Obama = Hitler = Lenin?

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/ap/20100713/capt.8d045165e62d4d59a7853546c3f458df-c67ec42d88a747429e363da081d8d39c-0.jpg?x=400&y=300&q=85&sig=bBgWFd_88H61iDPVYd6v9w--


DES MOINES, Iowa – A billboard created by an Iowa tea party group that compares President Barack Obama to Adolf Hitler and Vladimir Lenin is drawing sharp criticism — even from fellow tea party activists who have condemned it as offensive and a waste of money.

The North Iowa Tea Party began displaying the billboard in downtown Mason City last week. The sign shows large photographs of Obama, Nazi leader Hitler and communist leader Lenin beneath the labels "Democrat Socialism," "National Socialism," and "Marxist Socialism."

Beneath the photos is the phrase, "Radical leaders prey on the fearful & naive."

The co-founder of the roughly 200-person group said the billboard was intended to send an anti-socialist message. But Bob Johnson admitted Tuesday that the message may have gotten lost amid the images of fascist and communist leaders.

"The purpose of the billboard was to draw attention to the socialism. It seems to have been lost in the visuals," Johnson said. "The pictures overwhelmed the message. The message is socialism." He said he didn't know of any plans to remove the sign.

But others in the tea party movement criticized the sign.

"That's just a waste of money, time, resources and it's not going to further our cause," said Shelby Blakely, a leaders of the Tea Party Patriots, a national group. "It's not going to help our cause. It's going to make people think that the tea party is full of a bunch of right-wing fringe people, and that's not true."

Blakely also expressed outrage at linking Obama to Hitler, the leader of Nazi Germany who oversaw the killing of 6 million Jews and whose invasions of neighboring countries led to World War II.

"When you compare Obama to Hitler, that to me does a disservice to the Jews who both survived and died in the Holocaust and to the Germans who lived under Nazi regime rule," Blakely said.

John White, an Iowa coordinator of the Tea Party Patriots, said that he can understand the North Iowa group's perception that Obama is "Hitler-esque," but he thinks the billboard is offensive and unproductive. White said that he planned to discuss the matter with national tea party officials.

"I fear they may end up in some kind of trouble over it, because it's basically slanderous," White said. "I don't know that it's the message we want to send. I'd much rather see billboards that say 'Remember in November. Get Out and Vote.'"

The billboard is owned by Waitt Outdoor of Omaha, Neb. Waitt general manager, Kent Beatty, said the company didn't have a problem with the message.

"We believe in freedom of speech," Beatty said. "It doesn't reflect our views, necessarily."

The White House declined to comment on the sign.

One person who welcomed the billboard was Dean Genth, a Democratic activist from Mason City, a city of 30,000 people just south of the Minnesota border, who said he thinks the sign lays bare the views of tea party supporters.

"I welcome them to continue to spew that kind of stuff because I think it's going to do a lot of good for the good Democrats around the state," Genth said.

[Stephen Colbert]

Look at what happens when stupid people exercise free speech; you have this garbage and you have all the infowars.com shit that depicts Obama as the joker from Batman.

Sit your ass down and take civics 101 and turn off the right-wing machine, then make a billboard.

[Adi Shankara]

Obama isn't hitler or Lenin, but he's still crap. he is a traitor to the left and passed himself off as a revolutionary (not in the marxist sense, but you get what I mean) and capitalized on his "hip factor" to get people to vote for him...and it turns out his record is almost as conservative as George W Bush's:

Does Obama:

Support's NAFTA? CHECK

Supports more troops in Afghanistan? CHECK

Supports Capitalism and Free Markets? CHECK

opposes homosexual marriage? CHECK

Opposes amnesty for all illegal immigrants? CHECK

Talk out of his ass, and lie to the entire american public by not actually instituting any real change? CHECKMATE

[A Revolutionary Tool]

Radical leaders prey on the fearful & naive.
Ironic much?

[M-26-7]

Well, according to that article, the consensus across the mainstream political spectrum--from the Democratic activist Dean Genth to the local Tea Party activist Shelby Blakely--is that this kind of thing only discredits the Tea Party "movement" further. I have to concur.

