Private barbers in Cuba

[A.R.Amistad]

Just got some news from CNN (Capitalist Noob Network) that Cuba is now allowing a sort of NEP style relaxation on barbers and allowing individual barbers to make a profit from their haircut services. CNN used the story to try to highlight the advantages of the "free market." But some interesting things were brought up. Most Cubans they interviewed said that "they had learned to stop relying on the state years ago. Living off of the state salary can only give you what you absolutely need." People in Cuba seemed to be living a fairly normal lifestyle, in the sense they had colorful clothing, restaurants, culture, etc, etc. They weren't just living off of what they absolutely needed. What are your thoughts on the NEP style poilicies that are being implemented in Cuba now? I think, since socialism is not possible in one country, it is necessary and good to a strict degree for now, until revolutions start getting in progress around the world. But could this privatization of things like barbershops a sign of the rise of capitalism in Cuba, or is it just a necessary measure to sustain socialist revolution in Cuba?

[RedSonRising]

I'd say the latter, much like the housing and automobile reforms that have recently been implemented. If Cuba was going to fundamentally change their economic system, I think the gradual privatizations would begin somewhere else besides a small portion of the local service industry. I like your parallel to the NEP, which I consider this more in line with than a start towards reversing the revolution. As far as their living standards, I was told of a lot of black market activity by some Cubans. They help each other get by through doing each other favors and telling them of opportunities to make some extra valuable CUC (the more valuable currency on the island) so while they aren't living luxuriously and many people are surely struggling, the people have found ways to survive and from time to time enjoy living well.

[RadioRaheem84]

As far as their living standards, I was told of a lot of black market activity by some Cubans. They help each other get by through doing each other favors and telling them of opportunities to make some extra valuable CUC (the more valuable currency on the island) so while they aren't living luxuriously and many people are surely struggling, the people have found ways to survive and from time to time enjoy living well.



I really don't think that the existence of the black market to survive or enjoy life is an example of the revolution's success.

The special period and the tightening of the US embargo really put a damper on the revolution but considering that the country has the resources of a poor country like El Salvador, they've managed to give their citizens at least a modicum of dignity.

I just think that subsistence living isn't enough for most Cubans (I don't blame them) so they resort to the black market, selling stuff to tourists, or in some instances; prostitution. It's not even because they're dying of hunger or in terrible need of some tangible goods; they just want it. They just want something different, something more.

That is quite a different standard of living than most developing nations in the third world. They're struggling because they're just getting by, but they're not struggling because of the reasons other citizens in developing nations face.

[RedSonRising]

I really don't think that the existence of the black market to survive or enjoy life is an example of the revolution's success.

The special period and the tightening of the US embargo really put a damper on the revolution but considering that the country has the resources of a poor country like El Salvador, they've managed to give their citizens at least a modicum of dignity.

I just think that subsistence living isn't enough for most Cubans (I don't blame them) so they resort to the black market, selling stuff to tourists, or in some instances; prostitution. It's not even because they're dying of hunger or in terrible need of some tangible goods; they just want it. They just want something different, something more.

That is quite a different standard of living than most developing nations in the third world. They're struggling because they're just getting by, but they're not struggling because of the reasons other citizens in developing nations face.

Of course their standards are sub-par, and by black market I was referring more to the sale of commercial goods from the US and elsewhere and other informal practices, not prostitution and criminal activities. The networks I was talking about wasn't black market at all. For example a cook we met recommended a restaurant and brought us to a private taxi to take us there, and the driver slipped a CUC coin out the window and drove off. He brought him business, and was given something for it. Besides the illegal route to complimenting income, these are some of the ways citizens get by. And you're correct in asserting that it's not about need but more about the want to be able to enjoy more different things than what the State provides.

[A.R.Amistad]

what is the Cuban State's attitude toward the Black Market? Do they realise it is a necessity to the livelihood of the Cuban people and simply follow a line of benign neglect?

[RadioRaheem84]

And you're correct in asserting that it's not about need but more about the want to be able to enjoy more different things than what the State provides.

It's a testament to what central planning can do to give its citizens even a modicum of social security even with such scarse resources.

[A.R.Amistad]

so, things like "luxuries" in Cuba, like haircuts, cafes, music halls, etc. all things that everyone knows exist in Cuba, are these all black market? And what is the State's attitude toward them?

[manic expression]

A few things. I imagine this would follow roughly the same line as the treatment of restaurants: families can opt to run small restaurants out of their homes but cannot employ workers (and thus cannot profit from the exploitation of labor). It's not a privatization as much as it is recognizing the independence of individual barbers.

