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View Full Version : Help! Need thoughs / quotes / etc. toward a thinger I'm writing.



The Garbage Disposal Unit
9th October 2010, 07:04
Neither reform, nor revolution. Rupture.

Neither right, nor left. Exit.

Neither apathy, nor activism. Insurrection.

Basically I need quotations, thoughts, etc. on the theme above, ideally in such a way as to tie in to any of the individual terms. For example:


A revolution is certainly the most authoritarian thing there is; it is the act whereby one part of the population imposes its will upon the other part by means of rifles, bayonets and cannon — authoritarian means, if such there be at all; and if the victorious party does not want to have fought in vain, it must maintain this rule by means of the terror which its arms inspire . . .

Works really well with (nor) revolution. Or, a thought:


I'm drawn to the term rupture because there is no corresponding identity attached to it - a person can be a revolutionary or a reformist, but there's no rupturist, only a realization in immediate practice.
This, of course, would fit with rupture.

The pairings, within the neither/nor, of course, are arranged in such a way that the obvious shit-option is first. I'm sure most of the folk on the board will agree the political right, reformism, and apathy are all dead ends. The left, and revolution, I recognize are much closer to peoples' hearts, and I'd like to pre-empt the shit-show: I want to speak about revolution as baggage we've inhereted from the realization of capitalism and the modern state - to understand revolutions as they have happened (and their results - France, America, The Soviet Union, China, and many other examples of something less than communism) instead of ideologically (the revolution that will be different than any of the others that have come before). Similarly, the left as the exists-in-practice left wing of capital, and activism as the extraparliamentary practice of those same Politics. If you want to argue the validity of this understanding, I mean, that's fine, but it probably won't help me with what I'm trying to write.

Thanks!

MarxSchmarx
9th October 2010, 07:24
Neither reform, nor revolution. Rupture.

Neither right, nor left. Exit.

Neither apathy, nor activism. Insurrection.

Basically I need quotations, thoughts, etc. on the theme above, ideally in such a way as to tie in to any of the individual terms. For example:



Works really well with (nor) revolution. Or, a thought:

I'm drawn to the term rupture because there is no corresponding identity attached to it - a person can be a revolutionary or a reformist, but there's no rupturist, only a realization in immediate practice.
This, of course, would fit with rupture.

The pairings, within the neither/nor, of course, are arranged in such a way that the obvious shit-option is first. I'm sure most of the folk on the board will agree the political right, reformism, and apathy are all dead ends. The left, and revolution, I recognize are much closer to peoples' hearts, and I'd like to pre-empt the shit-show: I want to speak about revolution as baggage we've inhereted from the realization of capitalism and the modern state - to understand revolutions as they have happened (and their results - France, America, The Soviet Union, China, and many other examples of something less than communism) instead of ideologically (the revolution that will be different than any of the others that have come before). Similarly, the left as the exists-in-practice left wing of capital, and activism as the extraparliamentary practice of those same Politics. If you want to argue the validity of this understanding, I mean, that's fine, but it probably won't help me with what I'm trying to write.

Thanks!

I honestly have no idea what you are getting at. Are you getting at something like:

Under capitalism, man exploits man; under communism, it is the other way around

John Kenneth Galbraith
or


I always have a quotation for everything - it saves original thinking. Dorothy L. Sayers

¿Que?
9th October 2010, 07:33
Neither right, nor left. Exit.


The lid on the social kettle is shut triple-tight, and the pressure inside continues to build. From out of Argentina, the specter of Que Se Vayan Todos is beginning to seriously haunt the ruling class.TCI (http://tarnac9.wordpress.com/texts/the-coming-insurrection/)

Mostly the Que Se Vayan Todos part. It's a popular protest chant in Argentina, which basically means "Let's get rid of all of them" referring to politicians.

The Garbage Disposal Unit
9th October 2010, 07:39
I honestly have no idea what you are getting at. Are you getting at something like:

Under capitalism, man exploits man; under communism, it is the other way around


No. Not even a little bit. Fuck.

MarxSchmarx
9th October 2010, 07:46
http://www.revleft.com/vb/revleft/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.revleft.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1890266#post1890266) I honestly have no idea what you are getting at. Are you getting at something like:
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Kenneth Galbraith
Under capitalism, man exploits man; under communism, it is the other way around No. Not even a little bit. Fuck.

Try being a little less cryptic. My original question stands.

¿Que?
9th October 2010, 07:54
No. Not even a little bit. Fuck.
What about my quote?:crying:

EDIT: n/m, just noticed your thanks.

The Garbage Disposal Unit
9th October 2010, 08:00
Try being a little less cryptic. My original question stands.

Sorry, my bad.
The problem with the quote in question was that I'm still coming at this from a communist perspective. I think the best bet is to focus on quotes from within a tradition that (likely unintentionally) emphasize what might be objectionable about them, or, in the case of rupture/exit/insurrection, what might differentiate them from the dichotomies we're normally presented with.
That said, I'm not looking exclusively for quotes either - any thoughts you have that might be compatible with the general thrust would be greatly appreciated too.

cenv
10th October 2010, 10:51
Good stuff; it's important to explicitly state that the overthrow of capitalism is something qualitatively new, not just the realization of "revolutionary" ideologies that have developed within the material parameters of capitalism. I like the idea of using "rupture," since using "revolution" can make it harder to move beyond the particular form bourgeois ideology has assigned it.


Neither right, nor left. Exit.This is catchy, but you should be careful not to present communism as a purely negative transformation. It's neither rightist nor leftist because it's a radically creative -- and as such, it has an inherently destructive component.

Anyway, here's a quote you might be able to work with:

"In revolution there are two types of people: those who make it and those who profit from it."

(Not sure the original source, but it was used during May '68).

Look forward to seeing your final product.

The Garbage Disposal Unit
14th October 2010, 06:23
BUMP.
So far so good - if people can keep it coming, I'd be super-thankful.
My inspiration is primarily for "doin' stuff," and less for writing lately, so the more I can borrow of other folks' brain-labour, the better.

ZeroNowhere
14th October 2010, 15:48
Wasn't the original quote by Fred? Anyhow, in a similar vein:

And Culture thus emerges
As soon as Man starts using purges.
-Karl Marx.

Pawn Power
19th October 2010, 05:52
Neither reform, nor revolution. Rupture.

Neither right, nor left. Exit.

Neither apathy, nor activism. Insurrection.



Sounds like some Paris '68 graffiti.