In a few years, the Tea Party "movement" will have evaporated, and the sum total of its contribution to American political life will be to have replaced a few Republican incumbents with slightly crazier, slightly more right-leaning Republican candidates during primaries, thus leading perhaps to a few more Democratic wins in the general elections.

And that will be it.

[bcbm]

i think the most telling part of this is that anyone can call obama a "radical leader" with a straight face.

[Robocommie]

And then the Hitler picture and Lenin picture make a secret pact to divide the Obama picture between them, before fighting a horrible, bloody war, culminating in Lenin Picture's victory. URRAH!

[9]

Sit your ass down and take civics 101

Is Civics 101 a University course?


he is a traitor to the left and passed himself off as a revolutionary

Where are you getting this from? He has always, always been a liberal.

[A Revolutionary Tool]

Is Civics 101 a University course?



Where are you getting this from? He has always, always been a liberal.
I think he's saying he presented himself in a revolutionary way meaning he fooled people into thinking there was going to be some huge and fundamental transformation of society.

[Stephen Colbert]

Is Civics 101 a University course?.

At some colleges there's a Humanities course which is basically civics/politics/history.

But yea it bothers me listening to ignorance of people who obviously have no knowledge of civics etc

[9]

At some colleges there's a Humanities course which is basically civics/politics/history.

But yea it bothers me listening to ignorance of people who obviously have no knowledge of civics etc

Not everyone has the opportunity to go to University. I doubt it applies in this particular case, considering these people were in a position to blow heaps of money on a ridiculous billboard, but its something to keep in mind in general.

[Guerrilla22]

This just shows how delusional this people really are.

[Leonid Brozhnev]

Seems to me like the teabaggers are scraping the bottom of the fear campaign barrel...

[Delenda Carthago]

I remember this show I ve seen on YT,where this republican blond idiot host invited a more idiot "communist" and during his attack to him,got him to apologise for...Hitler!!!

I love US!

[Glenn Beck]

Seems to me like the teabaggers are scraping the bottom of the fear campaign barrel...

No, just playing into the conventional wisdom that communism is either identical to or worse than Nazism, or that both are variations of the same thing. This kind of bullshit has always been their first resort. What's new is that they managed to scrape together the cash and the desire to go and take out a billboard with this garbage.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

http://a.imageshack.us/img132/8725/obamabushsigncopy.jpg

So, when are we going to put this billboard up?

[Slavoj Zizzle]

To me, there are 2 ways to look at the tea party:

Option 1 is they are a neo-fascist movement which is being encouraged by the elite as an alternative to real leftist grassroots change. The financial crisis has created a new opportunity for leftism, and the elites fear that more than anything. If the left can get organized, remain principled, and actually provide the correct answers for the people who are angry at the government/banks and don't know why we could really accomplish something.

Option 2 is they are a true libertarian movement, and the proletariat of the United States are so propagandized and racist that a crappy libertarian childish lashing out at everything is the closest we're going to get to grassroots anything here. This basically conceded decades of anti-communist rhetoric has worked and the left has to start from scratch by re-branding and re-educating the working class to ever get to the point we want to be.

Obviously one of these is optimistic and one is pessimistic, but recently I've been more optimistic seeing the tea party spin out of control of the elites who created it into genuine anti-war and anti-corporate rhetoric, coupled with actual leftist criticism of Obama which has really surprised me. Keep your chins up :thumbup1:

[Glenn Beck]

To me, there are 2 ways to look at the tea party:

Option 1 is they are a neo-fascist movement which is being encouraged by the elite as an alternative to real leftist grassroots change. The financial crisis has created a new opportunity for leftism, and the elites fear that more than anything. If the left can get organized, remain principled, and actually provide the correct answers for the people who are angry at the government/banks and don't know why we could really accomplish something.

Option 2 is they are a true libertarian movement, and the proletariat of the United States are so propagandized and racist that a crappy libertarian childish lashing out at everything is the closest we're going to get to grassroots anything here. This basically conceded decades of anti-communist rhetoric has worked and the left has to start from scratch by re-branding and re-educating the working class to ever get to the point we want to be.

Obviously one of these is optimistic and one is pessimistic, but recently I've been more optimistic seeing the tea party spin out of control of the elites who created it into genuine anti-war and anti-corporate rhetoric, coupled with actual leftist criticism of Obama which has really surprised me. Keep your chins up :thumbup1:

I don't see how these two possibilities are mutually exclusive.

