Elitist and hipsters.

[The Red Next Door]

what do you think of them, and are they a problem when they participate in revolutionary movements?

[Who?]

I don't think we should discriminate against any individual group, so long as they help the cause.

Although I feel as if most hipsters are probably lifestylists than authentic revolutionaries, I'm not going to judge the whole group based on that perception. I'm sure there are plenty of authentically red comrades among the them.

[727Goon]

Man, fuck them niggas, I swear I care about everything but them niggas.

[Raúl Duke]

elitists=/=hipsters...

It's just a subculture...

supposedly some people on revleft are hipsters.

[The Douche]

A lot of people might call me a hipster.

[Raúl Duke]

A lot of people might call me a hipster.

Me too...

[Ele'ill]

The only thing worse than another theory thread is another thread that will inevitably turn into a lifestylists vs 'revolutionary' thread.


http://www.peterf.net/blog/content/binary/picard-facepalm.jpg

[leftace53]

Yea, I'm sure I could be classified as a hipster...and an elitist.

Regardless, we shouldn't leave anyone out as there is bound to be a few revolutionaries everywhere.

[x359594]

Hipster isn't a fixed category. As near as I can tell the expression emerged in the 1940s to signify urban cultural dissidents, both black and white.

In his roman-a-clef novel Junky (written in 1949 and published in 1953) William Burroughs used the expression "hipster be-bop junkies" to distinguish a certain class of heroin addicts from the "old time junkies."

These 1940s hipsters were often jazz fans and connoisseurs of the avant garde in the arts, worked low income jobs and included both men and women. They pushed the boundaries in their sexual behavior by engaging in interracial relationships, homosexuality and bi-sexuality. Politically they were cynics, soured on communism and the New Deal and disdainful of "good old fashioned Republicanism and the squares who believe in all that jive while the big grab goes on in Washington and Moscow."

The term hippie originally meant "baby hipster" and was meant as a term of opprobrium, but the hippies of the 1960s took it on gleefully.

Myself, I'm a 59 year old post-beat.

[The Douche]

I hate old people.:laugh:

[KC]

I'm a hipster and I'm probably smarter than you.

[Widerstand]

People call me Hipster because I listen to Neutral Milk Hotel, Crystal Castles and Animal Collective, shop at Thrift Stores, buy organic food, am vegan, shop Fairtrade products, go to underground art exhibitions, watch plays at the theater, refuse to read crime novels and refuse to watch TV. I totally can't understand it, the only thing hipster I do is wearing a post-ironic Korn shirt.

[Magón]

People call me Hipster because I listen to Neutral Milk Hotel, Crystal Castles and Animal Hotel, shop at Thrift Stores, buy organic food, am vegan, shop Fairtrade products, go to underground art exhibitions, watch plays at the theater, refuse to read crime novels and refuse to watch TV. I totally can't understand it, the only thing hipster I do is wearing a post-ironic Korn shirt.

What the fuck? Neutral Milk Hotel (great band by the way, love their stuff,) is considered Hipster? :blink: Damn... The only other thing I could incorporate with being Hipster, would be that most wear thrift store plaid shirts and checkered Vans shoes. :laugh:

[Saorsa]

All hipsters should be shot on sight.

[Raúl Duke]

Neutral Milk Hotel (great band by the way, love their stuff,) is considered Hipster?

It's indie...but now-a-days some people find indie-hipster to be interchangeable.

I heard of this band but I'm more familiar with other bands (Of Montreal, The Apples in Steroe, Olivia Tremor Control) from the same originating record label-collective (elephant 6).

[Across The Street]

That's harsh money.

[Kayser_Soso]

Sub-cultures have virtually nothing to do with revolution.

[infraxotl]

There are worse subcultures to deal with. Goths, juggalos, crusties, etc.


People call me Hipster because I listen to ... Animal Hotel

A band so obscure, it can't be found on wikipedia/what/waffles? What a dedicated hipster.

[~Spectre]

All hipsters should be shot on sight.

Take the knife off the Ak and gut these niggas?

[Revy]

I'm more of a nerd than a hipster, thank you very much. Too socially awkward to care much about being "hip".

Elitists suck.

[Obs]

All hipsters should be shot on sight.
I've missed you.

[Telemakus]

Roughly speaking, being hipster implies that you're adopting a particular ideology, look, genre etc. because of it being praised in social circles, and not because you actually like it or feel a real connection with its values. All appearance, no substance. (which, btw, probably isn't a conscious decision, as in "hm... this thing is popular and makes me look better than everyone else, I think I'll join in")

This is a problem for any ideology, because hipsters love to show off their "appreciation" for the ideology, without actually believing in the values of the ideology, or really understanding it - and end up making a mockery of whatever it is they've latched on to. This is one reason why 90% of everything is crud.

As the thread's replies indicate, many of you have seen the negative effects of this in regards to things like music taste. Revolutionary hipsters would eventually end up degrading the movement and giving it a very poor ([slash] even poorer) public image, as hipster infiltration generally does.

[Decommissioner]

This is dumb. As other have stated, a lot of people (that is, people ignorant of certain subcultures) would call me "hipster". I listen to hardcore/post hardcore music, as well as indie, I am in a post hardcore band, I participate in the local scene to a great extent (book shows, play music etc etc.) I look similar to my friends (band tees, jeans), I like the simplicity and I like to rep the things I love. If I were to care about fashion to an extravagant sense (swooped hair cut, kitsch clothing etc etc), would that be a crime? People should look how they want to look, and listen to what they want to listen to. If you come to me and said "linkin park is emo", you would quickly be corrected on your mistake, as you would be wrong. Is this elitist?

People lump a lot of subcultures under the generic "hipster" or "scene" category. Frankly I find it dumb. Chances are if you call something hipster, it probably isn't even hipster (even considering the very loose and ambiguous definition of hipster). I like to ride bikes, i've been called a "hipster faggot" for that. Hell, even some crustie friends of mine (some of them actually being revolutionary anarchists) have been labeled hipsters. It is as if the label "hipster" is broadening to include any subculture that dominated by young white college kids into whatever music they listen to. If you don't occupy the role of a "good ol boy" or whatever socially accepted "white person" role that is tolerated in your area, you must be some sort of weird culture loving liberal hipster type. This seems to come from both sides of the hipster hating camp, those who view them as dumb liberal white kids (conservative), and those that view them as spoiled, racist college kids (left). Examples of both can be found within the ever expanding, all encompassing "hipster" subculture, however I would stress most people associated within our music scene identify with left politics (lifestylist, revolutionary and otherwise) and a good deal come from middle class backgrounds, and many haven't even gone to college (such as myself).

It's all nonsense, and very embarrassing on behalf of those who choose to hate what they do not know (whether it be "hipsters" "scenesters" "gangstas" "punks"). I would be very embarrassed if I were to lump underground hip hop (and those into that lifestyle) with mainstream hip hop, and furthermore go on to question the groups revolutionary potential. I am a person that likes to be informed, even if such things don't necessarily pertain to me. Given that, sometimes I find it odd when leftists start threads such as this, or bash certain subcultures (and not even do it right) since being into revolutionary politics itself is somewhat of subculture at this juncture in time. It takes an analytical mind and thirst for what is unknown to just reject what you've been told all your life. Perhaps most feel they just find certain matters beneath them, and true, the nuances of certain subcultures probably isn't important in the grand scheme of things. Even still, parading an ignorance of such subcultures as a virtue is foolish nonetheless.

I am lead to conclude that the image of the "hipster" is a stereotype. Theres truth in the stereotype, if you want to look for specific examples (ie "I know this one guy.."), but it is a stereotype. This issue would otherwise be frivolous, but considering it is being brought up in the politics forum on a revolutionary left message board, I think misconceptions need to be addressed.

[Decommissioner]

Roughly speaking, being hipster implies that you're adopting a particular ideology, look, genre etc. because of it being praised in social circles, and not because you actually like it or feel a real connection with its values. All appearance, no substance. (which, btw, probably isn't a conscious decision, as in "hm... this thing is popular and makes me look better than everyone else, I think I'll join in")

This is a problem for any ideology, because hipsters love to show off their "appreciation" for the ideology, without actually believing in the values of the ideology, or really understanding it - and end up making a mockery of whatever it is they've latched on to. This is one reason why 90% of everything is crud.

