Enterprise (Star Trek series)

[Thirsty Crow]

So, I'm a big fan of Star Trek, and Croatian national television is running "Enterprise" (with teh captain Archer) and something funny happened...
So, there is a temporal war, changing the past etc etc.

And one of the major screw-ups for humans in the 23rd century was that Lenin was assasinated by an aline in 1916, which enabled Nazi Germany to capture entire Europe and the eastern U.S. :D:D

Great to see some writer honour the legacy of Lenin :D

[Bilan]

NERD ALERT.


lul

[Thirsty Crow]

Ah, go eat a cake (if you don't have any bread) :tongue_smilie:

[ContrarianLemming]

I saw it (i have it on dvd) and i got a little tingle in my back when i heard His name.

[piet11111]

Yeah i noticed that one too and thought it was funny.
But i think they credit lenin too much without him the revolution would have happened and the tsar would have been overthrown anyway.

The rapid development & militarization of the USSR probably would have happened without lenin.

I think lenin came back to russia after the revolution by train so he was not even there to begin with.

[Comrade Wolfie's Very Nearly Banned Adventures]

Enterprise is shit. Go watch real star trek (but not voyager).

[Raúl Duke]

But i think they credit lenin too much without him the revolution would have happened and the tsar would have been overthrown anyway.

The rapid development & militarization of the USSR probably would have happened without lenin.

I think lenin came back to russia after the revolution by train so he was not even there to begin with.

The February Revolution occurred...

but without Lenin there may be no Bolshevik state and no Bolshevik state means no Stalin or Trotsky at the helm...

[Aloysius]

The Earth Empire thing was definitely one of the coolest plot runs in the entirety of Star Trek.
They need to make a DS9 movie. That series was not ended well at all.

[ContrarianLemming]

The Earth Empire thing was definitely one of the coolest plot runs in the entirety of Star Trek.
They need to make a DS9 movie. That series was not ended well at all.

Ds9 was absolute win, but I woulda prefered them going down the Picard and Archer route of having the final episode being a sort of extra long single story arc instead of simply being a wrapper upper.

wrap up eps tend to be sub par compared to the preceding eps. This is where BSG fell

[Aloysius]

I never really got into Battlestar Galactica. It got really serious and confusing at times.

[Comrade Wolfie's Very Nearly Banned Adventures]

The Earth Empire thing was definitely one of the coolest plot runs in the entirety of Star Trek.
They need to make a DS9 movie. That series was not ended well at all.

DS9 needed a movie, definatly.

[Aloysius]

Preferably closing up the Emissary thing.

[Queercommie Girl]

Enterprise cannot compare with the first 4 series of Star Trek.

I do always like to argue that the United Federation of Planets in Star Trek is basically a "socialist society" though. (Albeit an utopian rather than Marxist one)

[Queercommie Girl]

Enterprise is shit. Go watch real star trek (but not voyager).

I liked the fact that Voyager had a female captain though.

[Kuppo Shakur]

The original series.
The Next Generation.
That is it. You needn't bother with anything else falsely labeled "Star Trek".

[Quail]

Enterprise was pretty bad. I used to watch some of it because I had a massive thing for T'Pol, but the series itself is rubbish compared to the good Star Trek.

[Invincible Summer]

I liked the fact that Voyager had a female captain though.

I think the progressiveness of that was offset by Seven of Nine though.

[Thirsty Crow]

Enterprise was pretty bad. I used to watch some of it because I had a massive thing for T'Pol, but the series itself is rubbish compared to the good Star Trek.
Oh, T'Pol.
I knew there was another reason for me watching the series besides thzat I'm a Trek nerd :D




I do always like to argue that the United Federation of Planets in Star Trek is basically a "socialist society" though. (Albeit an utopian rather than Marxist one)
Well, they do have replicators and renewable sources of energy, so yeah, that's a post-scarcity society.
I always thought that it would be so kewl if some people shot a series concerning developments on Earth and depicting life on Earth in this post-scarcityof ours.

[Shokaract]

So, I'm a big fan of Star Trek, and Croatian national television is running "Enterprise" (with teh captain Archer) and something funny happened...
So, there is a temporal war, changing the past etc etc.

And one of the major screw-ups for humans in the 23rd century was that Lenin was assasinated by an aline in 1916, which enabled Nazi Germany to capture entire Europe and the eastern U.S. :D:D

Great to see some writer honour the legacy of Lenin :D

Oh yeah, thanks for reminding me.