I can't say I share your optimism about the Tea Party kicking the populist rhetoric up a few notches, in light of the history of populist movements in the USA. Anti-war sentiment via isolationist ideology and anti-corporatism via a petit-bourgeois class consciousness are a well established American tradition that tends to go hand with some of the ugliest racism and anti-communism. If anything I see it as another instance of the right outmaneuvering what passes for a left in this country. The Teabaggers are claiming yet another political niche the liberals abandoned since the 2006 & 2008 elections.

[AK]

I've got a better idea. How about we get pictures of Hitler and other capitalist dictators and give them the label of 'Bourgeois "Democracy"'.

[Slavoj Zizzle]

I don't see how these two possibilities are mutually exclusive.

I can't say I share your optimism about the Tea Party kicking the populist rhetoric up a few notches, in light of the history of populist movements in the USA. Anti-war sentiment via isolationist ideology and anti-corporatism via a petit-bourgeois class consciousness are a well established American tradition that tends to go hand with some of the ugliest racism and anti-communism. If anything I see it as another instance of the right outmaneuvering what passes for a left in this country. The Teabaggers are claiming yet another political niche the liberals abandoned since the 2006 & 2008 elections.

To sum it up it's the difference between the tea party as an elite facade to distract from the real grassroots leftism developing or as the best we can do as any sort of egalitarian politics. I'm going to ironically quote Nixon here, basically is there a silent majority of leftists who are mad at the Obama, mad at the banks, and know the crazy racists are the not the answer or are the crazy racists the only ones who even care.

It's not so much that the right is outmaneuvering the left, it's that the democrats and republicans are so divorced from what the people of this country actually believe that the media analysis of left and right totally wrong. It's a good thing that the left is growing independent of larger political parties, anti-authoritarianism is always a good thing and the democrats are an organization way beyond saving.

Of course your right about the nature of American politics, but don't forget socialist movements at the turn of the century were often segregated (except the IWW or course :thumbup1:). Any revolutionary analysis of the United States has to understand that as sad as it is, racism is so intrinsic to what America is that it will always plague any movement. I'm not sure what to tell you, the United States is the most powerful country to ever exist, has had the most strong anti-communist propaganda campaign for a century, and is all sorts of messed up. Despite all of that, it is still salvageable, because the proletariat masses you meet in the poverty stricken south and the barren midwest, unlike the bourgeois clowns you see on TV representing the tea parties, are actually good people who are not beyond saving. If I was not an optimist I wouldn't be a communist, as everyone knows the status quo or fascism is a much easier cause.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

I think the Tea Party is most definitely a National-Syndicalist ("fascist") movement.

National-Syndicalism is nationalist and patriotic in the extreme. Thus the Tea Party denounces things alien to the "national culture," from immigrants from Latin America to Islam to Presidents born in Hawaii with a different shade of skin than the first 43.

Of course this includes even the German Nazism and Italian Fascism with which it shares so many features. Thus we end up with talking head Glenn Beck denouncing "the rise of fascism."

It's no coincidence that the Tea Party arose at the same time that capitalism entered its biggest crisis since the Great Depression. As Slavoj rightly pointed out, the working class is feeling the effects of the crisis and beginning to look for a way out of this mess.

So in the present the Tea Party serves as a sort of reserve of shock troops. If and when the ruling class decides it needs them, the Tea Party will be mobilized, promoted, strengthened.

Note well though, the answer to this all is not some sort of "Anti-Fascism" that binds the working class with a section of its own exploiters in the name of defending capitalist democracy. The only way out is through a working class revolution that rids the world of the capitalist system that gave rise to this whole mess.

[The Fighting_Crusnik]

There is no doubt what the tea party movement is. The good thing however, is that people are waking up and realizing that the tea party is nothing more than a herd of mindless sheep being lead by an oligarchical group of nationalistic xenophobes that are afraid/too stupid to realize that change is eminent and that a nation that refuses to change and adapt to the current world is going to fail. Let us just hope that enough people wake up by 2012 so that when elections come to an end, we don't see Fuhrer Queen Palin shipping us back to the age of the anarcho-capitalism found in the industrial age...

