A Right Winger's View of Bowling for Columbine

[guerrillaradio]

That film, to me, seems to be the most damning indictment of America's (religious) right. I'm wondering what the capitalists on here made of it...

Alan

[Felicia]

just for the reecord, most of us don't lock our doors at night. I don't know how many foreigners have asked me that since that movie came out.... :D

I haven't seen it, so I can't comment, nor am I a capitalist :P

[Elect Marx]

That film was incredible but I'm also not a capitalist :lol: seems to damn capitalism to me. With the worker segment anyway. Marilyn Manson was great in the film!

[truthaddict11]

Michael Moore is not anti-capitalist he is a reformist. And his "documentry" is filled with lies and misconceptions

[Caldric]

Michael Moore is an idiot. He is just an opportunistic piece of crap.

[Dark Capitalist]

http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html

[Dark Capitalist]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31 2003, 12:10 PM
just for the reecord, most of us don't lock our doors at night. I don't know how many foreigners have asked me that since that movie came out.... :D

I haven't seen it, so I can't comment, nor am I a capitalist :P
Are you crazy? Everyone I know locks their doors at night. Someone could just walk in, kill you, and take all your belongings. Here, we not only keep the doors locked at night, but we also keep a handgun in each of our bedrooms. I have a loaded .357 magnum (I keep the first chamber empty) in the nightstand next to my bed.

[Rastafari]

I didn't like the movie near as well as I thought I would

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by Dark [email protected] 31 2003, 04:38 PM
http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html
Noone doubts that there are inconsistencies and deliberate distortions in BFC. However, if your only reply to a damning critique of America, the right wing, and pretty much every white man in your lovely country is to moan "he lied to me!!! He missed out Charlton burping!!! etc" then I guess Mikey's done his job.

Alan

[Dark Capitalist]

You know, it really doesn't make much of a "damning critique" when half of the "facts" presented are nothing but flat out lies.

If you ask me, Michael Moron's little pseudo-documentary does more to damage the credibility of the American left than anything we could have ever done.


Nice job, Mike! :P

[Loknar]

I've seen some clips on the I-net. The film holds allot of mis-information and insulting generalizations on white people. Michael Moore is a moron.

[Elect Marx]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31 2003, 04:08 PM
Michael Moore is not anti-capitalist he is a reformist. And his "documentry" is filled with lies and misconceptions
I never said he was a revolutionary or anything and When you say something, provide proof please.

[Elect Marx]

Originally posted by Dark [email protected] 31 2003, 04:38 PM
http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html
This site is bullshit. It is slanted and doesn't proves half of what it says, just like capitalists (the more honest ones).

[truthaddict11]

Originally posted by 313C7 iVi4RX+Aug 1 2003, 02:17 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (313C7 iVi4RX @ Aug 1 2003, 02:17 AM)
[email protected] 31 2003, 04:08 PM
Michael Moore is not anti-capitalist he is a reformist. And his "documentry" is filled with lies and misconceptions
I never said he was a revolutionary or anything and When you say something, provide proof please. [/b]
you said the film seems to damn capitalism, which is false

[truthaddict11]

Originally posted by 313C7 iVi4RX+Aug 1 2003, 02:21 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (313C7 iVi4RX @ Aug 1 2003, 02:21 AM)
Dark [email protected] 31 2003, 04:38 PM
http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html
This site is bullshit. It is slanted and doesn&#39;t proves half of what it says, just like capitalists (the more honest ones). [/b]
actualy just click on the links in the article they pretty much prove that michael moore misleads the reader. :(

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by Dark [email protected] 31 2003, 11:44 PM
You know, it really doesn&#39;t make much of a "damning critique" when half of the "facts" presented are nothing but flat out lies.

If you ask me, Michael Moron&#39;s little pseudo-documentary does more to damage the credibility of the American left than anything we could have ever done.


Nice job, Mike&#33; :P
Have you even seen the film?? Moore&#39;s pretty economical with statistics, and rightly so, cos noone wants a Maths lesson. The film&#39;s more a study of what it is to be American, right wing, religious, white etc etc. You aren&#39;t providing any answers DC. Explain why the America&#39;s gun murder rate is so high. Justify the presentation of news and media in your country. Counter Marilyn Manson&#39;s excellent "culture of fear" theory. And stop with the pathetic one-liners. They&#39;re just arrogant and aloof, much like the ideology you represent.

Alan

[Elect Marx]

Originally posted by [email protected] 1 2003, 11:05 AM
you said the film seems to damn capitalism, which is false
Not true. the film can damn capitalism without saying "Damn capitalism." The segment that delt with underemployed workers is very much a blow against capitalism, intentional attack or not.

