I am Ignorant about Feminism

[LebenIstKrieg]

I like the Idea that Men and Women can be on the same level in the terms of sexual, economic and social freedom but apparently Feminism is more than that. care enlighten me?

[Cyberwave]

Basically, there are numerous types of feminist movements. There are the liberal feminists which basically tend to focus on women gaining an equal role in the workplace for example. There are the radical feminists who while also supporting woman's liberation also support emphasizing femininity rather than superficial notions of masculinity. Anarchist feminists may also be included in radical feminist movements. But most importantly there is also Marxist and socialist feminism where women's struggles are seen in regards to the entire working class (i.e. opposed to identity politics in that the entire working class is in need of emancipation, and the interests shouldn't be merely based on the interests of groups alone).

As Marxists, there isn't necessarily a need for "Marxist-Feminism" because Marxism itself is a social system based on emancipation of oppressed, working class society, which includes women, LGBT, racial minorities, and so forth. But Marxism feminism has its roots in The Origins of the Family, Private Property and The State by Marx and Engels in which Marx and Engels asserted that woman's role is based on social relations, and that to extent (particularly during the 1800s) the family is merely a system for men to assert dominance over the women's services. In other words, the oppression of women comes directly from capitalism.

Where socialism was attempted women were generally given much greater rights. In Albania, women had previously been under extreme patriarchal dominance, treated as mere objects rather than human beings. This was enforced by the social relations and the laws of the time being. But then when Hoxha came to power and socialism began to grow, women gained equal rights. They were able to receive education, health-care, and the like. Women eventually comprised over 40% of the workers councils and over 30% of the assemblies as well.

Wherever you hear a Marxist claiming they are anti-feminist, they simply mean that they reject feminism as a label. Clara Zetkin was the same way; as a Marxist she believed that Marxism is feminism of it's own and therefore combing the two was unnecessary, as I have mentioned.

You can always read up on Marxist feminists here. (http://www.marxists.org/archive/index.htm#feminism)

[Invincible Summer]

There's a large thread here (http://www.revleft.com/vb/showthread.php?t=130144&highlight=feminism) which may be helpful

[LebenIstKrieg]

Because I was accused of being Macho chauvinist for supporting Physical Violent Confrontation of Fascism. I found this rather strange because I would think It Pretty fucking normal for girls to confront an inherently violent sexist Ideology that advocates men over women.

[KurtFF8]

I suggest this article What is Socialist Feminism (http://www.monthlyreview.org/0705ehrenreich.php) by Barbara Ehrenreich. She lays out the debate about what Marxist Feminism is and why it's important (to her at least) to keep the feminist label. There is of course much debate about the relevancy of Feminism amongst the revolutionary Left, but personally I think it's important to adopt feminism with Marxism.

[AK]

I like the Idea that Men and Women can be on the same level in the terms of sexual, economic and social freedom but apparently Feminism is more than that. care enlighten me?
Apparently you've been lied to. Feminism is about ending sexism, misogyny, patriarchy and the oppression of women and it is also about giving women equal opportunities in society as men - nowhere does it say that feminists seek to reverse things and implement matriarchy.

[LebenIstKrieg]

Apparently you've been lied to. Feminism is about ending sexism, misogyny, patriarchy and the oppression of women and it is also about giving women equal opportunities in society as men - nowhere does it say that feminists seek to reverse things and implement matriarchy.
From a social point of view is they're a strand that wants change men's behaviour I.e do they want us to seem more feminine? or is that just bullshit.

[eclipse]

From a social point of view is they're a strand that wants change men's behaviour I.e do they want us to seem more feminine? or is that just bullshit.


Well gender categories still serve certain dichotome, contructed stereotypes at the moment. What is "feminine" after all? If you think about this a little, it should become clear that the aim is not to make men "feminine" but to abolish the stereotyped gender roles of "feminine" and "maculine" behaviour at all.

[¿Que?]

From a social point of view is they're a strand that wants change men's behaviour I.e do they want us to seem more feminine? or is that just bullshit.
This question seems to me to be a bit nonsensical. It's not so much that feminists seek to "feminize" men as you suggest, rather, they (we) reject any essentialist idea of masculinity and femininity. That's not to say they don't exist, rather they are social constructions, they don't reflect any biological or natural condition between the sexes.

[Jazzhands]

From a social point of view is they're a strand that wants change men's behaviour I.e do they want us to seem more feminine? or is that just bullshit.

yes, it's bullshit. complete and total bullshit. during the 1960s the Right was spreading all this bullshit about bra-burners who are going to come to you in the night and castrate you. there are no bra-burners. there never were any bra-burners. fucking reactionaries.

[al8]

Apparently you've been lied to. Feminism is about ending sexism, misogyny, patriarchy and the oppression of women and it is also about giving women equal opportunities in society as men - nowhere does it say that feminists seek to reverse things and implement matriarchy.

What isn't said openly can be amply communicated by sub-text.

[AK]

What isn't said openly can be amply communicated by sub-text.
Or lies and strawmen, whatever it is that sexists choose.

[Jazzhands]

What isn't said openly can be amply communicated by sub-text.

you're kidding me right? this is like reactionaries saying Obama's a closet socialist. it's the same Slippery Slope fallacy, the same strawmen, the same blatant lies, and all the other technique the Right cranks out like a factory of bullshit.

[ContrarianLemming]

OP: seperatist feminism seeks matriarchy in a sense, thats what you're thinking of