Communism ever achieved?

[Sixiang]

Hello revleft. I'm working on a paper for my Sociology class. We have to create our "ideal society" by any way that we want. I am describing my society through written description. One of the topics I have to cover is "Are there any societies in the United States or in the world that come close to such an ideal society? Was there a specific society from history that stands out to you?" This has made me wonder:

What is the closest any society has ever come to communism? Or, if that doesn't work, have any societies properly implemented socialism as necessary to bring about Communism? Have any anarchist societies successfully existed? Have there been any societies in history that were truly controlled by the working class for the working class? Or, at least, have they come close?

Catalonia kind of sticks out in my mind, but all I really know about it is what I read in Homage to Catalonia, by George Orwell. What about the Paris Commune? I don't know too much about the histories of these societies. Even if it was only for a little while, did any of them do it right? Maybe there is even a current society that you think is properly implementing socialism.

I appreciate any and all feedback on this matter. Thank you.

[Adil3tr]

They were all under seige, Paris, Catalonia, Petrograd. The only communistic society that lived in peace was the Native Americans, but the capitalists got them too.
They might actually be the best option you have to study.

[F9]

No, neither communism nor anarchism has ever been achieved and what "we had" wasnt closed to them either, it would need a lot more job to achieve that.
Really the 2 best examples coming to my mind are paris commune(first) and then catalonia.Of course and they didnt do it right, if they would do it right, they would be successful.Of course correct and wrong at those periods was really close, and its natural for them not doing everything correct(there is never going to be a revolution,absolutely correct), they had some wrong decisions that in the end "destroyed them", they had strong opponents also, it wasnt an easy job.

[DaComm]

If you want to be extremely technical, Marxist "Communism" is only achieved when a state to perpetuate the rule of the workers loses it's purpose (there is no need for a military) once the world is totally subdued to Socialist ideals. That is, a country that follows the socialist track but is confined to "one country" is not Communist. In this sense, it's comical to ever claim that advanced Communism existed, but I would say the best example of Socialism would be Catalonia or maybe the early RSFSR. They exemplified how collectivism was, much to horror of idiotic conservatives, beyond practical. Catalonia in the steel industry for example, achieved an immense boost in productivity in a short time. Creative spirit was revived, erm, introduced, as was the elimination of labor exploitation. Perhaps more inspiring was that they proved that the modern proletariat could have a revolutionary consensus to revolt and resist. In this sense, they were star examples of what aspire to create and are the closest we have yet come. Keep in mind however, that places like Commune De Paris and Catalonia did not totally collapse because of an internal contradiction, but because of Capitalist aggression and lack of tolerance for anything that isn't them.

[Ocean Seal]

Hello revleft. I'm working on a paper for my Sociology class. We have to create our "ideal society" by any way that we want. I am describing my society through written description. One of the topics I have to cover is "Are there any societies in the United States or in the world that come close to such an ideal society? Was there a specific society from history that stands out to you?" This has made me wonder:

What is the closest any society has ever come to communism? Or, if that doesn't work, have any societies properly implemented socialism as necessary to bring about Communism? Have any anarchist societies successfully existed? Have there been any societies in history that were truly controlled by the working class for the working class? Or, at least, have they come close?

Catalonia kind of sticks out in my mind, but all I really know about it is what I read in Homage to Catalonia, by George Orwell. What about the Paris Commune? I don't know too much about the histories of these societies. Even if it was only for a little while, did any of them do it right? Maybe there is even a current society that you think is properly implementing socialism.

I appreciate any and all feedback on this matter. Thank you.
No communism has never been achieved. Communism is the 6th mode of production, most nations are capitalist today (4th mode of production) a few nations have reached socialism (5th mode of production) and there are some still that are feudal (3rd mode of production). Also the primitive commune is the 1st mode of production. So no communism has never been reached nor are we close to reaching it.

[Sixiang]

They were all under seige, Paris, Catalonia, Petrograd. The only communistic society that lived in peace was the Native Americans, but the capitalists got them too.
They might actually be the best option you have to study.
Okay, thank you. I am sorry to say that I actually don't know too much about Native American history. I have random snippets of information scattered here and there. The most any of my History classes ever covered of them were brief introductions to the big Incan, Mayan, and Aztec empires. Although, I did take a Michigan History class which covered the various tribes of the state quite well.

I also recently read about a tribe that Christopher Columbus came across called the Arawaks. Columbus wrote about how they willingly exchanged everything they had and said, "When you ask for something they have, they never say no. To the contrary, they offer to share with anyone." Columbus then proceeded to enslave them and force his religion on them, driving practically all of them to death.

