Humans suck

[etjusticepourtous]

Would an Utopia be ever possible? If not why are we wasting our fucking lives with life? So much pain, ignorance, stupidity, and violence.

[Apoi_Viitor]

Would an Utopia be ever possible?

Of course not, that's why Marx and Engels put forth the concept of Scientific Socialism, as a replacement to the early Utopian ideas that were tossed about previously.


So much pain, ignorance, stupidity, and violence.

DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT COMRADE!

[etjusticepourtous]

Of course not, that's why Marx and Engels put forth the concept of Scientific Socialism, as a replacement to the early Utopian ideas that were tossed about previously.



DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT COMRADE!

I have to do some reading. The oppressed will always betray you, why help them?

[bluerev002]

The oppressed will always betray you? How so comrade?

[Apoi_Viitor]

The oppressed will always betray you, why help them?

Proof?

[Kuppo Shakur]

The oppressed will always betray you, why help them?
I know, right? The other day I was helping some oppressed people, and they totally betrayed me.

[etjusticepourtous]

It depends, some people are brainwashed by political parties. Why steal from the same social class? Why harm people from the same social class? While the upper class drive their fancy cars and buy all their food with the people's money and they live untouched. With your good intentions known, they would not hesitate to side with a corrupt president and politician. There's also other factors like sociopathy, and ignorance. In sociopathy they just don't give a rats ass and kill you, and with ignorance they're so scared by what they say about communism and socialism that they turn you in. I was arrested in a third world country and I saw all of this.

[ContrarianLemming]

Capitalism sucks

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

I like humans a fuck of a lot more than I like house cats.
I mean, I guess the whole premise is ridiculous though, right? It's a matter not of "humans" or "cats" but forms of life ... and really, cats are just one ugly manifestation of this civilization.

[Chaz]

That just depends on your definition of 'Utopia'. The idea of everything being harmonious and 'good' or whatever is silly and unrealistic, yes, and I honestly feel like it would bore me to death were I to live in it.

[ContrarianLemming]

There is no empathy in Utopia.

[Hit The North]

Is it just me, or is everyone in this thread on acid?

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

Is it just me, or is everyone in this thread on acid?
Nope, its just you that's on acid.

[Hit The North]

That explains it.

[Summerspeaker]

The laws of physics as we know them allow for wonders well beyond the typical utopian vision. That's no guarantee, but worth remembering. Bourgeois fantasies that support the status quo deserve condemnation, but dreams also inspire revolutionary action. Ignore the so-called realism that enshrines oppression as an immutable fact of life.

[Plagueround]

The laws of physics as we know them allow for wonders well beyond the typical utopian vision. That's no guarantee, but worth remembering. Bourgeois fantasies that support the status quo deserve condemnation, but dreams also inspire revolutionary action. Ignore the so-called realism that enshrines oppression as an immutable fact of life.

If everyone in this thread is on acid, I want this person's supply.

[Summerspeaker]

If everyone in this thread is on acid, I want this person's supply.

It's freely available to you, comrade. But I'm entirely serious. Anti-utopianism functions a key technique for enforcing political conformity. It only serves the bosses. So many of us see the horrors around us and desire something better. Without the bludgeon of conservative realism, countless more would put the vision into action.

[Invincible Summer]

Would an Utopia be ever possible?

By definition, doesn't Utopia mean an ideal that is never really achieved?

And besides, if it is an ideal, then when we reach it, it is no longer an ideal. It is reality. So it's a self-defeating concept (I think there's a proper term for this but I can't remember it right now)... we reach for the ideal of Utopia, but if it is ever achieved, then it's no longer Utopia.


If not why are we wasting our fucking lives with life? So much pain, ignorance, stupidity, and violence.
Well even if we don't create the ultimate society with matter replicators like in Star Trek and complete equality, even getting halfway would be pretty damn good. Whatever that would look like.

And pain and ignorance are inherent to life - you'd be hard pressed to find someone that doesn't experience it. The whole point is to devise a way to lessen (or ideally virtually eliminate) these points of human suffering.