An important thing to establish is that it doesn't contradict the spirit or structure of socialism. It's what Marx talked about here, "Hard-won, self-acquired, self-earned property! Do you mean the property of petty artisan and of the small peasant, a form of property that preceded the bourgeois form? There is no need to abolish that; the development of industry has to a great extent already destroyed it, and is still destroying it daily."

The CNN report, on the black market at least, is likely highlighting what the capitalists want to highlight, so I wouldn't take much from it other than the fact that a black market exists and Cubans that use it, but that's hardly news to anyone. The black market just represents areas in which there is room for improvement, and the revolutionaries of Cuba are among the most capable in the world when it comes to things like this, so give them time and your full solidarity and issues will certainly be addressed.

Lastly, I wonder how many Cubans have their hair cut at home anyway. If I had a relative or friend who knew how to hook me up with a fresh cut I'd much rather do that than drop $20+ on a quality job. Finding this out is just another reason why I need to get to Cuba! :thumbup1:

[Obrero Rebelde]

Can you smoke pot in Cuba?

[manic expression]

so, things like "luxuries" in Cuba, like haircuts, cafes, music halls, etc. all things that everyone knows exist in Cuba, are these all black market? And what is the State's attitude toward them?
No, those are not on the black market. They are recognized by the government of Cuba. Some products used in those establishments might be from the black market, but I can't tell you the extent. Regardless, barber shops, restaurants and other establishments are sometimes run under a system where the workers who run the place (in the case of restaurants, it's limited to relatives IIRC) run it together and share the money they make (ie no employment of workers). Kind of like a collective, just limited to a certain number of members. That's my understanding of it, anyway. Perhaps someone who's been there can elaborate.

[RadioRaheem84]

The CNN report, on the black market at least, is likely highlighting what the capitalists want to highlight, so I wouldn't take much from it other than the fact that a black market exists and Cubans that use it, but that's hardly news to anyone. The black market just represents areas in which there is room for improvement, and the revolutionaries of Cuba are among the most capable in the world when it comes to things like this, so give them time and your full solidarity and issues will certainly be addressed.

Lastly, I wonder how many Cubans have their hair cut at home anyway. If I had a relative or friend who knew how to hook me up with a fresh cut I'd much rather do that than drop $20+ on a quality job. Finding this out is just another reason why I need to get to Cuba!


The existence of the black market is mostly due to the embargo and partly to do with the tourism industry and the privitazations on the island. US businesses are eating up third party companies the Cuban government used to do business with and this is seriously hurting imports and the production of goods on the island. This coupled with the expansion of tourism on the island has led to the introduction of an emerging black market to cater to those things lost or prohibited due to the embargo. I mean it's half out of want and half out of need that the Cubans seek for goods in the black market. Everything from steaks to shoes to electronics are on the black market. Sometimes it can even be stuff like toothbrushes that are cheaper on the black market! I mean the issues is very complex but it's easy to comprehend that the media is spinning this to make it look like it's all due to the command economy of the Cuban government and nothing to do with the embargo and the privatization schemes on the island.

[Robocommie]

Comrades,
Some of you may have read recently of the death of Alejandro Robaina, who recently died in Cuba at the age of 91. For those of you not familiar with the story, he was a tobacco grower - all the news stories (capitalist and otherwise) are using the term legendary. Apparently he was well liked in Cuba, and known by the nickname, "Godfather" or "the Don" and his tobacco leaves were used in the Cuban state-owned cigar industry's finest Habanos.

Anyway, I was curious about this man's life because I wanted to see how his life reflected Cuban society and the revolution, and I did some digging, and found this blog article. I think it'd be interesting to quote it here, because it shows an internal perspective on the Cuban economy, from someone who's lived through the whole thing.



Don Alejandro Robaina, master of cigars

By ALLAN KOAY
Looking at Don Alejandro Robaina, an 86-year-old unassuming, small-framed man, you would not reckon that he is the “Godfather of Cuban cigars.” But the fact remains that he is the man who is widely recognised as the producer of the finest cigar wrappers in the world.

Robaina and his grandson, Hirochi (who was born in Japan), were recently in Kuala Lumpur to attend a charity cigar auction organised by Havana Club, in aid of the Yayasan Raja Muda Selangor, under the patronage of the Sultan of Selangor. It was Robaina’s first visit to Asia, although he has travelled to many other countries before.

