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View Full Version : A guide to far left disease - you to can help!



ContrarianLemming
16th July 2010, 21:37
(I realize this is writen in a somewhat comical fashion, but it is intended for learners)

"But Stalin also greatly improved quality of life for Russians! and he only killed 800,000*"

"I do not wish to accociate myself with a movement these (http://www.thezephyr.com/archives/anarchist.jpg) and those (http://www.wilsonsalmanac.com/images1/castro.jpg) people are involved in!"

"Fuck orginization! It's reactionary! Burn Starbucks!"

Hear these phrases often? me too!
What do they mean?

There are many diseases afflicting our humble group of radicals, some common, some rare, some easilly fixed, some easilly ignored, lets learn!

Sovietphilia

*Does the person you talk to try to justify Maoist purges?
*Does he/she say "only" before each death count?
*Does he/she claim practicality should come before freedom?
*Does he refer to you as "ultraleft"?

You might be dealing with a real live authoritarian socialist! I call it "Sovietphilia", this chronic long lasting disease is difficult if not impossible to cure, like the common cold it must often go away by itself, way to speed this up include spamming the user with allegations of "red fascism", calling the person to source everything they say (no pics or it didn't happen) and daring them to look at alternitive sources.
Luckily for us, these poor souls are a rare breed and can be ignored without shame, or simply laughed at, no one will think less of you comrade!

An easy way to debate with these folks in a constructive manner is to "get down to the basics" and discuss the real ideas, not the history, and you might find these people have ideas like yours, and might very well take to heart Che's quote "If you tremble indignation at every injustice then you are a comrade of mine" - as long as that indignation was commited by right wing troops! Otherwise it didn't happen or was justifiable, so we should let them go along with seeling "Gulag Myths" leaflets.

Self Hating Leftist

*Does he/she often explain how lifestylism/authoritarianism has overrun the movement?
*Does he/she often become hostile at the mention of Punk or Grunge or how they may have spread the ideology?
*Does he/she believe "street cred" is getting through Kapital without getting bored once?
*Does he/she jump from tendency to tendency, trying to find the least embarresing? (it's orthodox marxism)

A close reletive of the "Bookworm leftist", the self hating leftist is the theoretical spanish civil war entusiaist we all know and love, though we must pity this group more then others: they are overly knowledgable of the state of the movement and we must keep a close eye on them - it can be fatal - as reversion back to mainstream politics is not unlikely. Eventualy the self hating leftist may grow to tired of putting up with "Oh you want chaos!" or "You must love Mao!" and revert back to Liberalism, if only to end it all.
Curing Self hating leftists is a long and difficult process, often the curer must bring long lists of supposed "anarchist"actions and show how these were not actual far left actions, the curer must show the self hater how there stereotyped views have been overly influenced by a mainstream upbringing and watching to much bourgeois news as a teen, often resulting in perverse side affects.
Often an inexperianced left wing doctor may cause the far leftist to revert into a bookwork, or if they take it to far, send them down lifestylist avenue, straight into Crimthnck city.

Lifestylist

* Does he/she smell?
* Does he she focus on buying fairtrade and "changing your world view, not the world itself"
* Does he/she focus more on womens struggle, animal rights and fighting republicans (in allieance with democrats) then on class struggle?
* Do they consider themselves "hippy"

The largest and most difficult to ignore group, though often easier to cure then most. The lifestylists ideals are built on not changing the world, but changing your own way, by living the "anarchist life" while forgetting about teaching others about it. Typically explaining how revolutions are authoritarian acts and that "slow change" is preferable. Lifestylists are most likely to participate in mainstream politics.
Predominantly an anarchist disease, Lifestylists can be cured through through explaining how the capitalists will not allow slow change, they will not slowly die off, that freedom must be taken, that it is not authoritarian to destroy authoritarian institutions.
Often is can be useful to point to historical examples of this, ones based most strongly on voluntarian, like the Italian general strike of 1920, which resulted in short lived anarcho syndicalism.
Lifestylists should not be mistaken for Insurrectos or book worms: they can often be well read.

Bookworm leftist (Intelligentsia)

* Does he she often critizize the "idealism" of anarchists and marxists?
* Does he/she reject modern struggle in favour of historical debate?
* Does he/she know what "dialectice materialism" is?
* Has he/she read every far left classic?
* Does he/she often quote far left theoritsts as "proof" for there arguments?
* does he/she accept the word of there given tendency as complete truth and as inevitable?

The Bookwork leftist can often be a deformed self hating leftist and may eventually besome a sovietphiliac. They are typified by a focus on acedemics and intellectual study, often represented by the "armchair intellectual" and college student know-it-all.
Typically in the marxist camp, the bookworm is the ultimate enemy of the Insurrecto and the lifestylist, though the lifestylist and bookworm may find common ground in their dislike of the former.
The bookworm leftist is incurable, we just have to hope they'll join in on a revolution and not just criticize it's actions from afar - or - worse yet, declear themselves it's leader.