[black magick hustla]

man is the wolf of man but

man is divine to man

[black magick hustla]

Homo, sacra res homin

[Jimmie Higgins]

It depends, some people are brainwashed by political parties.We're not and I grew up being taught by Catholics and watching 20 hours of TV a day. Ok, not that much, but I was exposed to everything everyone else was and I'm nothing special, so it goes to show that people can (and often do) break from the ideas handed down to them.


Why steal from the same social class? Why harm people from the same social class?Because people are forced to compete - it's a dog eat dog world, they say, but really it's a dog eat dog economic system. We are conditioned not to care about other people otherwise we could not walk down any city street without falling to our knees and weeping and giving all the money in our pockets to the first old homeless person we came across.

So to me, the real question is if people think that anything can be done about the current situation or not, rather than just blaming people for not doing anything. Stealing a radio or picking a pocket is just as callus as a worker with an extra 20 bucks in his pocket and a bunch of change that's just going to collect in a jar telling a panhandler that he doesn't have any money on him. Capitalism is cold and people are adaptable, so many people become cold (from sociopathic to just plain numb and disinterested) because of it.

[Amphictyonis]

Without a little suffering we wouldn't know how to recognize joy. Utopia, in think, is not only impossible but not something we would not want anyway. Minimized toil and suffering would be great.

[WeAreReborn]

The oppressed will always betray you, why help them? We all are the oppressed unless someone here is a Capitalist :glare:. But anyways a Utopia is a society based on metaphysics. As we all know metaphysics are nonsense and just used to justify oppression using abstract bullshit. So we need to work for a non perfect society where we balance the needs of all man with the freedom of all men.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

Yes, humans can be a real evil bunch of apes in the right conditions. But we are also capable of being far more noble animals, and we are certainly capable of small improvements in our general behaviour. With that, it's possible for us to make larger improvements over time. So there is hope, but it's not going to happen without a few bumps along the way.


Without a little suffering we wouldn't know how to recognize joy.

I think this is bollocks, the bastard descendant of the kind of mysticism that thinks everything has an opposite.

That isn't true. The opposite of light isn't darkness, that is simply what we call the absence of light. Similarly, cold isn't a "thing", it's an absence of something, namely heat.

When it comes to emotions, they are much more complex than the banal and anodyne dichotomies served up by cod philosophers. It is entirely possible to experience graduations of happiness and even different kinds of happiness.

Therefore, I contend that in the absence of pain and suffering, we would still know what joy is.

[9]

Yes, humans can be a real evil bunch of apes in the right conditions. But we are also capable of being far more noble animals, and we are certainly capable of small improvements in our general behaviour. With that, it's possible for us to make larger improvements over time. So there is hope, but it's not going to happen without a few bumps along the way.



I think this is bollocks, the bastard descendant of the kind of mysticism that thinks everything has an opposite.

That isn't true. The opposite of light isn't darkness, that is simply what we call the absence of light. Similarly, cold isn't a "thing", it's an absence of something, namely heat.

When it comes to emotions, they are much more complex than the banal and anodyne dichotomies served up by cod philosophers. It is entirely possible to experience graduations of happiness and even different kinds of happiness.

Therefore, I contend that in the absence of pain and suffering, we would still know what joy is.

or maybe 'joy' isn't a thing, its an absence of something, namely pain and suffering. :p

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aponia

[black magick hustla]

dont slide into misanthropý please. its a horrible viewpoint. it fucks your mental health. there is no reason to not love your fellow man, everything else is a distraction

[Thirsty Crow]

dont slide into misanthropý please. its a horrible viewpoint. it fucks your mental health. there is no reason to not love your fellow man, everything else is a distraction

Not only that it fucks your mental health, but it is also a completely unproductive viewpoint (that is, unless you're an arms dealer).

[Rafiq]

It's not the oppressed that will betray you.

Utopia isn't possible, and never will be.

The problem with establishing a Scientific Socialist society, is dealing with the Wolfs among the masses who will ruin it for everyone.

It only takes a couple people to destroy a revolution (Vietnam).

[Amphictyonis]

Yes, humans can be a real evil bunch of apes in the right conditions. But we are also capable of being far more noble animals, and we are certainly capable of small improvements in our general behaviour. With that, it's possible for us to make larger improvements over time. So there is hope, but it's not going to happen without a few bumps along the way.