[Slavoj Zizzle]

Actually we're lucky in the U.S. Most neo-fascist movements are run by intelligent people like Jean Marie Le Pen, Umberto Bossi, Jorg Haider, etc. Sarah Palin is a moron and if she ever gained any sort of real influence like the leaders I mentioned the republican party/tea party would spiral into oblivion shortly after.

[The Fighting_Crusnik]

Actually we're lucky in the U.S. Most neo-fascist movements are run by intelligent people like Jean Marie Le Pen, Umberto Bossi, Jorg Haider, etc. Sarah Palin is a moron and if she ever gained any sort of real influence like the leaders I mentioned the republican party/tea party would spiral into oblivion shortly after.


She has a lot of power in the tea parties though... not so much in the republican party. However, I don't think she would need much effort to get it, and whether or not the GOP would crash with her as head is hard to say because of how long the tea parties have held up. But there are a lot of people who like her and if she ran for pres, she would have a crowd following her around... question would be then whether or not she would end up like Hillary Clinton did or if she would be more successful...

[ComradeOm]

I've got a better idea. How about we get pictures of Hitler and other capitalist dictators and give them the label of 'Bourgeois "Democracy"'.Because reductio ad Hitlerum isn't smart and it isn't cool. Capitalism has enough flaws without resorting to dead German dictators

[Dimentio]

Obama isn't hitler or Lenin, but he's still crap. he is a traitor to the left and passed himself off as a revolutionary (not in the marxist sense, but you get what I mean) and capitalized on his "hip factor" to get people to vote for him...and it turns out his record is almost as conservative as George W Bush's:

Does Obama:

Support's NAFTA? CHECK

Supports more troops in Afghanistan? CHECK

Supports Capitalism and Free Markets? CHECK

opposes homosexual marriage? CHECK

Opposes amnesty for all illegal immigrants? CHECK

Talk out of his ass, and lie to the entire american public by not actually instituting any real change? CHECKMATE

He isn't a traitor. He didn't have anything to betray in the first place.

[RadioRaheem84]

OK, since radicalism is opposed in the states, what the hell is wrong with Democratic Socialism then? So you cannot even inject a little socialism democratically, through elections? They do not give a shit about radicalism and the "violence", "oppression" that socialism "causes"! All they care about is socialism i.e. the equal redistribution of the wealth.

Notice how the libertarian lexicon is trying to enter the mainstream. The word socialism is being equated with Fascism. This is straight up Hayekian doubletalk straight out of The Road to Serfdom. Some bigger forces are definitely funding this new type of propaganda.

God, I hate the right wing in this country. How can they be allowed to spread their stupidity like that, hide behind the free speech clause, and then marginalize our voices in response!?

[Raúl Duke]

For a moment I was reminded about how the U.S. right-wing used to talk alot about how progressives-liberals-secularists have a cultural war against "American values" (considering the heterogeneity of the U.S., why do people talk about general "american values" with a straight face? No such thing ever exists) when in reality it's the right-wing that's waging a media-culture-political blitzkrieg today with no substantial effective rebuttal against them.

I see the right-wing attempting to mold the U.S. political climate (with substantial backing from the elite, if one looks at how much media coverage they get) into something more favorable for themselves. Maybe they'll succeed, maybe they'll fail.

[Dimentio]

For a moment I was reminded about how the U.S. right-wing used to talk alot about how progressives-liberals-secularists have a cultural war against "American values" (considering the heterogeneity of the U.S., why do people talk about general "american values" with a straight face? No such thing ever exists) when in reality it's the right-wing that's waging a media-culture-political blitzkrieg today with no substantial effective rebuttal against them.

I see the right-wing attempting to mold the U.S. political climate (with substantial backing from the elite, if one looks at how much media coverage they get) into something more favorable for themselves. Maybe they'll succeed, maybe they'll fail.

If they cannot incorporate Latin Americans into their vision, they will fail.

The USA will be majority Latin-American by 2050.

[RedSonRising]

http://9gag.com/photo/11434_540.jpg

[Slavoj Zizzle]

If they cannot incorporate Latin Americans into their vision, they will fail.

The USA will be majority Latin-American by 2050.