[Sabocat]

Originally posted by Dark Capitalist+Jul 31 2003, 02:07 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Dark Capitalist @ Jul 31 2003, 02:07 PM)
[email protected] 31 2003, 12:10 PM
just for the reecord, most of us don&#39;t lock our doors at night. I don&#39;t know how many foreigners have asked me that since that movie came out.... :D

I haven&#39;t seen it, so I can&#39;t comment, nor am I a capitalist :P
Are you crazy? Everyone I know locks their doors at night. Someone could just walk in, kill you, and take all your belongings. Here, we not only keep the doors locked at night, but we also keep a handgun in each of our bedrooms. I have a loaded .357 magnum (I keep the first chamber empty) in the nightstand next to my bed. [/b]
Did you see the film DC? I especially like the cartoon segment. Your statement above basically proves the point Moore was trying to make.

A handgun in each bedroom? Talk about living in fear.

[truthaddict11]

Did you see the film DC? I especially like the cartoon segment. Your statement above basically proves the point Moore was trying to make.
The cartoon segment is filled with lies it leads to believe that the NRA and KKK are in legue which is false.

[Sabocat]

Originally posted by [email protected] 1 2003, 07:56 AM

Did you see the film DC? I especially like the cartoon segment. Your statement above basically proves the point Moore was trying to make.
The cartoon segment is filled with lies it leads to believe that the NRA and KKK are in legue which is false.
LOL....I don&#39;t know anybody who thinks the NRA and the KKK are linked from the depiction in the film, although I&#39;m sure that it&#39;s quite possible however that one certainly supports the other. ;)

It&#39;s a movie, there was no claim that said that everything you were about to see was absolute fact. It was meant to be provocative and illicit conversation and thought.

From this thread alone, I would argue that it was a tremendous success.

[truthaddict11]

the film was presented as a documentry, documentries are percieved as factual. With Moore delibertly warping, editing and lying thoughout the film hardly makes it a documentry.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by [email protected] 1 2003, 12:56 PM
The cartoon segment is filled with lies it leads to believe that the NRA and KKK are in legue which is false.
No it didn&#39;t...it just illuminated the similarities between the two, and how easy it would have been for them to help each other. Also, it shows how they work on the same level. Of course, you can read it how you like and demonstrate the inherent oneupmanship in the left wing, but that will say more about you than him. :angry:

Alan :ph34r:

[Exploited Class]

Originally posted by [email protected] 31 2003, 05:10 AM
just for the reecord, most of us don&#39;t lock our doors at night. I don&#39;t know how many foreigners have asked me that since that movie came out.... :D

I haven&#39;t seen it, so I can&#39;t comment, nor am I a capitalist :P
I live in America and I don&#39;t lock my door, even when leaving the house with nobody in it. The reasons are as follows

I understand my odds of somebody actualy breaking into my home.

I don&#39;t live in constant fear.

If somebody wants in that badly, my 15 dollar deadbolt will not stop them.

If they are going to go in and steal things, I don&#39;t want to also have to pay for the window they are going to break.

I care little for any of my possesions.

When we first moved into this house/commune one of roomates kept locking the door when he came in to the house, as I said to him. "Thank god you lock that door when you come in, all day I hear people just trying to get in." He stopped it.

I don&#39;t even lock it at night when we go to sleep.

[truthaddict11]

Originally posted by guerrillaradio+Aug 1 2003, 10:34 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (guerrillaradio @ Aug 1 2003, 10:34 AM)
[email protected] 1 2003, 12:56 PM
The cartoon segment is filled with lies it leads to believe that the NRA and KKK are in legue which is false.
No it didn&#39;t...it just illuminated the similarities between the two, and how easy it would have been for them to help each other. Also, it shows how they work on the same level. Of course, you can read it how you like and demonstrate the inherent oneupmanship in the left wing, but that will say more about you than him. :angry:

Alan :ph34r: [/b]
how are the KKK and the NRA similar?

[Hampton]

I found to hard to find a connection between thre NRA and KKK besides the fact that the NRA was founded when the KKK became illegal, which was said in the movie. The NRA was founded by former Union generals and Ambrose Burnside was their first president. Would an organization that was founded by union generals be earger to help racist southners? It&#39;s questionable and even so the NRA wasn&#39;t this huge organization that had the credibality that it has now and won&#39;t have been able to help Klan members obtain the right to bear arms.