He has been photographed and interviewed many times, and has the prestige of being the first person to have a cigar (Vegas Robaina) named after him. Yet he remains a humble farmer, as he likes to describe himself.

Asked if it is true that he and his family live modestly on their farm in the province of Pinar Del Rio, Robaina replied: “My house is a farmer’s house. It’s very widely visited by everyone. We are a big family, and we get together in the evenings. Economically, we live very normal lives, and we are close-knit. I am happy and contented with what I have, and I don’t wish for any other kind of life.”

Robaina’s father, Maruto Robaina, was also hailed as the finest tobacco grower in Cuba. After his father’s death in 1950, Robaina took over the plantations and continued the production of wrappers used for the manufacture of Habanos cigars. Five generations of his ancestors grew tobacco on that land, and their tobacco dynasty is one of the oldest in Cuba.

After the revolution, Fidel Castro met with the tobacco farmers and suggested that the best way to improve the quality of the tobacco was to form cooperatives, because he believed quality was easier to ensure in a group rather than individually. But in a meeting with Castro in 1960, Robaina voiced his disagreement and his wish to be personally responsible for his own crop. In the end, he joined the cooperative as an independent member and ran his own business. But Robaina said the picture the world has of what happened is inaccurate.

“The world is wrong about this,” he said. “Those who wanted to become independent were allowed to do so. They were not forced in any way. I was not the only one who worked independently, because a lot of other farmers chose to do the same.”

Indeed, Castro was the one who labelled Robaina the best tobacco grower in Cuba, and reportedly presented him with a Russian Lada. Asked if he still meets with Castro these days, he replied: “Yes, more or less.”

And what do they talk about? “We talk about tobacco. What else do we talk about?” he smiled.

Today, the farm employs about 80 workers, but the number varies according to the season and weather. The number naturally increases during harvest time.

“There are weeks and months when I employ about 130 to 140 workers,” Robaina explained. “It all depends. I supervise about 80 of them myself. In Cuba, for certain kinds of jobs, the state allows us to have extra workers, around 40 to 50. For example, some workers are needed to get the plant, tie it up and allow it to grow. This is a very demanding job.”

Robaina once said that not only is the climate and land important for crops to grow well, the “soul” of a farmer is equally essential. To be a good tobacco producer, one must love the land, he said, and also care for one’s family.

Other important skills include knowing how to predict the weather. In a magazine interview last year, Robaina cheekily said he knew how to predict the weather by listening to the weather forecast on the radio. But as it turned out, he was serious about it.

“We practically don’t need to know how to predict nowadays because we now have the weather forecast,” he said. “These days, when something happens, it’s not a surprise anymore because it has been known beforehand. Tobacco is easier to cultivate nowadays, because there are scientists working to produce new seeds that are equal or better in quality than those I produce. Back in the old days, you have to look at the moon, and commit to memory what happened in the past so that you can compare it to current weather.

“Even the weather has changed nowadays. In the old days, February was deemed to be a bad month for the crops, but now, February is considered a good month.”

Today, Robaina has passed the tricks of the trade on to his grandson Hirochi and son Carlos. The two help him to supervise the plantations, although Robaina himself still goes out to the fields to check for illnesses and problems in the crops. And as head of the family, Robaina still has the final say on everything.

The farm also receives tourists and other visitors regularly. The number ranges from 20 to 100 visitors a day. Tourists often bring cigar boxes for him to autograph, while others bring him cigars from other parts of the world. And the only way to tell whether a cigar is good or bad? Well, by smoking it, said Robaina.

“It is the only natural way to know,” he added. “Every cigar has its own aroma and strength. And I prefer those with strength in their flavour.”

Robaina, who admitted he started smoking cigars at the age of 10, used to smoke a whopping 15 cigars a day. But due to his age, he has had to reduce the number.

But he proclaimed: “If it was not for that, I would have continued with 15.”

And his advice to beginners?

“Start by smoking a Robaina,” he said wryly.

http://friendsofcuba.blogspot.com/2005/05/don-alejandro-robaina.html

[RadioRaheem84]

I think I saw a picture of an addidas store in Havana one time and it made me curious as to how an Addidas store would work on the island? Does the state have to become the major shareholder of the operation in Cuba? How do they keep workers in the store from being exploited?

What are the labor laws like Cuba? How many hours a week do they work and how are unions set up in Cuba?