However, I imagine that since there were so many different Native American tribes with different customs and beliefs, I imagine that you can't really lump them all together. I'm sure there were some tribes that showed similarities with capitalism, feudalism, imperialism, oppression in general.


No communism has never been achieved. Communism is the 6th mode of production, most nations are capitalist today (4th mode of production) a few nations have reached socialism (5th mode of production) and there are some still that are feudal (3rd mode of production). Also the primitive commune is the 1st mode of production. So no communism has never been reached nor are we close to reaching it.
What is the 2nd mode?

[DaComm]

What is the 2nd mode?

Primitive Communism, slavery, feudalism, capitalism, socialism, communism

[Sixiang]

Primitive Communism, slavery, feudalism, capitalism, socialism, communism

Thank you. I see that you mentioned that different nations are in different stages. Does this mean that it is safe for me to assume that these stages don't necessarily mean one specific time period (certain years), but rather these stages have to do with the specific historical and social variables that affect an area(nation, country, whatever)'s current status?

As in, when I hear the term "feudalism", I usually associated it with the middle ages, but since feudalism can still exist in the present era, then can I assume that feudalism has more to do with the specific sociological aspects of any feudal society? Sorry if that wasn't worded very well. I tried to describe what I was thinking as best as I could.

Also, since you said that there are some societies that are in the socialist stage, could you name the ones you are specifically referring to?

[fa2991]

The Free Territory in the Ukraine. One of anarchist communism's great, forgotten achievements. Plus I think you should take any chance you get to praise Makhno. :lol:

Avoid the Native Americans. That's primitive communism which, as has been pointed out, is FAR from ideal.

[Sixiang]

The Free Territory in the Ukraine. One of anarchist communism's great, forgotten achievements. Plus I think you should take any chance you get to praise Makhno. :lol:

Avoid the Native Americans. That's primitive communism which, as has been pointed out, is FAR from ideal.

That's pretty interesting as well. I just looked Makhno and The Free Territory up on wikipedia. I've never even heard of that society.

[Adil3tr]

Okay, thank you. I am sorry to say that I actually don't know too much about Native American history. I have random snippets of information scattered here and there. The most any of my History classes ever covered of them were brief introductions to the big Incan, Mayan, and Aztec empires. Although, I did take a Michigan History class which covered the various tribes of the state quite well.

However, I imagine that since there were so many different Native American tribes with different customs and beliefs, I imagine that you can't really lump them all together. I'm sure there were some tribes that showed similarities with capitalism, feudalism, imperialism, oppression in general.

The Aztecs, Maya, and Inca all reached the second stage. The Inca had some kind of insurance against disaster in exchange for labor system, however a lot, perhaps not all, of the the native american tribes were primitive communist, thats why I mentioned them. They weren't all the same, or all perfect, but their economic foundation was primitive communist.

[Dimitri Molotov]

Have you heard of Christiania in Denmark? i am not an expert, but from what i know it is a town of around 800 people in the middle of denmarks capital, and they are kind of hippy like, but they have communal housing, public land ownership, and all kinds of characteristics that a marxist/anarchist society should have. the only problem i know of with it is police occasionally raid the place for drugs, but thats not christianias fault, thats the pigs in denmark and have nothing to do with christiania in general. most of the buildings are wonderfully painted and the town is very artistic and everything works fine:) i would say them and the native americans are your best examples i can think of.:thumbup1:

[Barry Lyndon]

'Communism' is a worldwide stateless, classless society, so of course it has never been achieved. Even 'Communist' countries themselves claimed to be socialist nations working toward the goal of communism.

In my view, the closest that human beings have come to a society run by and for the working class have been the Paris Commune, the RSFR(pre-Stalin), Anarchist Catalonia, revolutionary Cuba(although the recent reforms are cause for great worry), Red Kerala(India), China during the Cultural Revolution, Sandanista Nicaragua, Burkina Faso under Sankara, the Zapatistas in Mexico, the current Bolivarian revolution in Venezuela.....

[fa2991]

Have you heard of Christiania in Denmark? i am not an expert, but from what i know it is a town of around 800 people in the middle of denmarks capital, and they are kind of hippy like, but they have communal housing, public land ownership, and all kinds of characteristics that a marxist/anarchist society should have. the only problem i know of with it is police occasionally raid the place for drugs, but thats not christianias fault, thats the pigs in denmark and have nothing to do with christiania in general. most of the buildings are wonderfully painted and the town is very artistic and everything works fine:) i would say them and the native americans are your best examples i can think of.:thumbup1:

I've heard of Christiania, and it's not at all communism. In my understanding, it's little more than a pretentious little hippie pot smoking commune. The only time I've heard someone speak positively of it is when they're talking about all the hash dealers that live there.

