Racism in Cuba [Archive]

robbo203

26th January 2010, 08:29

Interesting article on the pervasiveness of racism in state capitalist Cuba published in the Jamaica Observer http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/columns/Race-and-Cuba.

Next week she will be writing about class in Cuba. Should be interesting
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Race and Class in Cuba
BY DR GAYLE MCGARRITY
Sunday, January 24, 2010

WHEN I first returned to the United States in 1982, after living for a year and a half in Cuba, I was eager to share with my ´comrades´ on the left the extent to which racism and class divisions were still a glaring reality in ´Revolutionary Cuba´.
I had visited Cuba for the first time in 1976, when I travelled there with a group of Jamaicans interested in the legal and penal system. As it turned out, we never got even a glimpse of the prison system, but it was a great opportunity to get a first-hand view of other aspects of Cuban society. One of the first things that made an impression on me was the way in which white and mulato Cubans stared at a couple in our group -- composed of a very beautiful part Chinese, part Indian and part African girl and a very handsome, very black gentleman.

MCGARRITY... part of the reason for the Eurocentric concept of culture which is so pervasive in Cuba is that the Cuban Revolution occurred in 1959
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http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/images/x.pngMCGARRITY... part of the reason for the Eurocentric concept of culture which is so pervasive in Cuba is that the Cuban Revolution occurred in 1959

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During this period in my life, I was influenced by the Black Power movement, Marxism-Leninism, Pan-Africanism and Rastafarianism. I was totally enamoured with the Cuban Revolution. I devoured books like Tania, about an East German girl who had been an integral part of the process, works by Che Guevara, and anything I could get my hands on about Cuba. I naively assumed that, since it called itself revolutionary, the government would have incorporated aspects of the international black consciousness movement into both its theory and praxis.
So, as I stayed longer in Cuba, I was very disappointed to find that attitudes towards race and ethnicity were similar to those in the English-speaking Caribbean in the 1950s. I soon realised that the reason the "inter-racial couple" from the Jamaican legal tourism group had been stared at so much, was that their relationship violated the norms of 'blanqueamiento´, which literally means whitening. It was expected that a girl with the characteristics which I described above would yearn to ´whiten´ herself, or more precisely her progeny, by finding a lighter-hued as opposed to a more negroid sexual partner.
White Cubans prided themselves on having eradicated racism. However, racism to them meant legalised segregation, lynching and other manifestations of the ideology of white supremacy in pre-Civil Rights United States. The fact that there was no longer legalised discrimination in public places was touted to mean that there was no longer racism.
Cuban Racism from a Double Perspective
Marxism-Leninism has often been criticised by those concerned with issues of racial inequality for only emphasising class differences and not examining the ways in which different economic systems have created and perpetuated differences based on phenotype. I soon realised that Cuba was not really a socialist state anyway; that is, one based on true Marxist-Leninist principles. But even if we are to accept that the government was really based on these principles, no serious attempt had been made to root out the true ideological bases of racial injustice.
As an anthropologist, I base my conclusions on techniques of participant observation, which simply means immersing oneself to the greatest degree possible into the society and learning about attitudes, behaviours and practices from the inside. As a woman of mixed racial descent, who is fluent in Spanish, I was in a unique position to capture the ideas and beliefs, ie, the ideology, of Cubans of all different racial classifications. According to popular perceptions, Cubans are usually divided into the following phenotypical groups:
* prieto, which means very black;
* negro, which means black;
* mulato, which means more or less half black, half white;
* moreno, which is a little lighter than mulato, with whiter features;
* jabao, which means with light skin but negroid features;
* indio, which means that one appears to be like an Amerindian, but is actually a light-skinned mulato or darker white;
* trigueno, which is almost the same as moreno or indio, but literally means wheat-coloured;
* blanco, which means white in appearance; and rubio, which is blond.
It is important to emphasise that these categories are not carved in stone. They often overlap, and different individuals will consider the same person to belong to a different category. Also, as the aim of the racial hierarchy in Cuba, and in most of the Hispanic Caribbean and Latin America, is for everyone to gradually whiten themselves or ´mejorar la raza´ -- literally improve the race -- persons will be ascribed a ´higher´ position in the racial hierarchy if the observer likes them or wants to ingratiate him or herself with the observed individual.
During my first trip to Cuba, I also observed that those of similar phenotype tended to date each other, almost without exception. That is, a mulato claro would be seen with a mulata clara, a rubio with a rubia, a prieto with a prieta, etc. I found this strange, expecting that, in a society moving towards colour blindness, one would not find people sticking to their own precise category in their choice of a partner. When someone of a darker complexion did go out with someone lighter, they were generally considered to have really 'improved' themselves (adelantar la raza- to improve the race).
I was also disappointed to see that there were absolutely no contemporary books on blacks in Cuba, or under the topic of Afro-Cuba, in bookstores. The exception was books by Fernando Ortiz, a pre-Revolutionary ethnologist and folklorist. Whites claimed that there were virtually no blacks in higher government positions because blacks had not really participated in the Revolution. I determined that I would find an opportunity to return to Cuba and to really assess the situation methodically.
As luck would have it, my home in Kingston, Jamaica, was right next to the Cuban embassy, so I went there often. When I informed them excitedly that I wanted to study blacks in Cuba, I was told that I should go to Oriente, the Eastern part of the country, as that was where all of the blacks were. I would come to learn that this was an expression of the white Cuban tendency to claim that all blacks were descendants of Jamaican and other West Indian immigrants to Oriente. When I would protest that the Spanish had lots of slaves and that all of the blacks could not possibly be descendants of West Indian immigrants, known derogatorily as pichones (literally blackbirds), I was told that all of the ones who had come as slaves had inter-married, as the Spanish were so much less racist than the British. White Cubans expressed sympathy for the Jamaicans who were under the British, who did not mix with them, supposedly, and so the black population there was not able to dilute itself and move up the racial hierarchy.
I returned to Cuba on several occasions between 1976 and 1981, to pursue a Master's degree in Public Health. I was part of a delegation of persons of American-Indian descent who visited the island in 1980. We met with Fidel´s personal physician who told us about an International Health Master's programme, which was open to foreigners. I applied and got accepted. Now I felt that I would really get a chance to see what it was like to live as a mulata in revolutionary Cuba, and I was correct.
While waiting for the course to begin, I lived with a white woman who was a militante (militant) in the Communist party and who lived in the elite Miramar area of Havana. She prided herself on being very liberal as she had mulato friends. However, she warned me not to go to see the Conjunto Foklorico Nacional, as 'esta gente tiene enfermedades' -- those people have illnesses. I realised that she assumed that I would be doing more with the members of the Conjunto than just participating in their cultural events, as she was clearly referring to sexually transmitted diseases. When I did go to the performances of the Conjunto, there was hardly anyone in the audience. As I stayed longer in Cuba, I realised that no one, except for a very small group of people, was the slightest bit interested in this vital expression of national culture, particularly Afro-Cuban culture.
When I actually began the course, I moved into the Instituto de Desarollo de la Salud -- the Institute of Health Development -- in Arroyo Naranjo, near to Parque Lenin, on the outskirts of Havana. The very first night that I was there, I was thrilled to hear drums in the distance. I asked my fellow Cuban students, who were, with the exception of two mulato students, all white, if I could go and hear this expression of Afro-Cuban culture. I was told that what I was hearing was part of Afro-Cuban religious ceremonies, to which only anti-sociales (those who were against the Revolution) accrued.
A Marxist view of Race and Culture
It did not take me long to realise that ´culture´ in Cuba meant European culture. This perception was not only a result of a history of European colonialisation and slavery, but was also a reflection of the tenets of Marxism-Leninism, as promoted under the Cuban so-called socialist system. The text by Constantinov, used in all educational institutions on the island, and called Fundamentos de Marxismo-Leninismo (Fundamentals of Marxism-Leninism), supported a Darwinist view of social evolution, under which societies progressed from primitive communism, through feudalism and capitalism, and on to socialism and communism. The problem with this approach, as far as perpetuating erroneous views of human history, is that it places all of African traditional societies at the lower rungs of evolution and the European societies near the top.
Fidel Castro himself when he speaks about ´cultura´ in his interminable speeches, uses the term as synonymous with education, as opposed to using it in the way that we use culture in English. Throughout the years, he has often referred to how the Revolution improved the lot of ´gente de baja cultura´ -- which can be taken to mean either people of a low educational level or people who are lacking in culture, which anthropologists will tell you do not exist, as all people have some kind of culture and it is ethnocentric to arrange these cultures, conceptually speaking, in a hierarchical fashion.
Part of the reason for the Eurocentric concept of culture which is so pervasive in Cuba is that the Cuban Revolution occurred in 1959, and has remained relatively isolated from world intellectual currents since then. Only information that the government wants to enter the island does so. So all of the changes in mentality and practices that occurred in the United States, Brazil and throughout the region, during the 1960s until the present, have only recently filtered into the island and into the cultural framework of inhabitants. Despite the indisputable limitations of the Black Power movement in the United States, and the more recent growth of a similar phenomenon in Brazil and in other parts of Latin America, the transformation of Eurocentric views of history, culture and aesthetics has been invaluable in successfully attacking manifestations of cultural imperialism. Black began to be seen as something beautiful and not something that needed to be diluted in order to be acceptable. Numerous studies revealed the richness of African culture and the important contributions of African history to world culture and social development. Yet in Cuba, when manifestations of this new consciousness timidly emerged, they were brutally repressed, despite current government claims that concepts of negritude -- a movement with roots in the Francophone world, which promoted black civilisation and culture -- were encouraged.
Young idealistic black militants from the United States, who fled racism in their homeland, looking for a more racially just society in Cuba, were treated in a hostile fashion by immigration and other government authorities on the island. These militants, many of whom were hijackers, were firmly immersed in ideas of socialism and world revolution, so it is not as if the government could, in all fairness, categorise them as counter-revolutionaries. However, when I lived in Cuba, and even today, anyone who does not agree with the regime´s policies is branded counter-revolutionary and a danger to national security. I met several of these black Americans while I was living in Cuba and was deeply disturbed by the way in which their spirits had been wounded and their idealism challenged by their treatment at the hands of the Cuban government.
See Part 2 next week.

Dr Gayle McGarrity is a professor at the University of South Florida.

FSL

26th January 2010, 09:36

Dr Gayle McGarrity is a professor at the University of South Florida.

You never cease to amaze me.

robbo203

26th January 2010, 10:03

You never cease to amaze me.

Really? And why is that, old chum? Oh yes, now I get it - anyone who dares to criticise the Cuban state capitalist regime is obviously a "stooge of American imperialism", a "lackey of the bourgeosie" and a "running dog of capitalism".

Pathetic. Really pathetic

FSL

26th January 2010, 10:24

Really? And why is that, old chum? Oh yes, now I get it - anyone who dares to criticise the Cuban state capitalist regime is obviously a "stooge of American imperialism", a "lackey of the bourgeosie" and a "running dog of capitalism".

Pathetic. Really pathetic

In your case all that and dumb as well. Just my opinion of course.

Edelweiss

26th January 2010, 10:39

In your case all that and dumb as well. Just my opinion of course.

So do you actually have anything to say about the article except denouncing it for the profession of the author? The article is revealing a serious flaw in Cuba's society, and it's doing that from a leftist perceptive in a scientific manner. It's presenting well researched facts hard facts in a quiet convincing way.

Is your world view really that narrow-mined and simple that you assume a government agent and enemy behind any American university professor? Oh, I guess for you everyone outside your ML-sect is a potential government agent and counter-revolutionary...really, people like you are such an embarrassment to this board and the Left in general. You just live in your little, closed Marxist-Leninist wonderland based on concepts which failed long time ago, and which aren't able to explain the current world order to the slightest, but when someone is challenging or criticizing your dogmas you react with plain ignorance because everyone outside your sect/tendency can't be considered as a reliable source. It must be convenient in your little world...

(awaiting reply: you Zionist scum are the true embarrassment. spare it...;))

26th January 2010, 10:54

Interesting article and I wonder why we don't hear a lot more of this on the left.

robbo203

26th January 2010, 10:56

26th January 2010, 11:08

I do wonder though why the article has only been released almost 30 years after her visit she talks about, or is it an older article?

