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Saorsa
28th September 2010, 11:16
PFLP suspends its participation in PLO Executive Committee to protest return to negotiations

The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine announced in a press conference on September 25, 2010 that it was suspending its participation in the PLO Executive Committee in response to Abu Mazen's return to negotiations and the illegitimate "approval" of the EC for this dangerous action.

At a press conference held in Ramallah led by Deputy General Secretary Comrade Abdel-Rahim Mallouh and Political Bureau members Comrades Khalida Jarrar and Omar Shehadeh, the Front warned of the serious consequences and repercussions of the policy of concessions and appeasement to the U.S. and Israel.

The press conference issued a statement, as follows:

A policy statement issued by the Central Committee of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine

To the masses of our Palestinian people struggling in Palestine And the Diaspora...

To the masses of our glorious Arab Nation...

We make this statement today in light of our full national and historical responsibility and a high level of consciousness of the great risks to our people of current political developments on the Arab and Palestinian level. In light of the action of the leadership of the Palestine Liberation Organization to return to direct negotiations with the government of the Zionist entity under the auspices of U.S. imperialism, the Central Committee of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine convened an extraordinary meeting to discuss all of these developments, which determined the following:

First: The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine has firmly adhered to a categorical rejection of Oslo since 1993, and warned early of its dangerous approach and its disastrous consequences for the Palestinian cause, the PLO program and charter, and the Palestinian national struggle. The decision to return to direct negotiations is one that has failed for nearly two decades now. It is an affront to the blood of our people shed in the Al-Aqsa Intifada 2000 and represents the persistence of the PLO leadership to continue the devastating Oslo path, despite its devastating effect on our people. This development places the Palestinian cause in the hands of U.S. imperialism and Zionism, holding it accountable to their dictates, which aim at the liquidation of the inalienable historic and national rights of our people, particularly the right of return for refugees, the right of self-determination, and the right of citizenship and presence on the land of Palestinians in the 1948 occupied areas of Palestine. The direct negotiations also help to break the growing international isolation of the Zionist entity, to protect its leaders from accountability and consequences of their crimes and slaughter, and to circumvent the growing international solidarity with our people and their rights. They provide a cover for the occupation practices and policies of settlement building, land confiscation, displacement, siege, detention, imprisonment and killing; further erode our Palestinian national position and national constants; and contribute to the deepening of the disastrous internal Palestinian division.

Accordingly, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, which has maintained and adhered to the PLO, and has been a part of every political turning point in the organization, and cherishes its history and potential as a great national movement baptized by the blood of martyrs, refuses to accept that the PLO shall be a cover for policies that destroy and undermine our national cause. Further, we reuse to accept that the PLO's institutions shall be turned into institutions devoid of independence, militancy, democracy, transparency, or legality. Therefore:

The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine will suspend its participation in the meetings of the Executive Committee of the Palestine Liberation Organization. We knock on the walls of the tank in front of the masses of our people and our nation, warning of the serious consequences and repercussions of the policy of concessions and the return to direct negotiations under the U.S.-Israeli conditions, including the absence of the United Nations and its references and the imposition of the American-sponsored negotiating table as a substitute. With U.S. support, the Zionist state attempts to impose the requirement to recognize "Israel" as the "State of the Jewish people" upon the negotiating agenda as a part of the negotiations. We take this step in light of the continued settlement building, blockade and siege; and in light of the persistent selfish and exclusionary practices and policies that disregard collective Palestinian action and decision-making, and in light of the overwhelming popular rejection of the illegitimate decision to return to negotiations taken with only one-third of the membership of the Executive Committee.

Second: The decision to return to the direct negotiations severely undermines the decisions of the Central Council. It is an abuse of the PLO and its representation of a national militant Palestinian identity and its place as a location for joint Palestinian work.

Rather than holding to a national resolution to direct to the world, particularly in order to strengthen the official Arab position in order to serve the national struggle and its objectives, the Executive Committee rendered a decision that was made before it was even submitted. This decision took place at a meeting of the Executive Committee - the PLO's leading body - with a formal lack of quorum, and with the rejection of major forces.

