Unemployment

[John "Eh" MacDonald]

I'm sure I've read a thread on this site before on the subject but I cant seem to find it.

Is there a theory about how Communism and socialism can solve unemployment problems?

I believe what i read was along the lines of, in capitalism one man needs to work 9-12 hours a day to make it financially. But in Communism due to the world population each man would be able to work 3 hours a day since his needs are met?

Am I leaving anything out?

[Oswy]

I'm sure I've read a thread on this site before on the subject but I cant seem to find it.

Is there a theory about how Communism and socialism can solve unemployment problems?

I believe what i read was along the lines of, in capitalism one man needs to work 9-12 hours a day to make it financially. But in Communism due to the world population each man would be able to work 3 hours a day since his needs are met?

Am I leaving anything out?

Industrial capitalism has already advanced technology and organisation to meet everyone's needs, but because it is a system aimed at making profits for capitalists those needs remain unmet, tragically. Indeed, we already have overproduction in several sectors thanks to scientific, technological and organisational advance so the issue is more about the distribution of work rather than the need for everyone to do work. We really could have a society where people did only a couple of hours of labour a day (more if they wanted to) and still have everyone fed, clothed, sheltered, educated and medicined. Capitalists, of course, don't want that to happen.

[blake 3:17]

Is there a theory about how Communism and socialism can solve unemployment problems?

I believe what i read was along the lines of, in capitalism one man needs to work 9-12 hours a day to make it financially. But in Communism due to the world population each man would be able to work 3 hours a day since his needs are met?


We fight for full employment and a reduction in work hours. In a rational economy people would need to work less because a whole load of jobs would be made unnecessary and there'd be nobody to profit from unemployment. One of the basic irrationalities of capitalism is that unemployment is good for The Economy -- it pits worker against worker, makes working people afraid of falling into unemployment and poverty, and enables employers the ability to use scabs to undermine workers resistance.

We need to see jobs with living wages and decent work conditions as a social right, just as we need to see housing, education, food, freedom from violence and abuse, health care and education as social rights.

It gets more complicated when we look at the actual practices of socialist/communist countries. There are specific historical reasons why socialism has never been achieved but none of those constitute an argument against the possibility of socialism. It's just harder than many of us have thought.

Organizing democratic socialist production and services is very complicated. There are contradictions between a planned economy which would provide all the necessities of life for all and grass roots democracy in the workplace and communities. Reductions in the work week, production of goods that people actually want and need, and ecologically sound production are not exclusive of one another.

How we get there is another story..

[Die Rote Fahne]

Simple, everyone is able to train/recieve education for the profession they so desire. They then become a member of the union of that field and then they are given a job.

Make sense?

[RadioRaheem84]

How was Albania able to pull off 0 unemployment?

[Rakhmetov]

Capitalism creates a crisis of overproduction---- why? Because workers are not paid enough to buy back all the goods and services that capitalism produces.

Check out www.marxist.com (http://www.marxist.com) for answers

http://www.marxist.com/how-to-fight-unemployment180899.htm

http://www.marxist.com/grant-unemployment-debate.htm

[DaComm]

Capitalists drastically reduce their levels of productivity (that means boosting unemployment) to prevent a drop in profit rates caused by a commodity abundance. Socialist remuneration, that is, "to each according to his contribution" eliminates the need to produce for profit and create unecessary unemployment. Instead of limiting what we can potentially create, I feel that closely working consumer/worker councils can efficiently determine the total consumer demand, which could (because of technological advancements) be met using only a few hours of work per worker.

[Peace on Earth]

A moneyless economy would eliminate the harsh effects of unemployment, as you wouldn't need to work your ass off to survive. There could be rules that to gain (x) public services, you have to work (x) hours, but in that case there would be effective services to ensure you have a chance to do fullfilling work. More educational opportunities, especially for the unemployed, and job-service centers would allow citizens to find work they enjoy, or at the very least, do not mind.

[MarxSchmarx]

A moneyless economy would eliminate the harsh effects of unemployment, as you wouldn't need to work your ass off to survive. There could be rules that to gain (x) public services, you have to work (x) hours, but in that case there would be effective services to ensure you have a chance to do fullfilling work. More educational opportunities, especially for the unemployed, and job-service centers would allow citizens to find work they enjoy, or at the very least, do not mind.

The problem I've always had with these sorts of incentivized arguments is that it's actually not just "working (x) hours", it's working in socially productive capacities. Thus an hour's work of a palm reader justifiably be worth less than an hour of a clinical psychologist. On some level I am fine with this philosophy, but I think if desirable/comfortable work is seen as scarce you inherently create perverse incentives.

Another issue arises because very often novel insights come from seemingly useless and esoteric arenas - for example, the impact of Charles Darwin's theories on modern medicine. Ultimately I agree with other posters that the task at hand for a socialist society needs to be to minimize and share socially necessary work, allowing individuals to pursue what their hearts content during the rest of the time.

[blake 3:17]

Capitalism creates a crisis of overproduction---- why? Because workers are not paid enough to buy back all the goods and services that capitalism produces.

Hmmmm... Isn't it more like a lot of stuff that is produced nobody needs or wants?

[Tavarisch_Mike]

How was Albania able to pull off 0 unemployment?

I dont know if this is it, but what i always have heard about the eastern bloc-countries, they used to put two persons to managed a machine that just needed one. I think thats interesting since it shows the differences in thinking, the machine just neede one person according to capitalist menthality, but since the eastern bloc didnt have so much profit on theire agenda, they thought that its better that people can work in theire own tempo and by putting two pwrsons at the machine you also increased productivity and gave evrybody a job. Just a thought.

[Aurora]

Hmmmm... Isn't it more like a lot of stuff that is produced nobody needs or wants?

Not necessarily for example here in Ireland there are thousands and thousands of unsold houses all across the country that were built during the housing bubble which are derelict and waiting to rot even though the housing waiting lists have thousands of people on them. The only thing stopping people from good housing is private ownership and the profit motive.

To the OP unemployment is a capitalist construct i think blake 3:17 said it very well, i'd just add that in economic booms unemployment exists because of the need for what marx called a 'reserve labour army' that is used to force wages down etc while in economic busts its used more effectively for this purpose but also it increases because it's no longer profitable to employ people to make things which cant be sold.

In socialism unemployment wont exist because there is no reason for it too, the new society run by the workers wont need to break strikes and push wages down and by democratically planning the economy we will be able to produce according to need and not according to the market. In this way we can avoid the boom-bust cycle entirely and guarantee stable jobs and lower hours for all.