Insurrectionary/Anti thoery

* Do they despise orginizations of any sort?
* Do they "bloc up" during protests
* are they 15? (no offence to actual class struggle leftists of this age)
* Do they support mindless property destruction?

Often mistaken for lifestylists, Insurrectos are the ultimate embarresments of the anarchist movement, often the only form of anarchist reported on mainstream news (a direct cause of self hating leftism), Insurrectos are not however the direct cause of the missconception that the anarchist camp desire "chaos", this miscnception predates insurrectionary anarchists.
Note this breeds obsession with the color black, the clothing chain "Dickies" and it's biological impulse to migrate en-mass to republican national conventions, wherever mayham be caused.
Though well meaning, this group is devoid of theory, often embaressing the movement when they cannot describe an anarchist society outside of quoting John Lennons "Imagine".
This diseased group is typified by the Black Bloc, an utterly useless tactic if you don't want to look like a very dangerious group, and it's ability to attract FOX news cameras like magnets.
Often cures by itself, either becoming a proper leftist or reverting back to the conservatism they came from.



* a Stalinist figure

Chimurenga.
16th July 2010, 21:45
This is essentially worthless.

Uppercut
16th July 2010, 21:49
This is essentially worthless.

This.

Wanted Man
16th July 2010, 21:55
That's a lot of effort for such a shit thread.

Comical? Don't flatter yourself.

Lyev
16th July 2010, 22:00
* Does he/she smell?(I can't smell over the internet.)

Invincible Summer
16th July 2010, 22:28
You guys have no sense of humor, but this should be in chit-chat

Raúl Duke
16th July 2010, 22:36
I don't fit in any of these categories...thankfully.

Although #1, #4, and to some extant #2 are somewhat common on this site. Especially #1.

DaComm
16th July 2010, 22:37
That's a lot of effort for such a shit thread.

Comical? Don't flatter yourself.

:laugh: This.

Wanted Man
16th July 2010, 22:39
It does totally make sense that Sovietophiles would justify Maoist purges...

Black Sheep
16th July 2010, 22:44
I am recovering from a #4 state..

Imposter Marxist
16th July 2010, 22:44
This is essentially worthless.

This.

chegitz guevara
16th July 2010, 22:54
I kinda liked it.

IllicitPopsicle
16th July 2010, 23:15
We all must deal with the growing frustration of the movement on our own terms; this was clearly contrarianlemming's way of doing so.

ContrarianLemming
16th July 2010, 23:27
We all must deal with the growing frustration of the movement on our own terms; this was clearly contrarianlemming's way of doing so.

I got over the last one last week
don't take it so seriously, i do think they are all relevant groups that should be discussed

The Red Next Door
16th July 2010, 23:29
Funny.

Jazzhands
16th July 2010, 23:38
My new favorite person. Like usual, the Stalinoids are seething because they can't get the joke.

inb4sectarianism

Chimurenga.
17th July 2010, 00:31
My new favorite person. Like usual, the Stalinoids are seething because they can't get the joke.

inb4sectarianism

Right, because everyone who doesn't find it funny/thinks it's out of place in LEARNING MUST be a "Stalinist".

ContrarianLemming
17th July 2010, 00:33
Right, because everyone who doesn't find it funny/thinks it's out of place in LEARNING MUST be a "Stalinist".

Chillax and take that sickle out of your ass, lighten up.

Quail
17th July 2010, 00:37
I thought this was kind of funny. Some of you should lighten up.

Wanted Man
17th July 2010, 08:17
I thought this was kind of funny. Some of you should lighten up.

It's not funny, even if it's solely about groups that you dislike (I do dislike all 5 categories, including mindless "Sovietophiles"). There is just nothing comedic about it. Sorry, but if you think this is comedic, you've just got a very poor sense of humour.

I'd say most people here are "lightened up", but just can't laugh at unfunny things (except when high, I suppose). It's basically the Revleft equivalent of some wannabe comedian who leaves the stage after 15 minutes, because nobody has even cracked a smile after several jokes.

AK
17th July 2010, 10:21
Lemming, I love you more and more by the day.

chegitz guevara
17th July 2010, 12:52
It's not funny...

...to you, and of coure, you are the only one whose opinion counts. :rolleyes:

Hit The North
17th July 2010, 13:02
Right, because everyone who doesn't find it funny/thinks it's out of place in LEARNING MUST be a "Stalinist".

I guess that makes me a Stalinist, too. Moved to Chit Chat.

Wanted Man
17th July 2010, 13:38
...to you, and of coure, you are the only one whose opinion counts. :rolleyes:

Correct.