Third: The decision of the Popular Front to suspend its participation of the meetings of the Executive Committee does not mean that we are engaging in any parallel or alternative frameworks to the PLO as a national framework to encompass all of the Palestinian people in the homeland and in diaspora. The Front is not only against the use of the PLO and its institutions as empty shell structures to justify concessions; it also rejects any denial of the fact that the PLO is a great national achievement of our people and factions of the contemporary Palestinian revolution, and the product of many painful sacrifices. Just as it has in the past, the Popular Front will not cease in the present and the future to struggle to reform and rebuild the PLO on a national and democratic basis, including elections on the basis of proportional representation in Palestine and wherever possible in the diaspora. We reiterate the commitment of the March 2005 Cairo Declaration and the June 2006 National Accord document (the Prisoners' Document) to end the disastrous state of division, restore national unity, and strengthen the steadfastness of our people to confront the occupation and its practices on the ground. These are the central tasks of all Palestinians in the current national phase.

Fourth: The Popular Front, while affirming that the PLO is the sole legitimate representative of our people wherever it is present, calls on the masses of our people, factions, political forces, community leaders and independent personalities to form and support the broadest popular movement to stop the negotiations and end the disastrous path of the Oslo accords. We call for the convening of a fully empowered international conference under the auspices of the United Nations and with international resolutions and legitimacy as its reference in order to implement Palestinian rights and compel the Zionist entity to implement UN resolutions, most notably UN Resolution 194, assuring the return of refugees to their homes from which they were displaced, as well as the dismantling of settlements and the removal of settlers. We call for hard work to restore national unity and develop a strategy for political action to uphold our national principles and bring an end to reliance on negotiations that have been demonstrated through painful experience to be futile at best and devastatingly dangerous at worst.

Unity, steadfastness and resistance until victory!
Glory to the martyrs, health to the wounded, freedom for the prisoners, and victory for our people!

The General Central Committee
Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine
September 2010

http://www.pflp.ps/english/?q=pflp-suspends-its-participation-plo-executive-comm

Saorsa
28th September 2010, 20:29
This is kinda a big deal...

Crux
28th September 2010, 20:33
Good on them.

chegitz guevara
28th September 2010, 22:11
This is kinda a big deal...

Is it? My understanding is the PFLP doesn't have much weight anymore.

Saorsa
29th September 2010, 00:43
They were able to mobilise over 70,000 people (http://www.pflp.ps/english/?q=unity-and-steadfastness-over-70000-rally-gaza-pflp) in Gaza alone for the 42nd anniversary of their founding in December last year. They are still a force to be reckoned with and they are by far the largest secular, revolutionary socialist organisation in the Palestinian resistance.

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121200.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121208.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121210.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121211.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121215.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/english/files/images/gazarally1.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/english/files/images/gazarally2.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/english/files/images/DSC_0510.preview.JPG

chegitz guevara
29th September 2010, 16:16
Well hey, glad to be wrong!

Kiev Communard
29th September 2010, 22:36
But they still should be on alert regarding the character of their relations with Hamas. We all know how the games with Khomeini "anti-imperialism" ended for Iranian leftists...

Saorsa
30th September 2010, 00:11
Fatah and the Palestinian Authority have been far more oppressive of the PFLP than Hamas. And at least Hamas still fights Israel... I don't think there's anything special about Islamist groups that make them more dangerous to work with compared to groups like Fatah.

Crux
30th September 2010, 00:48
Making a subtle critique of the PFLP:


In view of all this, is it permissible for us to hear such slogans as "We are all commandos", or "The Palestinian people with all its classes are taking part in the armed struggle," or "No rich and no poor so long as we remain homeless," without evaluating and criticizing them and preventing their spread?

The revolution is science, and scientific thought looks for tangible facts. We will not be misled by deceptive mottoes and slogans which are at variance with the facts and which are launched by certain class forces in defense of their interests.


She called upon all Palestinian forces, particularly Fateh and Hamas, to unite under the banner of the blood of the martyrs and the promise of a better future for our people and children, and to fight to prosecute the occupation and its leaders in international courts for their crimes against our Palestinian people.

Kiev Communard
30th September 2010, 12:32
Fatah and the Palestinian Authority have been far more oppressive of the PFLP than Hamas. And at least Hamas still fights Israel... I don't think there's anything special about Islamist groups that make them more dangerous to work with compared to groups like Fatah.

Yes, it fights Israel, but what is Hamas project of future for Palestinians? The same kind of "Islamic Republic" that currently exists in Iran, undoubtedly. And you must be aware of the fact how Khomeinists dealt with their leftist allies once they got into power. The U.S. is not the "only" reactionary force in the world, you know. The fact that it is predominant imperialist power now does not mean that it would be such forever.