I think this is bollocks, the bastard descendant of the kind of mysticism that thinks everything has an opposite.

That isn't true. The opposite of light isn't darkness, that is simply what we call the absence of light. Similarly, cold isn't a "thing", it's an absence of something, namely heat.

When it comes to emotions, they are much more complex than the banal and anodyne dichotomies served up by cod philosophers. It is entirely possible to experience graduations of happiness and even different kinds of happiness.

Therefore, I contend that in the absence of pain and suffering, we would still know what joy is.

The elimination of suffering is impossible. Don't tell that to a Buddhist. Nirvana doesn't exist. Don't tell that to a heroin addict :)

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

The elimination of suffering is impossible.

We won't know that until we try.


Don't tell that to a Buddhist. Nirvana doesn't exist.

Negation of the self isn't the same as always being happy in some fashion.


Don't tell that to a heroin addict :)

Heroin addicts suffer along with the rest of us. I don't see your point.

[Amphictyonis]

We won't know that until we try.



Negation of the self isn't the same as always being happy in some fashion.



Heroin addicts suffer along with the rest of us. I don't see your point.

So your goal is the complete negation of human suffering? I guess it's good to set your standards high. I'd settle for 50% reduction in human suffering. Anyway, Buddhists want to eliminate suffering by eliminating desire. I guess you want to eliminate desire not by forcing scarcity on yourself but creating abject abundance. If I were a Buddhist I'd tell you you're setting yourself up for more suffering.

I use a heroin addict as an example, in part, to show the impossibility of perpetual happiness because it's simply not chemically possible. The brain can only release so much serotonin. We weren't meant to be painless creatures. Even the Dalai lama gets angry, suffers and feels physical and emotional pain. If he says otherwise he's lying.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

So your goal is the complete negation of human suffering?

I'm open to the possibility.


I guess it's good to set your standards high. I'd settle for 50% reduction in human suffering. Anyway, Buddhists want to eliminate suffering by eliminating desire. I guess you want to eliminate desire but not by forcing scarcity on yourself but creating abject abundance. If I were a Buddhist I'd tell you you're setting yourself up for more suffering.

Needless to say, I think the Buddhists are wrong on this one. Human nature is mutable. Even genetic qualities are subject to environmental influences such as natural selection or genetic engineering.


I use a heroin addict as an example, in part, to show the impossibility of perpetual happiness because it's simply not chemically possible. The brain can only release so much serotonin.

It's obvious then that chemistry will only be part of the solution.


We weren't meant to be painless creatures.

We weren't meant to be anything, because we are not the products of an intentional agent.


Even the Dalai lama gets angry, suffers and feels physical and emotional pain. If he says otherwise he's lying.

That's because the Dalai Lama is an ordinary human being living in the same crummy world the rest of live in. That doesn't mean that things can't be made better.

[Amphictyonis]

nwuy2t6025k

[9]

I use a heroin addict as an example, in part, to show the impossibility of perpetual happiness because it's simply not chemically possible.

Really it depends on how you're defining 'happiness'. Is 'happiness' euphoria? To be honest, when I think of 'happiness', I think more of feeling content than of feeling euphoric.

[Amphictyonis]

Really it depends on how you're defining 'happiness'. Is 'happiness' euphoria? To be honest, when I think of 'happiness', I think more of feeling content than of feeling euphoric.

Here's a SOMA for you. Mmmm....SOMA.

[9]

lolwut

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

Here's a SOMA for you. Mmmm....SOMA.

Are you going to actually discuss the matter properly or what?

[Amphictyonis]

lolwut

In Huxleys book 'Brave New World' the population takes 'SOMA'. I was poking fun at Noxion's post above concerning brain chemistry and or 'human nature'.

When he said "It's obvious then that chemistry will only be part of the solution" it reminded me of reading Huxley when I was younger. If not for suffering we wouldn't have Shakespeare, various forms of art, poetry, films and overall culture. To attempt to create a world free of human suffering, in my opinion, is dangerous (and unrealistic). A more modern version of BNW-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equilibrium_%28film%29

[9]

yes, I've read thebook. I wasn't sure how it related to what I said.