[Marxist in Nebraska]

I think linking the NRA and KKK in the cartoon segment was a mistake, but the rest of the cartoon is accurate. I also liked the "Wondeful World" segment displaying US imperialism. There has been debate on the validity of the Taliban mention, but even removing that from the strip does not subtract much from a brilliant piece of anti-imperialist propaganda.

[truthaddict11]

the "wonderful world" segment on afghanistan is horrible that aide was feeding millions of afghans does michael tells us this? no, thus leading in many peoples mind that the cut of this aide shortly after 9-11 was good even though it was feeding people.

[Rastafari]

Micheal Moore&#39;s "wit" is very blunt and annoys me to no end. I fucking hated how he kept pestering Moses at his house, even though I don&#39;t care for the NRA or Charly himself, I thought picking on a senile old man was pointless, to say the least.





That, and everytime I see Mickey Moore I imagine his overpowering smell of mustard packets and crusted milk left on his oversized chin

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by truthaddict11+Aug 1 2003, 03:46 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (truthaddict11 @ Aug 1 2003, 03:46 PM)
Originally posted by [email protected] 1 2003, 10:34 AM

[email protected] 1 2003, 12:56 PM
The cartoon segment is filled with lies it leads to believe that the NRA and KKK are in legue which is false.
No it didn&#39;t...it just illuminated the similarities between the two, and how easy it would have been for them to help each other. Also, it shows how they work on the same level. Of course, you can read it how you like and demonstrate the inherent oneupmanship in the left wing, but that will say more about you than him. :angry:

Alan :ph34r:
how are the KKK and the NRA similar? [/b]
They&#39;re both old fashioned, outdated right wing organisations which give more power to the rich white man. And I hate both passionately. That makes them similar in my book.

Rasta - I fail to see how Moore "pesters" Heston. He asks him for an interview, and gets one. Heston merely gets annoyed when he can&#39;t answer a perfectly legitimate question of Moore&#39;s.

Personally I think you&#39;re all smallminded and arrogant to make such petty criticisms. Anyone with half a brain can see how BFC can, and undoubtedly will open the eyes of many people, both in the US and internationally. The fact that you all say things on the level of "I didn&#39;t like his shoes" is symbolic of the average, conceited, wannabe left winger.

Alan :ph34r:

[Dark Capitalist]

They&#39;re both old fashioned, outdated right wing organisations which give more power to the rich white man. And I hate both passionately. That makes them similar in my book.

From the report on MM&#39;s Bowling for Columbine fraud which, judging by your criticisms of it, I&#39;d wager to say you haven&#39;t even read yet.

Fact: During the 1950s and 1960s, groups of blacks organized as NRA chapters in order to obtain surplus military rifles to fight off Klansmen.

Also check: Negroes with Guns (http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBPrintItem.asp?ID=2960)

Those damn rednecks....

Rasta - I fail to see how Moore "pesters" Heston. He asks him for an interview, and gets one. Heston merely gets annoyed when he can&#39;t answer a perfectly legitimate question of Moore&#39;s.

C. Heston Interview. Having created the desired impression, Moore follows with his Heston interview. Heston&#39;s memory of the Flint event is foggy (he says it was a morning event; in fact the rally was at 6 - 7:30 PM.). Heston&#39;s lack of recall is not surprising; it was one rally in a nine-stop tour of three States in three days.

Moore, who had plenty of time to prepare, continues the impression he has created, asking Heston questions such as: "After that happened you came to Flint to hold a big rally and, you know, I just, did you feel it was being at all insensitive to the fact that this community had just gone through this tragedy?" Moore continues, "you think you&#39;d like to apologize to the people in Flint for coming and doing that at that time?"

Moore knows the real sequence, and knows that Heston does not. Moore takes full advantage.

As noted above, Moore&#39;s deception works on reviewers. In fact, when Heston says he did not know about Kayla&#39;s shooting when he went to Flint, viewers see Heston as an inept liar:

"Then, he [Heston] and his ilk held ANOTHER gun-rally shortly after another child/gun tragedy in Flint, MI where a 6-year old child shot and killed a 6-year old classmate (Heston claims in the final interview of the film that he didn&#39;t know this had just happened when he appeared)." [Click here for original]

Bowling persuaded these viewers by deceiving them. Moore&#39;s creative skills are used to convince the viewer that things happened which did not and that a truthful man is a liar when he denies them.

A further question: is the end of the Heston interview faked? (http://www.hardylaw.net/hestonfilming.html)


Personally I think you&#39;re all smallminded and arrogant to make such petty criticisms. Anyone with half a brain can see how BFC can, and undoubtedly will open the eyes of many people, both in the US and internationally. The fact that you all say things on the level of "I didn&#39;t like his shoes" is symbolic of the average, conceited, wannabe left winger.