FSL

26th January 2010, 11:33

So do you actually have anything to say about the article except denouncing it for the profession of the author? The article is revealing a serious flaw in Cuba's society, and it's doing that from a leftist perceptive in a scientific manner. It's presenting hard facts in a quiet convincing way.

Is your world view really that narrow-mined and simple that you assume a government agent and enemy behind any American university professor? Oh, I guess for you everyone outside your ML-sect is a potential government agent and counter-revolutionary...really, people like you are such an embarrassment to this board and the Left in general. You just live in your little Marxist-Leninist wonderland based on concepts which failed long time ago, and which aren't able to explain the current world order to the slightest, but when someone is challenging or criticizing your dogmas you react with plain ignorance because everyone outside your sect/tendency can't be considered as a reliable source. It must be convenient in your little world...

(awaiting reply: you Zionist scum are the true embarrassment. spare it...;))

Before I start, I'm just dying to say that the "ML sect" I'm in is in all likelihood bigger than all the Luxembourgists of the world combined. Mhm, yes, this did feel as good as I had hoped.
And of course any comparison with imposibillists, or whatever the hell Robbo is, can only be for comedic purpoces.

Now leftist perspective

Marxism-Leninism has often been criticised by those concerned with issues of racial inequality for only emphasising class differences and not examining the ways in which different economic systems have created and perpetuated differences based on phenotype

The text by Constantinov, used in all educational institutions on the island, and called Fundamentos de Marxismo-Leninismo (Fundamentals of Marxism-Leninism), supported a Darwinist view of social evolution, under which societies progressed from primitive communism, through feudalism and capitalism, and on to socialism and communism. The problem with this approach, as far as perpetuating erroneous views of human history, is that it places all of African traditional societies at the lower rungs of evolution and the European societies near the top.

Apparently for some people leftist perspective is bashing dialectical materialism -Marxism- and identity politics. Not for everyone, thank god.

Scientific Manner

I also observed that those of similar phenotype tended to date each other

It did not take me long to realise that ´culture´ in Cuba meant European culture.

I met several of these black Americans while I was living in Cuba and was deeply disturbed by the way in which their spirits had been wounded and their idealism challenged by their treatment at the hands of the Cuban government

This is not what science is. Saying I heard this from him, or he acted like that. Having such a small sample, you can't extrapolate any conclusions you might draw, unless you spesifically aim in deceiving. Any clue on what science is? Statistics, like this percentage of blacks were gaining this amount of national income or had this level of education then and this now. Things like that would actually be important and an indication of failing policies if unfavourable.

But let's see if she did despite the not so scientific approach manage to get anything right.

The very first night that I was there, I was thrilled to hear drums in the distance. I asked my fellow Cuban students, who were, with the exception of two mulato students, all white, if I could go and hear this expression of Afro-Cuban culture. I was told that what I was hearing was part of Afro-Cuban religious ceremonies, to which only anti-sociales (those who were against the Revolution) accrued.

It's quite funny that this is such a blatant lie and yet people believe it. I'm guessing white people who have no urge to learn anything about non-white people but still think they need to protect them. White man's burden new edition.

Now for anyone who's mildly familiar with Cuba and its culture, it's basic knowledge that religions like Santeria are very well established. Its priests even have the tradition of making a prognosis for every new year.

A 1953 survey indicated that 93 percent of the population identified themselves as Roman Catholic. According to more recent information from the U.S.-based Puebla Institute, approximately 40 to 45 percent of the population was believed to identify themselves, at least nominally, with the Roman Catholic Church. A significant number of citizens share or have participated in syncretistic Afro-Caribbean beliefs, such as Santeria. Some sources estimate that as much as 70 percent of the population practice Santeria or la regla lucumi, which have their roots in West African traditional religions.

http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2004/35533.htm

This is how African culture has been "fought".

However, she warned me not to go to see the Conjunto Foklorico Nacional, as 'esta gente tiene enfermedades' -- those people have illnesses. I realised that she assumed that I would be doing more with the members of the Conjunto than just participating in their cultural events, as she was clearly referring to sexually transmitted diseases. When I did go to the performances of the Conjunto, there was hardly anyone in the audience. As I stayed longer in Cuba, I realised that no one, except for a very small group of people, was the slightest bit interested in this vital expression of national culture, particularly Afro-Cuban culture.

No one was interested in the expression of Afro-cuban culture? Only a deaf man would miss out on the obvious african influence in cuban music styles, like son. Or someone who would aim in fooling people who have never heard the word son before.

I can't believe I actually spend time reading that garbage or answering to people that liked it. What's an embarassement for the left is that trash like this article finds an audience.

scarletghoul

26th January 2010, 11:34

It is always necessary to treat with scepticism anything written by a Cuban-American. The reason being that most of the prominent ones are bourgie-ass counterrevolutionaries.

Anyway there is some truth in the article, as racism is still a problem in Cuba. But its nothing like in America Spain and most latinamerican countries. More needs to be done, but really I don't see why you people are criticising Cuba for this shit when black people are getting killed every day in/by your own countries. When did America send troops to Africa to fight imperialism?

Here's comrade Assata Shakur talking about the race issue in Cuba, where she's been living in exile for decades to escape America's persecution of black liberationists -

What about race and racism in Cuba?
That’s a big question. The revolution has only been around 30-something years. It would be fantasy to believe that the Cubans could have completely gotten rid of racism in that short a time. Socialism is not a magic wand: wave it and everything changes.

Can you be more specific about the successes and failures along these lines?
I can’t think of any area of the country that is segregated. Another example, the third congress of the Cuban Communist Party was focused on making party leadership reflect the actual number of people of color and women in the country. Unfortunately by the time the Fourth Congress rolled around the whole focus had to be on the survival of the revolution. When the Soviet Union and the socialist camp collapsed Cuba lost something like 85 percent of its income. It’s a process but I honestly think that there’s room for a lot of changes throughout the culture. Some people still talk about "good hair" and "bad hair."
Some people think light skin is good, that if you marry a light person you’re advancing the race. There are a lot of contradictions in peoples’ consciousness. There still needs to be de-eurocentrizing of the schools, though Cuba is further along with that than most places in the world. In fairness, I think that race relations in Cuba are 20 times better than they are in the States and I believe the revolution is committed to eliminating racism completely.
I also feel that the special period has changed conditions in Cuba. It’s brought in lots of white tourists, many of whom are racists and expect to be waited on subserviently.
Another thing is the joint venture corporations which bring their racist ideas and racist corporate practices, for example not hiring enough blacks. All of that means the revolution has to be more vigilant than ever in identifying and dealing with racism.
A charge one hears, even on the left, is that institutional racism still exists in Cuba. Is that true? Does one find racist patterns in allocation of housing, work, or the functions of criminal justice?
No. I don’t think institutional racism, as such, exists in Cuba. But at the same time, people have their personal prejudices. Obviously these people, with these personal prejudices, must work somewhere, and must have some influence on the institutions they work in. But I think it’s superficial to say racism is institutionalized in Cuba.
I believe that there needs to be a constant campaign to educate people, sensitize people, and analyze racism. The fight against racism always has two levels; the level of politics and policy but also the level of individual consciousness. One of the things that influences ideas about race in Cuba is that the revolution happened in 1959, when the world had a very limited understanding of what racism was. During the 1960s, the world saw the black power movement, which I, for one, very much benefited from. You know "black is beautiful," exploring African art, literature, and culture. That process didn’t really happen in Cuba. Over the years, the revolution accomplished so much that most people thought that meant the end of racism. For example, I’d say that more than 90 percent of black people with college degrees were able to do so because of the revolution. They were in a different historical place. The emphasis, for very good reasons, was on black-white unity and the survival of the revolution. So it’s only now that people in the universities are looking into the politics of identity.
I think this is a better view of what's going on. Shakur, as a black person living in Cuba, clearly recognises the problem, but does not use it as a shitty way of rubbishing the whole Cuban revolution like some people here do.

26th January 2010, 11:48

Before I start, I'm just dying to say that the "ML sect" I'm in is in all likelihood bigger than all the Luxembourgists of the world combined. Mhm, yes, this did feel as good as I had hoped.
And of course any comparison with imposibillists, or whatever the hell Robbo is, can only be for comedic purpoces.
Sectarian point scoring is really going to carry your argument so much better.

But I'm curious and going to take the bait: How big is your sect? 100? 500? 1000? 5000? You're only underlining your irrelevance by throwing with number arguments like that, far from placing yourself on any higher level.

FSL

26th January 2010, 11:57

Sectarian point scoring is really going to carry your argument so much better.

But I'm curious and going to take the bait: How big is your sect? 100? 500? 1000? 5000? You're only underlining your irrelevance by throwing with number arguments like that, far from placing yourself on any higher level.

Why didn't you make the same comment to Edelweiss when he first attacked tendencies instead of opinions? I'll really need an answer on this. Really really.

The sect I'm in has several thousand members and about half a million supporters. Alas, small country but doing well all things considered. And I don't see why it would have any relevance for Edelweiss to attack the size of my sect. Especially, since I'm unaware of any massive Luxemourgists organization.
And well, because obviously all that would have little to do with the obvious lies and propaganda in the article.

Edelweiss

26th January 2010, 12:02

FSL, no matter if you acknowledge the scientific manner or the leftist perspective (which isn't equivalent to Marxist-Leninist perspective BTW :rolleyes:), the report given by the author seems to be an honest report from the viewpoint of a former supporter of the revolution who witnessed Cuban society from within. Her report should be noted and taken seriously. Her criticisms are very much worth of discussion, and to ignore it just because of the profession of the author, and to denounce the article as complete lies and propaganda, as if it's part of some worldwide anti-Cuban conspiracy, is beyond ignorance and narrow-minded stupidity. Your reply is just one more proof for that. But again, I guess it's fits your own little, closed ML-wonderland.

I don't know if you heard of it, but universities have been a source of revolutionary activity for decades in the west (especially in Greece BTW), also because of the not so small percentage of Marxist/leftist professors and teachers like Chomsky, Adorno and many less prominent ones. I guess many here who attended to university once can name at least one Marxist or former Marxist professor. So to denounce someone just because of her job in a US university can't hold any check in the real world.

Guerrilla22

26th January 2010, 12:04

What a piece of garbage article. Yes I'm sure racist attitudes are very prevalent in Cuba which is why they have brought nearly 500 Haitians on to their island and put them through medical school free of charge in the last 10 years. Not to mention taking in former members of the black panthers, fighting alongside black africans in the Congo, and Angola and played a key role in getting the South African apatheid regime to release Nelson Mandela.

It did not take me long to realise that ´culture´ in Cuba meant European culture. This perception was not only a result of a history of European colonialisation and slavery, but was also a reflection of the tenets of Marxism-Leninism, as promoted under the Cuban so-called socialist system.

:rolleyes:

I also love how she discovered this after being there for only a year and a half. If she had actually lived there for years this article might be credible.

The article is revealing a serious flaw in Cuba's society, and it's doing that from a leftist perceptive in a scientific manner. It's presenting well researched facts hard facts in a quiet convincing way.

She is making an assertion based on very little experience in the country and offers no evidence to back up her claims other than trying to claim that a "euro centric" culture exist in Cuba, which is an absurd claim to make about any Latin American country and claiming that Marxism-Leninism is inherently racist. Again without actually pointing to any specific elements of the ideology to back up the claim.

(Fundamentals of Marxism-Leninism), supported a Darwinist view of social evolution, under which societies progressed from primitive communism, through feudalism and capitalism, and on to socialism and communism. The problem with this approach, as far as perpetuating erroneous views of human history, is that it places all of African traditional societies at the lower rungs of evolution and the European societies near the top.

Except this isn't unique to Marxism-Leninism, all communists believe in natural progression through various stages in history. So if Marxist-Leninism is inherently racist, then all communists must be inherently racist for believing in historical materialism. When examined closer this article is easily picked apart.

Part of the reason for the Eurocentric concept of culture which is so pervasive in Cuba is that the Cuban Revolution occurred in 1959, and has remained relatively isolated from world intellectual currents since then

I love how she is essentielly calling the Cubans backwards here because they had not been properly exposed to western intellectualism. This statement not only is extremely elitist, but also racist as well.