[black magick hustla]

It's not the oppressed that will betray you.

Utopia isn't possible, and never will be.

The problem with establishing a Scientific Socialist society, is dealing with the Wolfs among the masses who will ruin it for everyone.

It only takes a couple people to destroy a revolution (Vietnam).

i dont know if utopia is a possibility but it is definitely something i am willing to put my service to. utopia has been a cultural meme in different societies and historical epochs and i see communism as a sort of continuity to build a "kingdom of god among men". from plato, to millenarian christians, there has been always a tendency among men to dream wildly and i think it is a very positive aspect of the human condition. from the idea of the brethen of free spirit to bring humanity into an eternal state of "pristine inoccence", utopian socialists, anarchists, communists, to sci fi writers there has always been that tendency. this reminds me of a poem of william carlos williams:

You sullen pig of a man
you force me into the mud
with your stinking ash-cart!

Brother!
—if we were rich
we'd stick our chests out
and hold our heads high!

It is dreams that have destroyed us.

There is no more pride
in horses or in rein holding.
We sit hunched together brooding
our fate.
Well—
all things turn bitter in the end
whether you choose the right or
the left way
and—
dreams are not a bad thing.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

In Huxleys book 'Brave New World' the population takes 'SOMA'. I was poking fun at Noxion's post above concerning brain chemistry and or 'human nature'.

When he said "It's obvious then that chemistry will only be part of the solution" it reminded me of reading Huxley when I was younger. If not for suffering we wouldn't have Shakespeare, various forms of art, poetry, films and overall culture. To attempt to ceate a world free of human suffering, in my opinion, is dangerous (and unrealistic).

The truly objectionable part of Huxley's dystopia isn't that everyone is happy; it's the instrumentalist horror of intentionally producing mentally sub-normal humans for menial tasks.

[Amphictyonis]

Are you going to actually discuss the matter properly or what?

Did that post make you suffer :)

[Amphictyonis]

The truly objectionable part of Huxley's dystopia isn't that everyone is happy; it's the instrumentalist horror of intentionally producing mentally sub-normal humans for menial tasks.

No that wasn't the entire point of the book, sheesh. You sure chose to ignore a whole heck of a lot.

[black magick hustla]

this to

litanies of satan
baudeliare

The Litany of Satan
O you, the wisest and fairest of the Angels,
God betrayed by destiny and deprived of praise,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

O Prince of Exile, you who have been wronged
And who vanquished always rise up again more strong,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who know all, great king of hidden things,
The familiar healer of human sufferings,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!
You who teach through love the taste for Heaven
To the cursed pariah, even to the leper,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who of Death, your mistress old and strong,
Have begotten Hope, — a charming madcap!

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who give the outlaw that calm and haughty look
That damns the whole multitude around his scaffold.

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who know in what nooks of the miserly earth
A jealous God has hidden precious stones,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You whose clear eye sees the deep arsenals
Where the tribe of metals sleeps in its tomb,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You whose broad hand conceals the precipice
From the sleep-walker wandering on the building's ledge,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who soften magically the old bones
Of belated drunkards trampled by the horses,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who to console frail mankind in its sufferings
Taught us to mix sulphur and saltpeter,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who put your mark, O subtle accomplice,
Upon the brow of Croesus, base and pitiless,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

You who put in the eyes and hearts of prostitutes
The cult of sores and the love of rags and tatters,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

Staff of those in exile, lamp of the inventor,
Confessor of the hanged and of conspirators,

O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

Adopted father of those whom in black rage
— God the Father drove from the earthly paradise,
O Satan, take pity on my long misery!

Prayer
Glory and praise to you, O Satan, in the heights
Of Heaven where you reigned and in the depths
Of Hell where vanquished you dream in silence!
Grant that my soul may someday repose near to you
Under the Tree of Knowledge, when, over your brow,
Its branches will spread like a new Temple!

[black magick hustla]

communism looks like this btw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqowmHgxVJQ

[black magick hustla]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqowmHgxVJQ

[WeAreReborn]

communism looks like this btw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqowmHgxVJQ
Lol, pretty much just get rid of the cops all together.

[Bilan]

Would an Utopia be ever possible? If not why are we wasting our fucking lives with life? So much pain, ignorance, stupidity, and violence.