As the thread's replies indicate, many of you have seen the negative effects of this in regards to things like music taste. Revolutionary hipsters would eventually end up degrading the movement and giving it a very poor ([slash] even poorer) public image, as hipster infiltration generally does.

I find this definition to be correct. It would degrade the movement if people were to latch on merely for cool points.

The problem is, people don't really seem to understand fully what a hipster even is. Seeing as how people who are not hipsters are being labeled as hipsters by people who are different from them, it seems to have turned into a blanket term for any subculture a person doesn't seem to like.

The strange part about it is, there cant be such thing as a culture completely comprised of hipsters, since there has to be a genuine culture for hipsters to latch onto and degenerate.

[Communist Guy]

Well, I don't think we should really care too much about these small groups. If they want to help the cause then thats great but I don't think we should be for or against them.

[Across The Street]

Cultures come and go, no matter how they are defined. Most people who are into mainstream music and enjoy nothing more have absolutely nothing valid to say. This generation alive right now, we aren't contributing to a better planet in very many significant ways. We have been witness to the death of many cultures, some dying as we speak, begging to be kept alive. Most hipsters can be described as revolutionary. It's not as if every person you meet who you might label as hipster has no thoughts.

[9]

who cares

[9]

no one.

[black magick hustla]

there are hipsters in the anarchist scene. they are called insurrectionists

[The Douche]

there are hipsters in the anarchist scene. they are called insurrectionists

I was an insurrectionary anarchist long before I was anything close to a hipster.

Three years ago this thread would've been about punks or crusties, now its about hipsters, big fuckin deal.

[727Goon]

Except that punk was generally a working class subculture, while hipsters are generally fuck ass rich kids pretending to be poor.

[bricolage]

Except that punk was generally a working class subculture, while hipsters are generally fuck ass rich kids pretending to be poor.
Joe Mellor was the well off son of a diplomat before he changed his name to Joe Strummer and started signing for the Clash...

[Raúl Duke]

while hipsters are generally fuck ass rich kids pretending to be poor. not everyone who has been labeled hipsters are rich.

Not every hipster is pretending to be poor, some flaunt their art degrees (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9lmvX00TLY&feature=player_embedded), i-phone 4s, etc.

The term, as it's being increasingly used, is (as Decommisioner mentioned) so ambiguous and somewhat meaningless because different things have been called hipster before. Perhaps there are "many flavors" of hipster, but many things labeled under the umbrella of hipster are not really so inter-related.

However,

Telemakus has an interesting point. One could define hipster as one who's latched onto indie (and/or a variety of other things) and than added some stupid stuff (like "hipster irony" or whatever) and are in it just for the appearance/coolness of it all (yet they fail to seem cool, etc; like some people I saw in Brooklyn). But even than, this doesn't account the other things that has been labeled hipster before. It's even gotten to the point where the term indie has become synonymous with hipster (whereas indie is mostly a music genre, hipster includes some other subcultural aspects outside of indie).

[727Goon]

Most punk fans, at least back in the 70's and 80's, were working class. Now it's mostly a middle class suburban thing though.

[ComradeOm]

Sub-cultures have virtually nothing to do with revolution.I don't think anyone suggested that they did. This isn't about lifestylism because nobody has claimed that there is something inherently revolutionary about obscure bands or skinny jeans* or that these are positive steps on the road to social transformation

*I'm assuming here that 'hipsters' more or less translates as 'indie kid'

[The Douche]

Except that punk was generally a working class subculture, while hipsters are generally fuck ass rich kids pretending to be poor.

Or is it working class kids appropriating the image of a subculture created by rich kids? There are more than just a few hipsters over on the RAAN board who've been around for a little while.

I would'nt call myself a hipster, but, do I listen to lo-fi and indie? Yes. Do I wear skinny jeans and v-necks? Yes. Do I have a members only jacket? Yes. Do I ride a fixie? I'm building one right now.

But I also listen to hardcore and still regularly attend shows. I can't afford an iphone. Art as a concept is totally lost on me. And I certainly don't have a degree, I go to community college.

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Roughly speaking, being hipster implies that you're adopting a particular ideology, look, genre etc. because of it being praised in social circles, and not because you actually like it or feel a real connection with its values. All appearance, no substance. (which, btw, probably isn't a conscious decision, as in "hm... this thing is popular and makes me look better than everyone else, I think I'll join in")

This is a problem for any ideology, because hipsters love to show off their "appreciation" for the ideology, without actually believing in the values of the ideology, or really understanding it - and end up making a mockery of whatever it is they've latched on to. This is one reason why 90% of everything is crud.

As the thread's replies indicate, many of you have seen the negative effects of this in regards to things like music taste. Revolutionary hipsters would eventually end up degrading the movement and giving it a very poor ([slash] even poorer) public image, as hipster infiltration generally does.

So people in flanel shirts are going to degrade the revolutionary movement more than crusties (no disrespect) or socially awkward leninists who would sooner talk to the first member of the working class they actually meet about dialectical materialism than how their day's been? Be easy.

Being 'hipster' doesn't imply adopting a specific ideology, even if you're going to be 'roughly speaking'. Especially as the term is often applied externally. The first time I heard the term was when I was called it. Ignorant of any alleged ideology that's attached. Obviously there are groups of people who are consumed entirely by the stereotypes of what a hipster is and let it dominate their personality and actions. But, a comrade's a comrade, regardless of how they dress.

For the record, I wouldn't exactly consider myself a hipster...

[black magick hustla]

ive been called a hipster a few times too. idk, i guess i like bizarre humour, obscure facts, banter and weird music????? anyhow, there are shitty hipsters and good hipsters anyway. shit hipsters are the ones almost completely consumed by irony and nihilism. good hipsters are people who read camatte.

man i am going to make fuckin bordiga so hip. cursing democracy and calling for revolutionary totalitarianism with a straightface has so much hipster potential

[Widerstand]

What the fuck? Neutral Milk Hotel (great band by the way, love their stuff,) is considered Hipster? :blink: Damn... The only other thing I could incorporate with being Hipster, would be that most wear thrift store plaid shirts and checkered Vans shoes. :laugh:

NMH is considered Hipster, yes. Or well, Indie. But everything linked to Indie or Pitchfork is considered Hipster these days.


There are worse subcultures to deal with. Goths, juggalos, crusties, etc.

FUCKING MAGNETS HOW DO THEY WORK

I can't take juggaloes serious >_>



A band so obscure, it can't be found on wikipedia/what/waffles? What a dedicated hipster.

Animal Collective*


Except that punk was generally a working class subculture, while hipsters are generally fuck ass rich kids pretending to be poor.

I don't see the point in pretending to be poor. Or in fetishizing the working class' living standard in general. I just don't get it through my head. Why would anyone mind luxuries like watching plays or operas or going to art exhibits? They should be available to everyone, yes, but boycotting them because they aren't seems pointless.

[Magón]

...as hipster infiltration generally does.

Whenever I hear something like that, I always think of this quote: "I can no longer sit back and allow Communist infiltration, Communist indoctrination, Communist subversion and the international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids!"

- General Jack Ripper (Doctor Strangelove)

Obviously replace Communist with Hipster. :lol:

[The Douche]

ive been called a hipster a few times too. idk, i guess i like bizarre humour, obscure facts, banter and weird music????? anyhow, there are shitty hipsters and good hipsters anyway. shit hipsters are the ones almost completely consumed by irony and nihilism. good hipsters are people who read camatte.

man i am going to make fuckin bordiga so hip. cursing democracy and calling for revolutionary totalitarianism with a straightface has so much hipster potential

Is Camatte hip now? I literally just made a thread like last week on the RAAN board about him. My hipster staus=confirmed.

[A.R.Amistad]

Why isn't this in Chit Chat?

[Fietsketting]

Maybe its cause people want to put a tag on everybody?

[RadioRaheem84]

If any of ya'll saw me, you would think I was a preppy ass mofo. So let's not disparage anyone that is a potential revolutionary.

