Log in

View Full Version : Wither Anti-imperialist Internationalism and Revolutionary Defeatism?



SubVersion
29th September 2009, 15:10
“There are no boundaries in this struggle to the death. We cannot be indifferent to what happens anywhere in the world, for a victory by any country over imperialism is our victory”


—Ernesto Che Guevara

Certainly we can all acknowledge that every nation has the right freely to determine its own destiny. It has the right to arrange its life as it sees fit, without of course trampling on the rights of other nations. This is beyond dispute. Yet we must nonetheless understand that the struggle for the freedom of self-determination is a bourgeois-democratic demand, not a socialist one. With this in mind, what is the position to be taken by communists on the National Question in light of the objective conditions as they exist in the world today?

We can get some idea by looking at the position of the communists of Tsarist Russia in 1904. At that time it was a backward, semi-feudal and semi-colonial country and an imperialist state. It was economically subordinated to the wealthier imperialisms of Britain, America, France, Germany and Belgium. In 1904 tsarist Russia was at war with Japan—a young and aggressive imperialist power. The immediate cause of the clash was the conflict between Russia and Japan over China (Manchuria), but in fact, Japan was aiming to invade and conquer Siberia.

The war of 1904 between Russia and Japan was a war between two rival gangsters. Russian Tsarism oppressed the workers and peasants, but would Japanese rule have been any better? It is sufficient to recall the horrors of Japanese colonial rule in China to answer the question. What was the position of the Russian Marxists in the war of 1904? All the tendencies, from the Bolsheviks to the Mensheviks, adopted a defeatist position—they stood for the defeat of Russia. This was even the position of the Russian Liberals (Cadets), and every democratic trend. The defeat of Russia would lead to the overthrow of Tsarism—that was the reason why all revolutionaries and consistent democrats stood for a defeatist policy. Their position was shown to be correct in the first Russian revolution of 1905, which flowed directly from the defeat of Russia in the war. Surely we can also agree that revolutionary defeatism is just as viable a strategy in the U.S. today, when our imperialist military brutally occupies nations such as Iraq and Afghanistan.

In October of 1896 Rosa Luxemburg wrote an article in Sächsische Arbeiter-Zeitung, the German Social Democratic paper in Dresden. The piece was titled “Social Democracy and the National Struggle in Turkey.” Social Democracy in those days was just another name for communism. At the time the Armenians wanted to separate from Turkey. Luxemburg said, “Now what can be the position of Social Democracy towards the events in Turkey? In principle, Social Democracy always stands on the side of aspirations for freedom. The Christian nations, in this case the Armenians, want to liberate themselves from the yoke of Turkish rule, and Social Democracy must declare itself unreservedly in support of their cause.” Like the Iraqi resistance, the Armenians secessionists were not led by the working class. Unlike the Armenian secessionists, however, the Iraqis are suffering from a brutal foreign military occupation.

Today U.S. imperialism is waging an illegal war of aggression against the people of Iraq in what amounts to an international act of armed robbery (to steal that nation’s petroleum resources). As this war unfolds the gangster clique in Washington is actively planning an expanded war against the nation of Iran. With Iranian oil also under U.S. control, the U.S. imperialism will own the oil spigot that regulates the ability of China’s economy to grow. This is a recipe for another world war.

The international left cannot sleepwalk through yet another widening of the war. Marching in circles carrying signs is not enough to prevent the looming global catastrophe. More is required of progressive forces here inside the belly of the beast.

It has been four years since researchers from Johns Hopkins University collected data for a study which concluded 655,000 additional Iraqi deaths were caused by the U.S. war, and things have only gotten worse since then. They are dying from drinking the water; as many as one in eight Iraqi children die before reaching the age of five. The Iraqi people are fighting against the cause and source of these conditions—the U.S. government.

There are many parallels between the national liberation struggle of the people of Iraq today and the struggle of the Vietnamese people to expel that same invader from their lands. The response to each should be the same—solidarity. We must fight for the defeat of our own ruling class and for victory to those opposing the foreign military occupation of their lands.