The dread of civilisation is nourished by it's fruits. - Horkheimer.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

No that wasn't the entire point of the book, sheesh. You sure chose to ignore a whole heck of a lot.

I mentioned nothing about the whole point of the book - I was pointing out that your reference to it doesn't make sense in the context of this subject.

[Amphictyonis]

yes, I've read thebook. I wasn't sure how it related to what I said.


"Really it depends on how you're defining 'happiness'. Is 'happiness' euphoria? To be honest, when I think of 'happiness', I think more of feeling content than of feeling euphoric.

Perpetual content. A constant feeling of well being. It reminded me of SOMA and 'victory gin'. I'm not sure the point of communism is to completely eliminate human suffering- the point is to facilitate material abundance and general equality. To minimize human suffering as much as possible.

Man has tried to create 'heaven on earth' for thousands of years and to my knowledge every attempt has failed. This isn't to say I think communism is impossible I just think total elimination of human suffering is impossible. A world completely free of human suffering would seem to me to be a very controlled environment. The negation of freedom and free will.

[9]

Perpetual content. A constant feeling of well being. It reminded me of SOMA and 'victory gin'.

Well, my memory is sort of fucked up so maybe I've got this wrong, but I thought the whole point of 'soma' in the book was that it was an escape from life, basically? I'm not sure what 'victory gin' is.



I'm not sure the point of communism is to completely eliminate human suffering- the point is to facilitate material abundance and general equality. To minimize human suffering as much as possible.

Man has tried to create 'heaven on earth' for thousands of years and to my knowledge every attempt has failed. This isn't to say I think communism is impossible I just think total elimination of human suffering is impossible. A world completely free of human suffering would seem to me to be a very controlled environment. The negation of freedom and free will.Obviously there is a difference between human suffering caused by oppression, exploitation, poverty, war, alienation, domestic violence, etc. on the one hand, and human suffering caused by the death of a loved one, a break up, illness, etc. on the other. I think the former kinds of suffering certainly would be fundamentally incompatible with a communist society - which I do think is a real possibility even though it obviously isn't on the agenda today. The latter type obviously isn't going to go away, although I'd imagine the extent to which it really interferes with peoples' lives might be immensely reduced.

[Klaatu]

The elimination of suffering is impossible.

I respectfully disagree. It's all about how you look at the world.

For example, I have met and talked with, happy homeless guys, as well as depressed millionaires (really, I am not making this up!!!) :)

[Amphictyonis]

I respectfully disagree. It's all about how you look at the world.

For example, I have met and talked with, happy homeless guys, as well as depressed millionaires (really, I am not making this up!!!) :)

Good luck on your mission to completely eradicate human suffering. :cool: May the force be with you.

(The thought of it is so absurd I don't even really want to discuss it anymore. Sorry.)

[noble brown]

humans dont suck. our dominant culture sucks, capitalism!

[noble brown]

I think this is bollocks, the bastard descendant of the kind of mysticism that thinks everything has an opposite.

That isn't true. The opposite of light isn't darkness, that is simply what we call the absence of light. Similarly, cold isn't a "thing", it's an absence of something, namely heat.



isnt the definition of darkness the absence of light? so if the oppisite of light is absence of light and absence of light = darkness then then the oppisite of light is darkness.

anyways

its not a matter of opposites. its one of contrast. its only thru contrasts that we can experience our world around us. this doesnt mean that without a contrast a thing doesnt exist. all it can mean is that we just cant exerience it.

[MellowViper]

I have a love-hate relationship with my species. I want the best for them, but they keep killing and exploiting their selves. Its more pity than anger really. I'm confident it can change though. Once people get fed up with these market collapses, they'll be open to Socialism. Its already happened in South America, and I think they're getting it right this time. They should have had it right 100 years ago, really.