Sam_b
17th July 2010, 13:45
some easilly ignored

Kinda like this thread, right?

Nolan
17th July 2010, 16:40
*cricket*

ContrarianLemming
17th July 2010, 19:23
Guys, really, take it easy and chillax, it's just a bit of fun, some of you folks seem genuinly insulted by this.
Take a break, take it for what it is and lighten up.

Nwoye
19th July 2010, 02:02
My new favorite person. Like usual, the Stalinoids are seething because they can't get the joke.

inb4sectarianism
no, you are not "inb4sectarianism" because you brought a sectarian insult with you in your first comment.

dumbass.

bcbm
19th July 2010, 04:30
wow collecting a bunch of "funny" stereotypes in one piece, how clever.

NGNM85
19th July 2010, 05:00
There's a lot of this going around...

scarletghoul
19th July 2010, 05:02
Trotskyitis
Symptoms include-


Being a petit-bourgeois minded middleclass student
being easily won over by opportunistic posturing
probably giving up and becoming a liberal later in life because you never really understood the science of marxism-leninism
super eurocentrism. the only nonwhite people who can be considerd marxists are those who side with trotsky and do not have any original ideas.
criticising every successful revolutionary movement as stalinist
being generally annoying and not likable
avoiding the working class in real life, instead favouring the proletariat as an abstract theoretical concept.
spending all your effort on hating other trot groups who no one has even heard of

The only known cure is an icepick to the head.

Nolan
19th July 2010, 06:13
The only known cure is an icepick to the head.

Indeed, they're like zombies, except in ideology: they're already dead.

scarletghoul
19th July 2010, 20:20
:lol:

The Ungovernable Farce
19th July 2010, 21:02
Lifestylist

* Does he/she smell?
* Does he she focus on buying fairtrade and "changing your world view, not the world itself"
* Does he/she focus more on womens struggle, animal rights and fighting republicans (in allieance with democrats) then on class struggle?
* Do they consider themselves "hippy"

Eh? The rest of it was fairly inoffensive, if not that funny, but I really don't get how you suddenly throw "a focus on women's struggle" into a list of lifestylist characteristics as if it wasn't, y'know, an essential part of the class struggle and that.

Os Cangaceiros
19th July 2010, 22:11
An easy way to debate with these folks in a constructive manner is to "get down to the basics" and discuss the real ideas, not the history, and you might find these people have ideas like yours, and might very well take to heart Che's quote "If you tremble indignation at every injustice then you are a comrade of mine" - as long as that indignation was commited by right wing troops! Otherwise it didn't happen or was justifiable, so we should let them go along with seeling "Gulag Myths" leaflets.

That one's pretty accurate. Leftists are (justifiably) outraged in regards to the 250,000 people that Franco executed after the Spanish Civil War, but some regard lowball estimates of executions in the USSR with a shrug, or even praise them as a justifiable response against kulaks and "saboteurs". :rolleyes:

redSHARP
20th July 2010, 04:10
Trotskyitis
Symptoms include-


Being a petit-bourgeois minded middleclass student
being easily won over by opportunistic posturing
probably giving up and becoming a liberal later in life because you never really understood the science of marxism-leninism
super eurocentrism. the only nonwhite people who can be considerd marxists are those who side with trotsky and do not have any original ideas.
criticising every successful revolutionary movement as stalinist
being generally annoying and not likable
avoiding the working class in real life, instead favouring the proletariat as an abstract theoretical concept.
spending all your effort on hating other trot groups who no one has even heard of

The only known cure is an icepick to the head.

no punches were pulled on this one!!


I thought it was funny, but i can also see it as a bit insulting. My theory is if i cant laugh at myself then fuck my life.

fa2991
20th July 2010, 04:25
Self Hating Leftist

*Does he/she often explain how lifestylism/authoritarianism has overrun the movement?
*Does he/she often become hostile at the mention of Punk or Grunge or how they may have spread the ideology?
*Does he/she believe "street cred" is getting through Kapital without getting bored once?
*Does he/she jump from tendency to tendency, trying to find the least embarresing? (it's orthodox marxism)

A close reletive of the "Bookworm leftist", the self hating leftist is the theoretical spanish civil war entusiaist we all know and love, though we must pity this group more then others: they are overly knowledgable of the state of the movement and we must keep a close eye on them - it can be fatal - as reversion back to mainstream politics is not unlikely. Eventualy the self hating leftist may grow to tired of putting up with "Oh you want chaos!" or "You must love Mao!" and revert back to Liberalism, if only to end it all.
Curing Self hating leftists is a long and difficult process, often the curer must bring long lists of supposed "anarchist"actions and show how these were not actual far left actions, the curer must show the self hater how there stereotyped views have been overly influenced by a mainstream upbringing and watching to much bourgeois news as a teen, often resulting in perverse side affects.
Often an inexperianced left wing doctor may cause the far leftist to revert into a bookwork, or if they take it to far, send them down lifestylist avenue, straight into Crimthnck city.