Well, I know it opened my eyes to something, that something being that the American Liberal can be just as devious as the Soviet communists when it comes to outright propaganda.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by Dark [email protected] 1 2003, 09:23 PM
They&#39;re both old fashioned, outdated right wing organisations which give more power to the rich white man. And I hate both passionately. That makes them similar in my book.

From the report on MM&#39;s Bowling for Columbine fraud which, judging by your criticisms of it, I&#39;d wager to say you haven&#39;t even read yet.

Fact: During the 1950s and 1960s, groups of blacks organized as NRA chapters in order to obtain surplus military rifles to fight off Klansmen.

Also check: Negroes with Guns (http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBPrintItem.asp?ID=2960)

Those damn rednecks....

Rasta - I fail to see how Moore "pesters" Heston. He asks him for an interview, and gets one. Heston merely gets annoyed when he can&#39;t answer a perfectly legitimate question of Moore&#39;s.

C. Heston Interview. Having created the desired impression, Moore follows with his Heston interview. Heston&#39;s memory of the Flint event is foggy (he says it was a morning event; in fact the rally was at 6 - 7:30 PM.). Heston&#39;s lack of recall is not surprising; it was one rally in a nine-stop tour of three States in three days.

Moore, who had plenty of time to prepare, continues the impression he has created, asking Heston questions such as: "After that happened you came to Flint to hold a big rally and, you know, I just, did you feel it was being at all insensitive to the fact that this community had just gone through this tragedy?" Moore continues, "you think you&#39;d like to apologize to the people in Flint for coming and doing that at that time?"

Moore knows the real sequence, and knows that Heston does not. Moore takes full advantage.

As noted above, Moore&#39;s deception works on reviewers. In fact, when Heston says he did not know about Kayla&#39;s shooting when he went to Flint, viewers see Heston as an inept liar:

"Then, he [Heston] and his ilk held ANOTHER gun-rally shortly after another child/gun tragedy in Flint, MI where a 6-year old child shot and killed a 6-year old classmate (Heston claims in the final interview of the film that he didn&#39;t know this had just happened when he appeared)." [Click here for original]

Bowling persuaded these viewers by deceiving them. Moore&#39;s creative skills are used to convince the viewer that things happened which did not and that a truthful man is a liar when he denies them.

A further question: is the end of the Heston interview faked? (http://www.hardylaw.net/hestonfilming.html)


Personally I think you&#39;re all smallminded and arrogant to make such petty criticisms. Anyone with half a brain can see how BFC can, and undoubtedly will open the eyes of many people, both in the US and internationally. The fact that you all say things on the level of "I didn&#39;t like his shoes" is symbolic of the average, conceited, wannabe left winger.

Well, I know it opened my eyes to something, that something being that the American Liberal can be just as devious as the Soviet communists when it comes to outright propaganda.
It matters little to me that blacks joined the NRA. I never called it explicity "racist". It remains a simple fact that it is slanted towards the white man.

And I&#39;ve seen the "fraud" page maybe 50 times already, mainly shown to me by embittered left wingers jealous that they didn&#39;t make the film and are incapable of making so many valid points.

The deal with the Flint shootings is incorrect. As Moore says, with an image of the site to back it up, the shooting was mentioned on either Heston&#39;s or NRA&#39;s site (I can&#39;t remember) 48hrs after the shooting. If Heston was not informed after it was put on one of those sites, them maybe he is a "senile old man". However, I&#39;d say it&#39;s pretty likely that he was at least told. After all, it was the youngest ever participant and victim of a US school shooting, and graced all the news channels at the time. I&#39;d say most Americans would have heard of it. I remember it. What then, would it say about a man who heads an organisation that promotes gun ownership if he had not heard of a shooting of such significance in a town he was due to visit in a matter of days?? Be realistic.

Was the end of the interview faked?? Well whose to say?? We all saw Heston walk out of the interview disgruntled cos Moore asked him for a simple apology. Does it matter if he walked a few more yards or not?? Even so, it looks likely that he did. We all saw Heston struggle to answer, both why he kept his gun loaded and why the gun murder rate in the US is so high. We all saw him get angry, ignore Moore&#39;s shouts. Would it not make sense for him to totally walk off??