Basically this. The American right wing is dying, and the tea parties are the last gasp of the old white folks who are getting left behind. Either the facade of democracy we have will have to be eliminated soon or Hispanics, who have not been indoctrinated to be anti-communist for decades will take over the government. It's easy to get mad reading about the right wing, but who expects the bourgeois to go against their own self interest anyway. Stay positive, our generation is about a million times better than the reaganites and a thousand times better than the baby boomers :thumbup1:

[Die Rote Fahne]

Like Obama, I am a proponent of fascist-capitalist-communist liberalism. :laugh:

[Lolshevik]

Oh great. This is in *Iowa*? I live in Cedar Rapids, about an hour and a half away from Des Moines. And I'm trying to organize. -.-

[Burn A Flag]

That poster is one of the worst lies I have ever seen. Calling Obama a democratic socialist is like calling Stalin a tender and caring man.

[Slavoj Zizzle]

That poster is one of the worst lies I have ever seen. Calling Obama a democratic socialist is like calling Stalin a tender and caring man.

And this is why trots accomplish nothing and are universally rejected in the real world :rolleyes: Stop living in 1920 dude, communism has come a long way since then regardless of what you think about whether Stalin was a nice guy (who cares?).

[Weezer]

Look at what happens when stupid people exercise free speech; you have this garbage and you have all the infowars.com shit that depicts Obama as the joker from Batman.

Sit your ass down and take civics 101 and turn off the right-wing machine, then make a billboard.

This isn't free speech. This is libel, there is a difference.

[Adi Shankara]

http://a.imageshack.us/img132/8725/obamabushsigncopy.jpg

So, when are we going to put this billboard up?

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[RadioRaheem84]

For a moment I was reminded about how the U.S. right-wing used to talk alot about how progressives-liberals-secularists have a cultural war against "American values" (considering the heterogeneity of the U.S., why do people talk about general "american values" with a straight face? No such thing ever exists) when in reality it's the right-wing that's waging a media-culture-political blitzkrieg today with no substantial effective rebuttal against them.

I see the right-wing attempting to mold the U.S. political climate (with substantial backing from the elite, if one looks at how much media coverage they get) into something more favorable for themselves. Maybe they'll succeed, maybe they'll fail.


Exactly. There is no culture war. The left, usually fronted by the progressives are just defending people from a right wing assault.

[Weezer]

I remember this show I ve seen on YT,where this republican blond idiot host invited a more idiot "communist" and during his attack to him,got him to apologise for...Hitler!!!

I love US!

I think you mean Glenn Beck's intrerview of CPUSA President, Sam Webb.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OxG98hNSDQI

[Adi Shankara]

Exactly. There is no culture war. The left, usually fronted by the progressives are just defending people from a right wing assault.

I love it how no mainstream "intellectual" can define what "American values" are.
Everyone knows it's cognitive dissonance to say that they are christian, since many of the signers of the Declaration of Independence were atheist (including Thomas Paine) or didn't consider themselves christian in the traditional sense.

[Adi Shankara]

I think you mean Glenn Beck's intrerview of CPUSA President, Sam Webb.

OxG98hNSDQI

That's not a communist party at all! that could be a good video to troll CPUSA members though :lol:

[Burn A Flag]

Obama has Marxist tendencies??????? And it's a fact??????? I can look it up????


Horseshit.

[Stephen Colbert]

Oh well he's not a marxist.... He's a socialist.

What makes him a socialist?

The healthcare.

The healthcare in the U.S. is still privatized.

Oh, well he's not a socialist he's a progressive.

What makes him a progressive?

He stands for equal rights.

Obama does not at this time support marriage equality.

Oh, well he's not a progressive he's a ...



and so on...

[Delenda Carthago]

I think you mean Glenn Beck's intrerview of CPUSA President, Sam Webb.

OxG98hNSDQI
yeees!:D

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

http://a.imageshack.us/img132/8725/obamabushsigncopy.jpg

So, when are we going to put this billboard up?

If the 14 people who thanked this post chipped in $43 each, we could run this sign in Iowa for a month. :lol:

[RadioRaheem84]

If the 14 people who thanked this post chipped in $43 each, we could run this sign in Iowa for a month. :lol:


I wish, but heck, it would be seen as an attack from the "far left" making Obama a pure moderate hero, incapable of succumbing to the "extremes". Liberals love to paint themselves as the moral center.