The struggle of the Iraqi people is an anti-imperialist struggle. It is the duty of anti-imperialists in the occupier nation to support this struggle, if only on a tactical level (such as when they kill the invading military forces). Those who ridicule the notion that the Iraqis are fighting a legitimate battle that deserves our material (if critical) support should be exposed for the opportunists they are. This issue is not complicated. Ask yourselves these two simple questions, is this an anti-imperialist struggle? Yes or no? Does international law support the right of the Iraqi people to take up arms against foreign occupiers? Yes or no? If your answer to either of these questions is yes, then your duty is clear. Notwithstanding this very straight forward issue, there are those who objectively side with the occupation by proudly proclaiming, “I will not sell out Iraqi women, gays, and communists to a bunch of Islamic fascists.” In their zeal for political correctness they crawl into bed with their own ruling class.

These are the same “leftists” who call advocating support for the Iraqi and Afghani people “the terribly flawed logic of ‘my enemy's enemy is my friend’.” They, like Gorge W. Bush, will call the resistance fighters “Islamo fascists” or some variation of the term, they will trot out the Islamist’s treatment of women, etc. Such people do not really understand nature of the global struggle against U.S. imperialism. Only privileged Americans would characterize support for this anti-imperialist struggle as undeserving of our support. These “comrades” have not internalized the important lesson that class trumps all other forms of oppression.

There are those who believe that the central oppression is not one of class but is, rather, gender based, and if only women were in power it would all be so different. Well, yes, with a bunch of Margaret Thatcher types running the show it would be slightly different, but capitalism and imperialism would remain. The same is true if Blacks were calling the shots, or gays, etc. Yes, there would be important differences, such as progress in the areas of sexism, racism, and homophobia, but class would out in the end. Without a radical transformation of existing class relations it would be business as usual. Just look at today’s South Africa. Now they have white capitalism with a Black face selling weapons materials to Israel.

While this segment of the left prattles on and on about rights of women and the other crimes of the “Islamo Fascists,” they do not address the issue of oppressed and oppressor nation, or of occupied or occupier nation, or imperialist and anti-imperialist struggles. No, they do the same thing Bush and the bourgeois media do, hold up examples of the evil religious fundamentalists. The question is, however, do these wrongs negate our duty as anti-imperialists to support their struggle to be free of the foreign invaders—the invaders acting in our names? For the most part the answer on the left is yes, that indeed the islamo fascists (most of these people don’t know what fascism really is) must endure the crimes of our government because they do not meet the political correctness test we here in the occupying nation have set for them.

Sure, it would be nice if the Iraqi and Afghanistan resistance movements were led by communists or other working class formations. But the sad fact of the matter is that our government, with the silent acquiescence of the American people, installed and/or supported reactionary dictators like the Shah (Muhammad Reza Pahlavi) of Iran and Saddam Hussein in Iraq. These two U.S. supported thugs murdered many of the progressives, leaving the religious leaders as the primary force to oppose the current occupations. Are we to now wrench our bloody hands and say “we can’t help you because you are not communists” or because “we disagree with you on the issue of women’s rights or gay equality”? To do so would be to elevate those issues above the right of a people to throw off the yoke of a foreign invader; it would be a slap in the face of the global struggle against U.S. imperialism. It’s not about fascists versus imperialists; it’s about a people’s inalienable right to choose their own fate and to control their own resources. It is, in short, about right and wrong.


While people in other parts of the world are fighting and dying in the just struggle against international imperialism, we here in the belly of the beast enjoy a special privilege of limiting our feeble protests to only lawful means (read acceptable to the bourgeoisie). This is nothing short of American Exceptionalism—a racist belief that our lives are more precious than those of our darker-skinned comrades in places like Palestine, Afghanistan, Somalia, and Iraq. History demands more from us.

capsulvok
5th October 2009, 07:53
Great little topic.
And Nice work--thank you for sharing- for me this makes perfect sense though.

Niccolò Rossi
7th October 2009, 13:43
What a rediculous article. Where, out of curiosity, did you source it? Is it your own?

To deal with some specific points of the article itself (apologies for the laziness of my reply):


Certainly we can all acknowledge that every nation has the right freely to determine its own destiny.

As communists, certainly not! Communists do not speak abstractly in terms of 'nations' and 'peoples'. Nations are composed of classes. The 'right' of a nation to 'freely determin its own destiny' is nothing other than the unrestrcited, free reign of the national bourgeoisie!


