of Marx’s talk. About the Commune, Marx reiterated his view that “the Commune was the conquest of the political power of the working classes.” Its aim was to remove any “base for class rule and oppression”: “But before such a change could be effected a proletarian dictature would become necessary.” (The verbs are those of the reporter’s paraphrase.)

Thus Marx’s first use of the term since 1852 took place before an assemblage heavily weighted with Blanquist Communards, where “the name that set the whole assembly in motion like an electric shock was Blanqui’s” (in the words of the dispatch). Apparently Marx even used the French form of the term (dictature). He was once again confronting the Blanquist mind with his own conception of class dictatorship.
As it turns out, the use of the word 'dictatorship' did in fact make it quite clear that they were opposing Blanquism for socialists at the time, although since the Blanquists have more or less died out by now it tends to be misinterpreted. Indeed, the term itself has been attributed to Blanqui sometimes, although this is a myth.

[JerryBiscoTrey]

In fact, the reason why the term was used, as Hal Draper has demonstrated, was primarily to contradict the Blanquists. The Blanquists essentially advocated the 'educational dictatorship' of a small minority over the proletariat in order to achieve revolution. Hence, in periods where Blanquists were at large, Marx and Engels used the term 'dictatorship of the proletariat' to stress that they were in fact in favour of the rule of the proletariat as a whole, rather than simply a small minority at its head. In fact, Engels specifically contrasts the two here: "From Blanqui's assumption, that any revolution may be made by the outbreak of a small revolutionary minority, follows of itself the necessity of a dictatorship after the success of the venture. This is, of course, a dictatorship, not of the entire revolutionary class, the proletariat, but of the small minority that has made the revolution, and who are themselves previously organized under the dictatorship of one or several individuals."

As it turns out, the use of the word 'dictatorship' did in fact make it quite clear that they were opposing Blanquism for socialists at the time, although since the Blanquists have more or less died out by now it tends to be misinterpreted.

Thanks so much for the help! That article was great by the way!

[Leonid Brozhnev]

I think Dictatorship OF the proletariat has always been misunderstood.

I think it would more exact to say dictatorship BY the proletariat.


This is exactly how I used to see it and how I see it now. It's an easily misunderstood quote.

[Manic Impressive]

They are extremely important questions and they're not stupid.

When Marx wrote it he meant exactly what Q said the dictatorship of the proletariat not of one person and not of a small group of elites. Lenin advocated a vanguard party to represent the interests of the proletariat and all models since have been based on that structure.

[Desperado]

The differences between the meaning of today's "dictatorship" and the word in "dictatorship of the proletariat" is even more than just how it's concerning class (and not an individual). For example, someone once said (praisingly) of Marx that he had I think the fiery oratory skill of a "democratic dictator", something which sounds like complete drool in today's language (or look at some of the abused quotes concerning the word for which Bakunin is criticised).

[Victus Mortuum]

DOTP = Radical Democracy