G-20 march turns chaotic on streets of Pittsburgh

[KurtFF8]

Source (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090924/ap_on_re_us/g20_summit_protests;_ylt=AoFgg0SDVp07JO3PYVhcobOs0 NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTMxNWliNDFpBGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMDkwOTI0L 2cyMF9zdW1taXRfcHJvdGVzdHMEY3BvcwMxBHBvcwMyBHB0A2h vbWVfY29rZQRzZWMDeW5fdG9wX3N0b3J5BHNsawNnLTIwbWFyY 2h0dXI-)



By DANIEL LOVERING and MICHAEL RUBINKAM, Associated Press Writers Daniel Lovering And Michael Rubinkam, Associated Press Writers – 6 mins ago
PITTSBURGH – Protesters and police are clashing on the streets of Pittsburgh after police tried to break up a march opposing the Group of 20 summit.
Protesters rolled trash bins toward police and a man in a black hooded sweat shirt threw rocks at a police car, breaking the front windshield. Some protesters also are using pallets and corrugated steel to block a road.
Officers fired pepper spray and smoke at the protesters. Some of those exposed to the pepper spray were coughing, complaining of eyes watering and stinging.
The march began with several hundred protesters. It did not have a city permit and police declared it an unlawful assembly. The group broke into smaller groups after being confronted by police.
THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP's earlier story is below.
PITTSBURGH (AP) — Protesters and police are clashing on the streets of Pittsburgh after police tried to break up a march oppposing the Group of 20 summit.
Protesters rolled trash bins toward police and a man in a black hooded sweat shirt threw rocks at a police car, breaking the front windshield. Some protesters also are using pallets and corrugated steel to block a road.
Officers fired gas at the protesters. Some of those exposed to the gas were coughing, complaining of eyes watering and stinging.
The march began with several hundred protesters. It did not have a city permit and police declared it an unlawful assembly. The group broke into smaller groups after being confronted by police.


Seems only a few hundred were involved in this. I don't know that that means only a few hundred of these black blockers or in general but I'm sure we'll eventually know since this is quite breaking.

[What Would Durruti Do?]

Sounds like they're being way too predictable. They need to split up and start pushing the police around.

I guess it is just the first day though.

[ellipsis]

They need to split up and start pushing the police around.

explain the merits/goals of this tactic, please.

[What Would Durruti Do?]

explain the merits/goals of this tactic, please.

Confusion of the police, gives the protesters the advantage of defining their own territory and setting up defenses/barricades. Basically, it's attempting a role reversal by putting the police on the run, rather then just letting the police march all over organized marches. This is a common tactic of the Black Bloc and other groups.

But like I said it's only the first day. I'm curious if there will be any attempts to control downtown like at the RNC.

[KurtFF8]

Confusion of the police, gives the protesters the advantage of defining their own territory and setting up defenses/barricades. Basically, it's attempting a role reversal by putting the police on the run, rather then just letting the police march all over organized marches. This is a common tactic of the Black Bloc and other groups.

Which is why I don't see the point of Black Bloc organizing. There is a video in the top headline of Yahoo! News that shows some kids shouting "Anarchy is fun!" Need I say more about this particular group's tactics and goals?

/sectarian rant

[bcbm]

Need I say more about this particular group's tactics and goals?

No need, one group of kids goofing is clearly enough to damn a 30 year old tactic.

[What Would Durruti Do?]

Which is why I don't see the point of Black Bloc organizing. There is a video in the top headline of Yahoo! News that shows some kids shouting "Anarchy is fun!" Need I say more about this particular group's tactics and goals?

/sectarian rant

You don't see the point in trying to gain the advantage in riot situations and attempting to quell police aggression? This is a board of revolutionaries right?

I don't see the problem with someone enjoying their direct action tactics either. I wish I was there myself.

[Kukulofori]

Which is why I don't see the point of Black Bloc organizing. There is a video in the top headline of Yahoo! News that shows some kids shouting "Anarchy is fun!" Need I say more about this particular group's tactics and goals?

