France dabbled in socialism?

[Rusty Shackleford]

so, i was talking to this republican recruiter dude. (who could not get over the obama crap about birth certificates and that white kid that got beat up) said france tried socialism and because of that, a bunch of middle easterners moved there. and he is saying that is a source of problems.
does anyone have any information on this "socialist france" i know its bullshit but i cant understand where he got that from. the only thing i can ever imagine is a social democratic phase.

this isnt anything worthy of learning, politics, or history. just something that is bugging me a bit

thanks

[JazzRemington]

What about birth certificates and that white kid that got beat up?

[Bilan]

The closest France ever got to socialism was in 1871, with the Paris Commune.
I don't know what he is refering to. It doesn't make a lot of sense in the first place.

[NecroCommie]

He's a conservatist! He propably does not make sense even for himself. :rolleyes:

[Tower of Bebel]

Social security is the source of all evil. Apparantly. But he's wrong. There was no socialism and the "bunch of middle easterners" came over to France because either they were asked to work in the mines and in the steel factories (policy of the 60's), or because they were forced to by poverty.

France, together with other countries, achieved a certain system of social security (more secure than the American or British system) because of factors like workers' uprisings, the growth of the Communist Party after WW2, and of course the Resistance and May '68. Just to remind you: the reason why De Gaulle was so keen on liberating Paris early was because he feared the city would be taken over by the Resistance and self-organized workers. De Gaulle feared a second Commune (or actually: the third).

[Il Medico]

He's an idiot, that is where he got it from.

[Tjis]

What about birth certificates and that white kid that got beat up?

I don't know about any white kid that got beaten up, but there are lots of people that think Obama can't legally be president cause supposedly he wasn't born in the states. They claim his birth certificate, which shows he was actually born in the states is a fake.

[Prairie Fire]

Nice to see that the republicans are carrying on their long and prestigious history of un-apologetically open racism (as opposed to the muted and patronizing racism found in the democrats).

A few things, comrade Vacant:

1. Conservatives see "socialism" everywhere (if only). My friend that I grew up with, a Canadian Bushite, sees no difference at all between Sweden and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. Even the Sweden that she pictures in her mind doesn't exist anymore (right, Dimentio?), but this is a good text book example.

According to the right, Sweden is "socialist", Canada is "socialist", Obama is "socialist", the social-democratic Canadian NDP is "socialist" (they are portrayed in newspaper political cartoons wearing Mao suits :rolleyes:)...

France had nationalized healthcare in around the same capacity as Canada, and some semblence of a welfare state (As Rakunin said, this is a concession to keep actual socialism at bay,) so they are also "socialist" by the standards of the Glen Beck crowd.

This same dumb shit who is now calling France "socialist" probably called it that back in his "Freedom fry" days as well.

2. Conservatives generally blame non-white people for all problems in their country and in the world, to some extent.

Both major political parties in the US are built on a strong foundation of racism, but the Republicans are more up front about it, so you will see a lot more Trent Lotts, Strom Thurmonds, and David Dukes in their ranks. I suppose your republican here, attributing Frances problems to middle easterners, is a pretty good example.

The republicans still have the Minuteman vote and the Klan vote, at least to some extent.

But to be fair, both parties are built with racism in their make up, even the democrats (whom both Lott and thurmond originally ran for).


3. Conservatives can't be defeated with logic.

Do what you can to use logic on this beast, but I think it will be the conversational equivilant of trying to kick water up hill.

Anyone ignorant enough to to be a xenophobic racist and politically classify countries with terms that don't apply is going to be harder to teach than a sign language gorrilla.

Rakunin gave some good points for your second encounter, but I doubt that logic is going to solve this problem.

