One problem of revolutionary socialism in the UK

[Minotaur]

In the UK it is the general conception that there are three classes the working class, the middle class and the upper class. I was thinking about this concept when a fellow Marxist was talking about the middle class. By definition a proletariat is someone who sells there labour, while a bourgeoisie is someone who owns the means of production. Under Marxism there are only two main classes the proletariat and the bourgeoisie (I know Marx did separate them into e.g. the petite bourgeoisie but that is not too relevant), and also under historic materialism there is always an upper and lower class outside that of primitive communism. It is with this that I came to think that for revolutionary left groups to grow in the UK the idea of the middle class and worker class are separate entities must be dismantled by the left first, there are still only two classes not three. It is also my thought that this conception is just capitalist hegemony to separate the proletariat from unification and also makes socialism appear not vote able by most middle class and working class damaging class conciousness.
I’m happy to hear any criticisms :D

[syndicat]

The people who control working people day to day, and who stand in antagonistic power relations to workers, are often not owners, but people paid salaries, like middle managers, high-end professionals like corporate lawyers, the firm's top financial planners and HR experts, cops, judges, government administrators. This bureaucratic class only became a major class in the last hundred years, after the emergence of the big corporation and massive growth of the state in the 20th century. So it i s no wonder Marx didn't focus on it.

In any event class needs to be regarded as a power relation, power over the working class in social production, and then, based on that, throughout the society. To control the working class the top capitalists need a class of overseers and top experts working for them. This is the class in between the major capitalists and the working class.

According to data compiled by David Gordon, this bureaucratic class varies in size among the various industrial countries and is largest in the Anglo-Saxon capitalist countries (USA, UK, Canada).

[Minotaur]

hmmm i think that bureaucratic class is just false class concious proletariate controlled my capitalist hegemony, for i surely they are being exploited too by the capitalist system they are mere puppets

[Minotaur]

Does no one think this is a problem because its alienating a whole section of proletariat which means you can never have a popular revolution

[scarletghoul]

You're correct. A whole section of the working class has been bought off and put into the 'middle class', where they still work for capitalists but lead a relatively comfortable life. They are bought off with excess national wealth gained by imperialist exploitation, which is why the 'middle class' is so much bigger in the UK than in say Mozabique or whatever.

The best way to counter this concept of a 'middle class' being a seperate class is I guess to educate middle class workers in marxist economics, and show them that they are still being exploited and that they are working class.
But at the same time it is important to recognise that there is a differance between 'middle class' workers and 'lower class' workers. There is a big differance in quality of life which we should not ignore. Lower class workers are gonna be more willing to struggle for revolution so I think we should concentrate more effort on them than with the 'middle class' workers.

[Minotaur]

I agree but it is fundamental that we get rid of the concept of the working class and the middle class to actually achieve a socialist revolution for without them there can be no revolution. They are still proletariat in essence, there quality of life may be better but comparisons are not going to work too well the working class in this country is much better off than the working class in that of Mozabique for they too have been bought off with excess national wealth gained by imperialist exploitation. I'm not saying concentrate on middle class workers but to recognise them as proletariat all the same and for revolutionary socialism in gerneral to stop the segmentation of the proletariat, for it is hurting there own cause.