[727Goon]

Or is it working class kids appropriating the image of a subculture created by rich kids? There are more than just a few hipsters over on the RAAN board who've been around for a little while.

I would'nt call myself a hipster, but, do I listen to lo-fi and indie? Yes. Do I wear skinny jeans and v-necks? Yes. Do I have a members only jacket? Yes. Do I ride a fixie? I'm building one right now.

But I also listen to hardcore and still regularly attend shows. I can't afford an iphone. Art as a concept is totally lost on me. And I certainly don't have a degree, I go to community college.

Oh I always associated being a hipster with like being a stuck up rich artist type. I dont really have any problems with indie kids or fixie kids, hell I wear skinny jeans and V necks as well even though I listen to rap and punk. I think its cause I came up skating and skaters sort of dress with that sort of style. But fuck elitists period.

[Blackscare]

Man, fuck them niggas, I swear I care about everything but them niggas.


So that's cool on here now? I guess if you're quoting some rapper.

[727Goon]

Yes that is cool now, and yes, I am quoting some rapper.

[Ele'ill]

...crusties, etc.



What's this? Another 8 pages?

[Who?]

Oh I always associated being a hipster with like being a stuck up rich artist type. I dont really have any problems with indie kids or fixie kids, hell I wear skinny jeans and V necks as well even though I listen to rap and punk. I think its cause I came up skating and skaters sort of dress with that sort of style. But fuck elitists period.

Same here, I associated hipsters with being wealthy, fake, artsy brats from the suburbs. I felt like they were only expousing left wing beliefs because it was fashionable in their particular social circle. I personally have nothing against genuine leftists who happen to wear skinny jeans and/or listen to indie music. Heck, I even own a copy of In the Aeroplane over the Sea.

However elitism is generally counterproductive to furthering our cause.

[The Douche]

So that's cool on here now? I guess if you're quoting some rapper.

He's black

[x359594]

...I associated hipsters with being wealthy, fake, artsy brats from the suburbs. I felt like they were only expousing left wing beliefs because it was fashionable in their particular social circle...

So is that an accurate description of hipsters today? A far cry from the people called hipsters in the 1940s and 50s when the hipster life style included unconventional sexuality and drug use that brought hipsters in contact with law enforcement and scandalized the bourgeois moral order.

[The Douche]

So is that an accurate description of hipsters today? A far cry from the people called hipsters in the 1940s and 50s when the hipster life style included unconventional sexuality and drug use that brought hipsters in contact with law enforcement and scandalized the bourgeois moral order.

Nah a hipster is anybody into stuff that's trendy right now like thrift stores, indie music and fixed gear bikes. Oh...and cocaine

[Who?]

It's just the way I perceived them at first, so I got where a lot of these folk were coming from. I know that many hipsters aren't wealthy, fake or artsy brats. It obviously isn't very accurate, the sub-culture, like most, draws from all walks of life.

Here's a quick summary from Wikipedia about the contemporary hipsters:
Hipster is a slang term that first appeared in the 1940s, and was revived in the 1990s and 2000s often to describe types of young, recently-settled urban middle class adults and older teenagers with interests in non-mainstream fashion and culture, particularly alternative music, indie rock, independent film, magazines such as Vice and Clash, and websites like Pitchfork Media. In some contexts, hipsters are also referred to as scenesters.
"Hipster" has been used in sometimes contradictory ways, making it difficult to precisely define "hipster culture" because it is a "mutating, trans-Atlantic melting pot of styles, tastes and behavior[s]."One commentator argues that "hipsterism fetishizes the authentic" elements of all of the "fringe movements of the postwar era—beat, hippie, punk, even grunge," and draws on the "cultural stores of every unmelted ethnicity" and "gay style", and "regurgitates it with a winking inauthenticity."

[Boyle1888]

WTF is a hipster? Seriously

[bcbm]

WTF is a hipster? Seriously

nobody knows but everyone hates them

[gorillafuck]

Neutral Milk Hotel sucks.

[this is an invasion]

I like fixed gear bikes.

[Jimmie Higgins]

Neutral Milk Hotel sucks.That's such a hipster thing to say.

The funny thing about hipsters is that almost all hipsters deny their hipster identity. Honestly, in my view hipsters were a lot more boring and obnoxious 5-6 years ago. Now "hipster" is just like emo because it has spread beyond the small groups in gentrified areas of cities (which means, yes, many of them seemed to be trust-funders to me several years back) and is part of general youth culture.

Really, the only thing that separates "good" youth culture from "bad" youth culture is the time-period we live in. In apolitical times, the main underground scenes are all apolitical - in more turbulent times, there is a more turbulent dynamic at play.

Back a few years ago, the defining feature of hipsters that I ran across was their aloof attitude (and coke snorting and pill popping). I think it had less to do with hipsters themselves and more to do with living at a time when a lot of people felt that the government was just going to do terrible things and we are all just powerless to do anything about it, so we might at well be frivolous and cynical. Now people that I meet that could be defined as hipster seem to be more engaged in things going on and more sincere. I think that's the recession effect.

[KC]

Except that punk was generally a working class subculture, while hipsters are generally fuck ass rich kids pretending to be poor.

I know probably every "hipster" in Milwaukee and almost all of them are working part- or full-time jobs with little or no health insurance and pursuing what they love.

In short, you're an idiot.

[Homo Songun]

The funny thing about hipsters is that almost all hipsters deny their hipster identity. Honestly, in my view hipsters were a lot more boring and obnoxious 5-6 years ago. Now "hipster" is just like emo because it has spread beyond the small groups in gentrified areas of cities (which means, yes, many of them seemed to be trust-funders to me several years back) and is part of general youth culture.


Honest question: Who are these "trust fund" idlers that everyone is always taking about? Is there just lot more fabulously wealthy people than I thought? Or maybe is it that people with trust funds tend to know a shit load of people? This starting to make me feel paranoid.

[Homo Songun]

Except that punk was generally a working class subculture, while hipsters are generally fuck ass rich kids pretending to be poor.
I know probably every "hipster" in Milwaukee and almost all of them are working part- or full-time jobs with little or no health insurance and pursuing what they love.

In short, you're an idiot.

Moreover, Punk was never mainly about the working class, it was always openly a middle class thing. The original punks were art student types in the big cities (lol hipsters), and then later on in the early eighties the bands that ended up pioneering hardcore always sang and talked predominately about alienation, suburbia, and other classically middle class themes. Any history of punk will discuss this at great length.

[KC]

It's stupid to call punk either working class or middle class. It was bigger than some "class phenomenon". Your all idiots.

[Homo Songun]

hm, heres me thinking being determines consciousness.:blink:

[Mindtoaster]

The stereotype of hipsters as being rich kids acting poor comes from Manhattan, where they're often bankers or real estate agents

I don't think you really see that in other hipster scenes.

[Raúl Duke]

The stereotype of hipsters as being rich kids acting poor comes from Manhattan, where they're often bankers or real estate agents
Those are yuppies...

Everyone knows that all the hipsters are in Brooklyn (perhaps, as the stereotype goes, going to Pratt) and Queens. Williamsburg is considered the "hipster capital" but only for those with the money; many people end up living in more cheaper areas in Queens/Brooklyn.

[727Goon]

Also lets not forget that rich NYC hipsters gentrify the fuck out of neighborhoods and are thus scum.

[Jimmie Higgins]

Honest question: Who are these "trust fund" idlers that everyone is always taking about? Is there just lot more fabulously wealthy people than I thought? Or maybe is it that people with trust funds tend to know a shit load of people? This starting to make me feel paranoid.I don't know - it's my fall-back explanation for people I meet who own art galleries and shit but never seem to sell enough paintings to pay for it all. Fair enough, most don't last, so it could be that they got loans or something.

My other explanation for these acquaintances who don't seem to have a regular source of income is that they are dealers (I don't mean art) who just haven't told me that that's where their money comes from.





They should tell me - if they have good shit, that is.

[Ztrain]

:Dhipster is in the eye of the beholder but it seem to me that most hipsters would hang out in the coffee shop and talk about revolution rather than participate...people have identified me as indie kid thou along with punk and ska kid

[Raúl Duke]

Also lets not forget that rich NYC hipsters gentrify the fuck out of neighborhoods and are thus scum.

