Learning through thinking and discussing

[Mumbles]

Okay, so I had an idea, but I'm not entirely sure how to implement it.

It basically goes like this: for newer communists who haven't gotten deep theory down pat, members here would post literature that is "somewhat communist or anarchist or whatever" but in reality isn't for some reason or another, and it would be up to the new members to try and figure out why or why not the literature is good or not based on wording etc., and the older members would help point out ways and words and phrases that have been used to manipulate people by sounding good but in reality are filth.

Please let me know if this makes sense to any of ya'll. I'm just kinda throwing this out there to see what kind of response this gets and if it would be useful or not. I was just thinking that by working in theory with newer people by throwing around literature it would help newer people, such as myself, who don't know good places to start when there is so much out there and don't really know what to look for as to what is helpful and what isn't.

Also I'm hoping this won't spark up some sectarian stuff, so please try not to start arguments that'll confuse the heck out of us inexperienced people.

Thanks,
Mumbles

[¿Que?]

Okay, so I had an idea, but I'm not entirely sure how to implement it.

It basically goes like this: for newer communists who haven't gotten deep theory down pat, members here would post literature that is "somewhat communist or anarchist or whatever" but in reality isn't for some reason or another, and it would be up to the new members to try and figure out why or why not the literature is good or not based on wording etc., and the older members would help point out ways and words and phrases that have been used to manipulate people by sounding good but in reality are filth.



I think overall this is a good idea, but here's the problem I see. First of all, what you are asking for is articles that are intentionally deceptive, one ideology disguised as another. I'm not sure, but I think this type of writing might be difficult to locate.

Furthermore, there is somewhat of a subjective element to this. Who gets to decide what the good articles are and what the bad ones are. There usually are no clear distinct boundaries which separate different theories, rather, most have been developed or elaborated from other similar theories.

But I think most important, I would ask what you hope to achieve by this. You should read different theories and make a decision on which ones are right or wrong based on your own convictions. Why would you want to limit yourself by placing ideological restrictions on your freedom to think?

[Mumbles]

Ah, good points. I guess I was more or less thinking in that there'd be more deceptively made pamphlets and whatnot by subversive groups or the government, etc. hoping to confuse those who were hoping to learn for themselves. But seeing as you said it's not that likely I can rest assured I won't have to face too much of it in my search for enlightenment.

Thanks :)

[¿Que?]

Well, actually, I said it might be difficult to locate, not necessarily that it was unlikely.

I'll relate some personal experience on this matter. For a while I was convinced libertarian communism was this type of thing. I believed libertarianism to be too individualistic to logically work as communism. Furthermore, I read some of their literature on career activists and it seemed to me they were discouraging people from getting involved in the struggle. To be sure I didn't then nor now really understand libertarian communism, mostly because I don't have the time or interest to really look into it closely, but the point is that at one point I thought it might be conservative philosophy disguised as communism.

More recently I ran across the nihilist communism manifesto and had some similar doubts. While I thought it was an interesting read, I didn't understand how it could possibly ever be a mass movement, and had suspicions as to the real intentions of the authors.

I think the point I was making is that things aren't always as cut and dry as we'd want them to be. But here's the thing...A lot of times, they are. So I sort of regret discouraging you, and hey, if you find deceptive leftist literature I urge you to bring it to everyone's attention.

One last thing, a lot of times people use the wrong words and phrases more out of ignorance than deception. For example, in one thread I made a reference to left-wing terrorism, where I should probably have said urban guerrilla warfare or something along those lines.

[Mumbles]

Oh, okay. Sorry about misreading what you meant by how extensive the limitation might be.

Yeah, at school there's a small "group" of libertarians who definitely seemed more interested in theory than action, which is why i stopped considering myself one even if not all are like that. I just didn't want those I knew to group me with what their stereotype of that was... which seems kind of ironic now that I openly declare myself a communist there, and we're constantly being told by our history teachers the atrocities of communism without even mentioning that America might have even remotely done anything illegal or evil.

I guess a thing I didn't think to consider was groups of somewhat disillusioned people as the group of nihilists seem. I mean to them it must sound reasonable, but nihilism in general being mixed with politics just seems a bit... strange. But that may just be from what my ideas on nihilism are.

Don't worry about discouraging me :) I don't think there's any way to get me to stop studying more and more now that I've joined here and have a consistent onslaught of information handed to me, for the most part. haha Gotta love intra-left debates.