[A.R.Amistad]

A few things. I imagine this would follow roughly the same line as the treatment of restaurants: families can opt to run small restaurants out of their homes but cannot employ workers (and thus cannot profit from the exploitation of labor). It's not a privatization as much as it is recognizing the independence of individual barbers.

An important thing to establish is that it doesn't contradict the spirit or structure of socialism. It's what Marx talked about here, "Hard-won, self-acquired, self-earned property! Do you mean the property of petty artisan and of the small peasant, a form of property that preceded the bourgeois form? There is no need to abolish that; the development of industry has to a great extent already destroyed it, and is still destroying it daily."

The CNN report, on the black market at least, is likely highlighting what the capitalists want to highlight, so I wouldn't take much from it other than the fact that a black market exists and Cubans that use it, but that's hardly news to anyone. The black market just represents areas in which there is room for improvement, and the revolutionaries of Cuba are among the most capable in the world when it comes to things like this, so give them time and your full solidarity and issues will certainly be addressed.

Lastly, I wonder how many Cubans have their hair cut at home anyway. If I had a relative or friend who knew how to hook me up with a fresh cut I'd much rather do that than drop $20+ on a quality job. Finding this out is just another reason why I need to get to Cuba!

This might go to my "communist restaurants" but I'll mention it anyway. I always had a theory about restaurants, cafes, movie theaters, concert halls, etc. under socialism. worker could petition to start up a Metal themed clothing store. The worker would have to get the support of X amount of workers in the community who would agree to support the creation of such a store. As soon as they got enough worker's to sign the petition, the community would furnish them with the materials necessary (building, access to garments, printing works, etc.) to run the place. Every so many years they would have to petition again to remain in existence. It smacks of entrepreneurship, but nobody profits, nobodies deprived of the full value of their labor, and their is no private property.

[Robocommie]

This might go to my "communist restaurants" but I'll mention it anyway. I always had a theory about restaurants, cafes, movie theaters, concert halls, etc. under socialism. worker could petition to start up a Metal themed clothing store. The worker would have to get the support of X amount of workers in the community who would agree to support the creation of such a store. As soon as they got enough worker's to sign the petition, the community would furnish them with the materials necessary (building, access to garments, printing works, etc.) to run the place. Every so many years they would have to petition again to remain in existence. It smacks of entrepreneurship, but nobody profits, nobodies deprived of the full value of their labor, and their is no private property.

That sounds more like a society that has developed communism, rather than socialism. Socialist economies are not radically different from market economies in a very general sense, they just operate under communal ownership, whether that's public or direct worker ownership. For example, there might be a state bank which offers developmental loans, and if you wanted to you could get together some like minded workers, and you'd apply for a loan to start a co-operative to build your store, which you would do by paying other businesses which are themselves cooperatives.

Also, I don't think entrepreneurism is the enemy per se, after all, we want people to embark on new things and set up new production to meet new demands - the question is whether or not the labor used in that entrepreneurial venture is exploitative or whether it's democratic.

[Raúl Duke]

Can you smoke pot in Cuba?

Are you being a troll? This thread has nothing to do with that.

But to oblige you,
It's illegal (http://www.webehigh.com/city/detail.php?CITYID=2495)

[A.R.Amistad]

That sounds more like a society that has developed communism, rather than socialism. Socialist economies are not radically different from market economies in a very general sense, they just operate under communal ownership, whether that's public or direct worker ownership. For example, there might be a state bank which offers developmental loans, and if you wanted to you could get together some like minded workers, and you'd apply for a loan to start a co-operative to build your store, which you would do by paying other businesses which are themselves cooperatives.

Also, I don't think entrepreneurism is the enemy per se, after all, we want people to embark on new things and set up new production to meet new demands - the question is whether or not the labor used in that entrepreneurial venture is exploitative or whether it's democratic.

You are right comrade, I am describing a communist society. I should have used that word, my mistake. I understand that, under socialism, the first stage of communism, their will be some limited small business. I was just putting out an idea of what "entrepreneurship" would look like in a pure communist society.

[mykittyhasaboner]

Can you smoke pot in Cuba?

Such an issue is not very important when people's basic needs are threatened by economic sabotage. Can you smoke pot in the US? No, but that shit is everywhere.



Are you being a troll? This thread has nothing to do with that.

But to oblige you,
It's illegal (http://www.webehigh.com/city/detail.php?CITYID=2495)

We be high is anything but accurate unfortunately. It's certainly illegal as far as I know though. The basis for criminalization is also enforced by drug traffickers coming from the south headed north.