This reminds me of putting the blame on the immigrant when it's the boss who's in charge of hiring and firing.

Likewise, it's the landlords and developers who are in charge of increasing rent.

It's always the capitalist, not the consumer or worker, what is the source of economic woes.

[Lyev]

Yesterday I saw hipster at the airport with the obligatory moustache wearing leather trousers, a sailors hat, and a white t-shirt with child-like scribble on it. He was thus reactionary (and elitist) and should have no place in the revolutionary leftist movement.

[howblackisyourflag]

Yesterday I saw hipster at the airport with the obligatory moustache wearing leather trousers, a sailors hat, and a white t-shirt with child-like scribble on it. He was thus reactionary (and elitist) and should have no place in the revolutionary leftist movement.

Correct comrade, only strong anti-hipsterism rhetoric and pro-forkliftism will bring the revolution to fruition.

[Ztrain]

They seem like they would spend more time talking about revolution in a cofee shop than actually revolting of course on chick thought I was an indi guy even though I listen to punk,ska and grindcore

[gorillafuck]

Moreover, Punk was never mainly about the working class, it was always openly a middle class thing. The original punks were art student types in the big cities (lol hipsters), and then later on in the early eighties the bands that ended up pioneering hardcore always sang and talked predominately about alienation, suburbia, and other classically middle class themes. Any history of punk will discuss this at great length.
Some punk was from working class backgrounds and some from middle class backgrounds. Punk music doesn't have a class character, it's stupid to try to assign one to it. I hate how some socialists try to determine the class character of everything on the planet.

Speaking of which, what is the class character of pokemon?

[Mindtoaster]

Those are yuppies...

Everyone knows that all the hipsters are in Brooklyn (perhaps, as the stereotype goes, going to Pratt) and Queens. Williamsburg is considered the "hipster capital" but only for those with the money; many people end up living in more cheaper areas in Queens/Brooklyn.

The yuppies in New York have BECOME hipsters.

http://newyork.timeout.com/articles/features/4840/why-the-hipster-must-die

[this is an invasion]

Moreover, Punk was never mainly about the working class, it was always openly a middle class thing. The original punks were art student types in the big cities (lol hipsters), and then later on in the early eighties the bands that ended up pioneering hardcore always sang and talked predominately about alienation, suburbia, and other classically middle class themes. Any history of punk will discuss this at great length.

Alienation is only a middle class thing?

[Raúl Duke]

The yuppies in New York have BECOME hipsters.Maybe but I doubt it; more as they are/will displace hipsters (or whatever) geographically.

For example, I was at Boerum Hills/Cobble Hills, Brooklyn. It was a very gentrified place but most people in the area seemed more like late 20s-early 30s professionals, some already married and with kids. They seemed less like the stereotype hipster (and there were more hipsters commuting to Manhattan than here) and more like the usual yuppies who are obsessed with organic foods and what not. This area was never marketed towards hipsters (while Williamsburg and Greenpoint were) only yuppies

I went to Greenpoint (above Williamsburg; I think) and there were more mid-20s people and the area had a more hipster vibe. But another trend is also occurring, actual 'hipsters' (or bohemians) are being displaced by yuppies (maybe you can call them yuppie "hipsters") and tend to than move to other more cheaper areas (while, at least in the case of Williamsburg, still going there for nightlife/venues). For example, at this venue I was at in Greenpoint/Williamsburg there were a lot of people who lived in other more cheaper areas outside Greenpoint/Williamsburg (Red Hook, Bedford-Stuyvesant, Bushwick, and areas in Queens).

Also, I bet who wrote that article is a hipster...since some hate each other (themselves :confused:)

[Revy]

and now a haiku, performed in green:

I am a hipster
yeah maybe you are one too
let's be hipsters yeaaaaaah.

[thesadmafioso]

Why should we bother judging someone politically based upon whatever social trends they do or do not follow? Honestly, the leftist movement is fragmented and weak enough as it is, I really do not think we have the liberty of excluding people based upon what subculture they subscribe to at the moment.

Though I can see situations arising in which ones social devotions could clash with their proclaimed political alignment, so my previous statements are open to alteration based upon context and circumstance, as they should be when dealing with a question that deals with such a vague and difficult to define subject matter.

[Ele'ill]

Yup, there are certain activities that attract groups of people that like those activities. That's life. You have people that like to drink with coworkers at a local bar. You have people that like to smoke hash and watch Lord Of The Rings extended edition ala marathon style- there are people that like to dress up and go to shitty shows- Some people like to collect lots of cats- some people really like bicycling others like traveling- some like political theory without action- some like to lift weights and congregate at BBQ's with fellow lifters- ....

This is life- this is what we- as organizers, activists and potential organizers and activists have to work with. An elitist attitude will get you all kinds of defense mechanisms and the shields will go up. This isn't post revolution- we have a lot of information to hand around and there will be a lot of minds to change.



Also, there are people that are 'hipsters' that are very invovled there are people who are 'thugs' that are very involved there are people who are everything in between that are very involved in leftist struggle but let's just promise never to have another thread like this again for as long as this particular forum is up and running?

[What Would Durruti Do?]

i know a lot of wealthy hipsters, but that probably has more to do with the fact that I live in an extremely wealthy city than it does anything to do with hipsterdom.

the majority of hipsters I know (myself included as I'm also occasionally called a hipster), however, are students/dropouts, or lower class workers.

so this "rich fake suburbanite artists" definition just doesn't jive with me. There are way more hipsters in the cities than the suburbs.

[Ele'ill]

i know a lot of wealthy hipsters, but that probably has more to do with the fact that I live in an extremely wealthy city than it does anything to do with hipsterdom.

the majority of hipsters I know (myself included as I'm also occasionally called a hipster), however, are students/dropouts, or lower class workers.

so this "rich fake suburbanite artists" definition just doesn't jive with me. There are way more hipsters in the cities than the suburbs.

I agree but I wouldn't say that there are more lower class workers in the city- there are huge sections of 'suburbs' that are very low income.

A lot of the non-city people get labeled as 'rich' but that isn't accurate at all- and I'm not saying that's what you're saying.

Yeah so I basically agree with what you said

Ignore the swill

"The keyyyboard has been drrriinnking...etc'

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Chit-chat?

[Magón]

There are worse subcultures to deal with. Goths, juggalos, crusties, etc.



A band so obscure, it can't be found on wikipedia/what/waffles? What a dedicated hipster.

Juggalos from what I've seen and heard, are pretty downright hilarious. And I don't mean that in the sense of a 5 year olds birthday party, with a silly clown making all the children laugh, I'm just talking about how they describe some of themselves, and why they became a Juggalo or whatever the female equivalent is to the male one. (I hardly pay attention to them, so I'm not up on my Juggalo ed.) They're just downright hilarious to me.

[TwoSevensClash]

This reminds me of putting the blame on the immigrant when it's the boss who's in charge of hiring and firing.

Likewise, it's the landlords and developers who are in charge of increasing rent.

It's always the capitalist, not the consumer or worker, what is the source of economic woes.

They wouldn't raise the price if the hipsters didn't flock there and be willing to pay 200% more then the original people. The hipsters are the part of the reason for increase. Though I do agree that the landlords share more of the blame.

[Bilan]

They wouldn't raise the price if the hipsters didn't flock there and be willing to pay 200% more then the original people. The hipsters are the part of the reason for increase. Though I do agree that the landlords share more of the blame.

You're a fool.
As is everyone who is posting in this thread.

Including me.

[Homo Songun]

Some punk was from working class backgrounds and some from middle class backgrounds.
True.



Punk music doesn't have a class character,
False.



it's stupid to try to assign one to it.
No. What is stupid is thinking that music, along with every other manifestation of culture in a given society, can possibly emanate from the minds of humans without being a reflection of the very society which the minds in question find themselves situated. And as a very non-stupid person once said, "the history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles" -- necessarily implying the existence of different class positions in the culture.

Of course, you don't need to be a Marxist to know the class outlook of Punk. Like I said, any book on the subject could tell you that.

Think about how stupid it would sound to say that hip-hop had no racial character, or romantic ballads had no sexual character. Then why the hell would music have no class character?