And I think your propaganda comment is disgustingly callous. Did you snooze into your popcorn in the bit where Moore attacks the news presentation in your lovely country?? No, no that&#39;s not possible, cos it&#39;s a running theme throughout the film and ultimately, Moore&#39;s answer to the question he poses at the film&#39;s start (that being: why does America have such a high gun murder rate??).

Your attempts to skirt the issues are very transparent. It seems that everyone else on here is content in being bogged down in semantics, whether Moore "lied" or "decevied" in one place or another. Personally, I prefer to look at the bigger picture. The fact remains that the US is fed a culture of fear; through its media and their presentation of the news (via corporations), through adverts on the television (from corporations), through their (right wing) politicians (in bed with corporations), through their (racist, imperialist) history, through everything an average American sees. Is it no surprise that you have more than 11,000 deaths every year through gunshot wounds?? Get used to the word "fear", DC, cos it&#39;s a very real concept in your nation.

Alan :ph34r:

[Vinny Rafarino]

Originally posted by Dark Capitalist+Jul 31 2003, 07:07 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Dark Capitalist @ Jul 31 2003, 07:07 PM)
[email protected] 31 2003, 12:10 PM
just for the reecord, most of us don&#39;t lock our doors at night. I don&#39;t know how many foreigners have asked me that since that movie came out.... :D

I haven&#39;t seen it, so I can&#39;t comment, nor am I a capitalist :P
Are you crazy? Everyone I know locks their doors at night. Someone could just walk in, kill you, and take all your belongings. Here, we not only keep the doors locked at night, but we also keep a handgun in each of our bedrooms. I have a loaded .357 magnum (I keep the first chamber empty) in the nightstand next to my bed. [/b]
So you are saying that your parents allow you to keep a loaded firearm in you bedroom at 17 years old? This is either a tetament to your parents oblious lack of common sense or you are simply full of shite and are attempting to look like a tough-guy.


I&#39;m going with the latter.

[Vinny Rafarino]

Originally posted by [email protected] 1 2003, 12:56 PM

Did you see the film DC? I especially like the cartoon segment. Your statement above basically proves the point Moore was trying to make.
The cartoon segment is filled with lies it leads to believe that the NRA and KKK are in legue which is false.
&#39;cos we all know the KKK would never ever partner with the NRA. That would be "immoral".

[truthaddict11]

And I&#39;ve seen the "fraud" page maybe 50 times already, mainly shown to me by embittered left wingers jealous that they didn&#39;t make the film and are incapable of making so many valid points.

Jealous? How? That I couldnt decieve millions of movie goers and the fil academy? Hardly.


Moore attacks the news presentation in your lovely country?? No, no that&#39;s not possible, cos it&#39;s a running theme throughout the film and ultimately, Moore&#39;s answer to the question he poses at the film&#39;s start (that being: why does America have such a high gun murder rate??).

If videogames and movies dont cause it what makes news broadcast cause it? Now the American Media is nothing to think highly of but I dont think that thats the cause of gun violence it is a factor but not the cause, The Columbine Kids were not influenced by video games violent movies or Marilyn Manson, thier killing spree was brought from malicious bullying. How come Moore didnt bring up that point?


Personally, I prefer to look at the bigger picture. The fact remains that the US is fed a culture of fear;
Probally the only intelligent point you or Moore made about the film, too bad the mockumentry didnt focus on that.


So you are saying that your parents allow you to keep a loaded firearm in you bedroom at 17 years old?

I have been allowed to shoot shootguns since I was about 14 (first time I ever fired a gun) and I wasnt allowed near those guns at any other time

[Dark Capitalist]

Originally posted by COMRADE RAF+Aug 2 2003, 12:17 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (COMRADE RAF @ Aug 2 2003, 12:17 AM)
Originally posted by Dark [email protected] 31 2003, 07:07 PM

[email protected] 31 2003, 12:10 PM
just for the reecord, most of us don&#39;t lock our doors at night. I don&#39;t know how many foreigners have asked me that since that movie came out.... :D

I haven&#39;t seen it, so I can&#39;t comment, nor am I a capitalist :P
Are you crazy? Everyone I know locks their doors at night. Someone could just walk in, kill you, and take all your belongings. Here, we not only keep the doors locked at night, but we also keep a handgun in each of our bedrooms. I have a loaded .357 magnum (I keep the first chamber empty) in the nightstand next to my bed.
So you are saying that your parents allow you to keep a loaded firearm in you bedroom at 17 years old? This is either a tetament to your parents oblious lack of common sense or you are simply full of shite and are attempting to look like a tough-guy.