Saorsa
30th September 2010, 12:48
The Palestinian resistance is weaker and more divided than it has ever been. In light of this, and with the constant primary goal of ensuring the survival of the Palestinian people, the PFLP argues for reuniting the resistance, ending the feud between Fatah and Hamas and only using violence against the Zionists, not fellow Palestinians.

This seems a pretty common sense position to me. Cherrypicking an out of context reference to class from 1969 and counterposing it to a call for resistance unity in 2010 proves nothing.

Seriously, selective quoting is one of the worst habits of the Marxist left. You're better than that Majakovskij.

Saorsa
30th September 2010, 12:50
Yes, it fights Israel, but what is Hamas project of future for Palestinians? The same kind of "Islamic Republic" that currently exists in Iran, undoubtedly. And you must be aware of the fact how Khomeinists dealt with their leftist allies once they got into power. The U.S. is not the "only" reactionary force in the world, you know. The fact that it is predominant imperialist power now does not mean that it would be such forever.

What are you proposing the PFLP do? Start a war with Hamas? I'm sure that would really advance the revolution in Palestine.

Seriously, let's try to live in the real world comrades.

Kiev Communard
30th September 2010, 13:17
Seriously, let's try to live in the real world comrades.

Well, if Nepali Maoists, for instance, had "lived in real war", they surely would not have "started a war" in 1996, when all "reasonable" politicians touted the "death of communism", against "progressive" Nepali Congress and "amti-imperialist" CPN-UML, would not they?

Obs
30th September 2010, 14:11
Well, if Nepali Maoists, for instance, had "lived in real war", they surely would not have "started a war" in 1996, when all "reasonable" politicians touted the "death of communism", against "progressive" Nepali Congress and "amti-imperialist" CPN-UML, would not they?
There is literally no difference between the circumstances in Nepal and those in Palestine. :rolleyes:

Saorsa
30th September 2010, 14:16
Well, if Nepali Maoists, for instance, had "lived in real war", they surely would not have "started a war" in 1996, when all "reasonable" politicians touted the "death of communism", against "progressive" Nepali Congress and "amti-imperialist" CPN-UML, would not they?

I don't think you understood my point.

Rafiq
1st October 2010, 00:46
They were able to mobilise over 70,000 people (http://www.pflp.ps/english/?q=unity-and-steadfastness-over-70000-rally-gaza-pflp) in Gaza alone for the 42nd anniversary of their founding in December last year. They are still a force to be reckoned with and they are by far the largest secular, revolutionary socialist organisation in the Palestinian resistance.

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121200.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121208.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121210.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121211.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/arabic/images/news/pflp_09121215.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/english/files/images/gazarally1.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/english/files/images/gazarally2.jpg

http://www.pflp.ps/english/files/images/DSC_0510.preview.JPG


H-Holy Sh**!

Never knew they were that popular.

But I'm also glad to see that Palestinians who support this group won't feel pressured to renounce their religious ways, (ect. Second to Last picture, women in Headscarves).

Middle Eastern Communists are usually more tolerant of Religion then other Communists...

Rafiq
1st October 2010, 00:47
Yes, it fights Israel, but what is Hamas project of future for Palestinians? The same kind of "Islamic Republic" that currently exists in Iran, undoubtedly. And you must be aware of the fact how Khomeinists dealt with their leftist allies once they got into power. The U.S. is not the "only" reactionary force in the world, you know. The fact that it is predominant imperialist power now does not mean that it would be such forever.


Hamas isn't in power yet. Perhaps, open diologue and discussion between the Leftists and Hamas about future of Palestine is needed, BEFORE any power is put into anyone's hands. Unlike the Iranian Revolution.

Kiev Communard
1st October 2010, 07:49
Hamas isn't in power yet. Perhaps, open diologue and discussion between the Leftists and Hamas about future of Palestine is needed, BEFORE any power is put into anyone's hands. Unlike the Iranian Revolution.

I highly doubt that Hamas would be ready to co-operate with secularist forces, not mentioning the fact that these forces would profess Marxism, an ideology the Islamists usually consider "satanic".

Saorsa
1st October 2010, 08:05
But I'm also glad to see that Palestinians who support this group won't feel pressured to renounce their religious ways, (ect. Second to Last picture, women in Headscarves). True. But it's also worth noting that these are liberated women - headscarves yes, but their faces are uncovered. The women in the ranks of the PFLP are not confined to the kitchen - they hijack aeroplanes and march in the streets.


I highly doubt that Hamas would be ready to co-operate with secularist forces, not mentioning the fact that they profess Marxism. I think the objective fact that the PFLP is openly operating in Hamas-controlled Gaza (albeit with occasional repression) is more important than your hunch.

