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Communist
2nd March 2010, 03:43
.
Ex-Rebel Sworn In (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/uruguaypolitics;_ylt=%20AvQbi5yv5qcxoFBiW1tYuLas0N UE;_ylu=%20X3oDMTNrbzh0dmdwBGFzc2V0A2FmcC8yMDEwMDM wMS91cnVndWF5cG9%20saXRpY3MEY2NvZGUDbW9zdHBvcHVsYX IEY3BvcwM1BHBvcwMyBHB0A2%20hvbWVfY29rZQRzZWMDeW5fa GVhZGxpbmVfbGlzdARzbGsDYmx1bnRsZ%20WZ0aXN0)
as Uruguay President (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/uruguaypolitics;_ylt=%20AvQbi5yv5qcxoFBiW1tYuLas0N UE;_ylu=%20X3oDMTNrbzh0dmdwBGFzc2V0A2FmcC8yMDEwMDM wMS91cnVndWF5cG9%20saXRpY3MEY2NvZGUDbW9zdHBvcHVsYX IEY3BvcwM1BHBvcwMyBHB0A2%20hvbWVfY29rZQRzZWMDeW5fa GVhZGxpbmVfbGlzdARzbGsDYmx1bnRsZ%20WZ0aXN0)

AFP March 1, 2010


Jose Mujica, who decades ago served time in prison for
taking up arms against Uruguay's "bourgeois state," was
sworn in Monday as his country's new president.

The former radical leftist guerrilla fighter is now a
mellower but still-feisty senior citizen who grows
flowers at his ranch and calls himself a pan-theist.

Colorful and charismatic in contrast to respected
outgoing fellow leftist president Tabare Vazquez,
Mujica is known for his willingness for dialogue.

A straight talker, Mujica has a reputation for being
able to win over even political foes and business
interests.

Before Monday's swearing-in ceremony, Mujica joked to
reporters that "today is a little bit of heaven, but
there will be plenty of purgatory tomorrow."

His inauguration was attended by top-level guests,
including US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and
Spain's Crown Prince Felipe.

"We genuinely want to achieve an end to poverty" and
"for people to have jobs," Mujica said after his
inauguration, adding: "None of that can be achieved in
this country just by making noise."

"We are calling for transformation, and genuine
progress," he said, after riding to Independence Plaza
with Vice President Danilo Astori in a Chinese-made car
outfitted by Uruguayan mechanics with an electric
motor.

The pair walked the last few blocks to the swearing in
together, delighting thousands who cheered "Let's go,
Pepe (nickname for Jose), Pepe's with the people."

Clinton promised closer bilateral ties.

"It's the second time (I am here) to see the peaceful
transfer of power and to have visited both the
president (Vazquez), the president-elect (Mujica) and
pledged strong partnership based on mutual respect and
mutual interest. We are going to continue to work close
together," Clinton said.

Also on hand to witness the ceremony were regional
counterparts Presidents Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva of
Brazil, Alvaro Uribe of Colombia, Hugo Chavez of
Venezuela, and Cristina Kirchner of Argentina.

Bolivia's President Evo Morales also`took part along
with his Ecuadoran counterpart Rafael Correa, Fernando
Lugo of Paraguay and Alvaro Colom of Guatemala.

Mujica has become the second former Latin American
rebel to be elected president recently, after
Nicaragua's Daniel Ortega, an ex-Sandinista.

He has said he models himself on popular Brazilian
president Lula, a left-leaning former labor activist
who is known for a centrist approach.

The new Uruguay president was co-founder of the radical
leftist Tupamaros movement back in the 1960s, and when
jailed took part in a huge prison break.

But the more mature Mujica is largely a product of his
years as a lawmaker which he says taught him to
"embrace serpents" if necessary to get a deal done.

The ex-rebel chose pragmatic former finance minister,
Danilo Astori, as his running mate and the pair pledged
to continue the economic policies of Vazquez.

Mujica's wife, Lucia Topolansky, also a former rebel
and now a senator, will be third in line to the
presidency due to her legislative post.

Mujica has said he will not move to the presidential
palace, instead choosing to stay at his small ranch in
Rincon del Cerro.

He also is putting most of his salary into a fund for
homeless Uruguayans.

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/afp/20100301/capt.photo_1267475449579-1-0.jpg?x=213&y=280&xc=1&yc=1&wc=311&hc=409&q=85&sig=ocnm.EHx_utYpgVs50XJRg-- (http://news.yahoo.com/nphotos/inauguration-ceremony-Jose-Mujica-Plaza-Independencia/photo//100301/photos_ts_wl_afp/540508014a85bbd2561b3570a933156b//s:/afp/uruguaypolitics;_ylt=AuAYGdQPtTT3wgwpLdKwoF6GOrgF; _ylu=X3oDMTE5aW1tc2k2BHBvcwMxBHNlYwN5bl9yX3RvcF9wa G90bwRzbGsDYmx1bnRsZWZ0aXN0)
New Uruguayan President Jose Mujica
red cat
2nd March 2010, 03:55
"Ex"-rebels who have embraced the bourgeois political system are particularly good at taking political and military actions against their former comrades. As another positive point for their capitalist masters, they can boast of their revolutionary past and preach to potential revolutionaries how the radical line is wrong and they realized it "out there in fighting in the fields", both at the same time.
dez
2nd March 2010, 05:43
The tupamaros were the most effective urban guerilla movement in latin america in my opinion, both in operations and in perception concerning public opinion.