I&#39;m going with the latter.[/b]
Alright, alright, there were a few break ins that occured about a month ago just a couple blocks away from my house. Some people we new got hurt, and I guess my parents were a little irked by it. So they let me keep one of my dad&#39;s revolvers in the middle drawer of my night stand just for the summer.


Yeah, you got me RAF.


Actually, it&#39;s really not that big of a deal with us. I&#39;ve had a .22 and a twelve guage in the bedroom closet since my 13th christmas. Albeit the twelve guage had a lock on it, but the .22 didn&#39;t. Both came with a small box of ammo, and no one thought anything of it.

My father happens to collect guns, so I&#39;ve been around them for as long as I can remember. And there&#39;s a certain amount of trust between us when it comes to firearms.

[Dark Capitalist]

Yeah, I just proved guerillaradio&#39;s point in that last post. But hey, maybe this so-called "culture of fear" is good for us in the long run. It tends to make people highly individualistic, which is a good thing. After all, like my father used to always say; Never trust a woman, never trust a jew, and never, I mean absolutely never, trust a nigger. And, well, for that matter you should never fully trust anyone. Not me, or your mother, or your grandparents or the church - no one, trust no one but yourself.


I never give anyone my full trust. Not even my parents (though they&#39;re the closest to recieving it).

[Vinny Rafarino]

Get a security system Ted Nugent Jr. It&#39;s only around &#036;30.00 bucks a month. This would be the logical response to break-ins.


Let me ask you a question mini-charlton, what if you or your parents were not home and some pre-teens decided to break in your home? (not a rare occurance I might add)

Allow me to paint a picture for you son. Little johnny likes to pretend he is a tough-guy around his mates. He&#39;s always bullying his mates into doing stupid things...Like breaking into homes. (no one knows little Johnny tough-guy&#39;s father drinks too much and likes to beat Johnny on almost a daily basis. He also likes to put his revolver to his and his mum&#39;s head after a night out with the lads at the local hillbilly pub; I believe they call this the bowlin&#39; alley) Little Johnny tough-guy coerces his two mates that breaking into your home will be a fuckin&#39; charge man&#33; they might even have a few bucks lying around&#33; Beef jerky and slushies for the hose bartender&#33;&#33; They don&#39;t find any quid but they do find a loaded .357 in some kid&#39;s dresser drawer.

"hey look at this&#33;" says Johnny Tough-guy, pulling back on the slide just like he saw Stallone do a hundred times over. "I&#39;m fuckin Rambo....No better yet...I&#39;m fuckin&#39; COBRA" he aims the gun at one of the other lads and says in his best Sly Stallone voice "You&#39;re the disease....and I&#39;m the cure" and pulls the trigger.

The kid whose face got blown off&#39;s parents didn&#39;t think it was a funny impersonation of Sly at all. Especially when th Mortician has to fill their only son&#39;s face with clay so they could have an open casket funeral.

Now Little Johnny Tough-guy is spending the upcoming years getting gang fucked by 17 year old criminals in the local "youth rehabilitation camp" I&#39;m sure we got a candidate for higher education when the lad gets out. Oh yeah...I&#39;m sure going to college to become a doctor is all he thinks about now.

[CubanFox]

Out of interest, how do these security systems function?

Great story, RAF. Made me think.

[Dark Capitalist]

Jesus christ....your hopeless.



I keep the first chamber empty.

[Vinny Rafarino]

I told you not to reply as any thing you possibly could have mustered would be absurd. What you have posted here transcends absurdity. There is a phrase in Latin that best describes your latest post DC;

Reductio ad absurdissimum, ad oculus.


Fox,


You can call any Home Security dealer and they will install a home security system (usually free of charge) and set you up with 24 hour monitoring. The going rate for monitoring is around &#036;30- &#036;35 bucks a month.

Thanks for your compliment. I should get a cookie for that story.

[Dark Capitalist]

Tell me where you said that.

[Vinny Rafarino]

I just noticed I had edited that portion out of my original post. Well....six of one, half dozen of the other. You still replied with the most innane post I&#39;ve seen in a long time. You even beat out Kelvin90210.


Perhgaps you should get the cookie.

[Dark Capitalist]

Tell me then, how am I absurd?

[Vinny Rafarino]

The fact that that rather than responding to the story in a humanitarian manner you chose to say;

"Jesus christ....your hopeless. I keep the first chamber empty" is all the proof that is required.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2003, 04:32 AM

And I&#39;ve seen the "fraud" page maybe 50 times already, mainly shown to me by embittered left wingers jealous that they didn&#39;t make the film and are incapable of making so many valid points.

