Neo Nazis steal death camp sign

[Melbourne Lefty]

Heroic Nazis steal sign.



The slickly organised theft of one of the most potent symbols of the Holocaust sent a wave of outrage around the world yesterday.
The sign that hung over the gates of Auschwitz extermination camp, where more than a million people died during the Second World War, was stolen in minutes. Polish police suspect that the culprits were either neo-Nazis or acting on behalf of collectors or a group of individuals.
The slogan wrought in iron, Arbeit Macht Frei (“Work sets you free”), was the cynical welcome to those entering the camp in the 1940s. One million of the 1.1 million people who died at Auschwitz were Jewish.
The theft in the early hours of yesterday was seen as an attempt by right-wing extremists to muddy the narrative of the Holocaust.


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article6962317.ece

another great victory for the aryan race.:rolleyes:

[An archist]

Let's not jump to conclusions shall we?

[Sasha]

Let's not jump to conclusions shall we?

this...

my money is on a sick history collector, that or randsom.

[ComradeMan]

Well according to Neo(???) Nazis the Holocaust never happened anyway.

I hope they find it and put it back.

I heard that some <insert expletive> kicked the door down of the Anne Frank House in Amsterdam a few years ago--- I don't know if it's true. I do know that when I went it was just a normal looking Dutch house, now it's like a museum and visitor centre or something.

[Lyev]

Why would you say "heroic" and "great victory"? I know it's probably meant to be a joke, but what's your point? I find it really bad taste to make jokes when talking about genocide.

And why on earth would someone want to steal it? I wouldn't be able to bear the look of something so grotesque. "Arbeit Macht Frei" is cruelly ironic. I'm visiting Auschwitz with school later in this year... it's not something I'm "looking forward" to, per se.

[Wanted Man]

The neonazi speculation seems kind of pointless. I guess it's related to the ever persistent wishful thinking that "bad things happening" can easily be associated with "thoroughly sick and evil individuals". It could be anyone.

The Israeli government is also deeply concerned with the theft. So much, in fact, that their press statement managed to misspell the phrase three times.

[Chambered Word]

Why would you say "heroic" and "great victory"? I know it's probably meant to be a joke, but what's your point? I find it really bad taste to make jokes when talking about genocide.

Genocide? I thought we were talking about the theft of a sign? :confused:

[9]

^Seriously? It's the Auschwitz sign......

[scarletghoul]

who cares its just a sign

modbreak: dont troll this forum with these kind of one-liners.

[ComradeMan]

Why would you say "heroic" and "great victory"? I know it's probably meant to be a joke, but what's your point? I find it really bad taste to make jokes when talking about genocide.

And why on earth would someone want to steal it? I wouldn't be able to bear the look of something so grotesque. "Arbeit Macht Frei" is cruelly ironic. I'm visiting Auschwitz with school later in this year... it's not something I'm "looking forward" to, per se.

I don't think he was making a joke about genocide. I think he was satirising the people who did this. If they prove to be Nazis (I don't believe in Neo-Nazis, they are just plain Nazis and that's it)- I can well imagine what sort of people they are and how they might see this as being "heroic" and some kind of "victory" for the Aryan race in their sick and twisted little minds.

The phrase "Arbeit Macht Frei" has become an iconic (if that's the right word- in a negative sense) symbol of Auschwitz and the Shoah/holocaust- by stealing it they take a way a "symbol" and slowly erode something that the world should never forget.

[The Idler]

But the notion that "work sets you free" isn't exclusive to fascists. Its a popular idea among capitalists (even today) and especially the Soviet Union and trade unions. Its only a brave minority who challenge this, William Morris, Paul Lafargue, Bertrand Russell, Bob Black and the Wobblies.

[ComradeMan]

who cares its just a sign

Are you serious? :confused:

[Tjis]

But the notion that "work sets you free" isn't exclusive to fascists. Its a popular idea among capitalists (even today) and especially the Soviet Union and trade unions. Its only a brave minority who challenge this, William Morris, Paul Lafargue, Bertrand Russell, Bob Black and the Wobblies.