[Jazzhands]

I wish, but heck, it would be seen as an attack from the "far left" making Obama a pure moderate hero, incapable of succumbing to the "extremes". Liberals love to paint themselves as the moral center.

You'd be surprised at how little Americans actually think about things. This oughta work.

[Lyev]

How widespread is the "evil Communist Obama" line in America? It seems rather prevelant on the internet, but how big are the Tea Party guys, and do they express opposition to Obama's purported "Communism"?
http://777denny.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/obama-communism.jpghttp://spktruth2power.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/obama-wants-you.jpg
And also:
http://obamaism.blogspot.com/
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils%20in%20Government/Communism/barack_obama.htm
http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/vernon/080526
http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig10/lazarowitz8.1.1.html
http://commieblaster.com/obama/index.html
http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/259785.php

These people are fucking crazy, their rationale as to why Obama is indisputably "Communist" is so jumbled-up and incoherent, not to mention horribly demagogic.

[RadioRaheem84]

We have religious fundamentalists in this country too:

Christians and the religion of anti-communism.

[Stephen Colbert]

How widespread is the "evil Communist Obama" line in America? It seems rather prevelant on the internet, but how big are the Tea Party guys, and do they express opposition to Obama's purported "Communism"?
http://777denny.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/obama-communism.jpghttp://spktruth2power.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/obama-wants-you.jpg
And also:
http://obamaism.blogspot.com/
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils%20in%20Government/Communism/barack_obama.htm
http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/vernon/080526
http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig10/lazarowitz8.1.1.html
http://commieblaster.com/obama/index.html
http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/259785.php

These people are fucking crazy, their rationale as to why Obama is indisputably "Communist" is so jumbled-up and incoherent, not to mention horribly demagogic.


Its pretty prevalent in right-wing talk shows like Savage, Miller, Beck and Limbaugh. It has a lot to do with the " unprecedented overreach of government". But then like I explained people can't really tell you how... it goes to Healthcare and the only thing that could be considered unconstitutional in it is the personal mandate from the fed...but guess what "conservatives" there's a thing called SCOTUS and it works too, it might find the legislation to be unconstitutional. :lol:

The Tea Party's are maybe 20,000 at rallies I think, but it's nothing too serious. It's predominately AARP covered old white people who dont know what to ***** about but they have that lovely freedom loving FOX news station that tells them what to think and what to do.

[Robocommie]

Did Nikita Khrushchev actually say that?

Anyway, in Victoria terms, the Tea Party is the result of POPs with high Militancy and low Consciousness.

[Stephen Colbert]

Peasants with Pitchforks-- is what I refer to the tea party as

But not the good type of peasants; the bourgeois peasants? :laugh:

[mykittyhasaboner]

How widespread is the "evil Communist Obama" line in America? It seems rather prevelant on the internet, but how big are the Tea Party guys, and do they express opposition to Obama's purported "Communism"?

It's really not that widespread. The most widespread opinions, in my experience, are much more moderate than the standard tea party line. The tea baggers don't number in the millions as fox news or whatever talking heads wants people to believe, but they do draw people. It depends on where you are. I've only seen a small share of tea baggers where I live, they always go to the same spot, and at times they've been violent and very crude and offensive. Haven't seen them in a while though.

I honestly haven't met or seen any rabid anti-communists among them, just latent nonsense. They certainly do exist, as the internet will readily show you, but I wouldn't bet on them being very prevalent.

In dc, the big rallies are held there, all the travel expenses probably paid for by some corporate sponsors.


These people are fucking crazy, their rationale as to why Obama is indisputably "Communist" is so jumbled-up and incoherent, not to mention horribly demagogic.

Some of them are crazy, some of them are just pissed off, some of them had nothing better to do than go to a little "tea party".


Did Nikita Khrushchev actually say that?

No, it's a misquote, or a fabrication.

[Robocommie]

No, it's a misquote, or a fabrication.

I like it, because it implies that Nikita Khrushchev forgot the true distinction between Socialism and Communism, and is in fact now helping Obama convert America to Communism FROM BEYOND THE GRAVE. :blink:

[mykittyhasaboner]

I like it, because it implies that Nikita Khrushchev forgot the true distinction between Socialism and Communism, and is in fact now helping Obama convert America to Communism FROM BEYOND THE GRAVE. :blink:

This is kind off topic, but Khrushchev was wrong about the distinction between socialism and communism for other reasons, (namely the economic questions surrounding the transition from socialism to communism) not because of whatever the quote is supposedly talking about.