Despite the rehashing of stories early on and continuity-breaking introductions of enemies, I've always thought that Enterprise wasn't that terrible.

The thing is that Enterprise improved in the fourth season, but unfortunately wasn't given a chance to develop fully. The finale was a disaster though.


I do always like to argue that the United Federation of Planets in Star Trek is basically a "socialist society" though. (Albeit an utopian rather than Marxist one)

Needs met. Poverty and hunger eliminated. Money eliminated. United Earth government. Multi-cultural/ethnic crew (albeit with the overrepresentation of white Americans for the obvious reason of being on American television). Sounds right.

[Comrade Wolfie's Very Nearly Banned Adventures]

Oh yeah, thanks for reminding me.

Despite the rehashing of stories early on and continuity-breaking introductions of enemies, I've always thought that Enterprise wasn't that terrible.

The thing is that Enterprise improved in the fourth season, but unfortunately wasn't given a chance to develop fully. The finale was a disaster though.

God dam you meddling exectives.

[Queercommie Girl]

Well, they do have replicators and renewable sources of energy, so yeah, that's a post-scarcity society.


No that's not primarily why it is utopian socialist. The Federation is an utopian socialist society because inequality and poverty does not exist, and most of the people in most cases never use any kind of money. It's a "post-monetary" economy.

See for instance the conversation between Lily and Captain Picard in Star Trek VIII: First Contact.

Also, even the Federation is clearly not a "post-scarcity" society in the natural sense, as it clearly does not command infinite resources or have infinite access to resources. It is however a "post-scarcity" society in the limited Marxist sense, as in all the basic rational needs of every person can be always satisfied.

[Queercommie Girl]

I think the progressiveness of that was offset by Seven of Nine though.

7 of 9 was still generally speaking a positive figure though.

I can see how her style is mainly designed for male eyes, but from a sex-positive feminist point of view, couldn't one say that the very fact that males can actively show off their sexuality but females can't (because it's supposed to be a kind of oppression against them) is itself a form of sexism?

[Thirsty Crow]

It is however a "post-scarcity" society in the limited Marxist sense, as in all the basic rational needs of every person can be always satisfied.
Well, yeah, that's what I meant.

[ContrarianLemming]

7 of 9 was still generally speaking a positive figure though.

I can see how her style is mainly designed for male eyes, but from a sex-positive feminist point of view, couldn't one say that the very fact that males can actively show off their sexuality but females can't (because it's supposed to be a kind of oppression against them) is itself a form of sexism?

see Paris and chuckles, Voyeger wasn't that progressive, compared to generations, which was way ahead of any other shows at the time.

I was of the firm opinion that yes, the federation is an anarchist federation, but then DS9 fucked it up and introduced a federation president.

fuck

[Queercommie Girl]

see Paris and chuckles, Voyeger wasn't that progressive, compared to generations, which was way ahead of any other shows at the time.

I was of the firm opinion that yes, the federation is an anarchist federation, but then DS9 fucked it up and introduced a federation president.

fuck

TNG contains some weird ethical principles like taking the Prime Directive too far so that they would literally watch an entire planet die instead of helping them. Surely with all their technology, they have a way to save the natives without letting them know about the Federation's presence.

Yes, I'm surprised it took you until DS9 came out to find out that the UFP couldn't possibly be anarchist. Although the president was not shown in previous series, the info was there in the Star Trek encyclopedia and fact files.

I'm happy that the UFP is much closer to Leninist socialism in form. :cool: With its parliamentary structure of direct democracy and a head of state, and a powerful and centralised military force (Starfleet).

[Aloysius]

I'm just trying to figure out how this discussion went from Enterprise to the political status/whatever of the Federation.

[Invincible Summer]

7 of 9 was still generally speaking a positive figure though.

I can see how her style is mainly designed for male eyes, but from a sex-positive feminist point of view, couldn't one say that the very fact that males can actively show off their sexuality but females can't (because it's supposed to be a kind of oppression against them) is itself a form of sexism?

Yes, one could make that argument. I don't see/remember how 7 of 9 was positive overall though...

[Queercommie Girl]

Yes, one could make that argument. I don't see/remember how 7 of 9 was positive overall though...

Apart from sexuality, in what sense was she not positive?

[Queercommie Girl]

I'm just trying to figure out how this discussion went from Enterprise to the political status/whatever of the Federation.

They are related topics and this is "Chit Chat". Anything goes.