Are there rich communist/socialist. PLUS my stereotypes.

[LC89]

I have notice male made up of most of the anarchists, communists, and socialists.

Also majority are the low-class and minorities...

Is it the mostly witnesses and victims of inequality would stand up and struggles?

Any anarchists, communists, and socialists from upper-class family over here?

[Invincible Summer]

While my parents would still be considered "proletariat" under a Marxist class structure, I am from an "Upper-middle class" family in terms of income.

[DaComm]

I read somewhere that Marx was a capitalist.

[Raúl Duke]

I read somewhere that Marx was a capitalist.

That was Engels...

Although Marx was from a well-off family and studied enough to possibly be a lawyer; instead he ended up being a journalist for a newspaper and later on organizing/writing the theories that later became called "Marxism."

[LC89]

While my parents would still be considered "proletariat" under a Marxist class structure, I am from an "Upper-middle class" family in terms of income.
Having ability to own a property but not wanting to own might not be what Marx would expected...


I read somewhere that Marx was a capitalist.
I heard of Engels is somewhat of a capitalist instead of Marx. Engels I think he or his family invest in some kind of farm where he witness in labor exploitation.

[Raúl Duke]

some kind of farm

His father owned a factory in Manchester. It was partly due to this experience that led Engels to write the book "Conditions of the English Working Class."

[The Ben G]

My family would be considered "Upper Middle Class", so I guess so.

[LC89]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

[Stephen Colbert]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

perhaps. :laugh:

[infraxotl]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

No.

[Raúl Duke]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

Not exactly, but it would be against your self-interest in some aspects...

It'll be odd.

[Adil3tr]

My dads a doctor, so I'm upper middle class, BUT we are muslim, so that planted the seed for my radicalism. Plus, my dad doesn't seem to mind, I think he hates the system too. My mom was livid though, shoe thought I would get arrested and sent to Guantanamo.

[Adil3tr]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

No. But perhaps if you hire workers and give them a fixed wage to extract surplus value from.
If you start a franchised business, then yes, you would be a hypocrite.

[DenisDenis]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

No, I dont think so. But on the condition that you try to help the left with it...
I mean that communists are in a difficult position, we dont really have any
wealthy sponsors to aid our campaigns, which would really help counter the
capitalist propaganda, but on the other side would we still have the credibility
of the people should we start accepting money from (socialist) sponsors?

If I should own a company i would be glad to hand it over in case if revolution, i
think i would even try to teach the workers some class consciousness
(which would be a really odd situation now that i think about it :p)

[AK]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?
Anyone can align themselves with any ideology - although it may not be in their class interests. The working class voting for capitalist parties is a good example. But it is much rarer to see a member of the ruling class call themselves a socialist (with the exception of "democratic socialists" - i.e., reformists).

[DenisDenis]

Anyone can align themselves with any ideology - although it may not be in their class interests. The working class voting for capitalist parties is a good example. But it is much rarer to see a member of the ruling class call themselves a socialist (with the exception of "democratic socialists" - i.e., reformists).

It is rare but do-able I believe, in school my history teacher (who was marxist)
did tell us that in the 1800 there were -some- factory owners that took care of
his workers and invested a large part of his income in housing, sanitation, food, ...

so I dont think its impossible but as you said, it is rare...

[AK]

It is rare but do-able I believe, in school my history teacher (who was marxist) did tell us that in the 1800 there were -some- factory owners that took care of his workers and invested a large part of his income in housing, sanitation, food, ...

so I dont think its impossible but as you said, it is rare...
Those capitalists were not socialists, rather the label "social democrats" would have fitted them better. An modern example of a member of the bourgeoisie adopting socialist principles would have been the American capitalist who gave his company to his workers (or did something similar, I can't be arsed reading the article again).
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2011111010_birthdaygift18.html

[ed miliband]

It is rare but do-able I believe, in school my history teacher (who was marxist)
did tell us that in the 1800 there were -some- factory owners that took care of
his workers and invested a large part of his income in housing, sanitation, food, ...

so I dont think its impossible but as you said, it is rare...

Just as some slave owners took good care of their slaves; Oscar Wilde said such slave owners were the very worst.

Yes, some factory owners 'took care' of their workers, and such a strategy was probably useful in pacifying them. The point is, we as socialists don't want factory owners to treat 'their' workers nicely, we want the notion of 'factory owners' to cease to exist.

[Jolly Red Giant]

It is rare but do-able I believe, in school my history teacher (who was marxist)
did tell us that in the 1800 there were -some- factory owners that took care of
his workers and invested a large part of his income in housing, sanitation, food, ...