[brigadista]

so, i was talking to this republican recruiter dude. (who could not get over the obama crap about birth certificates and that white kid that got beat up) said france tried socialism and because of that, a bunch of middle easterners moved there. and he is saying that is a source of problems.
does anyone have any information on this "socialist france" i know its bullshit but i cant understand where he got that from. the only thing i can ever imagine is a social democratic phase.

this isnt anything worthy of learning, politics, or history. just something that is bugging me a bit

thanks


"A bunch of middle easterners moved there " there are french people with origins in north africa - algeria and francophone Africa[eg Mali] as a result of french COLONIALISM not socialism.. !!!

how stupid are these people giving this disinformation and you said they were recruiters... stoking up hostility to get people to join up perhaps?

read the book wretched of the earth by Frantz Fanon ,see the film the battle for algiers and then La haine and you will get the picture and be able to counter attack againt this ignorance

France isnt socialist however I wouldnt mind moving there for the 14 weeks holidays per year ....

[Rusty Shackleford]

Thankyou comrades.
About France, it must have been that period in the 60's where the middle easterners were asked to work in factories. He didnt explain his position well. He said that socialism existed there because the work week was brought down to 35 hours and they got better vacations:laugh:

And i see not many people know of the white kid getting beat up. well, there was some kid on a bus(white) who got beat up by a bunch of other kids (black) and the man who i talked to said that kid is now going to be racist for the rest of his life. and anyone would be if they were to be beat up by a different race, according to his logic.

he also tried to pin the problems of segregation and post-slavery racism on black people themselves for their "genetic aggresiveness" and culture. i made the point that when they were taken into slavery, their culture was left behind and they adopted language, religion, and culture of their new masters.

This man is a blatant racist.

He also used the robin hood analogy for socialism :laugh: what robinhood did was justifiable! To steal from the rich to save the over taxed poor that King Richard was levying for his little war? and, its also a story.


Anyways, if i do talk to him again, im going to ask him a simple question. Is Sweden Socialist? Or, Is China Communist?

[Dimentio]

The closest France ever got to socialism was in 1871, with the Paris Commune.
I don't know what he is refering to. It doesn't make a lot of sense in the first place.

The Gaullist Party had a policy of nationalisations and coporatism where the state played a major role. But republicans do not understand anything about European politics or the European culture (while Europeans tend to understand more about American politics). Also, the ruling party in France is socially conservative and statist.

In Europe, conservatism is statist. A lot of European conservative parties would gladly ban all guns if they had the chance.

[NecroCommie]

A lot of European conservative parties would gladly ban all guns if they had the chance.
Except from the army!

As to americans, and especially american conservatives being ignorant about european politics, does it not follow that the less you know the more you think you know? Apparently american conservatives think they have unlocked all the mysteries of space and time. :lol:

[Pogue]

Rest assured this man is talking a whole bunch of shit.

[scarletghoul]

France is in Europe. Europe is liberal. Liberalism is socialism. Therefore, France is socialist.

[NecroCommie]

If sweden is socialist, then I am a cappie. :laugh:

[Jazzratt]

Sweden is socialist is something I hear all the fucking time, usually from "socialists". It's like these people make up new meanings for words as they go along.

[Il Medico]

France is in Europe. Europe is liberal. Liberalism is socialism. Therefore, France is socialist.
Actually it is a little more along the lines of:
"France has the Arc de Triumph, Rome has the arch of Titus, the one it was modeled on. Italy was Allied to Nazi Germany in WWII. And Nazi Germany was defeated by the USSR who claimed they were communist, thus France is communist...By the Transitive property of bullshit."


EDIT: Now assuming that a conservative would know what the Arc de triumph is let along that it was modeled off of the Arch of Titus is giving them more credit than they deserve.

[Rusty Shackleford]

So, i was talking to the man again today. and guess what. a teacher wearing a Ludwig v Mises hat fucking walked up.

im just going to quit talking to him.

[Bilan]

Stupid people just tend to regard the French as socialists for really stupid reasons. Such as, lots of strikes. That's about it. That's probably the depth of his thought: inane presumptions.