I hate how some socialists try to determine the class character of everything on the planet.Dude, its revleft.com. If you are getting sick of it, may I suggest the rest of the Internet (http://google.com/)?

[TwoSevensClash]

You're a fool.
As is everyone who is posting in this thread.

Including me.
Maybe, but still if they didn't move to those neighborhoods the rent wouldn't of skyrocketed in such a short period of time and the original inhabitants wouldn't of been forced out.

[Bright Banana Beard]

gosh, NYC are being gentrified thanks to hipsters/yuppies!

[727Goon]

I know probably every "hipster" in Milwaukee and almost all of them are working part- or full-time jobs with little or no health insurance and pursuing what they love.

In short, you're an idiot.

Right and they all come from the suburbs and could go back to living off mommy and daddy if they had to. They aren't working class, they're not forced to sell their labor, they just do it because its ironic or some shit.

[Raúl Duke]

^^^

"I'm soooooo prole, more prole than those goddamn hipsters; working-class hipsters who 'may not go back home' cannot exist"

A fucking sub culture does not automatically equate to a certain kind of class status; such an idea is ridiculous.
There are rich and poor of each sub cultures; it's all relative. There are people who think they're straight up gangster from the barrio who suck up to their parents.
On this site itself there are people representative of many subcultures.

[What Would Durruti Do?]

^^^

"I'm soooooo prole, more prole than those goddamn hipsters; working-class hipsters who 'may not go back home' cannot exist"

A fucking sub culture does not automatically equate to a certain kind of class status; such an idea is ridiculous.
There are rich and poor of each sub cultures; it's all relative. There are people who think they're straight up gangster from the barrio who suck up to their parents.
On this site itself there are people representative of many subcultures.

Exactly. The idea that we should exclude a certain subculture is ridiculous. I don't even care if we're talking about old English Dandies who idolize the bourgeois here.

We need all the help we can get, period. I don't care what subculture someone comes from, if they want to help destroy capitalism or the state, then great.

[infraxotl]

some flaunt their art degrees (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9lmvX00TLY&feature=player_embedded),

the fuck did i just watch

[bricolage]

Right and they all come from the suburbs and could go back to living off mommy and daddy if they had to. They aren't working class, they're not forced to sell their labor, they just do it because its ironic or some shit.
having a shit job is well ironic.
'toilet cleaners; in it for the lulz'

[Ravachol]

I was an insurrectionary anarchist long before I was anything close to a hipster.

Three years ago this thread would've been about punks or crusties, now its about hipsters, big fuckin deal.

Over here in mainland Europe it's still about crusts so meh. Guess we're lagging behind a bit :rolleyes:



Right and they all come from the suburbs and could go back to living off mommy and daddy if they had to. They aren't working class, they're not forced to sell their labor, they just do it because its ironic or some shit.

While that comment was pretty funny it's completely wrong. I know plenty of working-class kids who are hipsters and I can assure you they don't have a single penny to spare. Most shop at thrift stores because it's fashionable but mainly because it's affordable.

On the other hand, I know tons and tons of (petit-)bourgeois faux-punx or skins running around town claiming they're "working class 'n all lads OI!OI!OI!" while working in corporate finance or some shit :rolleyes:

Subcultures don't have a homogenous class character.

[Bilan]

Maybe, but still if they didn't move to those neighborhoods the rent wouldn't of skyrocketed in such a short period of time and the original inhabitants wouldn't of been forced out.

Welcome to capitalism, buddy. What, you think if there were no bourgeois hipsters, this wouldn't happen?
Come on now.

[Raúl Duke]

the fuck did i just watch


:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Delenda Carthago]

I freakin LOVE hipsters.

When my life is fucked up,when I feel like nothing I do is worth shit,when I feel trapped in an endless dead end situation called "surviving",when puting a gun in my mouth seems the only logical thing to do,I look at them and I think to myself:You are not that bad.

And just like a miracle,I feel ready for another battle!

[gorillafuck]

No. What is stupid is thinking that music, along with every other manifestation of culture in a given society, can possibly emanate from the minds of humans without being a reflection of the very society which the minds in question find themselves situated. And as a very non-stupid person once said, "the history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles" -- necessarily implying the existence of different class positions in the culture.
Then what is the class character of pokemon fandom?


Of course, you don't need to be a Marxist to know the class outlook of Punk. Like I said, any book on the subject could tell you that.I listen to a shitload of punk and I've watched American Hardcore and it all seems fairly diverse in regards to class makeup. A lot of early hardcore bands were from California suburbs, Choking Victim were squatting after they were homeless people.


Think about how stupid it would sound to say that hip-hop had no racial character, or romantic ballads had no sexual character. Then why the hell would music have no class character?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOk_0BpyC44

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfy9ZqKUJjU

Would you consider these two songs to both overall have the same "class character"? (Ignoring the fact that not all suburban people are middle class). Though I see why you think punk has a middle class character if you sincerely think of alienation as a middle class phenomena (which is absurd).

[theeuphioanswer]

For a thread that's supposed to be bashing elitist behaviors, this thread appears to be quite hypocritical.

[Lyev]

Seriously, how on earth has this generated 5 pages? It's a complete non-issue that's been turned into a mountain and we don't want it becoming another shitty forklift or dog thread. For a start, "hipster" is completely ambiguous anyway - are we talking about someone who loves jazz or someone who wears American Apparel? What the fuck is a hipster? Any attempt at somehow guessing someone's personality or "revolutionary potential" by some vaguely defined subculture is going to be completely nonsensical from the start. How can you try and gauge whether one person or another can be "allowed" into the leftist movement simply because of their clothes or the music they like?

[bcbm]

y'all just wish you looked this good

[Bright Banana Beard]

Seriously, how on earth has this generated 5 pages? It's a complete non-issue that's been turned into a mountain and we don't want it becoming another shitty forklift or dog thread. For a start, "hipster" is completely ambiguous anyway - are we talking about someone who loves jazz or someone who wears American Apparel? What the fuck is a hipster? Any attempt at somehow guessing someone's personality or "revolutionary potential" by some vaguely defined subculture is going to be completely nonsensical from the start. How can you try and gauge whether one person or another can be "allowed" into the leftist movement simply because of their clothes or the music they like?

The one who drinks Pabst, own Iphone or Ipad or anything Apple made product and think they are living "post-lifestyle."

[Ravachol]

y'all just wish you looked this good

Pah, I don't need v-necks, distressed denim or slipons to look like a hot motherfucker!

Although I am wearing distressed denim right now...

[727Goon]

I dont mind any particular subculture or style of dress, I just hate suburban kids pretending to be poor, or elitist art school snobs, and thats what I always thought hipster meant. If by hipster your talking about indie or fixie kids or whatever, I dont have a problem with working class kids who like indie or ride fixed gear bikes or dress in that style.

[bcbm]

Pah, I don't need v-necks, distressed denim or slipons to look like a hot motherfucker!

ironically (lol) i don't have any of those things.

[Ravachol]

ironically (lol) i don't have any of those things.

Heh, how Ironic :p
I just don't get the whole v-neck thing those people are into, turtlenecks OK but v-necks...

[bcbm]

turtlenecks, are you fucking kidding me?

[Ravachol]

turtlenecks, are you fucking kidding me?

It's not like I'd wear one.. Not really my style brah :rolleyes: But I think they look less ridiculous than v-necks. But perhaps that's because v-necks are mainly worn by preps here in the Netherlands.

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

Brother needs to circumcise his jumpers...

[bcbm]

It's not like I'd wear one.. Not really my style brah :rolleyes: But I think they look less ridiculous than v-necks. But perhaps that's because v-necks are mainly worn by preps here in the Netherlands.

the only people who wear turtlenecks are like... i can't even think of anyone. old ladies? beat poets? me when i was 11? nobody cool, that's for sure.

[Os Cangaceiros]

I used to be a little anti-hipster. Not so much anymore, though...they mostly just amuse me now.

[bcbm]

you hung out with me too much

[Os Cangaceiros]

I think that's what happened too.

[Ele'ill]

when puting a gun in my mouth seems the only logical thing to do,I look at them and I think to myself:You are not that bad.