26th January 2010, 12:10

Why didn't you make the same comment to Edelweiss when he first attacked tendencies instead of opinions? I'll really need an answer on this. Really really.
Ok, you tried to assert your authority by using the number argument (paraphrase: "my group is bigger than your group, thus I'm right and you're wrong"), Edelweiss didn't use such a logical fallacy.

The sect I'm in has several thousand members and about half a million supporters. Alas, small country but doing well all things considered.
You mean half a million voters perhaps? And if not, could you qualify "supporters"?

And I don't see why it would have any relevance for Edelweiss to attack the size of my sect. Especially, since I'm unaware of any massive Luxemourgists organization.
Here you go again on your logical fallacy.

And well, because obviously all that would have little to do with the obvious lies and propaganda in the article.
This is indeed somewhat off topic, but hey, you started using logical fallacies.

FSL

26th January 2010, 12:19

Ok, you tried to assert your authority by using the number argument (paraphrase: "my group is bigger than your group, thus I'm right and you're wrong"), Edelweiss didn't use such a logical fallacy.

"Oh, I guess for you everyone outside your ML-sect is a potential government agent and counter-revolutionary..."

His argument. Direct quote. Where he clearly mentions size. :)

Go on, two choises. a) make a fool out of yourself, b) Deny everything you've said in a grandiose backflip.

Edelweiss

26th January 2010, 12:22

His argument. Direct quote. Where he clearly mentions size.

I don't actually. I'm just describing your quasi-religions, sectarian world view.

Edelweiss

26th January 2010, 12:27

From the article:

Wow what a gem. I love hoe she is essentielly refering to the Cubans as being backwards because they had not been properly exposed to western intellectualism. this attitude is not only elitist, but racist as well.

strange, the guy quoted by your fellow ML comrade dies imply the same as the article:

The fight against racism always has two levels; the level of politics and policy but also the level of individual consciousness. One of the things that influences ideas about race in Cuba is that the revolution happened in 1959, when the world had a very limited understanding of what racism was. During the 1960s, the world saw the black power movement, which I, for one, very much benefited from. You know "black is beautiful," exploring African art, literature, and culture. That process didn’t really happen in Cuba. Over the years, the revolution accomplished so much that most people thought that meant the end of racism. For example, I’d say that more than 90 percent of black people with college degrees were able to do so because of the revolution. They were in a different historical place. The emphasis, for very good reasons, was on black-white unity and the survival of the revolution. So it’s only now that people in the universities are looking into the politics of identity.

both, the Jamaican Mulatto who wrote the article and the black nationalist quoted must be both black pro-western racists than. Interesting.

Guerrilla22

26th January 2010, 12:37

strange, the guy quoted by your fellow ML comrade dies imply the same as the article:

both, the Jamaican Mulatto who wrote the article and the black nationalist quoted must be both black pro-western racists than. Interesting.

The latter did not essentially call the Cubans backwards because they did not have adequate exposure to western intellectualism as the author of the article did. Your argument is a logical fallacy. Racism is not limited to white Americans or "white" latins as the author refers to some people in Cuba as.

26th January 2010, 12:42

"Oh, I guess for you everyone outside your ML-sect is a potential government agent and counter-revolutionary..."

His argument. Direct quote. Where he clearly mentions size. :)

Go on, two choises. a) make a fool out of yourself, b) Deny everything you've said in a grandiose backflip.
I don't understand "sect" to be synonymous to "small", but more along the lines of "one golden and holy truth of which no one should deviate or criticize". The Dutch SP for example has about 45 000 members, yet is very sectarian. It seems Edelweiss follows the same definition.

Edelweiss

26th January 2010, 12:45

The latter did not essentially call the Cubans backwards because they did not have adequate exposure to western intellectualism as the author of the article did.

actually the author did not explicitly speak of "western" intellectualism. She speaks about the influence of the black power movement and general black emancipation in the US. If this is some form of cultural imperialism or racism than i really can't help you, and it just shows how desperately you are trying to find anything to generally bash the article. Well, I guess an assumption of racism is always worth a try when you can't finy anything else...

Guerrilla22

26th January 2010, 12:55

actually the author did not explicitly speak of "western" intellectualism. She speaks about the influence of the black power movement and general black emancipation in the US. If this is some form of cultural imperialism or racism than i really can't help you,

Ok "world intellectualism" either way she is essentially calling the Cubans backwards because they ahd not properly been exposed to the intellectualism of the day.
A direct quote from the article: "Part of the reason for the Eurocentric concept of culture which is so pervasive in Cuba is that the Cuban Revolution occurred in 1959, and has remained relatively isolated from world intellectual currents since then " You did actually read the article before you started praising its merits didn't you?

Also I made several points in my first post which you conviently ignored.

it just shows how desperately you are trying to find anything to generally bash the article.

I don't even have to try. As I stated before anyone that actually takes the time to read that rubbish can easily pick it apart.

Well, I guess an assumption of racism is always worth a try when you can't finy anything else...[/

Highly ironic given the claim made by the author. :rolleyes:

RaÃºl Duke

26th January 2010, 14:00

Dr Gayle McGarrity is a professor at the University of South Florida.
You never cease to amaze me.

You do know that USF is located far (hours away, at the gulf-side) of Miami, has very little Cuban community left in comparison to Miami, and that this professor is not of Cuba descent...?

In PR we have this too (with the exception of jabao):

According to popular perceptions, Cubans are usually divided into the following phenotypical groups:
* prieto, which means very black;
* negro, which means black;
* mulato, which means more or less half black, half white;
* moreno, which is a little lighter than mulato, with whiter features;
* jabao, which means with light skin but negroid features;
* indio, which means that one appears to be like an Amerindian, but is actually a light-skinned mulato or darker white;
* trigueno, which is almost the same as moreno or indio, but literally means wheat-coloured;
* blanco, which means white in appearance; and rubio, which is blond.

The fact that a culture has many "racial distinction" groups doesn't exactly mean its racism per se...While in the U.S. there might be less groupings than in other cultures (like Brazil) I heard there're many groupings.
While I might not be surprised that "white" (their ideas could also apply to groups like moreno, trigueno, etc) cubans have some bit prejudiced idea in terms of institutional racism there's probably none in Cuba (I think it's about the same between Cuba and PR).

pranabjyoti

26th January 2010, 14:08

I Can Has Communism

26th January 2010, 14:16

why a huge mass of people of third world, who are the main victims of racism is spontaneously attracted to Marxism-LeninismThey're all evil stalinist state capitalists. That's why.

26th January 2010, 14:25

Hey comrades,
Instead of arguing on racism in Cuba, why don't you try to make a society "less" racist than the "racist" Cuban society.
I am also a bit surprised why a huge mass of people of third world, who are the main victims of racism is spontaneously attracted to Marxism-Leninism and the attraction is still growing day by day.

They're all evil stalinist state capitalists. That's why.
So, we can't discuss racism in Cuba because we're (supposedly) not active in the fight against racism? And what does ML gaining momentum in other countries have anything to do with it?

If you disagree with the points made in the OP and later on in another article (posted by scarletghoul), at the very least use some sane and actual arguments as opposed to various tactics to try and undermine the authority of the writers, so you can avoid the points made.

pranabjyoti

26th January 2010, 16:00

The problem here is that it's not a discussion but rather be called as some kind of witch hunting or flaw finding tendency. Whenever, we discuss "racism" in Cuba, the duty of making a less racist state will automatically fall on our shoulders and it's our duty too to show some way to overcome this kind of racist tendency. Otherwise, it will be nothing more than giving some tool of propaganda in the hand of imperialists.

RedSonRising

26th January 2010, 16:47

Racism is obviously a problem in Cuba due to the reactionary ideals which affected Latin American culture since it's creation, but to pretend the Cuban government has not done much to better the lives and promote progress and equality for their black population is naive. As was said before, what about the housing of Black Panthers, the defense of Angola and the Congo from western Imperialism, the granting of civil and workplace rights previously denied blacks before the revolution, and the constant verbal stressing of racial equality in the country?

Also, her narrative of experiences make me doubt her honesty. When I visited Cuba, "culture" was surely not being stressed as simply European, at least among the people. Compay Segundo, their most famous musician and composer, has strong mulato features, and many blacks today, as I witnessed, perform much of the Afro-Cuban music inspired by the rythms and cultural blend influenced by blacks. Many of the black Cubans, as a majority, had considerable things to complain about, and while discrimination is no doubt something they face, it's not something they highlight, as many recognize the progress made since before the revolution. This is fairly obvious and I can't recall as a Colombian myself visiting the country any social self-depreciation so far as a state-propagated desire for "whitening", as many Filipinos for example would say to describe what their country's population experiences in terms of natives having a sort of racial inferiority complex.

Racism should be discussed and improved, it's present and unfortunate in Cuba, and should be combated through the revolutionary ideals which led the popular revolution of the July 26th movement. We can't ignore the successes or the problems, and being constructively critical will benefit us more than it will benefit the capitalist newspapers of the bourgeoisie.

manic expression

26th January 2010, 17:28

Racism is obviously a problem in Cuba due to the reactionary ideals which affected Latin American culture since it's creation, but to pretend the Cuban government has not done much to better the lives and promote progress and equality for their black population is naive. As was said before, what about the housing of Black Panthers, the defense of Angola and the Congo from western Imperialism, the granting of civil and workplace rights previously denied blacks before the revolution, and the constant verbal stressing of racial equality in the country?
Well said, this deserves repeating (along with other great posts from other comrades).

I would also add this:

http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-09-28/music/not-only-built-4-cuban-bronx/

That's right, Fidel Castro is the first world leader to embrace hip-hop. In 1997, the question that came up at the Cuban Rap Colloquium was "Is rap revolutionary or counterrevolutionary?" Well, I think they've made up their minds.This past June, Cuba's Minister of Culture, Abel Prieto, officially recognized rap as a valid and important part of Cuban culture that must be supported by the people. In a ceremony on Cuban national television, he stated that "We have to support our Cuban rappers because this is the next generation of Cubans and they are saying powerful things with this art. I am responsible for giving this generation the freedom to claim their power culturally." And he delivered.

Emphasis mine. Anyone who thinks the revolutionary Cuban government isn't making great strides against racism is fooling themselves.

RaÃºl Duke

26th January 2010, 17:41

Cuba is as racist or less racist than Puerto Rico, which I consider to be noticeably less racist than the U.S./Europe (especially in terms of what can be considered institutional racism, I've never heard tales of police beating down badly people due to "being black, arab, etc" {although in PR the focus is more on class, the police focus on public housing projects and impoverished neighborhoods and tend to be harsh on people from these areas or look like they're from such areas} or such things), and not surprising since both of these islands are (or were) culturally similar (more so than the DR and PR).

I'm not sure how Cuba treats immigrants (I don't think many people are immigrating into Cuba anyway) but in PR the only harsh cultural thing that happens to our mostly Dominican immigrants is that they're the butt (i.e. the stupid character; although no one in PR would make a joke that implies that Dominicans are lazy since they're usually considered more hard-working than Puerto Ricans themselves) of some jokes and for U.S. white people moving in usually some derisive comments. You never hear about people like Arpaio or anti-immigrant parties like BNP and Lega Nord happening in PR.

punisa

26th January 2010, 17:47

Fidel Castro Addresses UN Racism Conference:
http://www.socialistaction.org/news/200109/fidel.html

el_chavista

26th January 2010, 19:06

The article is revealing a serious flaw in Cuba's society

It can be also said "The article is revealing a serious flaw in Latin American societies" for that matter, because its sociological conclusions are valid everywhere in the Latin-Caribbean area countries. Its an attempt to manipulate just idiosyncrasy (or "culture") to attack the Cuban Marxism.

robbo203

26th January 2010, 19:24

Having posted the OP this morning I come back to find the thread has taken on a life of its own and developed in all sorts of directions - some relevant others completely irrelevant. But - hey! - whats unusual about that on Revleft! My point was not to make some bold sweeping comparative statement of racism in Cuba vis-a-vis elsewhere. It would awesomely difficult to carry out a comparative study of that kind and citing one or two anti-racist declarations by the Cuban regime or indeed, contrariwise, indicting Cuba as racist on the grounds of one or two anecdotes is really not satisfactory at all. The reason I thought the article would be of interest was because it was written by someone who was of mixed race descent, had lived in Cuba for a while and said she had been influenced by "marxism-leninism" .