Capable leadership, they obviously had, irregardless of what he is planning for his presidency at the moment.
Bright Banana Beard
2nd March 2010, 10:18
The tupamaros were the most effective urban guerilla movement in latin america in my opinion, both in operations and in perception concerning public opinion.

Capable leadership, they obviously had, irregardless of what he is planning for his presidency at the moment.

Do you have any information on how they operate? Either English or Spanish will be fine.
chegitz guevara
2nd March 2010, 16:18
Do you have any information on how they operate? Either English or Spanish will be fine.

They don't operate anymore. They were wiped out by the military dictatorship following the 1973 golpe.
dez
2nd March 2010, 16:28
Do you have any information on how they operate? Either English or Spanish will be fine.

http://www.stormpages.com/marting/tupamaros.htm
This gives a nice summary of their history.


They don't operate anymore. They were wiped out by the military dictatorship following the 1973 golpe.

Some defeats are political victories
dez
2nd March 2010, 16:52
http://www.lahaine.org/index.php?p=10307

kind of relevant
chegitz guevara
2nd March 2010, 22:45
Some defeats are political victories

And sometimes they are just defeats. AFAIK, the communist movement in Uruguay has yet to recover from the military dictatorship. It was pretty bad.
dez
2nd March 2010, 23:10
And sometimes they are just defeats. AFAIK, the communist movement in Uruguay has yet to recover from the military dictatorship. It was pretty bad.

Except you werent talking about the communist movement but one organization within it: the Tupamaros. They gained a moral high ground, came off as liberators and promoted their ideals at the scope they wanted, it was so much of a political defeat that they are now electing a president.
FreeFocus
2nd March 2010, 23:14
Reformism is a failed strategy, if you can even say he's pursuing that, considering such figures as Hillary Clinton being present for his inauguration.
red cat
2nd March 2010, 23:22
Reformism is a failed strategy, if you can even say he's pursuing that, considering such figures as Hillary Clinton being present for his inauguration.

Don't forget that anti-communist mass-murderer Uribe.
dez
3rd March 2010, 01:09
Reformism is a failed strategy, if you can even say he's pursuing that, considering such figures as Hillary Clinton being present for his inauguration.

He opted for reformism, but the tupamaros had the choice of remaining in the revolutionary path.
chegitz guevara
3rd March 2010, 16:27
Except you werent talking about the communist movement but one organization within it: the Tupamaros. They gained a moral high ground, came off as liberators and promoted their ideals at the scope they wanted, it was so much of a political defeat that they are now electing a president.

Yes, the Tupamarus are electing a president. :rolleyes:

You can have the moral high ground. I want socialism.
dez
3rd March 2010, 20:56
Yes, the Tupamarus are electing a president. :rolleyes:

You can have the moral high ground. I want socialism.


Good luck on convincing people socialism is the way without a moral high ground.
chegitz guevara
3rd March 2010, 20:58
People will be won over to socialism by their material conditions, not because it's a good idea.
dez
3rd March 2010, 21:41
People will be won over to socialism by their material conditions, not because it's a good idea.

So you rule out agitprop entirely?
chegitz guevara
3rd March 2010, 21:46
No, but it certainly won't be the decisive factor.
dez
4th March 2010, 04:08
No, but it certainly won't be the decisive factor.

I agree to disagree
:cool:

(it will be A decisive factor)
chegitz guevara
4th March 2010, 13:21
I do not agree to disagree. You will be assimilated.
punisa
4th March 2010, 18:48
People will be won over to socialism by their material conditions, not because it's a good idea.

That is opportunism, not socialism. Socialism must be found on the basis of it being a "good idea" (no matter how unscientific this sounds), everything else is yet another failed project.
chegitz guevara
4th March 2010, 19:51
Marxists are historical materialists not idealists.

Socialism only comes about through revolution, and people do not engage in revolution because it is a good idea, but only because they have no other choice.
punisa
4th March 2010, 20:55
Marxists are historical materialists not idealists.

Socialism only comes about through revolution, and people do not engage in revolution because it is a good idea, but only because they have no other choice.

Yes, that is true for the actual revolution. But somewhere along the way (in post revolutionary era) we must be able to convince people that the idea was a good one :thumbup1:
chegitz guevara
4th March 2010, 20:56
I'm less worried about that than I am making the revolution.
FreeFocus
4th March 2010, 23:22
Marxists are historical materialists not idealists.

Socialism only comes about through revolution, and people do not engage in revolution because it is a good idea, but only because they have no other choice.

A lot of people (not me) will criticize this approach though, because they don't think that the working class has to be on the brink in order to bring about revolution. My opinion is that very few will put their life on the line for revolution (except for idealists, and I don't use that word in a negative way) when they can put food on the table and have a roof over their head.
red cat
5th March 2010, 12:10
A lot of people (not me) will criticize this approach though, because they don't think that the working class has to be on the brink in order to bring about revolution. My opinion is that very few will put their life on the line for revolution (except for idealists, and I don't use that word in a negative way) when they can put food on the table and have a roof over their head.

The notions of well-being change with time. If you look at the epicenters of revolution at present, you will find that though the people are in a very poor condition, they are many times better than what they used to be a few decades ago.

Even in the western world, a worker probably has access to technology and healthcare that a sixteenth century capitalist couldn't even dream of. That doesn't make them less revolutionary.

In my opinion, the main immediate condition that triggers revolution is relative impoverishment over a short time.