Hamas receives far more suspicion than a Catholic Liberation Theology influenced organisation in Latin America ever would. Don't allow Western imperialism to define your world view comrades.

Our duty as communists in the belly of the beast is to support the Palestinian armed resistance, and specifically to support the most revolutionary elements of it... the best example of which is the PFLP.

If you want to materially support the struggle of the Palestinian people, the Workers Party of New Zealand is running a solidarity campaign with the PFLP at this website. (http://www.anonym.to/?http://wpnz-pflp-solidarity.blogspot.com/2010/06/facebook-shuts-down-palestinian.html)

You can order over the internet one of the t-shirts we are selling - all the profits go directly to the PFLP to fund their armed resistance to the Israeli state and their political organising work. Unlike the Islamist organisations, they don't get funding from countries like Syria and Iran, and unlike the sell-out traitor groups like Fatah they don't receive funding from the imperialist West.

The only international funding the PFLP will receive is from the communist movement it is a part of - it is our internationalist duty to provide it with support that will help it grow.

We have two shirt designs - below is the latest. Leila Khaled sent us her signature to use on the front.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_k3gbTyoNBwA/TCajVzj-v-I/AAAAAAAAAEw/sNbQpomAq3g/s1600/Leila+Khaled+T-Shirt.bmp

Below is the other design:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_k3gbTyoNBwA/TCJyJ31CypI/AAAAAAAAADg/2OfNJP4Axho/s1600/gfhdfgdg.jpg

Kiev Communard
1st October 2010, 13:12
Hamas receives far more suspicion than a Catholic Liberation Theology influenced organisation in Latin America ever would. Don't allow Western imperialism to define your world view comrades.

The Iranian experience is the main cause of these suspicions - unless your think that Islamic Fundamentalism is somehow "progressive" or comparable to Libreation Theology (it is not), of course.

Saorsa
1st October 2010, 13:42
I think Palestinians resisting the occupation is progressive. The fact that they happen to be Islamists is secondary, not primary.

Buying into the myth of Islamo-fascism, which you seem to do, is deeply reactionary.

Crux
1st October 2010, 15:42
The Palestinian resistance is weaker and more divided than it has ever been. In light of this, and with the constant primary goal of ensuring the survival of the Palestinian people, the PFLP argues for reuniting the resistance, ending the feud between Fatah and Hamas and only using violence against the Zionists, not fellow Palestinians.

This seems a pretty common sense position to me. Cherrypicking an out of context reference to class from 1969 and counterposing it to a call for resistance unity in 2010 proves nothing.

Seriously, selective quoting is one of the worst habits of the Marxist left. You're better than that Majakovskij.
It's not about selective quotation, in fact I think their 1969 statement is very good and rather clear. A Strategy for the Liberation of Palestine (http://www.pflp.ps/english/?q=strategy-liberation-palestine).
Ending the sectarian violence by both Fatah and Hamas is one thing, allying with them is something else.

Kiev Communard
1st October 2010, 15:58
Buying into the myth of Islamo-fascism, which you seem to do, is deeply reactionary.

Buying into a myth of "progressive Islamists we must work with" is literally suicidal for Middle East Left, both from political (tailing the Islamist organizations and lacking their own coherent line) and sometimes personal (as fates of Tudeh and many other left-wing parties of Iran show) viewpoint.

The Grey Blur
1st October 2010, 16:14
Comrade A, learn the lesson of the gungho leftist cheerleaders of the ANC, Sinn Féin, or as was stated above, the Iranian Islamists. Hamas have nothing to offer the Palestinian, nor Israeli, working class other than a reactionary and bourgeois policy. Furthermore learn the lesson of what a short-sighted policy of armed warfare means - since you seem to be supportive of the IRSP - this idea of 'martyrdom', of pointless bottle rockets which provoke massive retaliation - this is not a working-class tactic, just as in the North it wasted a generation of genuine working-class fighters, rotting in jail or killed. Too late the republican left in Northern Ireland realised that only a class-conscious approach can solve the national question, the same applies to Palestine. The problem with internet leftist warriors is that you support the shooting and bombs but you don't hang around to learn the lessons.

Rafiq
3rd October 2010, 20:51
I highly doubt that Hamas would be ready to co-operate with secularist forces, not mentioning the fact that these forces would profess Marxism, an ideology the Islamists usually consider "satanic".


Hamas will cooperate with any non Fatah, PLO aligned Palestinian resistance group willing to talk.