What really irritated me no end was the stupid suggestion that because the woman works in an American University we can safely dismiss what she said as unsound. This was the clear implication of the second post on this thread to which I reacted sharply. I see that other posts here have similarly adopted this ad hominen approach such as calling into question the woman's honesty. How the fuck anyone can come to this conclusion on the basis of a single article, beats me. Presumably such individuals are gifted with ominiscience and can penetrate the inner psyche of a stranger over extraordinarily great distances and with an alarmingly lazerlike vision.

Ive noted this tendency again and again on Revleft. Some claim about this or that is dismissed because the source of the claim is deemed ideologically suspect and tarnished (difficult in this case though). Look if you are going to make a criticism of what someone says make it on the grounds of what that person says not who that person is. OK? 'Nuff said

manic expression

26th January 2010, 20:04

What really irritated me no end was the stupid suggestion that because the woman works in an American University we can safely dismiss what she said as unsound. This was the clear implication of the second post on this thread to which I reacted sharply.

Wow, that's really funny. If you think her assertions are being treated with suspicion because she works at an American university, you're just lost.

The fact that you can't comprehend the significance of the Miami exile community means you're singularly unqualified to pass judgment on the Cuban Revolution. You obviously know nothing about the topic, and your above quote proves this beyond any doubt.

Hoggy_RS

26th January 2010, 20:09

Racism still exsists!!!!! Alert the press!

:rolleyes:

Robocommie

26th January 2010, 20:16

Frankly, any post-colonial society is going to suffer from fundamental problems of racial inequality. This is one of the basic things civilization struggles against. To say that there is still institutionalized racism in Cuba is like saying there is still poverty in Cuba, which is really just saying that Fidel Castro is not the Messiah and Socialism is not a magic potion that instantly undoes the consequences of centuries of exploitation and injustice. Any realistic Leftist who does not have a cultist's vision of what Socialism is will not be surprised by this.

Instead, it should remind us to not hold things as sacred cows, recognize gains where they have been made and recognize failures where they have occurred, and redouble our efforts to be both empathetic to the needs of everyone and to come up with workable solutions for them.

jake williams

26th January 2010, 20:25

Oh yes, now I get it - anyone who dares to criticise the Cuban state capitalist regime is obviously a "stooge of American imperialism", a "lackey of the bourgeosie" and a "running dog of capitalism".
It's not a law of nature - it's just usually true. When I first started hearing it vis-a-vis Cuba I thought it was just self-defensive dogmatic blather. But then I looked into it a little more and found out that in fact that's where the vast, vast majority of this sort (against the Cuban revolution government per se, as a whole, and not as a complex project with inevitable flaws that need to be dealt with in the course of expanding and strengthening it) come from. There is some legitimate left criticism of Cuba and it needs to be fostered, because frankly there isn't enough of it. It's typically sympathetic, for good reasons. But it gets drowned out by wild accusations by, I'm sorry, it's just generally the case that it's done by people who are against socialism. You also get people who are left critics of Cuba, say anarchists, but they're pretty marginal. Those not making original statements tend to cite right-wing nonsense.

I also find it pretty dirty that someone writing from Spain would see fit to criticize the racist structure it set up in one of its former colonies. If you wanna talk about state racism, I haven't seen a thread in awhile about Spanish immigration policies.

manic expression

26th January 2010, 20:41

I also find it pretty dirty that someone writing from Spain would see fit to criticize the racist structure it set up in one of its former colonies. If you wanna talk about state racism, I haven't seen a thread in awhile about Spanish immigration policies.
As soon as the Spanish workers make a successful socialist revolution, you can bet your life savings that robbo will be along shortly to badmouth everything remotely related to Spain.

FSL

26th January 2010, 21:00

As soon as the Spanish workers make a successful socialist revolution, you can bet your life savings that robbo will be along shortly to badmouth everything remotely related to Spain.

No way! It will be a state capitalist revolution!

Anyway, the annoying thing here isn't that someone -whoever that may be- wanted to pinpoint the shortcomings of the Cuban revolution. The article is trying through half truths and whole lies (like claiming religions of african origin or "black music" are under siege) to intentionally misrepresent Cuba and do so from a "progressive" standpoint. It didn't even cross my mind that Florida gathers cuban exiles nor do I consider it relevant -in this case. But yes to have a US university professor write an article in Jamaica Observer condemning racism in Cuba, that's just preposterous. I'd even say that blacks in Cuba have a higher life expectancy than blacks in either of these countries (there can be no comparison with Jamaica of course).
Racism has deep roots in centuries of slavery, how on earth could someone look at today's Cuba and actually make the suggestion the state is intentionally worsening things for its minorities? I'm sure many white militant communists of Cuba helped Angolans in their struggle. What someone claims they heard during one of their trips to the island has little relative weight.

robbo203

26th January 2010, 23:26

Wow, that's really funny. If you think her assertions are being treated with suspicion because she works at an American university, you're just lost.

The fact that you can't comprehend the significance of the Miami exile community means you're singularly unqualified to pass judgment on the Cuban Revolution. You obviously know nothing about the topic, and your above quote proves this beyond any doubt.

Time to go to bed now, kid. Dont forget to pack way your toys and brush your teeth. Oh and dont forget to say your prayers too. Bless your little cotton socks. Theres a good boy now.....

I also find it pretty dirty that someone writing from Spain would see fit to criticize the racist structure it set up in one of its former colonies. If you wanna talk about state racism, I haven't seen a thread in awhile about Spanish immigration policies.

Er..,first off I dont originate from Spain and the article that was posted was written by an academic based in America as far as I can tell. And secondly even if I did come from Spain, so friggin what? You some kind of nationalist junkie who thinks it really matters what your so called nationaility is and that this determines whether you are qualified or not to make a comment about some other part of the world. Sod off! I wouldnt dare be so arrogant as to suggest that someone who hails from Montréal, Québec is not entitled to say something about, say , Spanish, immigration policies. You on the other hand...

The Red Next Door

26th January 2010, 23:38

It doesn't matter if it is a communist nation or a capitalist nation, racism happen everywhere. to say it don't happen Cuba because it a socialist nation is stupid because it happen where? Everywhere, so stop living in republica de utopia de cuba.:rolleyes:

scarletghoul

27th January 2010, 00:29

strange, the guy quoted by your fellow ML comrade dies imply the same as the article:

both, the Jamaican Mulatto who wrote the article and the black nationalist quoted must be both black pro-western racists than. Interesting.
First, Assata Shakur is a female and I don't think she's a black nationalist.

Anyway they make similar points but from completely differant angles. Assata was speaking of Cuba missing out on the cultural impact of black power conciousness and stuff among the people due to the country's revolutionary seperation from America; whereas in this bourgeois journalist's view, Cuban society is backwards and was shut off from the intellectual enlightenment of the great and glorious American establishment (or "world interlectualism").

There's a huge differance between these 2 views. One gives primacy to a mass movement and material developments among the people, the other views "world intelectualism" as the root cause of social progress. This is, essentially, the differance between the proletarian and bourgeois views of history.

Another huge differance of course is the Shakur recognises that racism is 20 times worse in America, while the other person does not. By missing out this vital fact, the impression is created that Cuba is more racist than America. In other words the piece become de facto anti-cuban pro-american propaganda

So I think it is true that the OP's article is based around bourgeois-Amerikan prejudice and bigotry.

Here's what happened:
Cuba has a revolution.
One effect of this revolution is that it makes leaps and bounds in combatting racism.
At the same time, in its former imperial master the US, blacks are engaged in a huge mass movement being beaten back and killed on mass in an attempt to be recognised as human beings.
The US is also constantly attacking and instigating counterrevolution in Cuba.
Cuba naturally cuts itself off from a lot of American influence, in order to save its revolution.
Eventually, as the years and decades go by, America grudgingly recognises that blacks are people, at least on paper. And as the blacks' mass struggle continues, the establishment intelectuals begin to recognise this and absorb some further ideas like "hey maybe black culture counts as some kind of culture" and stuff.
Cuba meanwhile has developed seperately, and racism is sharply reduced, but it still exists in a few areas and in some peoples minds.
Some bourgeois idiot comes along and criticises Cuba for having its own revolution and not waiting around for 20 years to absorb the few progressive ideas from the white amerikan intelectuals. Completely ignoring the fact that Amerikan racism is still fucking huge
someone posts it on revleft.
some morons on revleft applaud this heroic journalist for outlining the failures of racist backward stalinist cuba

jake williams

27th January 2010, 08:58

Er..,first off I dont originate from Spain and the article that was posted was written by an academic based in America as far as I can tell. And secondly even if I did come from Spain, so friggin what? You some kind of nationalist junkie who thinks it really matters what your so called nationaility is and that this determines whether you are qualified or not to make a comment about some other part of the world. Sod off! I wouldnt dare be so arrogant as to suggest that someone who hails from Montréal, Québec is not entitled to say something about, say , Spanish, immigration policies. You on the other hand...
If Cuban racism were never discussed and Spanish racism regularly discussed - by the left - we'd be living in a pretty different world. If that were the case, it might be really important for folks to step up and say, hey, it's also still an issue even in Cuba.

My point isn't about nationalism per se. It's not that what country you originate from or live in determines what you're allowed to say, or whether or not the criticisms you make should be judged at all on those merits. A valid criticism about racism in Cuban society - and you could make many - are valid irrespective of where you come from.

But I'm expressing personal discomfort with the process by which colonial powers blame the colonies for institutions they set up in those colonies. Canada didn't act as a colonial power in that sort of way, it didn't go to say the Caribbean and set up racist hierarchies (anywhere near to the extent that Spain did, anyway - we might now want to talk about Haiti, but it would be a bit of a different story). Canada has a whole other set of horrendous atrocities it has committed, but so far as colonialism goes, mostly within its own borders. And I'm very, very harshly critical of those processes. And I don't go on rants about how, say, contemporary native culture in territorial Canada is not good enough for me because in many cases where I might think to do so, it's the fault of Canadian colonialism.

I think anyone living in Canada, Canadian or not, or really anyone living anywhere - who would make claims about how "Canadian native culture" has big problems, which they certainly do, all cultures do - when those problems are clearly the consequence of the process of colonialism - I don't think that's okay to do. And when very clearly we can see that the system of racial hierarchy that is extant in Cuban society, it's not good at all, but it's very clearly a legacy of Spanish colonialism, it's in NO way a product of the Cuban revolution.

ComradeRed22'91

27th January 2010, 10:06

robbo203

27th January 2010, 10:13

My point isn't about nationalism per se. It's not that what country you originate from or live in determines what you're allowed to say, or whether or not the criticisms you make should be judged at all on those merits. A valid criticism about racism in Cuban society - and you could make many - are valid irrespective of where you come from.

But I'm expressing personal discomfort with the process by which colonial powers blame the colonies for institutions they set up in those colonies. .

Sorry this is disingenous or you have changed tack. What you actually said (which is why I pulled you up so sharply) was this

I also find it pretty dirty that someone writing from Spain would see fit to criticize the racist structure it set up in one of its former colonies. If you wanna talk about state racism, I haven't seen a thread in awhile about Spanish immigration policies.

This makes me sound like I condone what Spain has done or that in some sense I must be held morally culpable for what has been done in the name of the Spainish state because I happen to live in some arbitrary geopolitical entity called "Spain". Bollocks to that and to all those who think in such crass nationalist terms.

Uppercut

27th January 2010, 13:43

Is the government actively encouraging discrimination? I'm aware Havana has a gay community, and seeing as how I've never been to Cuba (I would love to go) I don't have a strong opinion on this topic.

However, racism is still rampant in some parts of the world no matter how developed (or underdeveloped) they are. Of course racism is irrational and backwards, but some people still cling to those regressive beliefs. It's difficult to completely irradicate racist beliefs no matter how much it is discouraged.

RaÃºl Duke

27th January 2010, 14:58

Perhaps I have to get in depth

I think in some Caribbean nations like both Cuba and Puerto Rico racism was embedded mostly in classism than a "thing for itself" as it were/is in the U.S.