Also, a quick search brought me to this:

http://urbanlegends.about.com/b/2008/11/13/bogus-khrushchev-quote-makes-the-rounds-again.htm

[Zanthorus]

I like it, because it implies that Nikita Khrushchev forgot the true distinction between Socialism and Communism

You mean Khruschev secretly became a real Marxist?

[Robocommie]

You mean Khruschev secretly became a real Marxist?

I don't want to get into a tendency war. But transition state, man.

[Zanthorus]

I don't want to get into a tendency war. But transition state, man.

Misses the point, which is that socialism and communism aren't "stages" of history but real movements which emerged from the womb of bourgeois society with a set programmatic tasks. The original distinction between "socialists" and "communists" made in the Manifesto was a distinction between two movements. Besides which the "transition state" was only concieved as a way to enforce the will of the working class against the other non-proletarian classes of society. Society emerged from the revolution without classes or a state. It was never meant to be a "stage" of history.

[Robocommie]

Misses the point, which is that socialism and communism aren't "stages" of history but real movements which emerged from the womb of bourgeois society with a set programmatic tasks. The original distinction between "socialists" and "communists" made in the Manifesto was a distinction between two movements. Besides which the "transition state" was only concieved as a way to enforce the will of the working class against the other non-proletarian classes of society. Society emerged from the revolution without classes or a state. It was never meant to be a "stage" of history.

I don't really see the point in talking about what was "meant" to be, because it's about what works, not what fits a pre-ordained scheme.

[Zanthorus]

I don't really see the point in talking about what was "meant" to be, because it's about what works, not what fits a pre-ordained scheme.

Well for one, it's irritating to have M-L's claim an un-broken line of descent from Marx and Engels and declare everyone else as "revisionist" when they're also "revisionists". If you think a beuracratic-military apparatus is compatible with "socialism" then fine but argue on your own terms rather than making appeals to your supposed Marxist orthodoxy.

I for one think that the opposite option is what really works... but if you really want to get into that we should probably start a new thread or argue via PM rather than taking this thread any further off-topic.

[Robocommie]

I for one think that the opposite option is what really works... but if you really want to get into that we should probably start a new thread or argue via PM rather than taking this thread any further off-topic.

Well, as I had said, I didn't want to start a tendency war, so I was going to stop you there anyhow.

[Adi Shankara]

If the 14 people who thanked this post chipped in $43 each, we could run this sign in Iowa for a month. :lol:

really? I'm being 100% serious, but if you're really meaning that, I'd contribute.

[RadioRaheem84]

yeah right, a billboard like that is never going to ever see the light of day in the States.

[howblackisyourflag]

If you're in Iowa put the billboard in the same place as where the tea party one was, with at the bottom, "www.revleft.com"

[The Red Next Door]

They are retarded people who don't know history.

[Delenda Carthago]

yeah right, a billboard like that is never going to ever see the light of day in the States.
land of the free,home of the brave!

[Delenda Carthago]

Khrushchev had this whole idea of CPs to work with social democratic parties,with the terrible effects they had.In Greece,when PASOK first came out,more left and radical than now but always socialdemocratic,its leader Andrew Papandreou had a basic slogan:I am the change. KKE had as a basic slogan "Change cannot be done without KKE"!:laugh:

So annyways,yeah,he might have said that.

[Red Commissar]

I like it, because it implies that Nikita Khrushchev forgot the true distinction between Socialism and Communism, and is in fact now helping Obama convert America to Communism FROM BEYOND THE GRAVE. :blink:

A conspiracy long in the making, and quite a considerable amount of foresight as well in planning the Soviet Union's final revenge on the United States. :laugh:


No, it's a misquote, or a fabrication.

It's not unfamiliar to these wackjobs. A lot of these get passed around in emails too (Some of you may know people or family who send these types of emails) and spread like wild fire. Another similar quote that gets tossed around a lot was a fabricated one by Norman Thomas.

"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened."

As I said before this quote is a fabrication but obviously that won't stop them.

