Flouride

[Revy]

Okay this is what gets me...is that you can't honestly talk about subjects like this without being called a quack.

The dental establishment is quick to pull all kinds of crap on entire populations. Mercury fillings. Even if they realized it was dangerous they would not admit it because it would damage the common trust in the dental field.

I read a comment by someone they were raised by a dentist but their water wasn't flouridated so they were told to take flouride pills.

Flouride may be beneficial to your teeth, but that doesn't mean it is beneficial to your body.

That would be like saying it's great to swallow mouthwash, or toothpaste.

We don't really know what health effects lots of fluoride has every day.

To clarify I don't think flouride is the only problem with tap water. I could go on and on about how toxic tap water tends to be. Heavy metals, chemicals, pesticides, you name it. Some lefties bash bottled water and see themselves as more environmentally friendly by drinking tap water. Well my city is one of the worst cities in terms of water quality, it's in the top 10 worst in America. And the water tastes bad. I drink bottled for health reasons and I recycle the jugs. It also saves trash bags because water jugs take up a lot of space.

You could get a filter though, but some of them are made so you still get flouride. I hear Zero Water is a good one.

[lines]

You could get a water distillation device and as far as I know that would help get fluoride out. Water distillation heats water into steam in one container and then the steam travels to another container and becomes water.

Most water distillers cost between 150 and 250 dollars but some are more expensive.

Water distillation has been historically the way people got drinkable water from the ocean.

FLuoride isn't good I agree.

[bcbm]

flouride is part of a communist plot to sap and impurify our precious bodily fluids

[Revy]

I am sure humans didn't evolve on "pure" water. Some minerals (magnesium, calcium) are good to have in water but most of the minerals you get in tap water (like lead and arsenic) are the toxic ones.

Granted they are in tiny concentrations but even that is enough to alter your health.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

With the proliferation of fluoridated toothpaste and other products, it may be possible that some are over-fluoridating themselves unintentionally.

On the other hand, it is effective (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19772843) at slowing and preventing tooth decay.

[Os Cangaceiros]

The well that we used for drinking water where I grew up had a fair amount of naturally occuring flouride, and I've never had a cavity. (Which, unsuprisingly, my dentist attributes to the flouride.)

[lines]

Whether you agree with fluoridating the water or not... its a form of forced medication. People should be able to drink tapwater that is somewhat normal. If someone wants to add fluoride to their water they could just buy some to put in their water.

[x371322]

And the fillings they put in our teeth are actually a secret government plot to implant our heads with mind control devices so the illuminati can take over our thoughts and turn us into slaves for the new world order...

BOO!

Don't be so paranoid... I used to work at a water plant for a job program back in high school. We did nothing to the water that isn't necessary. All those scary "chemicals" make the water not kill you. We had to run lab tests (very thorough tests) every couple of hours on water samples to make sure all was good. I'm not saying the fluoride is a great thing to be doing, but hey, I'm not worried. :thumbup1:

[Revy]

Oh my....why the hyperbole?

This was exactly my point. I don't think the government does this for mind control. They do it because they're lax as shit when it comes to pollution.

Humans are not meant to drink from deep wells (wells closer to the surface are safer). That's why there is an epidemic of arsenic poisoned water in Bangladesh that is giving loads of people cancer , skin rashes and making them sick. Look it up, it's tragic.

[x371322]

Your OP wasn't about Bangladesh though. You mentioned how toxic our tap water is here in America... You make it sound like the water here is so deadly and scary, but that's quite an exaggeration. Our water may not be the best or cleanest in the world (far from it I'm sure), but it's safe.

As for Bangladesh I can only hope those conditions improve.

My hyperbole was meant in good nature. No disrespect intended. Just sharing my thoughts.

[WeAreReborn]

And the fillings they put in our teeth are actually a secret government plot to implant our heads with mind control devices so the illuminati can take over our thoughts and turn us into slaves for the new world order...

BOO!

Don't be so paranoid... I used to work at a water plant for a job program back in high school. We did nothing to the water that isn't necessary. All those scary "chemicals" make the water not kill you. We had to run lab tests (very thorough tests) every couple of hours on water samples to make sure all was good. I'm not saying the fluoride is a great thing to be doing, but hey, I'm not worried. :thumbup1:
Make the water NOT kill you? Where the hell do you get the water from that it can kill you without treatment? :blink: That is disturbing... Anyways, it has been shown fluoride is not healthy.
http://www.huliq.com/48463/fluoridation039s-unhappy-unhealthy-birthday
Sure it is good for your teeth but there are plenty of other non-fluoride toothpastes that work just as well and if you swallow them it won't harm you.

