No Violence?

[LebenIstKrieg]

I was wondering about the Militant Antifascist movement and why it seems to peter out when the fascists (for example BNP) become simply "national democrats" or "Contemporary" British nationalists. it seems when they stop street fighting (when we have them on the run!) and go towards the professional ballot box look, we seem to go "all right that's enough lads" but surely we'd gain the upper hand if we crush them as suit wearing fascist just as we would with the racist casual or skin. you know we wouldn't have any qualms with political terror and violence seeing as we are already deemed by liberal Society as "extremists". Why don't we hunt their main organisers such as Nick Griffin, his crony's and put them in hospital? If the political situation is really volatile why don't we just put them six feet under? They'd do the same if they had the chance, why doesn't this happen? is it because we have the mentality of the British which is a very sheep like and peaceful or is it dissaproved of by the left elite such as the Respect party, SWP or any-other middle class lefty group. I was just wondering what this forum thought of political violence.:confused:

[Ravachol]

I was wondering about the Militant Antifascist movement and why it seems to peter out when the fascists (for example BNP) become simply "national democrats" or "Contemporary" British nationalists. it seems when they stop street fighting (when we have them on the run!) and go towards the professional ballot box look, we seem to go "all right that's enough lads" but surely we'd gain the upper hand if we crush them as suit wearing fascist just as we would with the racist casual or skin. you know we wouldn't have any qualms with political terror and violence seeing as we are already deemed by liberal Society as "extremists". Why don't we hunt their main organisers such as Nick Griffin, his crony's and put them in hospital? If the political situation is really volatile why don't we just put them six feet under? They'd do the same if they had the chance, why doesn't this happen? is it because we have the mentality of the British which is a very sheep like and peaceful or is it dissaproved of by the left elite such as the Respect party, SWP or any-other middle class lefty group. I was just wondering what this forum thought of political violence.:confused:

Apart from the fact that you shouldn't most this kind of stuff openly on the internet, fascism isn't "run" by Nick Griffin, Jean-Marie Le Pen, Filip de Winter, Bennito Mussolini or Adolf Hitler. Fascism has roots in social structures and relationships and material conditions under Capitalism. Fighting fascism effectively requires more than (the often necessary) militant confrontation. It requires building class-based counter-power eradicating social divisions that run alongside religious, ethnic or 'racial' lines and organising along class lines. An effective class-based alternative operating on the workfloor and in the neighbourhoods is the best means to prevent the growth of fascism. Militant confrontation serves as a supplement to this by disrupting fascist organisational strength and morale.

[Palingenisis]

It requires building class-based counter-power eradicating social divisions that run alongside religious, ethnic or 'racial' lines and organising along class lines. An effective class-based alternative operating on the workfloor and in the neighbourhoods is the best means to prevent the growth of fascism. Militant confrontation serves as a supplement to this by disrupting fascist organisational strength and morale.

Also militant confrontation often makes the streets safe or at least safer for some of the most vunerable and exploited members of the working class.

[Ele'ill]

Until the violence reciprocates.

[iskrabronstein]

That is exactly the reason why the tactic of militant confrontation, both physical and ideological, is only successful when coupled with the development of a united class front to pull support and power away from growing fascist organizations.

Fighting individual fascists is not enough - one must strike at the root political conditions that permit the growth and ascension to power of such vile reactionary forces.

[durhamleft]

I was wondering about the Militant Antifascist movement and why it seems to peter out when the fascists (for example BNP) become simply "national democrats" or "Contemporary" British nationalists. it seems when they stop street fighting (when we have them on the run!) and go towards the professional ballot box look, we seem to go "all right that's enough lads" but surely we'd gain the upper hand if we crush them as suit wearing fascist just as we would with the racist casual or skin. you know we wouldn't have any qualms with political terror and violence seeing as we are already deemed by liberal Society as "extremists". Why don't we hunt their main organisers such as Nick Griffin, his crony's and put them in hospital? If the political situation is really volatile why don't we just put them six feet under? They'd do the same if they had the chance, why doesn't this happen? is it because we have the mentality of the British which is a very sheep like and peaceful or is it dissaproved of by the left elite such as the Respect party, SWP or any-other middle class lefty group. I was just wondering what this forum thought of political violence.:confused:

If the fascists argue with words, we should argue back with words. If they attack us, we should be stronger and more so we kick the shit out of them. If they bring guns, bring bigger and better guns and shoot the motherfuckers. But to bring fists to a ideological battle of the minds is only going to undermine our cause.

And don't post stuff like that on the internet as it'll get you arrested.

[tbasherizer]

From an objective point of view, killing Nick Griffin and the other leadership of the BNP would do it serious damage. As other comrades have pointed out, the BNP is only the result of the fascist trend that has emerged due to material conditions. The things that we should actually combat are the sociological roots of fascism. If we take away the base concepts upon which the ideology stands: disenfranchisement, fear of other cultures, "Good-Old-Dayism", etc, then fascism will starve to death on its own.

However, I have my own guilty share of good-old-dayism. I wish I could have been at the Battle of Cable street with a good old piece of metal in hand....

[LebenIstKrieg]

From an objective point of view, killing Nick Griffin and the other leadership of the BNP would do it serious damage. As other comrades have pointed out, the BNP is only the result of the fascist trend that has emerged due to material conditions. The things that we should actually combat are the sociological roots of fascism. If we take away the base concepts upon which the ideology stands: disenfranchisement, fear of other cultures, "Good-Old-Dayism", etc, then fascism will starve to death on its own.

However, I have my own guilty share of good-old-dayism. I wish I could have been at the Battle of Cable street with a good old piece of metal in hand....
From a Blackshirt perspective it meant nothing because they still went on with their march and their activity didn't deteriorate. It was mythologised by the left because at the same time the Spanish civil war was kicking off which was the start of a "European civil war" within Christian antiquity. I got this information off youtube on a video called "violent London" which is a video on the history of riots and rebellion throughout London and England. it sheds light on insurrection and revolutionary activity. I recommend it! :lol:

[No pasarán]

Cable St was a good show of force, they did outnumber the blackshirts that day and have a lot of local support. However it ended up being more of a fight against the police as they funnilly enough protected the fascists against the protestors.

The post (WW2) 43 group (a primarly jewish group, but with a number of english and irish working class lads mixed in too), 62 group, The Squads (a group mostly linked to the SWP) and AFA (who descended from The Squads and became much larger, more effective and attracted probably the most varied recruits from across the left) were all more effective.

"is it because we have the mentality of the British which is a very sheep like and peaceful or is it dissaproved of by the left elite such as the Respect party, SWP or any-other middle class lefty group"

Of course the SWP and all the similar parties completely condem political violence.. which is why I have nothing to do with them. But this site is not for discussion of any 'illegal' means. Its not worth getting done for incitement.