Nevertheless, this was not a sign above a factory gate, or of a trade union. This was a sign that hung above the gates of Auschwitz. More than a million people walked underneath it on the way to their death. The idea that someone would even want to have it makes me sick.

[ComradeMan]

Nevertheless, this was not a sign above a factory gate, or of a trade union. This was a sign that hung above the gates of Auschwitz. More than a million people walked underneath it on the way to their death. The idea that someone would even want to have it makes me sick.

In defence of Idler I think he was referring more to the concept than the sign itself....

I am sickened by this. I think it is a symptom of the rising anti-Semitism in Europe, I object to the idea that the Holocaust/Shoah is sometimes represented as only being about the extermination of the Jews, I sometimes think people forget about all the other groups that went into the overns too. However, I suppose the Jewish people were the biggest victims and Nazis do have an obsession with the Jews first and foremost.

Stealing this sign is not only an insult to the Jewish people but also to the Rom, Homosexuals, Trade Unionists, Communists, Freemasons, Catholics and Germans who were opposed to the Nazi cowardly bullyboys and their wicked crimes.

In that way, stealing this sign is an insult to humanity.

I would like to get whoever it is and sit them down for a couple of hours with some holocaust survivors and have them chat....

[Holden Caulfield]

who cares its just a sign

shut the fuck up.
you troll users on this board but you will not troll this forum. so fuck off if you have nothing of value to say.

Yes it is 'just a sign', but it is what it represents and what it means that makes this important.

If this happens to be Nazis who have stolen it, it is of great offence to everybody who suffered in the holocaust. Even if it wasn't nazis it still offensive, crass and an inhumane thing to do as that sign, to many, symbolises the holocaust.

[ComradeMan]

shut the fuck up.
you troll users on this board but you will not troll this forum. so fuck off if you have nothing of value to say.

Yes it is 'just a sign', but it is what it represents and what it means that makes this important.

If this happens to be Nazis who have stolen it, it is of great offence to everybody who suffered in the holocaust. Even if it wasn't nazis it still offensive, crass and an inhumane thing to do as that sign, to many, symbolises the holocaust.


Anyone who would do such a thing is a de facto Nazi and anti-Semite, guilty by association. They don't have to have swastikas tattoed on their arms to qualify. There is no one over the age of 14 who doesn't know what that sign "means" and what it represents. So in my opinion, regardless of membership of organisations etc, whoever did that was de facto a Nazi.

[Holden Caulfield]

Anyone who would do such a thing is a de facto Nazi and anti-Semite, guilty by association. They don't have to have swastikas tattoed on their arms to qualify. There is no one over the age of 14 who doesn't know what that sign "means" and what it represents. So in my opinion, regardless of membership of organisations etc, whoever did that was de facto a Nazi.

Thats an emotional and completely unfounded statement. They are worthless scum but they could be a greedy historical collector, or it could be Jews trying to rid the world of what is left of nazism (I know that is unlikely to the extreme).

Being dirt on the shoe of humanity doesn't necessarily make you a nazi, or even a racist. It just makes you scum. A nazi is a very specific title that we should do our best not to needlessly throw around.

[Tjis]

I just saw on the morning news that the sign has been found back in the north of Poland. It was sawn into 3 pieces and 5 people were arrested. Nothing was said about a motive though.

[Rusty Shackleford]

I just saw on the morning news that the sign has been found back in the north of Poland. It was sawn into 3 pieces and 5 people were arrested. Nothing was said about a motive though.
at this point im more curious about why they cut it into thirds. i suppose they may have been trying to smuggle it? and for what purpose?

