Was Marx NOT an atheist?

[heiss93]

This is what the Encyclopedia of Marxism (http://www.marxists.org/glossary/index.htm) argues:

"Marx saw Atheism as associated with crude communism and sought to transcend Atheism by revolutionising the social conditions which create the need for people to believe in God, rather than atheistic polemics against belief in God.
Marxism is neither atheistic nor agnostic nor pantheist, but practical-critical. It does not counter the theist by dogmatically asserting that God does not exist, but rather, asks why it is necessary to believe in God and how it is possible to live without God.
Just as Pantheism continues to take on ever new forms, with Nature or Gaia taking the place of God, likewise, Atheism continues in new forms. Friedrich Nietzsche, famous for having declared that “God is dead,” (The Gay Science §125, 1882), wrote in 1888:
The notion of “God” has been invented as an antithesis of “Life” – in God is subsumed, in a terrible unity, all that is unhealthy, venemous, calumnious, all hate for Life. The notion of “the above,” or “the true world” has only been invented to depreciate the only world there is – in order to retain for our earthly reality no purpose, no reason, no work to be done! [Ecco Homo §8]"


This argument is expanded here:
Why Marx was not an Atheist

http://home.mira.net/~andy/works/atheism.htm (http://home.mira.net/%7Eandy/works/atheism.htm)

[mikelepore]

Andy Blunden is playing an unnecessary game with words when he says Marx "was not an atheist" because he "went much further than denying the existence of God." Someone who is not a theist is an atheist. Of course Marx was an atheist.

[chimx]

His criticism was that atheism was irrelevant.

[danyboy27]

was Marx an atheist?

who cares anyway?

[Belisarius]

indeed who cares whether marx was an atheist or not. it is not essential to his thought. what is essential is that he saw people following religion slavishly without thinking for themselves. in this way the clergy could manipulate and suppress the people. this means the use of religions was wrong, not religion itself. otherwise such schools of thought, like christian communism, would be quite foolish (which they aren't)

[Demogorgon]

He was an atheist, I think that is clear, but it is also important to emphasise that to Marx the most important matter was that there is no God present in class struggle and that emancipation must be achieved by people and cannot be expected as a gift from God. To Marx a God existing outside of that would be irrelevant. Hence it may be useful to refer to him as an apatheist.

[chimx]

To Marx a God existing outside of that would be irrelevant.

For Marxists, atheism is as idealistic as theism

[vyborg]

Marx was atheist and explained scientifically why and how religions start, grow and develop.

[mikelepore]

It's not "irrelevant" at all. Marx was the writer who said philosophers have only interepreted the world in various ways; the point however is to change it. Many people believe that the major driving forces behind the direction of human history are God's will and people praying to petition God to perform miracles. Their attitude is going to be an obstacle for the objective of changing the world. People who don't believe in the necessity of taking effective actions will refuse to organize with us.

***

"I used to be all messed up on drugs. Now I'm all messed up on the Lord." -- "Big Bambu" comedy recording by Cheech and Chong

[Philzer]

Hi chimx!


For Marxists, atheism is as idealistic as theism

I know this argument, but I´m afraid that I never have understand this.

Could you please explain a little more, or give a link, for the type/kind of idealistic in the atheism?

Theism is a step of counsciuosness and alo a strategy. Over the self-created dispensation, I can transfer my demandings from the "Es" (Sigmund Freud). for example the endless expansion of my own genes in fights against the other peoples/religions, in my "Über-Ich"("over-me").

The result is, my demandings are satisfied and confirmated by a "higher sanity" and no human individual is in able to argue against this.(example: settler buildings expansion in palestina)

Religion is the will to be right without sanity.

Please note: I also include the pantheism of bourgeoisie, the most spread religion in present, in my concept and analysis of religion.

http://www.revleft.com/vb/communism-and-religion-t73036/index7.html

Sorry for my freestyle-english.

Kind regards