We can get some idea by looking at the position of the communists of Tsarist Russia in 1904. At that time it was a backward, semi-feudal and semi-colonial country and an imperialist state. It was economically subordinated to the wealthier imperialisms of Britain, America, France, Germany and Belgium.

How amazing it is that so-called communists defending 'anti-imperialist' positions manage to forget this reality completely!


In October of 1896 Rosa Luxemburg wrote an article in Sächsische Arbeiter-Zeitung, the German Social Democratic paper in Dresden. The piece was titled “Social Democracy and the National Struggle in Turkey.” Social Democracy in those days was just another name for communism. At the time the Armenians wanted to separate from Turkey. Luxemburg said, “Now what can be the position of Social Democracy towards the events in Turkey? In principle, Social Democracy always stands on the side of aspirations for freedom. The Christian nations, in this case the Armenians, want to liberate themselves from the yoke of Turkish rule, and Social Democracy must declare itself unreservedly in support of their cause.”

This is probably the part of the article which dumb-founded me the most. Luxemburg was, contrary to Lenin, an opponent of the 'right of nations to self-determination'. How it can even attempted to bastardise her work to justify a completely anti-thetical position to that which she held is beyond me.


There are many parallels between the national liberation struggle of the people of Iraq today and the struggle of the Vietnamese people to expel that same invader from their lands. The response to each should be the same—solidarity. We must fight for the defeat of our own ruling class and for victory to those opposing the foreign military occupation of their lands.

The line upheld by the Bolsehviks of 'revolutionary defeatism' during the Russo-Japanese war (which was cited at the start of this article) has nothing at all to do with this position. Standing for the defeat of Russian Imperialism during the war did not mean giving support to Japanese Imperialism! Your line is not a 'revolutionary defeatist' line at all. Of course, this shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone, but quoting the former example as an introduction to your argument does.


Ask yourselves these two simple questions, is this an anti-imperialist struggle? Yes or no?

No.


Does international law support the right of the Iraqi people to take up arms against foreign occupiers? Yes or no?As a communist, I don't give a damn what international law says.


Notwithstanding this very straight forward issue, there are those who objectively side with the occupation by proudly proclaiming, “I will not sell out Iraqi women, gays, and communists to a bunch of Islamic fascists.” In their zeal for political correctness they crawl into bed with their own ruling class.

What of the internationalists? Are we few and forgotten?


Such people do not really understand nature of the global struggle against U.S. imperialism.

Such people as yourself do not understand the nature of international class struggle against the world bourgeoisie.


Only privileged Americans would characterize support for this anti-imperialist struggle as undeserving of our support.

This is nothing but a lie. I wonder how the author would respond to the Left Communist militants in Mexico, Venezuela, Brazil, the Phillipines, India and Turkey who uphold this line? What of the other internationalists in Latin America? In the Middle East? In Asia?

More than this, I wonder if the author of the article is anoything more than a 'privileged American'? (The Author actually answers my question themselves: "we here in the belly of the beast enjoy a special privilege")


These “comrades” have not internalized the important lesson that class trumps all other forms of oppression.

How can the author uphold the line they do, and then go on to say this?

Stranger Than Paradise
7th October 2009, 16:46
This article is just completely stupid. It is based completely on sweeping generalisations and falsehoods. How can supporting Working Class Freedom as opposed to bourgeois democracy be bourgeois?

The Ungovernable Farce
7th October 2009, 20:57
Rossi demolishes that article pretty well. Honestly, if people insist on peddling support for nationalism, they should at least be honest enough not to call it "internationalism".

red cat
7th October 2009, 21:16
.

This is nothing but a lie. I wonder how the author would respond to the Left Communist militants in Mexico, Venezuela, Brazil, the Phillipines, India and Turkey who uphold this line? What of the other internationalists in Latin America? In the Middle East? In Asia?


May we have some information about the activities of these guys?

The Ungovernable Farce
7th October 2009, 21:31
Turkish left communists (http://eks.internationalist-forum.org/en)
Left Communists in the Phillipines (http://en.internationalism.org/node/3037)
I'm sure Devrim will be able to say more than I could about the Turks, tho.

Niccolò Rossi
7th October 2009, 22:30
May we have some information about the activities of these guys?

In the cases you highlight I am referring explicitly to the International Communist Current (ICC) who have sections in these nations. What more information would you be after exactly?