I misread this as "..I think to myself: You are not that dead."

Thought it was pretty neat.

[KC]

I have v-necks because they let my chest hairs breeeeeeeeaaaaaathe.

[Bilan]

I have v-necks because they let my chest hairs breeeeeeeeaaaaaathe.

:lol:

[Ravachol]

the only people who wear turtlenecks are like... i can't even think of anyone. old ladies? beat poets? me when i was 11? nobody cool, that's for sure.

Dutch Hipsters, that's who wear them. This obviously doesn't invalidate your statement AT ALL.

[Il Medico]

Some people would call me a hipster, and I don't mind it when they do. I shop at thrift store, I am into fashion, and artsy stuff, listen to a lot of music that is considered 'indie' (of Montreal, Neutral Milk Hotel, Architecture in Helsinki, etc). I know a lot of 'hipsters' and I quite like them, I daresay. I find there are a lot more 'hipsters' that are from dirt poor communities around here (Like the infamous "MoonLake") than there are from the rich areas.

[Qayin]

Cardigans man

[Sperm-Doll Setsuna]

Speaking of which, what is the class character of pokemon?

It's all about revolutionary transformation, maaan

[KC]

Cardigans man

I own this and you don't:

http://i35.tinypic.com/33nxmqg.jpg

[black magick hustla]

i dont listen to neutral milk hotel or that bullshit i listen to black metal and powerviolence

[Lyev]

So is this guy a hipster? to me, he looks a bit elitist.
http://www.r8ix.com/aron/turtleneck.jpg

[Adi Shankara]

So is this guy a hipster? to me, he looks a bit elitist.
http://www.r8ix.com/aron/turtleneck.jpg

who the hell is this fool?

[Raúl Duke]

Not a hipster, at least according to any of the many US definitions; at least not fashionably a hipster.

[Lyev]

who the hell is this fool?oops sorry, we're not allowed to post personal pictures!

[Pavlov's House Party]

http://i.imgur.com/8YMrp.gif

Same with the flannel shirts. Quebec is like a vortex that strips everything hipsters claim ironic away.

[Qayin]

I own this and you don't:
:'(
Sad that you identified my avatar, your the first.

[Chambered Word]

Juggalos have to be worse.

[Os Cangaceiros]

i dont listen to neutral milk hotel or that bullshit i listen to black metal and powerviolence

yah becuz no hipsters listen to black metal or anything.

black metal = metal 4 hipsters

[The Douche]

Or powerviolence, hello ceremony. (I just went to a ceremony show a week or two ago)

[Ravachol]

yah becuz no hipsters listen to black metal or anything.

black metal = metal 4 hipsters

I honestly don't get that fad. Over here black metal is still the exclusive domain of fat kids with long, unkempt black-dyed hair crying out to Odin or god knows who about how 'grimdark', 'kvlt' and 'frostbitten' their life in mom's basement is.

Still, I tend to enjoy black metal now and then...

[The Red Next Door]

Over here black metal is still the exclusive domain of fat kids with long, unkempt black-dyed hair

You just describe a friend of mine who listen to metal. hehehe :D except his black hair is natural.

[leftace53]

I honestly don't get that fad. Over here black metal is still the exclusive domain of fat kids with long, unkempt black-dyed hair crying out to Odin or god knows who about how 'grimdark', 'kvlt' and 'frostbitten' their life in mom's basement is.

Still, I tend to enjoy black metal now and then...

Agreed. This is why I listen to power metal :lol:

[Ele'ill]

Anybody that participated in this thread- but then went on to list 'what they are'- is a hipster.

[Ravachol]

Anybody that participated in this thread- but then went on to list 'what they are'- is a hipster.

I'm working class baby!

[black magick hustla]

I honestly don't get that fad. Over here black metal is still the exclusive domain of fat kids with long, unkempt black-dyed hair crying out to Odin or god knows who about how 'grimdark', 'kvlt' and 'frostbitten' their life in mom's basement is.

Still, I tend to enjoy black metal now and then...

yea, a lot of black metal culture has gotten old as hell. when it started, it was hella reactionary but in a sense, it was p. real. a bunch of alienatedd kids from bumfuck nowhere in norway burning down churches and preparing for an incoming insurrection to destroy judeo-christian civilization and bring back nordic honor. however wrong and disgusting their views where, i appreciate the history of black metal as the expression of anger and alienation.

[Il Medico]

All this talk of black metal made me think of this song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aPupUX2s_A&feature=search

[Widerstand]

All this talk of black metal made me think of this song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aPupUX2s_A&feature=search

N7piTcDllnY

Take that!

[Il Medico]

N7piTcDllnY

Take that!
For a second I thought you were going to post music as a rebuttal. I see I was wrong.

[Widerstand]

For a second I thought you were going to post music as a rebuttal. I see I was wrong.

For a second I was thinking about discussing black metal, then I figured posting a youtube link might be better ... But maybe I should've picked that one instead:

8ABbEh6RClg

[Il Medico]

For a second I was thinking about discussing black metal, then I figured posting a youtube link might be better ... But maybe I should've picked that one instead:

8ABbEh6RClg
:lol: Whats with the Kiss wannabes with swords?

And the every time the guy with the bright orange key-tar showed up, I couldn't help but laugh.

[Widerstand]

They are covering German Christmas songs comrade. Shit's br00tal trve kvlt as fuck!

[Angry Young Man]

Politically they were cynics, soured on communism and the New Deal and disdainful of "good old fashioned Republicanism and the squares who believe in all that jive while the big grab goes on in Washington and Moscow."

From this moment on, nobody will be able to read these lines without imagining that it's the Spirit of Jazz saying them.

Why's my hat on fire?

[Raúl Duke]

All this talk of black metal made me think of this song:
-aPupUX2s_A

:thumbup1:

[Ravachol]

For a second I was thinking about discussing black metal, then I figured posting a youtube link might be better ... But maybe I should've picked that one instead:

8ABbEh6RClg

Black Metal yeah

nq2SxzUJg7I

[Buitraker]

elitists=/=hipsters...

It's just a subculture...

supposedly some people on revleft are hipsters.

Best reply

[leftace53]

Are these hipster shoes?
http://dropdeadgorgeousdaily.typepad.com/.a/6a00e5540cf58c883401156f204574970c-800wi

They seem to be from american apparel, so is it safe to assume that they are indeed hipster shoes?

[Bilan]

Are these hipster shoes?
http://dropdeadgorgeousdaily.typepad.com/.a/6a00e5540cf58c883401156f204574970c-800wi

They seem to be from american apparel, so is it safe to assume that they are indeed hipster shoes?

Yes.

[leftace53]

Yes.
In that case, I am a hipster.

[Widerstand]

American Apparel clothes are pretty nice though, I like all my shirts I got from them ;s

[Bright Banana Beard]

Anyone who bought clothes from American Apparel is a hipster.

Tru Fax.

[The Douche]

I have a jacket from AA, and last time I went to urban outfitters another customer asked me for help cause they thought I worked there. Obviously I could be considered a hipster.

[leftace53]

AA is too expensive for me. I spend an average of 7 dollars on a shirt, and 17 dollars on pants.

[Il Medico]

In that case, I am a hipster.
I guess so Am I.

I don't shop at AA though. You can probably find a pair of those in Ross for a lot less.

[Honggweilo]

everyone claiming not to be a hipster ( especially the ones claiming to be working class :p) are hipsters. Only people who claim to be hipsters are not, just posers

I'm hipster as fuck, so i'm a fucking poser, the rest of you are all a bunch of fucking hipsters

[ed miliband]

I ocassionally shop at American Apparel and Urban Outfitters (only when money allows). I get most of my clothes in vintage stores that aren't too expensive. I listen to a lot of underground music and read publications like The Wire. I hang out in places where people who would be described a hipsters hang out.

Still, I don't think hipsters actually exist: there is no one, unique hipster style; hipsters do not all listen to a particular type of music; nobody chooses to identify as a hipster. You might meet a "hipster" who wants to channel Lou Reed whilst another will be heavily influenced by hip hop fashion. A "hipster" might like Wolves in the Throne Room or Lady Gaga. A "hipster" might have long hair or short hair or no hair. Unlike other subcultures "hipster" has very few discernible or unique 'things', and can accomodate a very large variety of styles and tastes.