Jealous? How? That I couldnt decieve millions of movie goers and the fil academy? Hardly.


Moore attacks the news presentation in your lovely country?? No, no that&#39;s not possible, cos it&#39;s a running theme throughout the film and ultimately, Moore&#39;s answer to the question he poses at the film&#39;s start (that being: why does America have such a high gun murder rate??).

If videogames and movies dont cause it what makes news broadcast cause it? Now the American Media is nothing to think highly of but I dont think that thats the cause of gun violence it is a factor but not the cause, The Columbine Kids were not influenced by video games violent movies or Marilyn Manson, thier killing spree was brought from malicious bullying. How come Moore didnt bring up that point?


Personally, I prefer to look at the bigger picture. The fact remains that the US is fed a culture of fear;
Probally the only intelligent point you or Moore made about the film, too bad the mockumentry didnt focus on that.


So you are saying that your parents allow you to keep a loaded firearm in you bedroom at 17 years old?

I have been allowed to shoot shootguns since I was about 14 (first time I ever fired a gun) and I wasnt allowed near those guns at any other time
Jealous? How? That I couldnt decieve millions of movie goers and the fil academy? Hardly.

Yep...pure jealousy and nitpicking. Get over it.

If videogames and movies dont cause it what makes news broadcast cause it?

Did you actually watch the film?? Fear my friend.

"Drive by shooting"
"AIDS"
"Floods"
"Killer bees"
"Terrorism"

24hr coverage of stories such as that. Sensationalist news telling you to be terrified of anyone who isn&#39;t American white and right wing, and of any product, animal or natural disaster perpetuated outside the American borders. Also, you should be terrified of Marilyn Manson, Eminem, and kids. Why?? Cos they&#39;re different. Ah, how I love America.

Now the American Media is nothing to think highly of but I dont think that thats the cause of gun violence it is a factor but not the cause, The Columbine Kids were not influenced by video games violent movies or Marilyn Manson, thier killing spree was brought from malicious bullying. How come Moore didnt bring up that point?

Ah&#33;&#33; At last you&#39;re getting somewhere. Yes, there is evidence to show that they were bullied (another staple of American high school), and that that may have led them to that, but, as Moore says, the same happens to millions of kids across American and indeed the world. Besides, there have been loads of shootings in America, not all of them by alienated "goths".

Probally the only intelligent point you or Moore made about the film, too bad the mockumentry didnt focus on that.

You&#39;re kidding right?? The whole film described this culture of fear.

DC - I&#39;ll get round to your post when I can. Right now I have work.

Alan

[truthaddict11]

24hr coverage of stories such as that. Sensationalist news telling you to be terrified of anyone who isn&#39;t American white and right wing, and of any product, animal or natural disaster perpetuated outside the American borders. Also, you should be terrified of Marilyn Manson, Eminem, and kids. Why?? Cos they&#39;re different. Ah, how I love America.

News Broadcasts do not cause deaths by guns

whatever Moore does do to damn the media he also does.

[Rastafari]

well, GuerillaRadio, I do agree COMPLETELY with Moore&#39;s claim that the media controls people with fear, but thats old news, my friend. People have know that since the 70&#39;s, I&#39;m afraid, and Moore focusing on the issue just acts as 20 minutes of purposeful filler in a movie that should be about gun control. Of course, a lot of the movie seemed to deviate from that very issue, whether Moore was pouncing on Dick Clark, or saying that the black man was stereotyped into a monster in this society (which I whole-heartedly hate but realize is true-once again, old news, though).

Micheal Moore is a half-wit combination of Noam Chomsky and Al Franken, a Liberal Reformist who thinks he has a point and tries to drag it across with humor-In his books

In his "documentary", he begs us to see the truth on one hand, and causticly attacks the foundations of this corrupt system on the other-not a good way to get ANYBODY&#39;s attention over High-School Age.

Sorry I&#39;m a fake liberal, by the way


See a good "documentary", see This is Spinal Tap. Or Best in Show. Anything more serious than this shit

[Bianconero]

Personally, I think that Moore&#39;s films and books can have a positive impact on society and on those who have the potential to become usefull to the movement in the future. I&#39;m everything but an admirer of Moore, yet I think he can help recruiting people, especially young people for the Marxist cause. After all, Moore knows where a lot of problems of capitalist America are to be found. Of course, he isn&#39;t smart enough to solve them (as socialism is the only solution and Moore isn&#39;t a socialist) but people watching his films at least learn about certain realities of capitalism such as poverty, the roots of criminality, greedy corporations, corrupt politicians etc.