It should be noted about the links procided by UF; the EKS website hasn't been updated in over a year as they are now a territorial section of the ICC. Internasyonalismo's (now ICC section of Phillipines) old website can be found here (http://internasyonalismo.blogsome.com/). You can find their language specific websites here (http://tl.internationalism.org/) and here (http://tr.internationalism.org/), you can also access materials in Hindi, Bangali and Farsi (amongst others).

Yehuda Stern
7th October 2009, 22:37
I do not see where NR has "demolished the article"; perhaps it could be pointed out to me. A bunch of one liners a demolition do not make. The truth is that the article has many flaws, but none of them are related to the dogmatic slogans of left-communism put out by most posters in this thread.

To begin with, I do not agree that every nation has a right to determine its destiny. Or, to be more precise, I don't think that it's a right that communists would always defend. Leninists only protect the right of self-determination of oppressed peoples, and do not recognize aristocratic, i.e. imperialist nations.

Another flaw is the writer's reliance on international law. The ways in which the imperialists settle their domination of the world amongst themselves is of no consequence to communists; their laws serve, in the last analysis, the interests of the world bourgeoisie and the imperialist bourgeoisie specifically. Our support for the struggle of the resistance in Iraq against the US occupation is due to the fact that it is a struggle against imperialism, not because of some law made by the imperialists to ensure their self-determination at the expense of the oppressed nations of the world.

But the main problem is what seems to me to be a refusal to politically challenge the Islamists and other bourgeois leaderships and to forgive their flaws because they lead the resistance. On the contrary, revolutionaries should seek to expose their rotten politics and show that they must inevitably betray the struggle of the masses. Part of this is the writer's dismissive attitude towards women's struggles, which already shows the terrible consequences of such a stance.

Niccolò Rossi
7th October 2009, 22:51
I do not see where NR has "demolished the article"

Nor I for that matter, maybe whittle at most.

On a serious note, Yehuda is right (atleast from a principled Leninist perspective) in his criticisms of the article.

Nwoye
7th October 2009, 23:49
"When we speak of the “right of nations to self-determination, “ we are using the concept of the “nation” as a homogeneous social and political entity. But actually, such a concept of the “nation” is one of those categories of bourgeois ideology which Marxist theory submitted to a radical re-vision, showing how that misty veil, like the concepts of the “freedom of citizens,” “equality before the law,” etc., conceals in every case a definite historical content.

In a class society, “the nation” as a homogeneous socio-political entity does not exist. Rather, there exist within each nation, classes with antagonistic interests and “rights.” There literally is not one social area, from the coarsest material relationships to the most subtle moral ones, in which the possessing class and the class-conscious proletariat hold the same attitude, and in which they appear as a consolidated “national” entity. [...] And whenever the formal strivings and the interests of the proletariat and those of the bourgeoisie (as a whole or in its most progressive part) seem identical – for example, in the field of democratic aspirations - there, under the identity of forms and slogans, is hidden the most complete divergence of contents and essential politics.

There can be no talk of a collective and uniform will, of the self-determination of the “nation” in a society formed in such a manner. If we find in the history of modern societies “national” movements, and struggles for “national interests,” these are usually class movements of the ruling strata of the bourgeoisie, which can in any given case represent the interest of the other strata of the population only insofar as under the form of “national interests” it defends progressive forms of historical development, and insofar as the working class has not yet distinguished itself from the mass of the “nation” (led by the bourgeoisie) into an independent, enlightened political class." - Rosa

blake 3:17
8th October 2009, 00:16
BTW, I think you mean "whither" not "wither". There's an important difference...

red cat
8th October 2009, 01:48
To The Ungovernable Farce and Niccolň Rossi: Thank you for the links. I was a little confused before by the terms you used. Here in the third world, "militant"(as well as "far left", ultra-left" etc.) often refers to the Maoists. I read some of the articles, and given the actions of the Maoists in both Philippines and India for the last few years, any common Indian or Filipino would laugh after reading all that.

To the OP: Your line seems almost identical to that of some Maoist parties. Am I right?

Niccolò Rossi
8th October 2009, 02:06
I read some of the articles, and given the actions of the Maoists in both Philippines and India for the last few years, any common Indian or Filipino would laugh after reading all that.