[Quail]

Make the water NOT kill you? Where the hell do you get the water from that it can kill you without treatment? :blink: That is disturbing... Anyways, it has been shown fluoride is not healthy.
http://www.huliq.com/48463/fluoridation039s-unhappy-unhealthy-birthday
Sure it is good for your teeth but there are plenty of other non-fluoride toothpastes that work just as well and if you swallow them it won't harm you.

To be fair, you'd have to swallow a lot of toothpaste and mouthwash for it to significantly harm you.

[x371322]

To be fair, you'd have to swallow a lot of toothpaste and mouthwash for it to significantly harm you.

Indeed. I had a friend in high school who once swallowed an entire tube of toothpaste for kicks and giggles. He's totally fine. Never even had a stomach ache.



Make the water NOT kill you? Where the hell do you get the water from that it can kill you without treatment? :blink: That is disturbing... Anyways, it has been shown fluoride is not healthy.
http://www.huliq.com/48463/fluoridation039s-unhappy-unhealthy-birthday
Sure it is good for your teeth but there are plenty of other non-fluoride toothpastes that work just as well and if you swallow them it won't harm you.

Yeah... you know... bacteria? The chemicals render the water biologically dead, and ergo, safe to drink.

And fluoride is also good for our bones. Research shows that fluoride deficiency can cause osteoporosis.

[WeAreReborn]

Indeed. I had a friend in high school who once swallowed an entire tube of toothpaste for kicks and giggles. He's totally fine. Never even had a stomach ache.




Yeah... you know... bacteria? The chemicals render the water biologically dead, and ergo, safe to drink.

And fluoride is also good for our bones. Research shows that fluoride deficiency can cause osteoporosis.
I know it won't damage you for in taking medium to small amounts I was just over generalizing to make a point. Anyways, your claim about Osteoporosis is not really solid. "A role in osteoporosis has been researched, but only the smallest of 3 trials (n=64) found a decrease in fractures, while the others found no difference (n=202) or an increase in fractures (n=354)." It shows it really didn't make that much of a difference. It also isn't an essential nutrient and sure it does prevent tooth decay but that should be kept in only toothpaste. Here is a quote talking about Fluoride deficiency, "The extent to which the condition truly exists, and its relationship to fluoride poisoning has given rise to some controversy." So your claims aren't really concrete. Is it deadly? No, not really but it isn't healthy to ingest it either. So it should be out of the water supply.

[Revy]

Your OP wasn't about Bangladesh though. You mentioned how toxic our tap water is here in America... You make it sound like the water here is so deadly and scary, but that's quite an exaggeration. Our water may not be the best or cleanest in the world (far from it I'm sure), but it's safe.

As for Bangladesh I can only hope those conditions improve.

My hyperbole was meant in good nature. No disrespect intended. Just sharing my thoughts.

Some localities have cleaner water than others.

You should read this article (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/us/17water.html?_r=1) and take a look at these pictures (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2009/12/17/us/20091217WATER_index.html). You may find it enlightening. Quite a stretch to call that water "safe" if by safe you mean healthy. I'm not saying the water will immediately kill you, but it will increase your risk of disease and cancer. my tap water is not as bad as this, it's clear, but it's still bad.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/12/17/nytfrontpage/31936822.JPG

^ this is tap water...in America.

[mikelepore]

I think the growing medical opinion about fluoride to prevent tooth decay is this: You should take a solution containing F -1 ions, once a day, swish it around in your mouth for a minute, then spit it out. The fluoride oral rinses sold over the counter say in the instructions be careful not to swallow it.

[Apoi_Viitor]

Yeah... you know... bacteria? The chemicals render the water biologically dead, and ergo, safe to drink.

The argument is about Water Fluoridation, not Water Treatment...


And fluoride is also good for our bones. Research shows that fluoride deficiency can cause osteoporosis.

Sure, but there are other ways to consume Fluoride...

Anyways, here's a few argument from Journal of Evidence Based Dental Practice, which I believe strongly support the notion that we should end Water Fluoridation.

- There are other ways of delivering fluoride besides the water supply;
- Fluoride does not need to be swallowed to prevent tooth decay;
- Tooth decay has dropped at the same rate in countries with, and without, water fluoridation;
- People are now receiving fluoride from many other sources besides the water supply;
- Studies indicate fluoride’s potential to cause a wide range of adverse, systemic effects;
- Since fluoridation affects so many people, “one might accept a lower level of proof before taking preventive actions.”

Also, the Wiki Entry is pretty good.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_fluoridation_controversy

[x371322]

Some localities have cleaner water than others.

You should read this article (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/us/17water.html?_r=1) and take a look at these pictures (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2009/12/17/us/20091217WATER_index.html). You may find it enlightening. Quite a stretch to call that water "safe" if by safe you mean healthy. I'm not saying the water will immediately kill you, but it will increase your risk of disease and cancer. my tap water is not as bad as this, it's clear, but it's still bad.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/12/17/nytfrontpage/31936822.JPG

^ this is tap water...in America.