Hamas are reactionary, probably don't love Marxism too much, but they don't view it as "satanic".

They aren't as "superstitious" as most Christian fundamentalists. I know this because I grew up in the Middle East, no organization is called Satanic to them.

For now, they should remain as brothers in arms against occupation, and have open dialogue of the future of Palestine.

DragonQuestWes
4th October 2010, 02:11
The chances are considering that every attempt at peace talks between Israel and Palestine has often failed, it will probably fail again, so good for the PFLP to withdraw because to negotiate with Israel is pretty much pointless.

gorillafuck
4th October 2010, 02:23
What are you proposing the PFLP do? Start a war with Hamas? I'm sure that would really advance the revolution in Palestine.

Seriously, let's try to live in the real world comrades.
I'm skeptical of your view. If Hamas came to power, then communists (such as the PFLP) would probably be among the first to be jailed and repressed. Look at what happened when Islamists came to power after the overthrow of the Shah, and there are more examples. Not to say they should start a war with Hamas, but collaborating with Hamas seems like political suicide.

Homo Songun
4th October 2010, 05:05
To me, its a bit like saying Christian Democrats in Germany are the same thing as the Francoists in Spain, or the Republicans in the Southern US. Different parties, different people, different history, different platform.

KurtFF8
4th October 2010, 05:31
True. But it's also worth noting that these are liberated women - headscarves yes, but their faces are uncovered. The women in the ranks of the PFLP are not confined to the kitchen - they hijack aeroplanes and march in the streets.
I think the objective fact that the PFLP is openly operating in Hamas-controlled Gaza (albeit with occasional repression) is more important than your hunch.

Hamas receives far more suspicion than a Catholic Liberation Theology influenced organisation in Latin America ever would. Don't allow Western imperialism to define your world view comrades.

Our duty as communists in the belly of the beast is to support the Palestinian armed resistance, and specifically to support the most revolutionary elements of it... the best example of which is the PFLP.

If you want to materially support the struggle of the Palestinian people, the Workers Party of New Zealand is running a solidarity campaign with the PFLP at this website. (http://www.anonym.to/?http://wpnz-pflp-solidarity.blogspot.com/2010/06/facebook-shuts-down-palestinian.html)

You can order over the internet one of the t-shirts we are selling - all the profits go directly to the PFLP to fund their armed resistance to the Israeli state and their political organising work. Unlike the Islamist organisations, they don't get funding from countries like Syria and Iran, and unlike the sell-out traitor groups like Fatah they don't receive funding from the imperialist West.

The only international funding the PFLP will receive is from the communist movement it is a part of - it is our internationalist duty to provide it with support that will help it grow.

We have two shirt designs - below is the latest. Leila Khaled sent us her signature to use on the front.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_k3gbTyoNBwA/TCajVzj-v-I/AAAAAAAAAEw/sNbQpomAq3g/s1600/Leila+Khaled+T-Shirt.bmp

Below is the other design:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_k3gbTyoNBwA/TCJyJ31CypI/AAAAAAAAADg/2OfNJP4Axho/s1600/gfhdfgdg.jpg

You do know that one of the reasons the FBI raided comrades in the United States recently was accusing them of materially supporting the PFLP, right? This kind of post endangers RevLeft and its users

Crux
4th October 2010, 13:08
PFLP is not on the New Zealand terrorlist.

Saorsa
4th October 2010, 15:03
What Majakovski said. The PFLP is not (yet) illegal to support in my country. If you buy a shirt you should be aware of the risks.

As for the subject of discussion... I haven't yet seen an alternative from anyone. You day the PFLP shouldn't work with Hamas. Right. I suppose leftists in the West shouldn't ever work with christian churches because of what the Catholic Church did in Spain? Or because of the Inquisition?

Why the double standards with Hamas?

The fact of the matter is that the people of Palestine are fighting for their survival in the face of a genocidal onslaught from the Israelis. Hamas is a part of the armed resistance to this genocide. Until that changes, it makes perfect sense for the resistance to be united.

The PFLP and Hamas do not live in each others pockets. But what should the 70,000 PFLP comrades who took part in that Gaza rally do? They are living in territory under Hamas control. What does it mean to 'not cooperate with Hamas' in such a situation?

And what about other groups like Fatah, the Popular Resistance Committees and so on? Should the PFLP refuse to ever work with them either?

Let's get some clarification here comrades.