What in particular do you think they would laugh at? The use of the term 'militant' or the politics of left communism?


To the OP: Your line seems almost identical to that of some Maoist parties. Am I right?

I'm interested in this; you seem to speak about the Maoists in third person. You have your profile tendency set as 'Marxist-Leninist-Maoist' though. Are you a Maoist? Are you a member of supporter of a Maoist group? You also say 'here in the Third World' - what country do you live in?

red cat
8th October 2009, 05:07
What in particular do you think they would laugh at? The use of the term 'militant' or the politics of left communism?

Consider the following article:

http://en.internationalism.org/internasyonalismo/2009/national-situation

Now let us see this from the point of view of a poor Filipino peasant or worker. The peasant or worker has been thoroughly exploited through the whole of his life. Then he sees Maoists leading him and his co-workers to get rid of the land-lord/ factory-owner. He also observes that the Maoists engage in armed warfare for this. As he participates in class-struggle, he slowly learns the basics of communist theory from the Maoists(and may be even joins their party). And then suddenly, he reads this article which attempts to equate the Maoists with the state and claims that Maoists are not communist revolutionaries at all. What will be his attitude towards left communists?




I'm interested in this; you seem to speak about the Maoists in third person. You have your profile tendency set as 'Marxist-Leninist-Maoist' though. Are you a Maoist? Are you a member of supporter of a Maoist group? You also say 'here in the Third World' - what country do you live in?

I prefer not to disclose information relevant to the above queries.

Niccolò Rossi
8th October 2009, 08:09
Now let us see this from the point of view of a poor Filipino peasant or worker. The peasant or worker has been thoroughly exploited through the whole of his life. Then he sees Maoists leading him and his co-workers to get rid of the land-lord/ factory-owner. He also observes that the Maoists engage in armed warfare for this. As he participates in class-struggle, he slowly learns the basics of communist theory from the Maoists(and may be even joins their party). And then suddenly, he reads this article which attempts to equate the Maoists with the state and claims that Maoists are not communist revolutionaries at all. What will be his attitude towards left communists?

Well it's not a matter of proclaiming: "The Maoists are anti-worker gangsters leading you astray; follow us!"

More than this, the central issue of the statement which you link to is not on the class character of Maoism (for this you might want to see: "Against the counter-revolutionary ideology of Maoism in the Phillipines (http://internasyonalismo.blogsome.com/2008/02/04/against-the-counter-revolutionary-ideology-of-maoism-in-the-philippines/)").

Also, I think the description you give of the role of Maoism amongst the masses in the Phillipines is a pathetic caricature of reality.

Besides, I'm not sure what your solution is. Do you propose the communist left adopt the opportunist tactic of refusing to criticise Maoism where the Filipino masses are under it's sway?

One could equally ask any communist: "What do you think the attitude of Muslim peasants and workers will be towards communists who tell them we support the right of couples to have sex outside of wed-lock (including homosexuals) and of women to not wear the hijab?"
"What do you think the attitude of Christian peasants and workers will be towards communists who tell them we support the right of women to have abortions and the free use of contraception?"
"What do you think the attitude of peasants and workers under the influence of nationalist and racist ideology will be towards communists who tell them 'the workers have no country' and call 'workers of the world, unite'?"
"What do you think the attitude of peasants and workers under the influence of bourgeois democratic ideology will be towards communists who tell them this is nothing more than the masked dictatorship of the ruling class?"

We are not opportunists. We tell the masses the truth.

Dimentio
8th October 2009, 08:52
The USA could probably not be defeated by military means in today's war in Afghanistan.

The only way to defeat the US is to give US decision-makers the impression that the war is unwinnable (which it is).

Only in a war against China and Russia could the US probably be defeated, and its defeat in such a war would mean mass-death.

It is also not so very sure that the US would turn communist because of a defeat in a war. It is as likely that it might turn fascist.

red cat
8th October 2009, 13:24
Well it's not a matter of proclaiming: "The Maoists are anti-worker gangsters leading you astray; follow us!"

More than this, the central issue of the statement which you link to is not on the class character of Maoism (for this you might want to see: "Against the counter-revolutionary ideology of Maoism in the Phillipines").

Also, I think the description you give of the role of Maoism amongst the masses in the Phillipines is a pathetic caricature of reality.