You may as well have just called this one "Murray Bookchin."

ContrarianLemming
20th July 2010, 05:24
Eh? The rest of it was fairly inoffensive, if not that funny, but I really don't get how you suddenly throw "a focus on women's struggle" into a list of lifestylist characteristics as if it wasn't, y'know, an essential part of the class struggle and that.

Right, I mean to imply that lifestylists put othe struggles foucing on smaller groups then on the larger class struggle, which simply imcompasses all of them.

I do not like to see feminists and animal rights advocates who just focus on these struggles alone and completely reject everything else, but I know they're a minority.
It reminds me of people who say "womyn"

ContrarianLemming
20th July 2010, 05:25
You may as well have just called this one "Murray Bookchin."

spot on, well said, I really wish he woulda gotten over it. Anything I bring his name up in defence of anarchism and repeat somethin he said I always get "Even your beloved Bookchin eventually abandones anarchism!"
curse him!

fa2991
20th July 2010, 07:13
spot on, well said, I really wish he woulda gotten over it. Anything I bring his name up in defence of anarchism and repeat somethin he said I always get "Even your beloved Bookchin eventually abandones anarchism!"
curse him!

I kind of like his (as you put it) self-hatred. SOMEONE had to take on Bob Black, Hakim Bey, etc. eventually, even if Bookchin took his critical look inward a bit far. "Social Anarchism or Lifestyle Anarchism: an Unbridgeable Chasm" is an anarchist classic.

Il Medico
20th July 2010, 12:08
@ most people complaining about the thread: find a dictionary and look up satire and humor.

@ the OP: Why are you wasting my time with such a bad attempt at such????

AK
20th July 2010, 12:29
Trotskyitis
Symptoms include-


Being a petit-bourgeois minded middleclass student

Reminds me of that movie, "The Trotsky".

bailey_187
21st July 2010, 22:55
That one's pretty accurate. Leftists are (justifiably) outraged in regards to the 250,000 people that Franco executed after the Spanish Civil War, but some regard lowball estimates of executions in the USSR with a shrug, or even praise them as a justifiable response against kulaks and "saboteurs". :rolleyes:

our violence is virtuous.

Os Cangaceiros
21st July 2010, 23:14
(praise Stalin!)

bailey_187
21st July 2010, 23:51
i prefer to just nod approvingly. he would of wanted it that way.

The Ungovernable Farce
22nd July 2010, 21:14
Right, I mean to imply that lifestylists put othe struggles foucing on smaller groups then on the larger class struggle, which simply imcompasses all of them.

I do not like to see feminists and animal rights advocates who just focus on these struggles alone and completely reject everything else, but I know they're a minority.
It reminds me of people who say "womyn"
That's not the same thing as lifestylism, though. You're conflating two completely different things.

Rusty Shackleford
22nd July 2010, 21:31
[/LIST]
Reminds me of that movie, "The Trotsky".
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0f/Exactly.png

bcbm
23rd July 2010, 03:27
our violence is virtuous.

divine, in fact.

scarletghoul
23rd July 2010, 03:34
[/LIST]
Reminds me of that movie, "The Trotsky".
The Trotsky is awesome precisely because it is based on this all-too-true stereotype. I was actually thinking of former user Bobkindles but it could apply to perhaps half the trotskyists in England

ContrarianLemming
23rd July 2010, 05:06
our violence is virtuous.

you will be purified

http://www.warseer.com/images/articles/40kadvanced/2.6%2040k%20Advanced%20Net%20Version_html_5f691113 .jpg

Os Cangaceiros
23rd July 2010, 16:14
The Trotsky is awesome precisely because it is based on this all-too-true stereotype. I was actually thinking of former user Bobkindles but it could apply to perhaps half the trotskyists in England

Half of all English Trots are bespectacled university student SWP members?

Il Medico
23rd July 2010, 21:00
Half of all English Trots are bespectacled university student SWP members?
Duh.

Lyev
23rd July 2010, 21:09
Trotskyitis
Symptoms include-


Being a petit-bourgeois minded middleclass student
being easily won over by opportunistic posturing
probably giving up and becoming a liberal later in life because you never really understood the science of marxism-leninism
super eurocentrism. the only nonwhite people who can be considerd marxists are those who side with trotsky and do not have any original ideas.
criticising every successful revolutionary movement as stalinist
being generally annoying and not likable
avoiding the working class in real life, instead favouring the proletariat as an abstract theoretical concept.
spending all your effort on hating other trot groups who no one has even heard of

The only known cure is an icepick to the head.scarletghoul's disease
Symptoms include:


Being a fucking ****.

The only known cure is: fuck off.