Robert Owen - utopian socialist -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Owen

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/IRowen.htm

I suppose the wealthiest on the far left would be actors or musicians. One that comes to mind is Vanessa Redgrave who was a member of Healy's WRP who then founded the Marxist Party and subsequently the Peace and Progress Party.

[DenisDenis]

you guys are right, but i never meant to say that this should be the way to go,
i just wanted to say that there are those of the ruling class that care about the workers,
but as aufkleben said, this would have probably been used mostly to pacify them...


Just as some slave owners took good care of their slaves; Oscar Wilde said such slave owners were the very worst.

what do you mean with "they are the worst"? Because they also pacify their slaves by
doing this?

[leftace53]

My family would be considered upper middle class, and haven't had to struggle much economically (a bit of struggle right after we immigrated). I have however faced thorough inequality in the hands of the government and corporations, ergo communist.

Also, I'm not male. Your "everyone is male" type observations might result from society generally saying that women shouldn't involve their pretty little heads in something like politics. Also its the internet, so us technologically inept females can't hop online to make our presence known.

[StoneFrog]

I guess as a wannabe artist i'm classed as petit-bourgeoisie, because i own capital which i use to produce. But im as broke as can be so idk.

[LC89]

It is rare but do-able I believe, in school my history teacher (who was marxist)
did tell us that in the 1800 there were -some- factory owners that took care of
his workers and invested a large part of his income in housing, sanitation, food, ...

so I dont think its impossible but as you said, it is rare...

Is your teacher teach in a university. I'm curious are people over Belgium open-minded to left wing ideas. Over here in U.S some school being accuse of spreading communism because they teach Mandarin.

[punisa]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

As long as you do not exploit anyone, you're good.
I'm self employed and do not consider myself a hypocrite because of it.

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

I am working class and I have never know of middle or upper class revolutionaries. I suppose it is not within their interests/they haven't been exposed to the conditions that influence revolutionary thought.

I have and, still do, know middle-class progressive liberals and social democrats though.

[Raúl Duke]

some school being accuse of spreading communism because they teach Mandarin.

I bet no one in the U.S. believes or takes that accusation seriously...

they wouldn't, not even in Florida.

[LC89]

As long as you do not exploit anyone, you're good.
I'm self employed and do not consider myself a hypocrite because of it.
I'm thinking if I'm self-employed. I'm both owner and worker so I'm ~ the worker in fact control the mean of production.

[Stephen Colbert]

I am working class and I have never know of middle or upper class revolutionaries. I suppose it is not within their interests/they haven't been exposed to the conditions that influence revolutionary thought.

I have and, still do, know middle-class progressive liberals and social democrats though.

I'm a libertarian socialist and I am middle class, do I count? :thumbup1:

[King of Frogs]

My situation with regards to weath is an odd one. I was raised very poor for my childhood, my mother was a single parent with very little money and was studying at university, so I kind of grew up with a working-class income, but in my teens my mother married a man who comes from quite a rich family and suddenly overnight we had money. It was very strange, but I suppose I am kind of middle-middle class if that makes sense.

Also with regards to personal wealth, I have a trust fund in my name with is invested in the stock market (which makes me feel quite a hypocrite sometimes, despite the fact that this investment was my step-father's idea). However, the money isn't technically under my control yet, so its sort of hypothetical, imaginary money right now. :blink:

[ed miliband]

It's a unhelpful to think of class in purely sociological terms. In the UK people are concious of class divisions, but more often than not 'class' is turned into this concept decided on how you pronounce 'h', or what your favourite clothing brand is. The other predominant class determinant is income, which is also flawed. As such, you have plenty of people who are in economic terms working class going 'oh, I earn x amount of money and live in a certain location, so I'm upper-lower middle class*'.


*yeah, people use that sort of terminology.

[KurtFF8]

Anyone can align themselves with any ideology - although it may not be in their class interests. The working class voting for capitalist parties is a good example. But it is much rarer to see a member of the ruling class call themselves a socialist (with the exception of "democratic socialists" - i.e., reformists).

Warren Beatty (Hollywood actor and director) once claimed that he "isn't a Communist or Socialist, but is a class traitor" (to the ruling class) and is quite influenced by Marxism. Just look at the film Reds which portrays the Russian Revolution in quite a positive light (there's a story that he even lectured the Russian background workers [or extras] about exploitation, and they decided to ask for higher wages or they wouldn't continue to work on the film or something along those lines).