[Rastafari]

Oh, and I won&#39;t even waste my time arguing with Dark Capitalist. I belive you, buddy. Now put on your General&#39;s helmet and go kill some dirty reds, Commander.

"Sleeps with a gun next to my bed"
Fucking Bullshit <_<



Pretty good call Bianconero, and congrats on having 50 posts

[Bianconero]

Well thanks for that, Rastafari.

[truthaddict11]

well, GuerillaRadio, I do agree COMPLETELY with Moore&#39;s claim that the media controls people with fear, but thats old news, my friend. People have know that since the 70&#39;s, I&#39;m afraid, and Moore focusing on the issue just acts as 20 minutes of purposeful filler in a movie that should be about gun control. Of course, a lot of the movie seemed to deviate from that very issue, whether Moore was pouncing on Dick Clark, or saying that the black man was stereotyped into a monster in this society (which I whole-heartedly hate but realize is true-once again, old news, though).

Read Culture Of Fear a lot better than Moore&#39;s halfwitted version of the fear the media uses.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2003, 03:15 PM
well, GuerillaRadio, I do agree COMPLETELY with Moore&#39;s claim that the media controls people with fear, but thats old news, my friend. People have know that since the 70&#39;s, I&#39;m afraid, and Moore focusing on the issue just acts as 20 minutes of purposeful filler in a movie that should be about gun control. Of course, a lot of the movie seemed to deviate from that very issue, whether Moore was pouncing on Dick Clark, or saying that the black man was stereotyped into a monster in this society (which I whole-heartedly hate but realize is true-once again, old news, though).

Micheal Moore is a half-wit combination of Noam Chomsky and Al Franken, a Liberal Reformist who thinks he has a point and tries to drag it across with humor-In his books

In his "documentary", he begs us to see the truth on one hand, and causticly attacks the foundations of this corrupt system on the other-not a good way to get ANYBODY&#39;s attention over High-School Age.

Sorry I&#39;m a fake liberal, by the way


See a good "documentary", see This is Spinal Tap. Or Best in Show. Anything more serious than this shit
So what if Moore isn&#39;t making "new" discoveries?? You seem to forget how mainstream and popular BFC is. It won an Oscar for Christ&#39;s sakes. Did these "people in the 70s" get as much exposure to the cause as Moore did. No...

This board can be so frustrating. You all would much rather bicker over whose better, your Dad or my Dad, then work together on something. I give up.

Alan :ph34r:

[Rastafari]

well, we are disagreeing about a movie we both went to theaters and saw under totally different conditions and assumptions. If everybody liked the movie (or even all lefties), it would have been great. But I am a nitpicky bastard who expects a point in everything he sees, so it just doesn&#39;t work out sometimes, unfortunately.

[Rastafari]

oh, and Kudos to Ghost Writer for his "Akira" avatar. Now there&#39;s a fuckin&#39; movie.

you are still pretty much a dumbass troll, though. But a dumbass troll who knows his movies.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by [email protected] 3 2003, 01:28 AM
well, we are disagreeing about a movie we both went to theaters and saw under totally different conditions and assumptions. If everybody liked the movie (or even all lefties), it would have been great. But I am a nitpicky bastard who expects a point in everything he sees, so it just doesn&#39;t work out sometimes, unfortunately.
I guess. Maybe I just appreciate someone saying something I&#39;d been screaming for ages. Maybe I&#39;m just sick of the lack of unity in the left. Maybe I should shut up. Delete as appropriate.

Alan :ph34r:

[Tasha]

I found the movie to be very good in some parts. Michael moore does bring up many points that he proves to be correct in. As for guns keeping people safer is the most retarded thing i have heard in the longest time. Even though i own a gun I see no use for it. Any society that allows guns to its citizens in normal conditions is not a very good one. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever for citizens to be in possession of guns. If you want to go hunting you can use a gun at a hunting club. There is also no need for violent revolution when you have popular support. Therefore there is absolutely no use for guns in a modern society, other than the fact that it helps contribute to fear.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2003, 01:28 AM
Even though i own a gun I see no use for it.
That one sentence makes the rest of your post totally invalid. If you believe what you write, then throw away your fucking gun. You&#39;re just contributing to the culture of fear. In short, you&#39;re a hypocritical idiot.

Prove me wrong.

Alan :ph34r:

[Tasha]

your right, but ive had it since i was a kid i never use it my grandfather had it. It is a persian k98 it isnt used for anything but decorating the bolt is not in it and it is on my wall. However if a law was passed restricting all guns i would gladly throw it away.