Orwell's Five Reason People Oppose Socialism

[Rakhmetov]

Class prejudice. This is real and it is visceral. Middle class socialists do themselves no favours by pretending it does not exist and—by glorifying the manual worker—they tend to alienate that large section of the population which is economically working class but culturally middle class.
Machine worship. Orwell finds most socialists guilty of this. Orwell himself is suspicious of technological progress for its own sake and thinks it inevitably leads to softness and decadence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decadence). He points out that most fictional technically advanced socialist utopias (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopia) are deadly dull. H.G. Wells (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.G._Wells) in particular is criticised on these grounds.
Crankiness (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crank_%28person%29). Amongst many other types of people Orwell specifies people who have beards or wear sandals, vegetarians, and nudists as contributing to socialism's negative reputation among many more conventional people.
Turgid language. Those who pepper their sentences with “notwithstandings” and “heretofores” and become over excited when discussing dialectical materialism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_materialism) are unlikely to gain much popular support.
Failure to concentrate on the basics. Socialism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) should be about common decency and fair shares for all rather than political orthodoxy or philosophical consistency.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier

[Comrade Marxist Bro]

4. Turgid language. Those who pepper their sentences with “notwithstandings” and “heretofores” and become over excited when discussing dialectical materialism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_materialism) are unlikely to gain much popular support.

Oh shit. :rolleyes:

[Zanthorus]

Failure to concentrate on the basics. Socialism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) should be about common decency and fair shares for all rather than political orthodoxy or philosophical consistency.

tbh, this just seems like another one of those lame excuses for opportunist politics. Can't actually argue against the so-called 'extremists' so they just throw around slurs about 'sectarians' and 'dogmatists'.

[Os Cangaceiros]

I hear him on the turgid language issue.

[BuddhaInBabylon]

word yo. word.

[Sixiang]

The Road to Wigan Pier is a fantastic book. It's one of those first examples of socialist literature that I read that helped me make the move towards it. I see his list and understand it in the historical context that it was written. One could add quite a bit to it as applies to one's own location in the modern world.

[khad]

adly dull. H.G. Wells (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.G._Wells) in particular is criticised on these grounds.

Crankiness (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crank_%28person%29). Amongst many other types of people Orwell specifies people who have beards or wear sandals, vegetarians, and nudists as contributing to socialism's negative reputation among many more conventional people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier
You must also include feminists and homosexuals in there, because that's what Orwell said. Apparently even wearing a pistachio colored shirt was not manly enough for that rapist.

[Tablo]

You must also include feminists and homosexuals in there, because that's what Orwell said. Apparently even wearing a pistachio colored shirt was not manly enough for that rapist.
Oh, snap! Orwell just got owned! :lol:

[kragura]

You must also include feminists and homosexuals in there, because that's what Orwell said. Apparently even wearing a pistachio colored shirt was not manly enough for that rapist.

Why was Orwell a rapist?

[Os Cangaceiros]

Why was Orwell a rapist?

George Orwell (then known as Eric Blair) was a sexually frusterated teenager. I guess he detected some signals from a childhood friend that didn't actually exist, which resulted in him pressing the issue. She said no, and he stopped. She said that the encounter resulted in bruises, but they continued to be friends afterwards.

That's about the extent of the story.

[Homo Songun]

Well, Orwell was an expert on opposing Socialism after all.

[Os Cangaceiros]

Yeah, I guess fighting fascists in Spain and getting shot in defense of socialist ideals doesn't count for much these days.

I'm not a huge fan of Orwell or his politics (although I do like 1984 as an entertaining novel), but a lot of the critics 'round these parts seem to be disgruntled Stalinoids.

[Homo Songun]

Yes, I'm sandal wearing, vegetarian Stalinoid. Sadly, he didn't snitch out only Stalinoids to the British secret police.

[Tavarisch_Mike]

George Orwell (then known as Eric Blair) was a sexually frusterated teenager. I guess he detected some signals from a childhood friend that didn't actually exist, which resulted in him pressing the issue. She said no, and he stopped. She said that the encounter resulted in bruises, but they continued to be friends afterwards.

That's about the extent of the story.

Hmm is this why Winstone express a desire to rape Julia before they get to know eachother in 1984? All of a sudden Orwell seems to be a little bit creepy.

Anyway i agree with his list allthough i didnt really get the machine worship-thing, but 3, 4, 5 feelt very familiar, you just have to change some of the examples in 3 like vegetarians will be replaced by animal rights activists and so.

[khad]

George Orwell (then known as Eric Blair) was a sexually frusterated teenager. I guess he detected some signals from a childhood friend that didn't actually exist, which resulted in him pressing the issue. She said no, and he stopped. She said that the encounter resulted in bruises, but they continued to be friends afterwards.

That's about the extent of the story.
If by friends you mean that they hardly spoke to each other since and that Orwell ran away to the overseas empire to live it up as a sex tourist, then all right. :thumbup1:

[Os Cangaceiros]

Any proof for this "sex tourist" allegation?

[Quail]

Class prejudice. This is real and it is visceral. Middle class socialists do themselves no favours by pretending it does not exist and—by glorifying the manual worker—they tend to alienate that large section of the population which is economically working class but culturally middle class.
Machine worship. Orwell finds most socialists guilty of this. Orwell himself is suspicious of technological progress for its own sake and thinks it inevitably leads to softness and decadence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decadence). He points out that most fictional technically advanced socialist utopias (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopia) are deadly dull. H.G. Wells (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.G._Wells) in particular is criticised on these grounds.
Crankiness (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crank_%28person%29). Amongst many other types of people Orwell specifies people who have beards or wear sandals, vegetarians, and nudists as contributing to socialism's negative reputation among many more conventional people.
Turgid language. Those who pepper their sentences with “notwithstandings” and “heretofores” and become over excited when discussing dialectical materialism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_materialism) are unlikely to gain much popular support.
Failure to concentrate on the basics. Socialism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) should be about common decency and fair shares for all rather than political orthodoxy or philosophical consistency.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier

I lol'd when I read the bolded bit in the book :laugh:

I agree with the language and the basics points as well. There are some socialists who make their organisation quite inaccessible to newcomers because they use too much jargon for the average person to understand.

[khad]

Any proof for this "sex tourist" allegation?

It's a known fact that almost every British colonial official made ample use of local "services."


When I was young and had no sense
In far-off Mandalay
I lost my heart to a Burmese girl
As lovely as the day.

Her skin was gold, her hair was jet,
Her teeth were ivory;
I said, "for twenty silver pieces,
Maiden, sleep with me".

She looked at me, so pure, so sad,
The loveliest thing alive,
And in her lisping, virgin voice,
Stood out for twenty-five.

[Il Medico]

It's a known fact that almost every British colonial official made ample use of local "services."
Alright, he had sex with a prostitute, so what?