The class composition of the Communist movement tends to be predominately working class, although not exclusively. Many people from "middle class" backgrounds tends to become revolutionaries (you see this a lot within the Anarchist movement for example). That doesn't necessarily make them hypocrites as long as they are actively trying to achieve socialism.


Like was was brought up a few times before: Engels, who through his capitalist families wealth directly helped Marx out in writing Capital.

So the exploitation of the workers that Engels family hired went directly to funding the most in depth critique of Capitalism written.

Other examples some people point out are Lenin not being directly from the working class, yet helping advance the working class movement quite a bit. etc. etc.

Also there's no shortage of intellectual Leftists out there who work in universities and the like. But while they certainly aren't traditional "working class" their contributions to theory and understanding of what's going on in the world is quite valuable (thus helping to move towards a better strategy)

[LC89]

My situation with regards to weath is an odd one. I was raised very poor for my childhood, my mother was a single parent with very little money and was studying at university, so I kind of grew up with a working-class income, but in my teens my mother married a man who comes from quite a rich family and suddenly overnight we had money. It was very strange, but I suppose I am kind of middle-middle class if that makes sense.

Also with regards to personal wealth, I have a trust fund in my name with is invested in the stock market (which makes me feel quite a hypocrite sometimes, despite the fact that this investment was my step-father's idea). However, the money isn't technically under my control yet, so its sort of hypothetical, imaginary money right now. :blink:

Oh lucky you... My early life is nearly same as you but with a single mom with 3 kids. Without the nice step-father and family. He and his family and cousins are awful.

[LC89]

My dads a doctor, so I'm upper middle class, BUT we are muslim, so that planted the seed for my radicalism. Plus, my dad doesn't seem to mind, I think he hates the system too. My mom was livid though, shoe thought I would get arrested and sent to Guantanamo.

I hear Guantanamo got health care:rolleyes:!


My family would be considered upper middle class, and haven't had to struggle much economically (a bit of struggle right after we immigrated). I have however faced thorough inequality in the hands of the government and corporations, ergo communist.

Also, I'm not male. Your "everyone is male" type observations might result from society generally saying that women shouldn't involve their pretty little heads in something like politics. Also its the internet, so us technologically inept females can't hop online to make our presence known.

Where did you immigrated from?

[Manifesto]

Hmm, well at my dad's I am poor (I have constantly shared my bedroom/living room with either my dad or sister) and at my mom's I am lower middle class but a lot of luxuries here (ah the glories of debt), so no not rich.

[Adi Shankara]

I grew up desperately poor and had a pretty bad childhood. to this day I have a bad complex with rich people, where I could like them one moment, but instantly start hating them if I find out they're wealthy or privileged, once or twice, to the point of violent encounter. For a while, I even dabbled in Pol Potist ideology because I had such a fantasy of watching rich people "get what they deserved". but then I realized that wasn't right and grew up.

it's not a good thing at all and am trying to control it, I guess I just am envious maybe, but at the same time, I never want that much wealth ever; I just hate how some people are allowed to be more well off than others, where my father had a recognized degree in agricultural science back in "the old country", now his degree means nothing, and he has remained mostly on welfare.

[DenisDenis]

Is your teacher teach in a university. I'm curious are people over Belgium open-minded to left wing ideas. Over here in U.S some school being accuse of spreading communism because they teach Mandarin.
In europe people arent really scared of communism as to the degree of being
kinda paranoia :p
But imo I think almost all the history teachers here are marxist or have socialist
sympathies. (speaking of my own experiences here, probably not all of them are
pro-commie though)
I guess they know what communism really is( I believe its in their education as
history teacher)

[Stranger Than Paradise]

I am probably what they call lower middle class but only very luckily, my family is from a working class background and even through my lifetime was still working class. Of course this is in sociological terms essentially, really they still belong to the working class using proper analysis.

[Tavarisch_Mike]

Average working class here, nothing more ore less.

[LC89]

I grew up desperately poor and had a pretty bad childhood. to this day I have a bad complex with rich people, where I could like them one moment, but instantly start hating them if I find out they're wealthy or privileged, once or twice, to the point of violent encounter. For a while, I even dabbled in Pol Potist ideology because I had such a fantasy of watching rich people "get what they deserved". but then I realized that wasn't right and grew up.

it's not a good thing at all and am trying to control it, I guess I just am envious maybe, but at the same time, I never want that much wealth ever; I just hate how some people are allowed to be more well off than others, where my father had a recognized degree in agricultural science back in "the old country", now his degree means nothing, and he has remained mostly on welfare.

You from Russia right? Does your father makes more money back in days in USSR (Are he happen to be old enough to live in the USSR?) ?