I remember this book written by a puerto rican Marxist about cultural formation (obviously he traced it to certain material conditions and, being a history type book, explain the history behind it). In one part, he defines that what we now consider "Puerto Rican culture" (in the strict sense) is basically folk culture "from below." This folk culture was formed between slaves/impoverished free blacks and poor white farmers/share-croppers which are usually referred to as 'jibaros'. The white share-croppers, who while substantial were the minority population of the poor, adopted many things from the black slaves/ex-slaves/etc such as food, plus other cultural customs that have undertones of indigenous origin. There was little to no animosity, at least not at the level as it were in the U.S./etc between poor rural whites and poor rural blacks.

Due to the proximity of poor whites and poor blacks (and their similar economic position), racism didn't became so ingrained in society. In fact, jibaros adopted poor black customs, partly for survival (i.e. certain food staples). The elites on the other hand, were obviously racist and looked disdainfully at the local culture and towards European/Spanish culture which at the time was racist. When the U.S. came and the elites perceived that they might not actually benefit from the U.S., they "adopted" the local culture as the "national" culture and tried to "whiten" it by focusing on the jibaro. This is the common mainstream perspective.

Cuba had a similar development, over there they had poor blacks, poor whites (who were called guajiros, which is practically almost the same as jibaros), and a very racist elite (perhaps more so than Puerto Rico at the time) that they even disliked mulatos and perhaps "morenos." (in PR morenos are basically seen exactly the same/equal to as white Puerto Ricans) They never accepted corrupt Batista into their social circles because of his skin, who I believe was mulato or moreno.

Than things changed, Cuba had its revolution (which made the old elite, who are mostly the racist component, move away) and Puerto Rico probably moved away from racism due to either the initial populism of the main parties (PPD, PNP) which (being elite parties) had to move away from elitist racism (which, due to lack of support/perpetuation from an elite class and obviously the end of the material conditions that created racism [slavery], lead to a decline of racism, to a degree, but due to current material conditions we still have classism when the populist era moved away or shifted towards the middle class) or the direction that the independence movement and independentista intellectual circles were taking (who have probably come to accept the idea presented by that Marxist writer, even though he wrote critically on Pedro Albizu Campos who's an idol in those circles, that Puerto Rican culture, in the strict sense, is perhaps mostly an afro-caribbean culture and other conclusions).

manic expression

27th January 2010, 16:12

Time to go to bed now, kid. Dont forget to pack way your toys and brush your teeth. Oh and dont forget to say your prayers too. Bless your little cotton socks. Theres a good boy now.....
Looks like you're still in denial. You were too ignorant to recognize that the suspicion didn't come from the author's employment at an American university, but at a specific university in a specific community with specific politics. This shows us that you simply didn't know the significance of the Cuban exile community in Florida, which shows us that you know absolutely nothing about the Cuban Revolution and its effects.

So basically, you're trying to side-step your own idiocy by posting witless insults. Well done, robbo, you've made my job easier yet again.

Er..,first off I dont originate from Spain and the article that was posted was written by an academic based in America as far as I can tell. And secondly even if I did come from Spain, so friggin what?
Why do you get so angry when someone indirectly points out that you slander socialist revolutions far more than you ever criticize capitalist states? Why does this bother you so much?

robbo203

27th January 2010, 17:29

Looks like you're still in denial. You were too ignorant to recognize that the suspicion didn't come from the author's employment at an American university, but at a specific university in a specific community with specific politics. This shows us that you simply didn't know the significance of the Cuban exile community in Florida, which shows us that you know absolutely nothing about the Cuban Revolution and its effects.?

Tut tut. Youre doing it again, I see. The writer of the article is summarily dismissed not because of what she says but because of who she is and where she comes from. This is what I was I was criticising in case you didnt know. Its called prejudging or P-R-E-J-U-D-I-C-E, in case you didnt know. I wont demean myself by bothering to respond to your puerile and shrill assertions about my knowlege or lack of it of the Cuban Revolution except to point that your grasp of logic leaves a rather lot to be desired. How does one thing "show us" the other, eh? On second thought, dont bother to respond. The thought of having to wade through and rebuff yet another shrill tirade from the likes of a buffoon like you is ...well, how can I put it? ..a little wearisome

Why do you get so angry when someone indirectly points out that you slander socialist revolutions far more than you ever criticize capitalist states? Why does this bother you so much?

Duh. Because it might just be that I dont actually see that what you ignorantly call a "socialist" revolution is in fact a socialist revolution. Havent you twigged that yet or do you need me to sapell it out for you?

manic expression

27th January 2010, 17:45

Tut tut. Youre doing it again, I see. The writer of the article is summarily dismissed not because of what she says but because of who she is and where she comes from.
You mistakenly thought this was because the author was based in the United States, showing us that you don't understand the Cuban Revolution and its effects. In other words, you still don't know what you're talking about. Thanks for proving my point yet again.

Duh. Because it might just be that I dont actually see that what you ignorantly call a "socialist" revolution is in fact a socialist revolution. Havent you twigged that yet or do you need me to sapell it out for you?No, it's more than obvious that you're having more than a little trouble seeing the facts of the Cuban Revolution. That would be evidenced by the fact that you don't know the significance of the exile community in Florida...a detail known to everyone who has an elementary understanding of the Cuban Revolution. You're not one of them.

robbo203

27th January 2010, 18:29

You mistakenly thought this was because the author was based in the United States, showing us that you don't understand the Cuban Revolution and its effects. In other words, you still don't know what you're talking about. Thanks for proving my point yet again..

Look, dumbo, go back to the original post in question which is addressed to FSL and then you might get a hang of what the issue was about. But, oh no , smart arse has to pipe up in his usual shrill insistent tone imagining that the original discussion revolved around him

No, it's more than obvious that you're having more than a little trouble seeing the facts of the Cuban Revolution. That would be evidenced by the fact that you don't know the significance of the exile community in Florida...a detail known to everyone who has an elementary understanding of the Cuban Revolution. You're not one of them ..

What is "obvious" about the facts of the Cuban revolution that I am not seeing? I dont see a moneyless wageless stateless society having been inaugurated in the aftermath of that revolution so I fail to see how I can be wrong in asserting that this was not a socialist revolution. What it delivered was essentially a system of capitalism run by the state - state capitalism.

And of course your flow of nonsequiturs gushes on, unabated. I "dont know the significance of the exile comnunity" (says you) therefore I dont have an "elementary understanding of the Cuban revolution" (again, says you). As if the one thing logically implies the other. Its seems that the only one who is lacking something "elementary" here is you and in your case it is called simple logic. But , hey, whats different, eh?

RaÃºl Duke

27th January 2010, 18:30

a specific university in a specific community with specific politics

As I said before, and I know from experience in living (still living) in the shit-hole called Florida...
USF is not in Miami and Tampa, where USF is at, does not have an influential Cuban community like Miami does.

manic expression

27th January 2010, 19:37

Look, dumbo, go back to the original post in question which is addressed to FSL and then you might get a hang of what the issue was about. But, oh no , smart arse has to pipe up in his usual shrill insistent tone imagining that the original discussion revolved around him
We're all still waiting for you to do that. You thought it was about being employed by an American university, when it was never about that, you were just too lost to figure out the context.

What is "obvious" about the facts of the Cuban revolution that I am not seeing? I dont see a moneyless wageless stateless society having been inaugurated in the aftermath of that revolution so I fail to see how I can be wrong in asserting that this was not a socialist revolution. What it delivered was essentially a system of capitalism run by the state - state capitalism.
So your contention is that Cuba is not communist? Is that your argument? By extension, is it your position that Cuba is racist because it is not stateless?

robbo203

27th January 2010, 20:53

We're all still waiting for you to do that. You thought it was about being employed by an American university, when it was never about that, you were just too lost to figure out the context

I dont know what the fuck you are jabbering on about now and I sincerely doubt if you do either. Does anyone else, I wonder? Could someone else put this poor benighted lost soul out of his all too evident misery - and ours.

So your contention is that Cuba is not communist? Is that your argument? By extension, is it your position that Cuba is racist because it is not stateless

Yes Cuba is not communist - obviously - and no I dont think Cuba is racist "because" it is not stateless. What on earth are you going on about? As it happens while I agree there is racism in Cuba I dont think it is quite comparable to quite a few other parts of the world i can think of including here in Spain where I live

leninpuncher

27th January 2010, 21:09

robbo203

27th January 2010, 21:17

Does anyone have any evidence that this woman is an American propagandist? She sounds an awful lot like a socialist, publishing in a Jamaican newspaper that probably doesn't have much of an American audience.

I wouldn't be surprised if her claims turned out to be true. The most racist places in the world are in the former USSR. There's a bigger per-capita percentage of fascists in Russia than anywhere else.

Good point. She does afterall say that Cuba is "not really a socialist state". Thats hardly something that an "American propagandist" is likely to say. I mean an "American progandist" would love for us all to believe ignoramuses like Manic Expression that Cuba is a good example of socialism so that they can use it to expose the the deficiencies of "socialism"!

Robocommie

27th January 2010, 22:07

Good point. She does afterall say that Cuba is "not really a socialist state". Thats hardly something that an "American propagandist" is likely to say. I mean an "American progandist" would love for us all to believe ignoramuses like Manic Expression that Cuba is a good example of socialism so that they can use it to expose the the deficiencies of "socialism"!

And for the sake of argument, she does seem to talk up the black consciousness movement of the 1970s, which is not the kind of thing Cappies like to celebrate.

FSL

27th January 2010, 23:18

Does anyone have any evidence that this woman is an American propagandist? She sounds an awful lot like a socialist, publishing in a Jamaican newspaper that probably doesn't have much of an American audience.

Yes. Her propaganda. Try and read some, it's at this thread's first post.

I wouldn't be surprised if her claims turned out to be true. The most racist places in the world are in the former USSR. There's a bigger per-capita percentage of fascists in Russia than anywhere else.

Sure. More racist than say Italy with Lega Nord, France with Lepen or US with the Tea Party.

leninpuncher

27th January 2010, 23:54

Yes. Her propaganda. Try and read some, it's at this thread's first post.

Sure. More racist than say Italy with Lega Nord, France with Lepen or US with the Tea Party.

So any dissenting opinion on Cuba can be categorized as propaganda? Your totalitarianism is showing.

And yes indeed. I've heard from a few sources that more than half of the world's neo-nazis reside in Russia.
http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/Story?id=3718255&page=1
Near the bottom of the page.

manic expression

28th January 2010, 16:18

I dont know what the fuck you are jabbering on about now
The fact that you don't understand the significance of the exile community, which means you know absolutely nothing about the Cuban Revolution, which means your words on this issue are worthless. That's what this entire thread has shown beyond any doubt: how clueless you are as to this issue.

Yes Cuba is not communist - obviously - and no I dont think Cuba is racist "because" it is not stateless.
Then why do you keep slandering Cuba (see previous posts) instead of other equally non-stateless societies? You didn't post articles about Spain's racism, did you? It's because you only focus on slandering socialist societies. The truth hurts.

manic expression

28th January 2010, 16:20

RedAnarchist

28th January 2010, 16:33

Yes, because publishing articles in a Jamaican newspaper automatically makes you a socialist. :rolleyes:

You won't get a reply from him, he was banned for being a sockpuppet.

scarletghoul

29th January 2010, 20:44

What !?!? But leninpuncher was the greatest username in RevLeft history :crying:

Soldier of life

30th January 2010, 03:52

This just in, what...Cuba isn't perfect!???