KurtFF8
4th October 2010, 17:21
Is RevLeft hosted in your country though? If not, then it still proposes a big problem for this website, and the many users who are not in your country

gorillafuck
4th October 2010, 21:53
As for the subject of discussion... I haven't yet seen an alternative from anyone. You day the PFLP shouldn't work with Hamas. Right. I suppose leftists in the West shouldn't ever work with christian churches because of what the Catholic Church did in Spain? Or because of the Inquisition?

Why the double standards with Hamas?
Hamas is different from a Christian church. Hamas, if they took power, would pose a real threat to Palestinian socialists. Christian churches don't pose a threat to leftists and don't have even a goal of taking power. Though I don't see why we would work with churches unless they are leftist churches. And leftist churches didn't fight against leftism in Spain.


The fact of the matter is that the people of Palestine are fighting for their survival in the face of a genocidal onslaught from the Israelis. Hamas is a part of the armed resistance to this genocide. Until that changes, it makes perfect sense for the resistance to be united.But is Hamas even capable of defeating Israel? Hamas tactics really haven't been able to make significant gains for the Palestinian working class, based on what I know. Palestine doesn't exist in a vaccum, and I don't see how Palestine could even successfully be freed from Israeli oppression without international support of some kind. And obviously we want that to be socialist support rather than Islamist, because a lack of socialist support would mean there's a serious problem with the international socialist movement (which admittedly, today there is).


The PFLP and Hamas do not live in each others pockets. But what should the 70,000 PFLP comrades who took part in that Gaza rally do? They are living in territory under Hamas control. What does it mean to 'not cooperate with Hamas' in such a situation?They should try to keep on building the PFLP and putting forward a socialist program to end national oppression and replace it with a socialist Palestine. This could be done while organizing against Israel. there are 70,000 of them at that rally all waving red flags, they shouldn't just concede socialism by helping Islamists to gain power.

maskerade
4th October 2010, 22:54
Is RevLeft hosted in your country though? If not, then it still proposes a big problem for this website, and the many users who are not in your country

It must really suck to live in the States. Considering the various terrorist organisations which are and have been sponsored by the US government, one can only laugh at the doublespeak/doublethink.

What were the responses and reactions to the raids though?

KurtFF8
6th October 2010, 00:03
It must really suck to live in the States. Considering the various terrorist organisations which are and have been sponsored by the US government, one can only laugh at the doublespeak/doublethink.

What were the responses and reactions to the raids though?

Pretty much every Leftist group has come out against them and held solidarity demonstrations against the raids.

We shall see how the hearings go

Saorsa
6th October 2010, 11:43
I'd definitely advise that anyone in the US considering buying a shirt check with a lawyer first. It's probably not a good idea.


Hamas, if they took power, would pose a real threat to Palestinian socialists.

Hamas are in power in Gaza. The PFLP have continued to exist in Gaza with less repression than they face from the secular Fatah.

Fatah and the Palestinian Authority arrested and imprisoned Ahmad Sa'adat, General Secretary of the PFLP, before allowing the Israelis to kidnap him and put him in one of their own jails.

Hamas have done nothing to rival an act as despicable as that.

Hamas are no more of a threat than Fatah - in many ways they are less of a threat, as they at least are continuing to fight against the occupation rather than becoming paid policemen for the occupation.


there are 70,000 of them at that rally all waving red flags, they shouldn't just concede socialism by helping Islamists to gain power.

That is not a concrete criticism. How are the PFLP conceding socialism? How are they helping Islamists to gain power? Strawmen, strawmen everywhere...

The PFLP knows what it's doing. I'm inclined to trust their judgement on this one.

Homo Songun
7th October 2010, 04:37
Classic idealism coming from the islamophobes ITT. Their reasoning is something like, "the socialists are not in control, therefore there is no one to support." (Well of course not. The Zionists are in control!) What is amusing is that this the same exact reasoning they would undoubtedly use if the PFLP were in control, namely, "the [insert favored trend here] are not in control, therefore there is no one to support." This kind of ethereal, hands off approach is alien to the Marxist method as far I am concerned, and certainly to any kind of real engagement in the struggle for social justice.

Hamas is a bourgeois nationalist movement. Fine. But any leftist who equates this with fascism as a matter of course is just embarrassing themselves. Either they don't understand the meaning of the word beyond its use as a political cuss, or they are attributing some magical characteristic to national liberation movements happening to belong to populations that are majority Muslim, in which case they are merely racist idiots. Besides, which fascist party spends 90% of their budget on social welfare and education, as does Hamas? And this statistic courtesy the Council on Foreign Relations!