Damn man. That shit sucks. I guess I should say the tap water in my city is safe. My mistake. I never realized it got that bad in the US. Clean water should always be a human right. :crying:

[x371322]

The argument is about Water Fluoridation, not Water Treatment...

Did you even read the op? Any of the thread discussion? Right in the first post Revy said:


To clarify I don't think flouride is the only problem with tap water. I could go on and on about how toxic tap water tends to be. Heavy metals, chemicals, pesticides, you name it.

Right off the bat this thread was about more than water fluoridation.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

Some localities have cleaner water than others.

You should read this article (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/us/17water.html?_r=1) and take a look at these pictures (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2009/12/17/us/20091217WATER_index.html). You may find it enlightening. Quite a stretch to call that water "safe" if by safe you mean healthy. I'm not saying the water will immediately kill you, but it will increase your risk of disease and cancer. my tap water is not as bad as this, it's clear, but it's still bad.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/12/17/nytfrontpage/31936822.JPG

^ this is tap water...in America.

Evidence that the US is a third world country. The worst tap water I've come across in the UK has been a bit cloudy due to water hardness (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_water), but still drinkable and never actually discoloured in such a fashion.

[Os Cangaceiros]

Labeling the USA as a third world country is kind of a strange classification, but whatev...

Anyway, yeah, none of this should come as a suprise to people. A lot of the tapwater usage here in Texas have been connected to an increased rate of birth defects in women. It's baaaaad, although as one of my friends said, it also probably has to do with everything that the water passes through before it exits your faucet.

I used to drink water that came directly out of a cliff. THAT was pure water.

[Amphictyonis]

Labeling the USA as a third world country is kind of a strange classification, but whatev...

Anyway, yeah, none of this should come as a suprise to people. A lot of the tapwater usage here in Texas have been connected to an increased rate of birth defects in women. It's baaaaad, although as one of my friends said, it also probably has to do with everything that the water passes through before it exits your faucet.

I used to drink water that came directly out of a cliff. THAT was pure water.

They process our shit water. They process things flushed don the toilet. Birth control, prescription drugs, all manner of everything. The thing is, what are the bottled water companies doing that the local water service isn't? We should demand higher standards so people don't have to buy so much bullshit when it comes to water. That would be "bad for the economy" though. Another reason capitalism is bunk.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

Labeling the USA as a third world country is kind of a strange classification, but whatev...

Seems appropriate to me. It certainly shares some properties; massive income disparities, a broken political system, and tapwater that's undrinkable.


I used to drink water that came directly out of a cliff. THAT was pure water.

It seems to depend mainly on the local geology around here. Granite-rich areas have the best tapwater, in my experience.

[Ovi]

And fluoride is also good for our bones. Research shows that fluoride deficiency can cause osteoporosis.
However, excess fluoride consumption weakens the bones (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoride_poisoning). Fluorine isn't a mineral that we need, so there's little reason to ingest it. There is no water fluoridation around here as far as I'm aware of and I, for one, don't want it. In the past, dental caries were far less prevalent (http://www.uic.edu/classes/osci/osci590/11_1Epidemiology.htm), one reason being the smaller amount of carbohydrates in the diet of those human beings. Especially sugar (which is probably the reason we don't have better protection against cavities right now, we didn't need it in the past, since prehistoric people didn't eat much cookies). If you want to eat sweets, brush your teeth afterwards and you'll probably have better protection against cavities than drinking fluoridated water.

[Os Cangaceiros]

Seems appropriate to me. It certainly shares some properties; massive income disparities, a broken political system, and tapwater that's undrinkable.

The reason I think classifying the U.S. as "third world" is weird is actually the same reason I think classifying any country today as "third world" is weird: it was a term used to describe the developing region that was the subject of power politics during the Cold War. Now that the Cold War is over, it seems kind of defunct.

[Yazman]

The reason I don't support fluoridation of tap water is simply because it amounts to forced medication, which to me is unethical.

[chegitz guevara]

We had yellow water when I first moved to Ft. Liquordale, but they rebuilt our water tank, and now it's better. Just rusty before. We had shallow wells in Jacksonville. I had to double filter that shit, and I probably should have just gotten bottled water. Nasty egg smell and taste. Wayyyy too much sulfur.

[Salyut]

We had yellow water when I first moved to Ft. Liquordale, but they rebuilt our water tank, and now it's better. Just rusty before. We had shallow wells in Jacksonville. I had to double filter that shit, and I probably should have just gotten bottled water. Nasty egg smell and taste. Wayyyy too much sulfur.

Hydrogen sulfide bro. I'm guessing there was natural gas operations in the area?