Infantiles 1 - 0 Marxist Leninists

I know what would be a good alternative to this hideous state capitalism, a world revolution, who's with me!!!

robbo203

16th February 2010, 17:37

Here's Part two of the OP article if anyone is interested:)
______________________________

Race and Class in Cuba - Part 2
BY Gayle McGarrity
Sunday, January 31, 2010

In the last decade, more and more tourists have gone to Cuba, not only to enjoy tropical beaches and cabarets, but to explore Afro-Cuban culture. This is laudable, as the cabarets were other places in which racism was blatant. It is amazing how Americans, both black and white, who are so critical of a phenomenon like blackface when it is found in the United States do not criticise it when they see it at Tropicana (the most prestigious Havana cabaret). When I expressed my dismay in 1981, I was told that it was not racist, but rather just an example of Cuban culture. This is just what white Southerners in the US said when they were criticised in the 1950s and 1960s for segregationist practices.
As the tourists are now quite interested in the black population and its cultural expressions, blacks have become quite in fashion. Police no longer harass people sporting dreadlocks as much, and foreigners are not steered away from aspects of black Cuban culture like rumba and Santeria, to the extent that they were when I lived there. Darker-skinned women are not harassed for consorting with foreigners to the same extent, but as with so much else in Cuba, the policy changes from day to day. One day, state security can be seen finding girls and boys for tourists' sexual pleasure, some of them very young; a few weeks later there will be a crackdown on jineterismo and offenders will be systematically rounded up.
When I was living there and the dollar was prohibited for all Cubans, some santeros -- traditional practitioners of African religion -- charged foreigners only in dollars. The practice led me to question whether or not the African deities were only concerned with the welfare of those who had divisas (foreign exchange). One of the great contradictions of the Cuban system is that all Cubans are by no means equal. Those who are in superior positions in the party and government have more privileges.

MCGARRITY... I do believe that feelings of inferiority are being erased to a small degree
http://assets.mediaspanonline.com/prod/4039912/Dr-Mcgarrity_w370.jpg
http://assets.mediaspanonline.com/prod/4039912/Dr-Mcgarrity_w370.jpg
http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/images/loading.gif
http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/images/x.pngMCGARRITY... I do believe that feelings of inferiority are being erased to a small degree

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http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/images/left.png (http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/columns/McGarrity-Part-2#) 1/1http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/images/right.png (http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/columns/McGarrity-Part-2#)

At the time when I was living and travelling to Cuba (during the 70s, 80s and 90s), only those Cubans who were high up in the party could enter the diplotiendas -- diplomatic stores -- and travel abroad. Now, there is a complicated system through which Cubans can travel if they are sponsored. This involves considerable expense and paying fees, but at least it gives ordinary Cubans a chance to see the outside world. As more and more Cubans take advantage of this, so do more and more black and brown Cubans. I have not yet had a chance to study the extent to which these new possibilities have altered the system by which mostly white Cubans sent remittances to their families back home, thus increasing their purchasing power and standard of living. I suspect, however, that the fact that more non-whites are travelling and sending money and coming back with increased financial resources may have somewhat increased their social status.
In fact, I have been motivated to write this article by the words of a black Cuban supporter of the Revolution, Esteban Morales . The latter, in a statement refuting what an influential group of 60 African-Americans were saying about the government's failure to protect the civil rights of blacks on the island, claimed that many blacks lived in inferior situations because they did not know how to transform their situation. "No saben como aprovecharse de las oportunidades que la Revolucion les ha dado" (They don't know how to take advantage of the opportunities provided by the Revolution). My position is that the blacks are perfectly able to take advantage of opportunities when they are presented to them. I know too many well-educated blacks, particularly those who studied languages and other careers connected to the tourist sector who have been unemployed for years. It is a well-known fact that the best jobs, in fact almost all of the jobs in the tourist sector, are reserved for whites. When I was visiting the island frequently in the 90s, the argument was that white Cubans had to limit the number of non-whites in the tourist sector because the Spaniards and other Europeans did not like to see them. I would argue quite the contrary, that it is white Cubans who do not want to see them.

A Race-Class structure under White Marxist Paternalism
While apologists for the Revolution claim that most black Cubans support the Revolution, during my years of contact with the society, I have not found that they do to a lesser or greater extent than other Cubans. As in all systems, those who stand to gain from the system support it. Those who continue to live in dilapidated homes, who suffer from discrimination in jobs and education, who form the majority in the prisons, who are noticeably absent from local television and are the brunt of most jokes, obviously expected more from the Revolution. Of course, when they begin to protest, they are told that things are much worse in the United States and, if they complain, they are playing into the hands of US imperialism.
As regards class distinctions, I have previously referred to the present government´s declared commitment to socialism, or Marxism-Leninism. I would suggest that what actually exists is state capitalism. The basic tenet of socialism is that the masses, that is the peasants and workers, should control the state apparatus. The profits created in the economy should also accrue, to the greatest degree possible, to the previously disadvantaged. The government should ensure that the basic needs of all of the population are met. To confront the government on its own terms, I would ask then, where do the profits created by Cuban workers and peasants end up?
There is no doubt that some goes to health, education and social services, but anyone who seriously analyses the society can see that there is clearly an elite class. Although we are asked to believe that these are representatives of the workers and peasants, and that this is why they are entitled to a higher standard of living, this is clearly not in keeping with the ideology of socialism. As this elite is disproportionately white, one could argue that the majority -- who are non- white -- labour to provide for the ´needs 'of the ruling white elite. It must be clarified that certainly not all whites are elite, but definitely almost all social - and it could be argued economic - elites are white.
Apologists for those in power point to Juan Almeida, the only black who has maintained an elevated position in government, as proof that blacks in Cuba have power. However, these same individuals say that Colin Powell, former secretary of state of the United States, and President Barack Obama, both African-Americans, are just "puppets". Why is it that the proponents of the Revolution see the latter as mere figureheads, while Almeida is seen as being so powerful? Although Almeida is usually trotted out to receive foreign dignitaries from black countries, I would suggest that he has very little real power. In this regard, Cuba is essentially not much different from Brazil -- not all the poor are black, but virtually all of the rich are white.
Turning once again to the terminology of the theory which those in power claim to be implementing and putting into practice, we must examine the concept of the superstructure. Supposedly the superstructure (that is the body of ideas, beliefs and practices) in a society is a reflection of the infrastructure (that is the economic system, the so-called relations of production). Racism then is seen as an ideology used in the past to justify economic systems like slavery, colonialism and capitalism. I would argue that racism in Cuba today is also used to support an economic system. If the majority of the citizens actually believe that they are inferior and that whites are supposed to be in control (either because they had an enhanced role in the Revolution, or simply because that is just the way the world is), then they are less likely to rebel.
I do believe that feelings of inferiority are being erased to a small degree, but not because of anything that the government is doing. The fact that many of the ideas which lead to enhanced self-esteem among blacks come from abroad, does not in any way make these ideas ´foreign' ideas which run counter to Cuban culture. Ideas of Marxism-Leninism also came from abroad, and they were supposedly embraced almost without condition. The international black Movement is enriched by contributions from throughout Africa, Latin America, the Caribbean, North America, Europe and Oceania.
As I have stated above, I do not believe that ideas emanating from many of the proponents of this movement are sufficient to transform societies for the good of all. However, particularly for those of African descent, I do believe that they are important precursors. One cannot build a society free of class and racial oppression if the majority, both those who perpetuate and those who suffer from racism, really believe in white superiority.
The racial propaganda of the Cuban regime
In Cuba, as I have implied above, racism and discrimination are linked to lynching and dogs being set on peaceful demonstrators. The fact that blacks are the brunt of most jokes is not considered racism. The fact that most white Cuban men cringe at the thought that a white woman might have sexual relations with a non-white man is not considered racism. The fact that the participation of blacks in world history, and more particularly in Cuban history, is left out of textbooks is not considered racism. The fact that African phenotype (like kinky hair, broad nose and big lips) is largely regarded with contempt, is not considered racism. The fact that the most deteriorated residential areas are where the majority of blacks live, is not considered racism. The fact that Fidel always refers to his Spanish father and never to his light-skinned mulata mother is not considered racism.
Those who take exception to the petition by the African-Americans to which I referred above, claim that the Revolutionary government cannot be accused of racism as it helped defeat apartheid and colonialism in Southern Africa, sent doctors and other professionals to work in underdeveloped nations and has allowed students from many black countries to study free of charge on the Isle of Youth.
It is not clear whether or not the present Cuban government provided assistance to liberation movements and governments in Africa for purely altruistic reasons, or because of geo-political considerations. Helping to train cadres in these countries has done much to secure support for the Cuban revolution in international fora like the United Nations. Just because doctors and other professionals go to work in black countries does not mean that they do not have racist ideas. Many of those who went abroad, either as military personnel or as professionals, and with whom I spoke in Cuba, expressed great resentment that they had to go there. Albeit, many of the professionals did not object, as they received consumer goods, like cars and electrical appliances, and often improved housing, when they returned.
Some assert that Armando Hart Dávalos, who was minister of culture for far too long, is not racist and Eurocentric because he allowed black musicians to travel and even live abroad and to return when they liked, in contrast with earlier policies that made it impossible for those who left to come back. First of all, the main reason that he allowed musicians, not only black ones, to go in and out is that the government has been very embarrassed by the number of 'cultural workers' who have defected while away on foreign trips. Secondly, his cultural policies have always been very Eurocentric. There is no comparison between the way that the Conjunto Folkorico, which is largely but not exclusively Afro-Cuban in orientation, has historically been treated, and the way that the Ballet Nacional has been nurtured. The Director of the National Ballet, Alicia Alonso, was criticised some years ago for not having any dark- skinned dancers in her group. She apparently reluctantly relented.
Racism coexisting with Socialism?
In conclusion, Cuba is not the only racist country in Latin America. The kinds of manifestations of white superiority that are discussed here are by no means exclusive to Cuba. We could be talking about Brazil, Venezuela, Dominican Republic or Colombia. But Cuba is the only country in this hemisphere which has had a successful revolution that has claimed to be dedicated to eradicating social and economic injustices and inequality.
I will never forget when I presented a paper on Racism as a Public Health Problem in the Americas, at a conference on Social Sciences and Medicine in Caracas in 1995: I was interrupted and reprimanded after only five minutes of the 20 minutes allotted. I was told by the outraged chair of the conference that racism was only a reality in the United States. It was unknown in Latin America. As I talked about subjects like the ways in which white elites abandoned their mixed-race offspring, who often grew up resentful and disenfranchised, the cheeks of the almost exclusively white male participants grew crimson. The exact same kind of reaction is occurring now, at the end of 2009, when a brave group of African-American intellectuals dare to protest manifestations of racism, epitomised by the unjust arrest and detention of a mulato activist on the island. In a response by black Cuban intellectuals, identified with the government, we are told that these Americans have no right to comment on race relations on the island because the United States is the most racist country in the world, and Obama only became president by denying his ´blackness´. The fact that African-Americans live in a racist society is no reason that they cannot criticise racism in other countries, just as members of this group of intellectuals have always done at home. As I emphasised throughout this article, we expect more from a Revolutionary process than from societies that are unabashedly capitalist. The fact that unconditional defenders of the Revolution fall back on the old tired accusation that those who criticise anything about Cuba, even in a spirit of constructive criticism, are agents of imperialism, is lamentable.

Lenny Nista

16th February 2010, 17:45

The "pervasiveness of racism in Cuba" in comparison to where, exactly? I don't doubt that racism exists in Cuba but if capitalism is restored (or "state capitalism is replaced by private capitalism" to speak the lingo of the OP), then go back to Cuba in 10 years and see how much worse racism is. Or just go to any other country in Latin America for a glimpse of the future of the Cuban people if this happens.

In other words, those leftists who won't defend the fundamental gain of the Cuban revolution - the expropriation of the bourgeosie and the liquidation fo their parties - are traitors who will have the blood on their hand of all those who die in poverty there once this "demcoratic counterrevolution", already udner way under Raul Castro's guidance, is completed.

A counter-revolution that they will are complicit in by not calling for the independent organization of Cuban workers in order to defend the existing gains of the revolution and keep the bourgeois parties out.

RaÃºl Duke

16th February 2010, 18:12

I'm still skeptical...
they make Cuba sound more racist than Puerto Rico and I doubt it.
Perhaps they're misinterpreting things from a cultural standpoint. While there's some "vestiges" of racism in language and one could say in cultural practices, they're not seen as such and/or do not generate the worst/real side of racism such as active discrimination (by police, etc) and getting attacked over one's race.

The Vegan Marxist

16th February 2010, 18:25

Response to Sidney Brinkley's article entitled "Racism in Cuba and the Failure of the American Left."

Opinions Are Political

It is always difficult for me to read articles written on substantive issues by a person who clearly has not studied a subject; yet draws huge conclusions based on a teeny bit of information. While everyone is entitled to his or her opinion on any subject, some opinions are clearly based upon serious consideration of sought after and studied information and others are not. Mr. Brinkley's article is one that is not.