[Holden Caulfield]

BBC News 24 just said something like there have been no links made to neo-nazis

[Fidel Follower]

The "Arbeit macht frei" sign stolen from Auschwitz in southern Poland has been found in the north and five men are being questioned by police. The five suspects, aged in their 20s and 30s, were not members of a neo-Nazi group, Krakow police said.
The metal sign from the main gate, which symbolises for many the atrocities of Nazi Germany, had been cut into three pieces, they added.
A major search was launched after the sign was stolen before dawn on Friday.
Andrzej Rokita, the local police chief in Krakow - where the men were being questioned - said the theft had been financially motivated, and it remained unclear whether it was carried out to order.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8423827.stm

It seems jumping to the conclusion that they were Neo-Nazi's was wrong.

[Wanted Man]

this...

my money is on a sick history collector, that or randsom.

It seems that ransom was indeed the motivation.

It would be convenient if the perpetrators were evil nazis ("de facto", whatever that means, or otherwise...), but the sad thing is that this kind of thing can and will be done by just about anyone.

[ComradeMan]

Thats an emotional and completely unfounded statement. They are worthless scum but they could be a greedy historical collector, or it could be Jews trying to rid the world of what is left of nazism (I know that is unlikely to the extreme).

Being dirt on the shoe of humanity doesn't necessarily make you a nazi, or even a racist. It just makes you scum. A nazi is a very specific title that we should do our best not to needlessly throw around.

Being dirt on the shoe of humanity = nazi :)

[An archist]

Being dirt on the shoe of humanity = nazi :)
Don't be so stupid, there are plenty fucked up people who have nothing to do with fascism, don't go around calling them all nazis, the word loses it's meaning if you do.
Nazis are fucked up, fucked up people aren't necessarily nazis.

[ComradeMan]

Don't be so stupid, there are plenty fucked up people who have nothing to do with fascism, don't go around calling them all nazis, the word loses it's meaning if you do.
Nazis are fucked up, fucked up people aren't necessarily nazis.

I still maintain that no one, other than someone who was clinically insane and not responsible for their own actions, would do something like this if there were not anti-Semitic and/or pro-Nazi sentiments involved. It does not mean they have to be formal members of a group.

[Holden Caulfield]

Don't be so stupid, there are plenty fucked up people who have nothing to do with fascism, don't go around calling them all nazis, the word loses it's meaning if you do.
Nazis are fucked up, fucked up people aren't necessarily nazis.
Yes


I still maintain that no one, other than someone who was clinically insane and not responsible for their own actions, would do something like this if there were not anti-Semitic and/or pro-Nazi sentiments involved. It does not mean they have to be formal members of a group.
No. Stop saying it.
Being motivated by greed and being insensitive is no where near the same thing as endorsing a genocide. They are both bastards, but they are not both Nazis.
Its like that lad who pissed on a war memorial over here, I bet he doesn't have any political stance on things he is just a fucking scumbag, similarly when a boy from my town mooned at a statue of Kemal when on holiday in turkey I doubt he was motivated by a strong dislike of Kemal, he is just a moron.

[Holden Caulfield]

Don't be so stupid, there are plenty fucked up people who have nothing to do with fascism, don't go around calling them all nazis, the word loses it's meaning if you do.
Nazis are fucked up, fucked up people aren't necessarily nazis.
Yes


I still maintain that no one, other than someone who was clinically insane and not responsible for their own actions, would do something like this if there were not anti-Semitic and/or pro-Nazi sentiments involved. It does not mean they have to be formal members of a group.
No. Stop saying it.
Being motivated by greed and being insensitive is no where near the same thing as endorsing a genocide. They are both bastards, but they are not both Nazis.
Its like that lad who pissed on a war memorial over here, I bet he doesn't have any political stance on things he is just a fucking scumbag, similarly when a boy from my town mooned at a statue of Kemal when on holiday in turkey I doubt he was motivated by a strong dislike of Kemal, he is just a moron.

[Guerrilla22]

Well they found the sign. Problem is it's in pieces.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_poland_auschwitz_sign

Turns out it was just a couple common criminals who wanted to sell pieces of it as souvenirs.

[ComradeMan]

Yes


No. Stop saying it.
Being motivated by greed and being insensitive is no where near the same thing as endorsing a genocide. They are both bastards, but they are not both Nazis.
Its like that lad who pissed on a war memorial over here, I bet he doesn't have any political stance on things he is just a fucking scumbag, similarly when a boy from my town mooned at a statue of Kemal when on holiday in turkey I doubt he was motivated by a strong dislike of Kemal, he is just a moron.