It seems to me people just throw the label "hipster" at things they perceive to be cooler than them.

[Das war einmal]

everyone claiming not to be a hipster ( especially the ones claiming to be working class :p) are hipsters. Only people who claim to be hipsters are not, just posers

I'm hipster as fuck, so i'm a fucking poser, the rest of you are all a bunch of fucking hipsters


I praise your logic

[Ele'ill]

The creation of this thread was based on elitism- which is ironic- which means this thread is a hipster.

[Il Medico]

The creation of this thread was based on elitism- which is ironic- which means this thread is a hipster.
And Hipsters love irony, the bastards.

[Commiechu]

Most hipsters are useless...many will wear a Che short for example without knowing who he is, a Kaffiyeh, and will listen to "revolutionary" music 24/7 without any real revolutionary thought.

[Who?]

And Hipsters love irony, the bastards.

The ultimate hipster would probably wear something like this:
http://rlv.zcache.com/die_hipster_scum_tshirt-p235410750249420446y2px_400.jpg

[Il Medico]

The ultimate hipster would probably wear something like this:
http://rlv.zcache.com/die_hipster_scum_tshirt-p235410750249420446y2px_400.jpg
I have that shirt....fuck.

[Pirate Utopian]

And Hipsters love irony, the bastards.
It's ironic that you of all people call them bastards.

[Il Medico]

It's ironic that you of all people call them bastards.
Well, I do love irony.

[Pirate Utopian]

Hipster!

[Il Medico]

Hipster!
:scared: omg!

[ed miliband]

Most hipsters are useless...many will wear a Che short for example without knowing who he is, a Kaffiyeh, and will listen to "revolutionary" music 24/7 without any real revolutionary thought.

What the fuck? I have never, ever seen a "hipster" wear a Che Guevara shirt or a keffiyeh (in Britian at least keffiyehs are quite a mainstream fashion item now). I don't think any hipsters would be seen dead in either item of clothing, considering one actually identifiable element of being a hipster is having a sense of style, and Che t-shirts are especially lacking in sartorial appeal. Your point about the music is just ridiculous.

Where do people get this shit from?

[The Red Next Door]

What the fuck? I have never, ever seen a "hipster" wear a Che Guevara shirt or a keffiyeh (in Britian at least keffiyehs are quite a mainstream fashion item now). I don't think any hipsters would be seen dead in either item of clothing, considering one actually identifiable element of being a hipster is having a sense of style, and Che t-shirts are especially lacking in sartorial appeal. Your point about the music is just ridiculous.

Where do people get this shit from?

Experience ?

[ed miliband]

?

[The Red Next Door]

?
made correction above

[bricolage]

Most hipsters are useless...many will wear a Che short for example without knowing who he is, a Kaffiyeh, and will listen to "revolutionary" music 24/7 without any real revolutionary thought.
I'm more concerened about people who wear Che shirts having knowledge of who is, think a keffiyah is a coherent political statement and who listen to 'revolutionary' music... whilst claiming to have 'revolutionary' thought.

[ed miliband]

made correction above

Okay... let's say a man is dressed head-to-toe in pink and yellow, bright pink and yellow. Would you call this man a goth? Let's say a woman is dressed in a very smart suit and has short, clean hair. Would you call her a hippie? There is nothing to suggest that the man wearing pink and yellow is a goth, nor is there anything to suggest the woman wearing the suit is a hippie, and so presumably you would not call the man a goth or the woman a hippie?

If you saw somebody wearing a Che Guevara t-shirt and a keffiyeh what would make you assume they were a hipster? Go and have a look at the website lookbook.nu - you'll find a lot of hipster fashion, and do you see anybody wearing a Che t-shirt or whatever?

It just seems to me people will label anything they don't like as "hipster" if they think it has an air of pretension or could be considered "cool" (and honestly, there is nothing more uncool than Che Guevara t-shirts). I highly doubt that the people 'Christopher Hill' has complained about are actually "hipsters", and aren't just people he doesn't particularly like.

But yeah, go and look at lookbook, go and read hipster runoff and look at some tumblr blogs, visit American Apparel, Urban Outfitters or a vintage store. I bet you won't find anyone like 'Christopher Hill' has spoken about.

[The Red Next Door]

Okay... let's say a man is dressed head-to-toe in pink and yellow, bright pink and yellow. Would you call this man a goth? Let's say a woman is dressed in a very smart suit and has short, clean hair. Would you call her a hippie? There is nothing to suggest that the man wearing pink and yellow is a goth, nor is there anything to suggest the woman wearing the suit is a hippie, and so presumably you would not call the man a goth or the woman a hippie?

If you saw somebody wearing a Che Guevara t-shirt and a keffiyeh what would make you assume they were a hipster? Go and have a look at the website lookbook.nu - you'll find a lot of hipster fashion, and do you see anybody wearing a Che t-shirt or whatever?

It just seems to me people will label anything they don't like as "hipster" if they think it has an air of pretension or could be considered "cool" (and honestly, there is nothing more uncool than Che Guevara t-shirts). I highly doubt that the people 'Christopher Hill' has complained about are actually "hipsters", and aren't just people he doesn't particularly like.

But yeah, go and look at lookbook, go and read hipster runoff and look at some tumblr blogs, visit American Apparel, Urban Outfitters or a vintage store. I bet you won't find anyone like 'Christopher Hill' has spoken about.

I agree with you.

[Obzervi]

Most hipsters aren't serious about revolution. They are just doing it for the image participating in the capitalistic system at the same time. They are entrenched in White Privilege and drive out minorities from their own living areas through gentrification.

[bricolage]

Most hipsters aren't serious about revolution. They are just doing it for the image participating in the capitalistic system at the same time. They are entrenched in White Privilege and drive out minorities from their own living areas through gentrification.
fuck class struggle, fight the hipsters.

[Il Medico]

They are entrenched in White Privilege and drive out minorities from their own living areas through gentrification.
ummm....not all hipsters are white.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

I think hipster boys are hot.

[Who?]

I think hipster boys are hot.

I have a total crush on Kevin Barnes. :wub:

But who doesn't these days?

[The Douche]

Okay... let's say a man is dressed head-to-toe in pink and yellow, bright pink and yellow. Would you call this man a goth? Let's say a woman is dressed in a very smart suit and has short, clean hair. Would you call her a hippie? There is nothing to suggest that the man wearing pink and yellow is a goth, nor is there anything to suggest the woman wearing the suit is a hippie, and so presumably you would not call the man a goth or the woman a hippie?

If you saw somebody wearing a Che Guevara t-shirt and a keffiyeh what would make you assume they were a hipster? Go and have a look at the website lookbook.nu - you'll find a lot of hipster fashion, and do you see anybody wearing a Che t-shirt or whatever?

It just seems to me people will label anything they don't like as "hipster" if they think it has an air of pretension or could be considered "cool" (and honestly, there is nothing more uncool than Che Guevara t-shirts). I highly doubt that the people 'Christopher Hill' has complained about are actually "hipsters", and aren't just people he doesn't particularly like.

But yeah, go and look at lookbook, go and read hipster runoff and look at some tumblr blogs, visit American Apparel, Urban Outfitters or a vintage store. I bet you won't find anyone like 'Christopher Hill' has spoken about.


Lol, AA and UO both have sold keffiyehs, until they came under fire for the politics of it. Che isn't very hipster, but keffiyehs are, and there are very different kinds of hipsters. I know people who meet the definition in my mind (irony, culture appropriation, fixed gear bikes, liberal arts study wtc) who look nothing alike fashion wise. Lookbook is a really fashionista kind of hipster place, and not representative of the everyday hipsters who ride bikes, drink cheap beer, read adbusters and go to college.

[Il Medico]

I have a total crush on Kevin Barnes. :wub:

But who doesn't these days?
qft

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

I have a total crush on Kevin Barnes. :wub:

But who doesn't these days?
crushes are overrated...

[9]

ummm....not all hipsters are white.

are you sure?

[Il Medico]

are you sure?
Yes.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

Yes.
Seconded!