The first problem with the way he constructs his opinion is not that he only had a week to spend in Cuba, but that he so arrogantly thinks he can know a people, their society, their racial sensibilities - which are all very complex - from one week only. I, as an activist/historian - who has researched and written on Cuba, the US and racism, and have traveled there many times over the last 15 years - am still learning and still searching for insight into these matters. I would never write in such an emphatic and unbalanced way and claim to know things without more study. If Mr. Brinkley has indeed done more study, he did not share his depth of research in his article.

The second problem is that even with a week, he could have done more as a journalist. His article would have been more meaningful if the reader got a sense that he had talked to black Cubans and Americans living there, if he had scanned the daily newspapers, if he had asked taxi drivers and hotel workers what they thought, and so on. Why did Mr. Brinkley not talk to any black Cubans about his experiences? Again, if he did that, it did not come through in the article. Also, background information on hotel development, the tourism industry, different types of restaurants like paladars, snack bars, etc. and differences in service between Havana and say Santiago de Cuba or Santa Clara would have given his article more validity and made for a richer, more thoughtful analysis. For instance, does he know that Havana is considered the "white" city while Santiago de Cuba is considered the "black" one by many Cubans? What does this mean in terms of race relations in one city versus another? Cuba is a big diverse island.

And then, there is his opinion about what the CBC and the TransAfrica sponsored delegations did and did not do on their separate trips to Cuba and what they did and did not ask. How does he know what went on during those trips? He states that they should have by-passed the "Castro-sponsored tour" and should have asked Fidel tough questions about race. How does he know who sponsored their tour? I happen to know from Cubans who took them around and from folks who went on the delegations that many did ask tough questions of Fidel and Cubans in general. In fact, one Cuban friend of mine said that some of the questions were so tough that she was made a bit uncomfortable. Thus, did Mr. Brinkley talk to anyone who went on those trips or did he just come up with his assumptions from thin air. I also know, that unlike Mr. Brinkley, these delegations did visit multiple sites - child care centers, work sites, cultural venues, etc. and therefore there opinions were based on a wider variety of experiences than those limited hotel and restaurant stories of Mr. Brinkley. If Mr. Brinkley did have more experiences - other than in restaurants and hotels - they are not reflected in his article.

More importantly, why has Mr. Brinkley chose to so roundly attack US Black initiatives in Cuba? And never mention the Right? Never mention Jesse Helms? Never mention the fact that the majority of Afro-Cubans basically trust in the revolution? Never mention that Cuba has provided safe harbor for political exiles such as Assata Shakur and given critical support to the struggle against apartheid in South Africa? What is he trying to do?

African-Americans are making a major "ethnic intervention," in Cuba, articulating what is in essence a Pan African position by saying "we" are concerned with Afro-Cubans. They are in effect challenging the right wing Cuban voice (which is really racist) as the only legitimate "ethnic" link to Cuba. Whether Mr. Brinkley agrees with their ultimate conclusions or not, his refusal to see the broader political picture is disturbing. (Below I will discuss in more detail why the Black Left has taken the position it has in relation to Cuba).

And finally, to base any current opinion on Cuba on a trip taken five years ago is very problematic indeed. The situation in Cuba is very fluid and always has been. It is a revolution in the making. It has never been static, especially in terms of social and economic policy. The Cubans have always been up against an economic and political wall and so have had little to loose from trying all sorts of innovative as well as problematic (my opinion) policies. Thus, their big socialist experiment has been full of little experiments. They initiate new initiatives, some work and some don't, and so they withdraw those they think are bad. In fact, one of the most interesting things about Cuba, to me, has been its ability to review policy, admit mistakes, change policy and attempt to move on. Thus, Mr. Brinkley needs to be careful about using old anecdotal situations to reflect on Cuba today - whenever that today is. Unless he is doing history, his analysis always needs to reflect Cuba's ever-changing landscape.

Racism, History, Capital

Given all of these contextual problems, Mr. Brinkley, nonetheless writes as if he has found all the answers. He has discovered that "racism is racism wherever it is found," and that there is "white minority rule" in Cuba, which he associates with South Africa. He raises a host of questions about black percentages in different sectors of Cuban society and states that "there are virtually no Afro-Cubans found in the hierarchy of the Cuban government and that they are not found anywhere else in anything close to their numbers in the population." He says the "hotels are entirely staffed by White Cubans" and he then attacks the American Left (which he never defines) and states that they have blinders on as "Castro has [played them] like a fiddle." He says he left Cuba "disappointed and disillusioned [for he] fell for the propaganda that, except for the US embargo, Cuban would be a success story." And he ends up by saying that he is "not anti-Castro…[just] pro black."

While there is clearly validity in the questions Mr. Brinkley raises (just like opinions, he has a right and maybe a responsibility to raise tough questions), that validity is tested by his weak attempts to answer his own questions. This of course leads to some gross errors in information. But more importantly, his questions and assertions lack an understanding of the relationship between history, economics and the world of ideas and reflect ideological assumptions that call into question his final claim that he is in fact "pro-black." Let me start by saying that Mr. Brinkley is absolutely correct when he writes racism has not been eradicated in Cuba. He is also correct when he states that as far as race is concerned the embargo is not solely to blame. Cuba has its own colonial/slave experience, and thus it's own indigenous and historically evolved forms of racism. The Cuban revolution also made certain choices, early on, that decentered the cultural fight against racism. However, Mr. Brinkley is wrong when he implies that neither US imperialism, nor the US embargo nor global capital has had anything to do with these racial developments in Cuba. In fact, to think about his hotel and restaurant experiences without thinking about these issues is ahistorical and erroneously unhinges what in fact is inextricably linked. (I will address this below)

Mr. Brinkley is also wrong when he states that neither the Cuban government nor the Black Left in the US has ever recognized and attempted to tackle continuing problems of racism in Cuban revolutionary society. One small case in point happened at the third Communist Party Congress of 1986. The Cuban leadership admitted that it had not adequately dealt with the race question and that racism continued to exist in Cuba. They instituted an affirmative action policy aimed at increasing the number of blacks, women and youth in government and other high positions of power.

I happen to know that some whites, men and older blacks have grumbled when asked to retire so that their positions could be filled by one of the marginalized groups. Thus, the Cuban leadership reviewed its policies around fighting racism and deemed it not working. Also, the Writers Union, within the last couple of years has called for better representation of blacks in the media, particularly television. And within the last two years, a series of anti-racist commercials have been launched on Cuban television. I have seen one or two of them while there. There are also publications and newspapers in Cuba, which now consistently deal with this issue.

Mr. Brinkley should also note, that there are blacks in the "hierarchy of the Cuban government." The Communist Party Secretaries, of the two key provinces -- Havana and Santiago -- are Black, Juan Carlos Robinson and Esteban Lazo Hernandes. And many other leaders of Cuba's trade union federation, Committees for the Defense of the Revolution, Peoples Power assemblies, the Union of Young Communist, the Women's Federation, etc. have always been black. These are some of the MOST important positions on the Island. Thus, while I would agree with Mr. Brinkley and the Cubans that there needs to be more black representation, there have been blacks in key places and shifts and nuances in Cuban policies, which Mr. Brinkley ignores. Oh to answer his questions about doctors: he wanted to know how many of Cuba's doctors are black. According to AfroCubaWeb, 13,500 of Cuba's 64,000 doctors are black. But Mr. Brinkley, should check this out: we in the US only have 17,000 black doctors. Thus, Cuba with a population of 11 million has nearly 13,500 black doctors while we here with a population of 290 million have only one thousand more!

In addition, while Mr. Brinkley might be correct in saying that the white Left in the US has not adequately dealt with the race question in Cuba, he is totally wrong in reference to the Black Left. Johnetta Cole, early on, in her co-written pamphlet Free and Equal: the End of Racial Discrimination in Cuba (1978) and her 1980 essay, "Race Towards Equality: The Impact of the Cuban Revolution on Racism" (Black Scholar no. 11, Nov. 1980), acknowledges both the successes and the failures of the Cuba's struggle against racism. And, I, James Early, Clarence LuSane, Manning Marable, Joy James, and a host of blacks who are clearly on the Left have critically written on race in Cuba. In fact in 1993, I wrote in an essay entitled "Back to the Future: Cuban and African-Americans in the Time(s) of Race" (Contributions in Black Studies, no 12) that:

"There existed no blueprint for an open discussion on race, and the Cuban revolution did not feel it should construct one. Given the barrage of U.S. hostility, Cuban leaders understandably feared that a discussion of race would divide the much-needed Cubanidad (Cuban national spirit). Sadly, though while encouraging debates on class and women's rights, and raising public awareness on Cuba's African heritage and international matters, they played ostrich on the critical topic of race. It is interesting to note the joining of classic Marxian and liberal positions in this regard. In pursuit of the orthodox Marxian belief that transformation of the material conditions can singularly dislodge racism, Cubans sought refuge - like liberals - in the hope that racism could be abolished through social integration alone. The Cuban leadership has recently begun to review this position through policies known as "rectification."

This essay was published in the Cuban journal Temas, as well.

My point here is this. Both the US-Black Left and the Cuban leadership has acknowledged the continued existence of racism in Cuba. While there are clearly those Cubans, who think the best way to deal with racism is to ignore it, there are others pushing hard against these opinions both within and outside of government. Mr. Brinkley's tirade, then, about the total lack of anybody, either here or there dealing with racism is wrong. He in fact, has set up straw men, which do not exist. In fact, most black Cubans will tell you that racism remains a problem, but they still support Fidel and the revolution. (This is something Mr. Brinkley does not interrogate, but I will below.) They also agree and disagree on how best to handle racism within the revolution. In fact, I have attended conferences and sat around kitchen tables where blacks, whites and people of color heatedly debate, amongst themselves, the issue of race in Cuba, which I happen to believe is healthy.

Thus, the Black Left, of which I am a part, have historically given critical support to the Cuban revolution, and has not been "played like a fiddle" as Mr. Brinkley would have his readers believe. And we, like Afro-Cubans, continue to support the revolution for some very real tangible reasons. It has been and continues to be in black interest to do so (which I will prove below). Moreover, while the Black Left has never viewed the US embargo as the only reason for racism in Cuba, it has always seen, the role of the US in Cuba as a major force in the promotion of racism and economic hardship. Why? Let me explain:

First, from the very beginning, U.S. imperialism militarily and politically propped up and empowered a white a racist Cuban elite, that in all likelihood would not have been able to sustain power against the military leadership and socially progressive ideas of Cuba's radical people of color - Juan Gualberto Gomez, Paulina Pedroso, Pedro Ivonnet and others. (In fact, the armed forces of all of Cuba's wars of independence were largely of color.) Then, between 1902 and 1959, the US established near total economic domination (US controlled telephones, textiles, oil refining, mining, railroads and the vast majority of agriculture) and pushed as far as possible its ultra-racist styles of power, which were of course integrated and intertwined with Cuban ones.

Second, when the revolution occurred in 1959 Cuba's people of color as a whole were at the bottom of Cuba's socio-economic ladder. This was at least partly because of US colonialism. While there were many whites among them, blacks, because of racism and colonial repression, were more likely as a whole to be illiterate and unemployed and to lack adequate housing and health care. When the revolution announced that it was launching a socialist revolution, Cuba's white racist elite fled to Miami and was given a privileged immigrant status. The US, attempted to crush Cuba by imposing an economic blockade and blackmailed as much as possible, other Latin American, Caribbean and European countries into doing the same. Thus, just as Cuba was launching a more equitable distribution of resources, the economic rug upon which those resources had been largely constructed was yanked from beneath them. Nearly 100% of its historic trade in technology, its medical supplies, its paper products, its car parts, its typewriters, it tractors, its building materials, its electrical wiring, its telephone systems, its food imports - given that food was imported from the US because US companies had turned much of Cuba's farm land into sugar and tobacco producing plantations - were gone in one fell swoop. The revolution was faced with some tough choices. Its people faced starvation (it takes time and capital to transform land historically used for commercial crop production into food production; post-colonial Africa faced a similar problem).