[Invincible Summer]

I had such a fantasy of watching rich people "get what they deserved". but then I realized that wasn't right and grew up.

To put it bluntly... they will.

[Coelacanth]

My family..I don't even know. Upper middle class? We have money. We live in a community that is chock-full of rich people, like really rich. I don't know what that makes me.
I'm also female.

[Sturzo]

I've gotten a good taste from both ends of the socio-economic spectrum. My family is middle-class, I suppose. However, we live rather sparsely but comfortably, one car, small apartment, buy sparsely in consumerist goods - but I suppose that is what being middle class these days is.

My dad works in non-profit sector, highly educated himself, a progressive, former Marxist in his younger days (he was in SDS), he exposed me to both sides of society, went to a working class school for elementary and middle, but got also exposed to the upper class through his own connections. Went to high school in a rich neighborhood, but I have always felt more comfortable with lower class kids.

Seeing the dichotomy of wealth is a lot of what really got me thinking towards socialism, plus my parent's openness in my development in not indoctrinating me in anything.

I don't necessarily think there is anything inherently wrong with being rich or privileged (this actually depends on how you are rich or privileged of course), but from I've experienced, the more privileged often have a very different perspective on life (not having to worry about living day-to-day, or hostility from law enforcement for being a minority) than those who've grown up grossly underprivileged.

I've grown up in between that spectrum, we're not rich, but we haven't faced going hungry or eviction - at the same time though we've experienced our own economic hardships. But, I definately feel a lot more in common with the lower class than upper class kids that I've interacted with.

[durhamleft]

I was brought up in an upper class household, and had the privilege? of travelling to many third world countries when I was younger and watching people starve. I was welcomed into the mud huts of families in Africa who had nothing and offered their gratuity despite the fact they had next to nothing and I had so so much. I could go on about it, but it is what it is.

I realised at some point that it wasn't right, and it tore me up. I spoke to a preacher, who was almost as despairing as me agreeing that Jesus would probably be dismissed as a communist if he came back today, and she thought the answer came in charity and prayer. I disagreed and thought the only way to change society is to fight against the forces that cause such horrific inequality.

So yeah, I guess you can be from an affluent family but still be anti-capitalist and anti-inequality, especially when you have a tremendous sense of guilt hanging over your head.

[Fictional]

Only just noticed this thread, it's a bit out-of-date but I'll bump it as this concerns me.

I come from a lower class background, my family barely scraped living in a house, my father works for the MOD in the UK and he's better off, my mother is a cleaner - obviously they're divorced. I lived with my mother, helped her anyway I can, I still pay her a large some of income to keep a roof over her head.

I got really lucky on my first job, after failing pretty bad in school and college due to spending too much time on the Interwebs teaching myself graphic design and web design, I got a job in a local recording studio as an artist and working in Band Promotions, Artwork and Websites for various British bands, the pay isn't too shabby £10.40 an hour and well, I can hardly say I'm finding it tough at the moment.

I'm currently setting up my own buisness in Graphic Design to reach a larger audience instead of just musicians.

I still come from a working class background, in which members of my family have died/been seriously injured due to the chemicals they've worked with under the rulling class.

[chegitz guevara]

I wonder if I start my own private business does it make me hypocrite to call myself a socialist?

It depends on the business and how you conduct yourself.

[LC89]

Only just noticed this thread, it's a bit out-of-date but I'll bump it as this concerns me.

I come from a lower class background, my family barely scraped living in a house, my father works for the MOD in the UK and he's better off, my mother is a cleaner - obviously they're divorced. I lived with my mother, helped her anyway I can, I still pay her a large some of income to keep a roof over her head.

I got really lucky on my first job, after failing pretty bad in school and college due to spending too much time on the Interwebs teaching myself graphic design and web design, I got a job in a local recording studio as an artist and working in Band Promotions, Artwork and Websites for various British bands, the pay isn't too shabby £10.40 an hour and well, I can hardly say I'm finding it tough at the moment.

I'm currently setting up my own buisness in Graphic Design to reach a larger audience instead of just musicians.

I still come from a working class background, in which members of my family have died/been seriously injured due to the chemicals they've worked with under the rulling class.

How do you promote your business? I'm planning to start a home-based business but promoting seems to be hard for me.

I think living in bottom-working class made me want some kind of change. Born in a religious family which it constantly sucks money from us and made us stuck in our class (Yes my family willing to do it) It lead me want a secular government.

[dearest chuck]

My family..I don't even know. Upper middle class? We have money. We live in a community that is chock-full of rich people, like really rich. I don't know what that makes me.
I'm also female.
you're a proletariat, comrade!