[MellowViper]

Well, everyone's has to share this same, weird predicament we all call human reality, and everyone has a different vantage point. I can't hate people, as a generality, because were all basically in the same circumstance. A few have a lot of things, and a lot of people have very little. That's what socialism's meant to change. I think utopias might be impossible, but there's plenty of room to make things better and for us to share the worlds resources in a more equitable way. This should be more like heaven on earth, because its basically the only reality we have. There isn't really any place better than what there is that we get to live in forever and ever for being good. Were pretty much stuck with what we have to work with. There's been societies before in the universe, I'm guessing, and some have probably made the same mistakes. Some nuked their selves out of existence, and some learned to coexist. I hope we end up like the latter, because, when it comes down to it, existence can be heaven or hell. Its what people collectively decide to make it into. We can choose a path that will create happiness for more or all people and one that'll lead to happiness for the few and suffering for the majority. When most conscious life experiences starvation and war, that makes the universe a lot more hellish than if we'd just cooperate. I can't hate humanity, because humanity is the universe subjectively experiencing itself, and I hope that experience turns out more good than bad in the long run. The track record, up to this point, though, is pretty grim.

[Milk Sheikh]

Most of the time, I feel humans, especially workers, are not worth caring for even though, ironically, I am a Marxist.

This is because workers themselves do not care about their welfare and are only too eager to 'defend' the rich and the famous (as if they need a defense). They barely have enough money to pay the rent but fawn over royalty, celebrities, or whoever - and might even attack you if you were to say something against them and in favor of the workers. Damn annoying!:mad:

[L.A.P.]

I used to think that way not to long ago, when you're an intellectual who believes the world around him is filled with idiots and the world is fucked then that misanthropy will either lead to libertarianism or fascism. Fortunately, I was still a Liberal just a misanthropic one.

[9]

Most of the time, I feel humans, especially workers, are not worth caring for even though, ironically, I am a Marxist.

This is because workers themselves do not care about their welfare and are only too eager to 'defend' the rich and the famous (as if they need a defense). They barely have enough money to pay the rent but fawn over royalty, celebrities, or whoever - and might even attack you if you were to say something against them and in favor of the workers.

what an obnoxious, condescending generalization. if this is the attitude you have toward working class people, why pretend to give a shit at all?

[Amphictyonis]

Its more pity than anger really.
DJnKm6ftPu0

Mr T pities the fool and also agrees with me that a little pain is necessary every now and then :) Sounds like he's a big fan of private property as well.

But seriously, I wonder what art would look like in a world free of suffering. Music? Literature? Poetry?

The theoretical quest to completley eradicate suffering reminds me of this movie-

MbNh6QubxCM

I think jealousy, fear, love, hate and everything in between that leads to suffering is what lets us know we're really alive.

[Milk Sheikh]

what an obnoxious, condescending generalization. if this is the attitude you have toward working class people, why pretend to give a shit at all?

Please don't twist what I say and accuse me on that basis. I care about the workers alright, but it appears that the workers do not care about one another. Is that my fault?

Most workers are willing slaves of the bourgeois; there's no getting around that. And that precisely is your problem, as it is with many dreamy, idealistic 'leftists': workers are just that, workers, and not necessarily socialists. Unfortunately, you conflate the two and thus tie yourself up in layers of contradiction.

[Aldemor]

I too am a Misanthropist. I generally think in the larger picture humanity can be seen in the same light as a virus or parasite (I could elaborate on my exact views if you want). I do however think that the evils of humanity are for the most part caused by the state itself and the greed that comes with Capitalism. I suppose you could say that it's my misanthropy that caused me to become a Revolutionary Leftist in the first place. I think that the current stage humanity is in can be overcome but only through Communist revolution.

[yobbos1]

What the fuck would be the point of being a communist misanthropist?

[Aldemor]

What the fuck would be the point of being a communist misanthropist?
To fix what you see as flawed in society...?

[yobbos1]

misanthropist



A misanthrope; a person who hates all mankind; a person who hates the human species.



Communism

A system of government in which the state plans and controls the economy and a single party holds power, claiming to make progress toward a higher social order in which all goods are equally shared by the people.



Seem to be mutually exclusive to me.

[ed miliband]

The thing about misanthropy is that more often than not the hatred is not directed at humanity as a whole, but at the people at the very bottom - the rancid, stupid mob. I've heard people excuse their misanthropy by claiming that they hate humanity because humans oppress other humans, and then they'll follow this statement up by mocking the very people that are being oppressed as stupid drones who do not know what is good for them.