And the original billboard, those quacks couldn't even make one for themselves. I saw a very similar image on the internet getting thrown around late last year.

http://pakalert.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/democratic-socialism.jpg

[RedSonRising]

yeah right, a billboard like that is never going to ever see the light of day in the States.

You know, I think it's exactly this kind of thing that NEEDS to happen if we are to start deconstructing the myths that surround modern politics in the minds of US citizens. Starting with de-polarizing the two ruling capitalist parties as the example talked about here, guerrilla marketing tactics exposing the contradictions within Bourgeois politics through sharp and humurous but substantive and critical informative messages -with a base for organization that interested onlookers can then reach out to or look up- is the only way the left is going to get any attention, in my opinion. Until we utilize the tools of propaganda in an ambitious effort of scale and creativity, we will either be outside of the media audience's mentality, or have our image continually warped by their rulers without a voice of our own to contest their version of reality.

Marketing ( <-- please excuse the irony) revolutionary ideas and coinciding them with other forms of activism on multiple fronts in different spheres of cultural life in the US and elsewhere is the key to long-term mobilization and initiating a dialogue with mainstream citizens. For all of the squabbles the left has between their tendency-oriented organization, not as much of it matters in the context of modern struggle as one might think. There are enough of us separated to combine valuable resources, but so many of us isolated that we're useless apart. Billboards,posters, cartoons on display, stencil graffiti, or any visual medium capable of delivering a message, are all possible avenues of propaganda open to organizations throughout the world with a little cooperation and thorough networking.

And all the while, a bunch of confused paranoid reactionaries are beating us to the punch with their cracked out bizzaro history lessons.

[AK]

http://pakalert.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/democratic-socialism.jpg
"In troubled times, the fearful and naive are always drawn to charismatic radicals."

Why isn't that right-wing populist douchebag Glenn Beck on there? Maybe this is something teabaggers should ask themselves.

[ComradeOm]

Why isn't that right-wing populist douchebag Glenn Beck on there? Maybe this is something teabaggers should ask themselves.Because Glenn Beck is conversing with intelligent and independent minded Americans. Whereas Obama and friends only appeal to the masses of sheep who make up the other 90% of the population. Clearly

[Adi Shankara]

http://pakalert.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/democratic-socialism.jpg

unrelated, but the Russian in me wants to correct the idiot who wrote the random cyrillic letters below Lenin's portrait, which read "SNDEE'EH" (of which there is no cyrillic letter that looks like a "G")

as if there wasn't any proof before that the poster creators lacked intelligence...

[progressive_lefty]

The Tea Party gives me the creeps, and that's coming from someone far off from Australia!

[chegitz guevara]

Billboards cost a shit load of money. Our atheist group down here ran one for two months, and that cost $4,000, and that was the cheapest one they could find.

The controversy made the national news, and it practically doubled the size of our group.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

It depends on the location, length, etc. You can run them in many parts of the U.S. for $600 a month.

[JacobVardy]

If the 14 people who thanked this post chipped in $43 each, we could run this sign in Iowa for a month. :lol:

I'm game. Would there be trouble with overseas donations?

[Nolan]

I suppose I would be willing to do it.

[The Idler]

really? I'm being 100% serious, but if you're really meaning that, I'd contribute.
Me too.

[Stephen Colbert]

fuck yea lets do it

[comrade_cyanide444]

We gotta stir up a shit storm and put up a a Marxist billboard bashing Obama in the middle of Tea Party territory (let's start at the delusionally schizophrenic wing of the psychiatric ward!).

But this is just absurd. The Tea Party doesn't seem to have the faintest idea of what Socialism/Communism means. Anyone who supports equality or the fact that Americans aren't really a race are "Communists". Welcome back to the 60's kids.

[Stephen Colbert]

The way SCOTUS is acting and the way general opinion is, we are heading for a MASSIVE red scare and perhaps some fascist elements in the 2012 election

[The Idler]

If the 14 people who thanked this post chipped in $43 each, we could run this sign in Iowa for a month. :lol:
Which billboard company do we need to pay and into what account can we collectively contribute to this fund? What poster/ad will we run?

[RadioRaheem84]

...some of the individualist language we used to advocate as a point in the early part of the twentieth century? The rightists seem to have a monopoly on the individual and claiming that theirs is the only philosophy where the individual can flourish (or a certain set of individuals, i.e. owners of capital).