I suppose you are right- it does make my blood boil in any case.

That is sick- re pissing on a war memorial! Like those idiots in France a few years ago... I can't believe some people at times...

[Sasha]

my money is on a sick history collector, that or randsom.

i win: http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/auschwitz-thieves-planned-demand-ransom

[Red Saxon]

I wonder why they haven't just kept the replica up all the time, and keep this valuable piece of history locked away.

Hopefully they could just weld the pieces together :(

[pastradamus]

Well they found the sign. Problem is it's in pieces.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_poland_auschwitz_sign

Turns out it was just a couple common criminals who wanted to sell pieces of it as souvenirs.

Yeah, Was listening to that news earlier. But its not too bad. A member of the police said they'll have no problem putting it back together and in perfect shape again.

[Rusty Shackleford]

I suppose you are right- it does make my blood boil in any case.

That is sick- re pissing on a war memorial! Like those idiots in France a few years ago... I can't believe some people at times...


heres Georgia (http://www.rferl.org/content/Georgian_Official_Arrested_In_Fatal_Monument_Blast/1910083.html) for you

[Wanted Man]

I suppose you are right- it does make my blood boil in any case.

That is sick- re pissing on a war memorial! Like those idiots in France a few years ago... I can't believe some people at times...

All kinds of people do that sort of thing. Like last year, when a monument to the International Brigades in Spain was sprayed over by anarkids:

http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2008/07/19/18517813.php
http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2008/07/21/18518486.php

[Sasha]

not realy sure if i believe this but the swedish nazi scene is a quite terrorist inclined so you would never know...


Swedish neo-Nazis stole Auschwitz death camp sign to fund terror plot, informant tells newspaper

By William Sherman (http://www.nydailynews.com/authors/William%20Sherman)
Originally Published:Friday, December 25th 2009, 1:28 PM
Updated: Friday, December 25th 2009, 11:10 PM

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/12/26/alg_auschwitz-sign.jpg Skarzynski/Getty
The infamous sign hanging over the main gate pver the entrance to the Nazi Auschwitz death camp - reading 'Arbeit Macht Frei' (Work Makes You Free)- in 2005 .

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/12/26/amd_auschwitz_suspect.jpg Praszkiewicz/AP
Police question one of the suspects in the Dec. 18 theft of the Nazi death camp sign.


Related News




Articles
Police recover infamous 'Arbeit Macht Frei' sign that was stolen from Auschwitz (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2009/12/20/2009-12-20_poliice_find_infamous_arbeit_macht_frei_sign.ht ml)
Infamous iron sign at Auschwitz memorial site is stolen, police say (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2009/12/18/2009-12-18_infamous_iron_sign.html)
Auschwitz's 'Arbeit Macht Frei' sign is stolen (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2009/12/18/2009-12-18_auschwitz_sign_stolen_arbeit_macht_frei_slogan_ sat_over_poland_nazi_death_camp_e.html)





A Swedish neo-Nazi group planned to sell the infamous "Arbeit Macht Frei" sign stolen from the Auschwitz (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Auschwitz-Birkenau) death camp to fund an attack on the prime minister, The London Times (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/The+Times+of+London) reported.
"We are aware of the information about the alleged attack plans," Patrik Peter (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Patrik+Peter), a spokesman for the Swedish security police told The Times.
The sign, which means "Work Makes You Free," was stolen Dec. 18 by five men and was later found in three pieces several hundred miles from the camp in Oswiecim (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Oswiecim), Poland (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Poland).
The thieves, all Polish nationals, were arrested and are being interrogated, Polish police said.
A Swedish newspaper reported that a former leader of a Nazi group said a buyer "was ready to pay millions for the sign."
The unidentified source told Aftonbladet (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Aftonbladet+Hierta+AB) that the money would pay for an attack on the home of Swedish Prime Minister Fredrik Reinfeldt (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Fredrik+Reinfeldt) and on the Swedish Foreign Ministry (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Swedish+Ministry+for+Foreign+Affairs).



Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2009/12/25/2009-12-25_swedish_neonazis_stole_auschwitz_death_camp_sig n_to_fund_terror_plot_report.html#ixzz0bAfbHUUB

[Ravachol]

This is of course possible, considering the Swedish fascist movement has a history of terrorism, especially groups like SMR, Legion Wasa (no not the Knackebrod :laugh::rolleyes:) and Vitt Ariskt Motstånd.

I doubt, however, they would be this stupid. First of all, the 'Arbeit macht Frei' sign is very, very high-profile and the primary suspects would be sought in the far-right scene. Secondly, finding a buyer and transporting it without troubles and sting operations bound to be set up after the theft would be rather troublesome. And last but not least, it isn't gonna raise that much money, especially considering the risk and effort. Plain robbery, counterfeiting, drug trade or extortion would have been more lucrative if they were inclined to finance a terrorist offensive. But meh, you never know with fascists. :rolleyes:

[aty]

This is of course possible, considering the Swedish fascist movement has a history of terrorism, especially groups like SMR, Legion Wasa (no not the Knackebrod :laugh::rolleyes:) and Vitt Ariskt Motstånd.

I doubt, however, they would be this stupid. First of all, the 'Arbeit macht Frei' sign is very, very high-profile and the primary suspects would be sought in the far-right scene. Secondly, finding a buyer and transporting it without troubles and sting operations bound to be set up after the theft would be rather troublesome. And last but not least, it isn't gonna raise that much money, especially considering the risk and effort. Plain robbery, counterfeiting, drug trade or extortion would have been more lucrative if they were inclined to finance a terrorist offensive. But meh, you never know with fascists. :rolleyes:
This is funny but may be true!
It is probably Dan Dalén who is behind all this. He wrote a book "revolution in the welfare-state", where he wrote how they would bring down the Swedish society in a five-step-program and then take the power.
The first step was to destroy public buildings so that Sweden would be in a financial mess, they managed to destroy windows for 1,5 million kronors. Then they got 2 years in prison...

If this is true Dan Dalén has skipped the second step and is now aiming for the third and fourth step. I hope he can kill our primeminister so he can move on to the fifth and last step, suicidebombers...

Yes all of this is true!

http://www.expo.se/www/img/1_1268.jpg
"Revolution in the welfare-state"

[9]

not realy sure if i believe this but the swedish nazi scene is a quite terrorist inclined so you would never know...



words from some "news" story

I tend to doubt it. More likely, some neo-Nazis tried to claim responsibility or connections or whatever afterward for the sake of publicity. Of course, whether they had anything at all to do with it (which, like I said, I tend to doubt it), it certainly will get them publicity, which will likely only work to their benefit. So why give it to them?
I sometimes worry that, for some leftists, anti-fascism becomes more of an anachronistic fetish than an actual relevant tactic, but I suppose that's a discussion for another thread. :-)

[*Viva La Revolucion*]

The phrase "Arbeit Macht Frei" has become an iconic (if that's the right word- in a negative sense) symbol of Auschwitz

Infamous?

I don't think it makes any difference whether it was a neo-nazi group, a collector or just ''mindless vandals'' that took the sign. That's beside the point. The fact that anyone could try and profit from the sign is sickening.

I've heard comedians who've made jokes or comments about the holocaust and I worry in case it's going to become accepted, as if enough time passing would make it fine. It's ridiculous to think that once something's far enough in the past it's OK to joke about it. The reason this sign is so important is because it acts as a reminder of something we should never forget. Anne Frank's diary tells the story of an ordinary, intelligent girl with ambitions and dreams and feelings like anyone else; she could be your daughter, sister, cousin or even yourself. Now if you times that by six million you begin to get an idea of what Auschwitz, The Anne Frank House and that sign represent. It should never be trivialized or just seen as ''just'' a sign. Never.