[enrici]

No, neither communism nor anarchism has ever been achieved and what "we had" wasnt closed to them either, it would need a lot more job to achieve that.
Really the 2 best examples coming to my mind are paris commune(first) and then catalonia.Of course and they didnt do it right, if they would do it right, they would be successful.Of course correct and wrong at those periods was really close, and its natural for them not doing everything correct(there is never going to be a revolution,absolutely correct), they had some wrong decisions that in the end "destroyed them", they had strong opponents also, it wasnt an easy job.

Yeha, the question seems to be how to preserve the workers' revolution once it's established, because history proves that there are always powerful enemies.
Also, what do some people have here against drugs? Do you think drugs shouldn't be legalised under socialsim?

[fa2991]

Also, what do some people have here against drugs? Do you think drugs shouldn't be legalised under socialsim?

I do, I just don't think a pointless little neighborhood dedicated exclusively to weed is communism.

[Sixiang]

In my view, the closest that human beings have come to a society run by and for the working class have been the Paris Commune, the RSFR(pre-Stalin), Anarchist Catalonia, revolutionary Cuba(although the recent reforms are cause for great worry), Red Kerala(India), China during the Cultural Revolution, Sandanista Nicaragua, Burkina Faso under Sankara, the Zapatistas in Mexico, the current Bolivarian revolution in Venezuela.....

Thanks for the list. Time for some more research...

[Crvena-Zastava]

SFR Yugoslavia during Tito's time by far was a much happier, FREE nation when compared to those nations that claimed to be Communist/Socialist [North Korea, Soviet Union, China etc].

[Magón]

That's pretty interesting as well. I just looked Makhno and The Free Territory up on wikipedia. I've never even heard of that society.

Yeah, it's kind of the lost chapter of Anarchist History for most. (Or for some, shaded over.) Very interesting though, and a good thing to look into. Like has also been said, Nicaragua during Sandinista rule is very interesting. If you want a group of people who really worked on educating the masses so they wouldn't be sheep, then the Sandinista's are your group for a more modern time.

[Omnia Sunt Communia]

Avoid the Native Americans. That's primitive communism which, as has been pointed out, is FAR from ideal.

Idealism is bourgeois.

[Obs]

Have you heard of Christiania in Denmark? i am not an expert, but from what i know it is a town of around 800 people in the middle of denmarks capital, and they are kind of hippy like, but they have communal housing, public land ownership, and all kinds of characteristics that a marxist/anarchist society should have. the only problem i know of with it is police occasionally raid the place for drugs, but thats not christianias fault, thats the pigs in denmark and have nothing to do with christiania in general. most of the buildings are wonderfully painted and the town is very artistic and everything works fine:) i would say them and the native americans are your best examples i can think of.:thumbup1:
Speaking as a Dane, Christiania is where you go to buy pot, not where you go to throw off the shackles of life under capitalism.

[AK]

Have you heard of Christiania in Denmark? i am not an expert, but from what i know it is a town of around 800 people in the middle of denmarks capital, and they are kind of hippy like, but they have communal housing, public land ownership, and all kinds of characteristics that a marxist/anarchist society should have. the only problem i know of with it is police occasionally raid the place for drugs, but thats not christianias fault, thats the pigs in denmark and have nothing to do with christiania in general. most of the buildings are wonderfully painted and the town is very artistic and everything works fine:) i would say them and the native americans are your best examples i can think of.:thumbup1:
Christiana? You mean the shitty little lifestylist commune that has no relevance to the class struggle as we see it today?

[Tavarisch_Mike]

'Communism' is a worldwide stateless, classless society, so of course it has never been achieved. Even 'Communist' countries themselves claimed to be socialist nations working toward the goal of communism.

In my view, the closest that human beings have come to a society run by and for the working class have been the Paris Commune, the RSFR(pre-Stalin), Anarchist Catalonia, revolutionary Cuba(although the recent reforms are cause for great worry), Red Kerala(India), China during the Cultural Revolution, Sandanista Nicaragua, Burkina Faso under Sankara, the Zapatistas in Mexico, the current Bolivarian revolution in Venezuela.....

Agree, I wanna include the DDR here.