Besides, I'm not sure what your solution is. Do you propose the communist left adopt the opportunist tactic of refusing to criticise Maoism where the Filipino masses are under it's sway?

One could equally ask any communist: "What do you think the attitude of Muslim peasants and workers will be towards communists who tell them we support the right of couples to have sex outside of wed-lock (including homosexuals) and of women to not wear the hijab?"
"What do you think the attitude of Christian peasants and workers will be towards communists who tell them we support the right of women to have abortions and the free use of contraception?"
"What do you think the attitude of peasants and workers under the influence of nationalist and racist ideology will be towards communists who tell them 'the workers have no country' and call 'workers of the world, unite'?"
"What do you think the attitude of peasants and workers under the influence of bourgeois democratic ideology will be towards communists who tell them this is nothing more than the masked dictatorship of the ruling class?"

We are not opportunists. We tell the masses the truth.

There is no thread in revleft on the achievements of Filipino Maoists, but there is one on the Indian Maoists. If you have any questions regarding the activities of Maoists in any third world country, you can ask those here:

http://www.revleft.com/vb/india-losing-maoist-t117578/index.html

Trying to compare a communist movement with a religion is of no use. It is a fact that except in Colombia, no self-proclaimed communist party that is not Maoist has taken up the task of leading a revolutionary war.

Leo
8th October 2009, 14:40
Here in the third world, "militant"(as well as "far left", ultra-left" etc.) often refers to the Maoists.

I don't know where you live (your IP doesn't seem to be coming from the third world) but here in the middle east, neither the word militant, nor far left nor ultra-left often refers to Maoists. As far as I am aware of, the official Soviet line identified Maoism as a "right-wing deviation", and thus identified it with fascism more than ultra-leftism. In Turkey, the Tankies called Maoists "Maoist Gray-Wolves" in the 70ies when both had any significance. It was a mostly accurate description, not that the tankies were any better of course.


and given the actions of the Maoists in both Philippines and India for the last few years, any common Indian or Filipino would laugh after reading all that.

Yeah, I'm sure families of Indian or Filipino workers and peasants who were slaughtered by the brutal counter-revolutionary Maoists laugh when they read about Maoists a lot.


Now let us see this from the point of view of a poor Filipino peasant or worker. The peasant or worker has been thoroughly exploited through the whole of his life. Then he sees Maoists

... coming and murdering members of his family, his workmates, bullying him, his family and his workmates, not being even a bit different from his usual exploiters, the brutal local states and so forth.

As touching as your concern for how well the arguements of our militants in the Philippines and India are taken, we are doing just fine thank you. In the Philipines, in fact, it is the workers themselves who protect our militants in the towns they operate from Maoist brutality.

red cat
8th October 2009, 15:54
I don't know where you live (your IP doesn't seem to be coming from the third world) but here in the middle east, neither the word militant, nor far left nor ultra-left often refers to Maoists. As far as I am aware of, the official Soviet line identified Maoism as a "right-wing deviation", and thus identified it with fascism more than ultra-leftism. In Turkey, the Tankies called Maoists "Maoist Gray-Wolves" in the 70ies when both had any significance. It was a mostly accurate description, not that the tankies were any better of course.



Yeah, I'm sure families of Indian or Filipino workers and peasants who were slaughtered by the brutal counter-revolutionary Maoists laugh when they read about Maoists a lot.



... coming and murdering members of his family, his workmates, bullying him, his family and his workmates, not being even a bit different from his usual exploiters, the brutal local states and so forth.

As touching as your concern for how well the arguements of our militants in the Philippines and India are taken, we are doing just fine thank you. In the Philipines, in fact, it is the workers themselves who protect our militants in the towns they operate from Maoist brutality.

Excellent theory there.

By the way, have your Filipino or Indian counterparts been able to launch even one offensive against the government forces?

Leo
8th October 2009, 16:14
Exploding a few bombs here and there or killing a few people is not an offensive against the government forces. It is classes that can actually fight the existing order, not individual bombers or assassins.

red cat
8th October 2009, 18:33
Exploding a few bombs here and there or killing a few people is not an offensive against the government forces.

That is not exactly the description of Maoist activities in the Philippines or India.


It is classes that can actually fight the existing order, not individual bombers or assassins.

Can the existing order be fought without actually fighting a war?