But Cubans were determined not to give up. With barely a Band-Aid, a sanitary napkin, or a tractor wheel, the Cubans began building their revolution as best they could. Economically, without significant trade in the West, they began trading with the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe. Having to import and export goods thousands of miles away was costly, as compared to 90 miles away. They bartered sugar for oil with the Soviet Union (among other things) and sold some of their oil for hard currency other places. In fact, one critique is their continued dependence on sugar production, but that is what the Soviet Union needed and wanted and they needed a marketable product - oil. Nonetheless, they used that hard currency to import certain things that they did not produce. Socially, the Cubans instituted class-based affirmative action, dictating by law that food, land, health care, housing, education and employment would be guaranteed and equally distributed to all, even if it at times the rations were small. In hard times, rationing is the only way to guarantee that the more strategically placed don't hoard and the poor and homeless don't die. Afro-Cubans overwhelmingly supported the revolution because it had the potential of significantly improving their life chances. Imagine our own country: If we had guaranteed food, shelter, education, full employment, etc. the lives of blacks would be significantly enhanced, whether we ever engaged in discourse about racism or not. Politically, the Cubans began to institute popular power through neighborhood, women, youth, trade union, and cultural organizations.

The Cubans then - black and white - had hard choices to make. Do we paint the buildings or feed the people? Do we tear down all the crumbling 17th century structures when we have no other places for people to go? Do we take away all property from middle class whites and give them to the black poor? Or do we allow every Cuban to stay in the ONE house they already possess (not more than one) and begin building new houses for those whose housing either is non-existent or whose housing is dilapidated? Do we capitulate to the US and have them come in and build our houses (and re-institute imperialism) or do we give the materials to the people themselves and train them to build their own houses? Do we alienate a sector of our population (whites) whom we need, by making race an up front topic of discussion (when the white elite left, Cuba lost 3000 doctors) Or do we do what we can in areas that we can and improve the conditions of our most poor (which are largely black but also white) through equal distribution of health care, education housing, etc.?

The Cubans, then made those hard choices, some of which we can be critical of. However, I often wonder what we, here in the United States, would do, should we ever be clear enough, unified enough and organized enough to actually have a revolution? What would we do after the seizure of state power, what would we build in the wake of hundreds of years of social, economic, and political inequity and racism, sexism, homophobia? How would we reconcile, for instance here in Chicago, the rich elite of the North Shore with the poor of the projects? How would we build houses for the thousands of homeless with no capital and constant invasion possibilities? How would we deal with child abusers and their abused, with men who believe in beating women and the victims of domestic violence, with gang members and drug addicts and their children. With millions of whites influenced in varying degrees by racism, how would we retrain them. Do we kill everyone that does not agree with the revolution? While some bloodshed will be inevitable, after the seizure of power, are we prepared to put millions of people before the firing squads or do we figure out ways to maintain the revolution and deal with them?

This, then is what Cuba faced! But astonishingly, and I say astonishingly, the Cuban revolution made great strides. Even though it still had not painted all of its buildings and many people continued to drive out of date cars, by 1990, the life chances of regular black and white Cubans had significantly improved. In fact, they were proud of what they had done with so little. According to World Health Organizations statistics, by 1988, the Cubans had increased the caloric intake of its population to such a degree that Cuban's rate of malnutrition had decreased from 30-40% in the urban areas and 60% in the rural areas in 1958 to zero throughout the country. Its illiteracy rate had decreased from 25% in 1958 to 2% in 1988. Unemployment had gone from 25% in 1958 to 3.4% in 1988. It's number of Day Care centers had gone from zero in 1958 to 1000 in 1988. Its student population at all levels had increased from 811, 345 in 1958 to 3,500, 000 in 1988. Its teachers at all levels had gone from 22, 595 in 1958 to 300,000 in 1988. It universities had gone from 3 in 1958 to 40 in 1988. And is life expectancy had risen from 57 years in 1958 to 75 years in 1988 (which is higher than in many African-American communities in the US today). Its infant mortality rate had gone from 60 deaths per 1000 in 1958 to 11.1 in 1988. This figure was better than both the south side (17 per 1000) and west side of Chicago (27 per 1000) in 1988. It is also better than Haiti, which in 1988 had 118 deaths per 1000 and Bahia, Brazil, which had 168 deaths per 1000.

I should note that there is little difference between largely black regions of the country and largely white (Santiago and Havana, for instance). In fact, Cuba in 1990 had better all around living standards than any other country (and some regions within countries) of color in the world, other than Japan, Hong Kong, and Singapore. It ranked higher than Mexico, Columbia, Ghana, Kenya, etc.. It also ranked 20th of 142 countries in terms of its number of women in universities. Thus, it was clearly better to be black in Cuba than it was to be black on the west side of Chicago, in Brazil, or in South Africa in 1988. Moreover, Cuba gave developmental and military support to tens of black countries. Between 1959-1990, it educated free nearly 80,000 African students. During the same time, it sent 3000 doctors to 30 countries, most of which were in Africa. It sent 3, 500 teachers and 8000 constructions workers as well. And it sent ongoing military support throughout the 1970s and 80s to Angola as the CIA and South Africa sponsored a devastating war against that country. In fact, it was only after a key battle, at Cuito Cuanavale, when a combined army of Cubans and Angolans defeated the South African military, that the South Africans began to negotiate the independence of Namibia. Thus, while there were many fronts upon which the struggle against apartheid was fought, Cuba's role in helping to win one of those fronts is clear. And finally, Cuba has been refugee for North Americans and Latin Americans fleeing political persecution. US-born Assata Shakur has been granted political asylum in Cuba, after being unjustly persecuted, prosecuted and jailed through the FBI's counter-intelligence program in the 1970s.

This is the record upon which the US Black Left, Afro-Cubans, and Africa base their critical support. And while, counting numbers of blacks in key "hierarchical positions of power" is important, counting numbers, alone is not necessarily the only measure or the best measure of black progress. Neither is counting the number of blacks with Afros and braids. While these can be indicators of black progress and black pride, they can also be misleading if ideology and class are not taken into account. After all, blacks hold the top government positions in Nigeria, Kenya, Burundi, and Haiti. But this had meant little in the life chances of the masses in those countries. We, in the US, have Clarence Thomas in the Supreme Court, and Colin Powell in the Military. We even have Michael Jordan and Oprah Winfrey. While it might in some way aid in the very long run white attitudes about blacks, has it meant better lives for the black poor? I think not. Thus, for the Black Left, being "pro-black" involves looking at more than blacks in "hierarchies of power." And being internationalist means listening to the voices of blacks in their own countries before framing political questions around race. Most Afro-Cubans support the revolution and want an end to the blockade. Being on the Black Left also means taking stock of the worldwide assault of people of color and making reasoned political and strategic decisions about allies and enemies. Neither Fidel nor the Cuban revolution is an enemy of black people. In the broad scheme of things, Cuba has clearly been an unbending ally to the struggles that matter most in the fight against racism. The CBC, TransAfrica, Nelson Mandela and other African leaders clearly understand that. In the words of Nelson Mandela:

"Cuba came to our region as doctors, teachers, soldiers, agricultural experts but never as colonizers. They have shared the same trenches with us in the struggle against colonialism, underdevelopment and apartheid. Hundreds of Cubans have given their lives, literally, in a struggle that was first and foremost not theirs but ours. As southern Africans we solute them. We vow never to forget this unparalleled example of selfless internationalism."

Cuba, then, while not a racial paradise, has advanced the struggle against racism, both in its own country and internationally. However, since 1990, these advances have been significantly challenged. With the collapse of socialist Europe, Cubans, again, felt the full impact of the U.S. blockade. Imports and Capital during the early 1990s were at an all time low. In 1993, when I visited the Island, everyone I knew was nearly 15 pounds thinner; again, because rather than create a haves and have nots, all persons' guarantees of cooking oil, fruits, meat, vegetables, milk. were reduced. Defining it as "the special period," times were hard and Cuba, again, had to make some tough choices. They decided to open up Cuba to foreign investors, who now because of the end of Cold War were prepared to engage in more trade with Cuba. They also decided to allow Cubans to obtain (from relatives abroad largely), and spend, dollars. In addition, all sorts of new economic initiatives, largely government but some private, were launched. Given Cuba's natural and cultural resources, tourism has become a primary area of expansion. However, Cuba, in their attempt to maintain some control have entered into joint ventures with foreign investors; whereby the Spanish or Italian concern, for example, own 49% and the Cuban government 51%. This has allowed the Cuban government to get capital in the country through investment itself and tourist dollars, without turning over the economy to foreigners completely.

But it has also proved difficult. Mr. Brinkley, in fact, is correct when he says that some of Cuba's new hotels only want whites in the front offices. He might also say that racial profiling has also increased as white Cubans have more dollars (because of family remittances from Miami) and blacks don't. Thus, blacks, it is assumed, are more likely to engage in criminal behavior around those areas where dollars are, hotels. However, he is wrong when he says that all hotels are like that or that average Cubans are not fighting back and/or that the Cuban government is completely unresponsive. Just one small example: the Havana Libre Hotel a few years ago was part owned by a Spanish businessman. This businessman went about firing older and blacker workers, as well as engaging in other unscrupulous behavior. The workers took it to the Cuban trade federation and after some deliberation and weighing of a lot of facts, the government decided to cancel that contract with that businessman. There are other stories such as this, but maintaining the gains and equity is clearly not easy, especially given the pace of tourism development. Someone told me that nearly 100 hotels have been built in the last 8 years. But again what choices did the Cubans have. What choices would we have made?

Thus, I would like to wind down with a story that an African-American friend of mine living in Cuba shared with me. She said: One day, a black Cuban friend of hers came to her house. He was on his bike and he seemed upset. He arrived at her door, disheveled and said: "give me some rum, I need it." She said, what's the matter, why are you so upset? He grumbled and said I am too angry to talk about it, so just give me the rum. She gave him the rum and decided she just better drop it. The next day he came back and his mood was considerably better. She asked him what had happened the day before. He said that he had been riding his bike when a police car came so close that it grazed him and knocked him off. He said he had been so angry that he called the policemen and his mother all kinds of names. The policemen, then, he said, got out of his car and called him and his mother all kinds of bad names. My friend, now really concerned said, "well then what happened after that? He said that he and the policemen got into a fistfight. He said: "I through some good licks and so did he." My friend said, oh my god, what did the policeman then do. He said, the policeman got back in his car and drove away and I got on my bike and came over here!

My friend was astonished. She and I both know that such a thing would never have happened in the US or in apartheid South Africa. The police would have either beat, tortured, killed or arrested the person and that would have been that. Over my many years of traveling to Cuba, I have heard many such stories and been astonished by my realization that while Cuba has not completely solved racial, or many other, questions., it has indeed pushed forward towards a new and different kind of society.

Therefore, Mr. Brinkley's assertion that "racism is racism wherever it is found" is ahistorical and unscientific. Some societies are better than others on this question. He needs to contextualize his very personal experiences in the real world or risk joining right wing forces that are really "anti-black." And please, his notion that Cuba has "white minority rule" similar to apartheid South Africa is simply ludicrous. He should ask Nelson Mandela what he thinks of this.

Lisa Brock

http://www.afrocubaweb.com/brock4.htm

Agnapostate

16th February 2010, 19:52

Anecdotal accounts are never a substitute for analysis of large data sets, considering that the vast spectrum of human experiences and behaviors renders such accounts heterogenous in nature.

JacobVardy

16th February 2010, 22:17

I read My Life by Fidel Castro and Ignacio Ramonet last year. There are a couple of passages in where Castro says, yes Cuba has racism; and that being white neither he nor other members of the leadership were aware of this. He also says that he had assumed that racism and racial discrimination would just disappear in a communist country. Castro also claims that there are now positive discrimination measures to counter-act the effects of racism.

I can't say how true any his statements are. All i take from this is that Castro thought there was racism in Cuba, and that it was bad enough that he had to at least say he was doing something about.

Robocommie

17th February 2010, 14:57

I read My Life by Fidel Castro and Ignacio Ramonet last year. There are a couple of passages in where Castro says, yes Cuba has racism; and that being white neither he nor other members of the leadership were aware of this. He also says that he had assumed that racism and racial discrimination would just disappear in a communist country. Castro also claims that there are now positive discrimination measures to counter-act the effects of racism.

That's actually a pretty reasonable approach to take, admitting he was wrong, admitting that his personal experiences made it more difficult to understand why it was wrong, but saying he had made an effort to improve things.