[9]

that's news to me :P

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

that's news to me :P
Get with the times, grandma.

[9]

I have never met a nonwhite hipster.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

I have never met a nonwhite hipster.
I was seeing a guy who was a nonwhite hipster.

I was gong to point out that I'm Mexican American, but I don't consider myself a hipster.

[Who?]

I have never met a nonwhite hipster.

I used to be in a rock 'n' roll group with one. :thumbup1:

[Il Medico]

I have never met a nonwhite hipster.
Find them and meet them:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_MPvDBGrKaXc/ShRU6DFqo9I/AAAAAAAAAlI/O27FaHzsido/s400/black-hipsters.jpg

[Widerstand]

Find them and meet them:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_MPvDBGrKaXc/ShRU6DFqo9I/AAAAAAAAAlI/O27FaHzsido/s400/black-hipsters.jpg

dat style

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

Find them and meet them:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_MPvDBGrKaXc/ShRU6DFqo9I/AAAAAAAAAlI/O27FaHzsido/s400/black-hipsters.jpg
The second guy from the right is really cute.

[Il Medico]

dat style
Indeed. The Guy in the Pea Coat is suave as hell.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

Indeed. The Guy in the Pea Coat is suave as hell.
(Fans self)

[Who?]

I dig the guy on the far left's jacket.

[Il Medico]

(Fans self)
When I read that, this is what I imagined:
http://www.artfagcity.com/wordpress_core/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/southern-belle.jpg

I've been in the south too long when I associate fanning ones self with southern belles.

[The Red Next Door]

the second guy from the right is really cute.

lame

[Os Cangaceiros]

Hipsters are actually a pretty diverse group. There are plenty of bad things one can say against hipsters, but being racially homogenous is not one of them.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

When I read that, this is what I imagined:
http://www.artfagcity.com/wordpress_core/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/southern-belle.jpg

I've been in the south too long when I associate fanning ones self with southern belles.
I always could see myself more as a high class mexican woman.

[Ravachol]

I have never met a nonwhite hipster.

There are actually plenty around here, especially amongst university educated immigrant youth.

[9]

There are actually plenty around here, especially amongst university educated immigrant youth.

Meh. It's probably because I live in the "White American Bastion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwestern_United_States)".

[Raúl Duke]

The creation of this thread was based on elitism- which is ironic- which means this thread is a hipster.


And Hipsters love irony, the bastards.

:lol::thumbup1:


Most hipsters are useless...many will wear a Che shirt for example without knowing who he is, a Kaffiyeh, and will listen to "revolutionary" music 24/7 without any real revolutionary thought.


In my experienceThat's not a hipster (che is overrated and if revolutionary music is RATM, hipsters will think it's trash), that which you describe is in fact the target demographic for this website, in my experience.


ummm....not all hipsters are white.

It's arguable that the majority are white, especially in specific areas. However, in places where one could claim there's a high hipster population, particularly Brooklyn, one can find immigrant and African American hipsters.

Even in my boondock area, I might have seen a few ethnic minority people who might be 'hipster' in some loose sense.

I have a total crush on Kevin Barnes. :wub:

But who doesn't these days?

:thumbup1::thumbup1::thumbup1:

[Honggweilo]

so people in flanel shirts are going to degrade the revolutionary movement more than crusties (no disrespect) or socially awkward leninists who would sooner talk to the first member of the working class they actually meet about dialectical materialism than how their day's been? Be easy.

Being 'hipster' doesn't imply adopting a specific ideology, even if you're going to be 'roughly speaking'. Especially as the term is often applied externally. The first time i heard the term was when i was called it. Ignorant of any alleged ideology that's attached. Obviously there are groups of people who are consumed entirely by the stereotypes of what a hipster is and let it dominate their personality and actions. But, a comrade's a comrade, regardless of how they dress.

For the record, i wouldn't exactly consider myself a hipster...
qft, people who call everyone with some cultural interest a "pretentious hipster artsy-farts" are just jealous talentless philistine losers

[Honggweilo]

all hail the king of leftist artsy-fartsy hipsterdom baby!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4foy9RuzMqE

[CJCM]

all hail the king of leftist artsy-fartsy hipsterdom baby!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4foy9RuzMqE

Ahh Hipsterism is Masochism?

[Honggweilo]

how is that remotely macho XD?

[praxis1966]

how is that remotely macho XD?

He said masochism, not machoism...:glare: Masochism is the act of deriving pleasure from pain. Anyway, I wish Sid Viscious were still around. He'd show that guy the real meaning of masochism and then kick his ass.

[bcbm]

Anyway, I wish Sid Viscious were still around. He'd show that guy the real meaning of masochism and then kick his ass.

nah he'd probably be too fucked on heroin

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

nah he'd probably be too fucked on heroin
yeah probably...

[Pavlov's House Party]

The ultimate hipster would probably wear something like this:
http://rlv.zcache.com/die_hipster_scum_tshirt-p235410750249420446y2px_400.jpg

wouldn't the ultimate hipster dress like a jock and join the army?

[Honggweilo]

I misread apperantly.. blame lysdexia

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTbwCsjN4Ek

THE hipster themesong XD

also a good summary of hipsters :cool:

[BeerShaman]

I don't think we should discriminate against any individual group, so long as they help the cause.

Although I feel as if most hipsters are probably lifestylists than authentic revolutionaries, I'm not going to judge the whole group based on that perception. I'm sure there are plenty of authentically red comrades among the them.
Agreed!

[BeerShaman]

What the fuck? I have never, ever seen a "hipster" wear a Che Guevara shirt or a keffiyeh (in Britian at least keffiyehs are quite a mainstream fashion item now). I don't think any hipsters would be seen dead in either item of clothing, considering one actually identifiable element of being a hipster is having a sense of style, and Che t-shirts are especially lacking in sartorial appeal. Your point about the music is just ridiculous.

Where do people get this shit from?
You are all hipsters there. that's why!:lol:

[Magón]

He said masochism, not machoism...:glare: Masochism is the act of deriving pleasure from pain. Anyway, I wish Sid Viscious were still around. He'd show that guy the real meaning of masochism and then kick his ass.

More like showing the guy masochism, through kicking his ass! :thumbup1:

[praxis1966]

nah he'd probably be too fucked on heroin

He managed to kill Nancy's psychotic ass when he was fucked out of is mind on heroin, so I don't see why he wouldn't be able to take that hairless tool box.


I misread apperantly.. blame lysdexia

:lol:Well played, sir.


More like showing the guy masochism, through kicking his ass! :thumbup1:

:lol: Perhaps you're right...

[ed miliband]

This is a bit shit but also a bit good, and it's clearly made by people that actually know what hipsters are (and are probably actually hipsters themselves):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVmmYMwFj1I

When I got linked to it yesterday it had 301 views, now it's all over the net. Weird.

[Honggweilo]

He said masochism, not machoism...:glare: Masochism is the act of deriving pleasure from pain. Anyway, I wish Sid Viscious were still around. He'd show that guy the real meaning of masochism and then kick his ass.

Sid Vicious can bring it on, ill kick his ass anytime

[Honggweilo]

More like showing the guy masochism, through kicking his ass! :thumbup1:

:rolleyes:

[Dimentio]

I hate hipsters, but my new glasses would make me look like one.

In fact, I hate all subcultures :D

I'm always going out in black jeans, a leather jacket and a black t-shirt with some monster on it. When I go to leftist events, people who haven't seen me before automatically assume I'm some kind of fascist :D

[Il Medico]

I hate hipsters, but my new glasses would make me look like one.

In fact, I hate all subcultures :D

I'm always going out in black jeans, a leather jacket and a black t-shirt with some monster on it. When I go to leftist events, people who haven't seen me before automatically assume I'm some kind of fascist :D
Wait...
You hate hipsters.

And you wear ironic clothes.

......

Hipster!

[Widerstand]

Wait...
You hate hipsters.

And you wear ironic clothes.

......

Hipster!

I think he was being ironic.

[Dimentio]

Wait...
You hate hipsters.

And you wear ironic clothes.

......

Hipster!

I don't wear them because of any particular reason. I haven't really changed my clothing style at all.