/sectarian rant

Well said comrade. The best tactic is clearly posting on RevLeft and not posing a credible threat or even voice of opposition to anything.

[Rusty Shackleford]

I posted in OI aswell but i have a link to video and source

http://socialistwebzine.blogspot.com/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia0wVU3RHkI&feature=player_embedded

i certainly feel there needs to be more of this kind of confrontation. yes they retreated but they brought attention to it and up until the gas they defied the police orders.

[What Would Durruti Do?]

You can keep up with everything pretty well at this site: http://indypgh.org/g20/#

[☭World Views]

No one should attend a protest without a gas mask handy and possibly a pair of gloves.

Kevlar armor and a video camera disguised as a common item are also great.

[bcbm]

Kevlar armor

too bulky and expensive. you're better off making some homemade armor out of pvc and foam.

[RedSonRising]

Obama:

President Obama, in an interview with the Toledo Blade (http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009909200322), cautions would-be protesters of the upcoming G20 Summit that while such protests are "are a sign of a healthy democracy," they're not likely to have much of a net impact:

"I was always a big believer in - when I was doing organizing before I went to law school - that focusing on concrete, local, immediate issues that have an impact on people's lives is what really makes a difference and that having protests about abstractions [such] as global capitalism or something, generally, is not really going to make much of a difference."


Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/21/obama-calls-g-20-protests_n_293620.html

An abstraction? (shakes head)

[KurtFF8]

While I do actually think that there are better ways to organize than the Black Bloc, my comment shouldn't have been taken too seriously (note the "/sectarian rant" part).

I don't think that all of those kids are just in it for the fun (although perhaps it is one of the attractions for egging on violent confrontation for them).

I just think that the sort of breaking up into small groups to directly confront the police doesn't accomplish too much, unless media attention itself is what the goal is, because if that's the case then perhaps it was successful.

[bcbm]

i believe the intent is to disrupt "business as usual." the fun part is that the police state inevitably created around this sort of shit does a good job of that too.

[YSR]

Saw a Youtube of some kids throwing lots of rocks at cops. That doesn't happen too often on the U.S. Left, interesting to see that emerging.

[bcbm]

Got a link on that?

[redasheville]

The problem with black bloc organizing, IMO, is that it is substitutionist. Instead of building a protest as broadly and as widely as possible, its 20 something protesters egging on cops. It invites repression.

(some) Anarchists in the US have turned "direct action" into a fetish. I am all for confronting cops, and being militant, but without a mass base where do such tactics get you? Other than inside a paddy wagon*.

*to be clear I am in absolute solidarity with any protester, regardless of tactics, that gets beaten, gassed, arrested etc.

[ellipsis]

I just think that the sort of breaking up into small groups to directly confront the police doesn't accomplish too much, unless media attention itself is what the goal is, because if that's the case then perhaps it was successful.

Perhaps this tactic would be more effective if it were a)part of a broader mass struggle and b) were deployed in a sustained manner, thus creating a state of urgency within a given society.

[redasheville]

Saw a Youtube of some kids throwing lots of rocks at cops. That doesn't happen too often on the U.S. Left, interesting to see that emerging.

Actually, it happens quite a bit. The problem is that it is isolated, white anarchist youth playing '68 dress up, and not a spontaneous manifestation of a mass movement (hence it is substitutionist). It is not the emergence of a US intifada, or anything.

[bcbm]

The problem with black bloc organizing, IMO, is that it is substitutionist. Instead of building a protest as broadly and as widely as possible, its 20 something protesters egging on cops. It invites repression.

Black bloc is a tactic, not a form of organizing.

[redasheville]

Black bloc is a tactic, not a form of organizing.

Yea but like...they have to be organized, right? People didn't just happen to all wear black that day, right?

True story: during a mass anti war demo in San Francisco, the black bloc split from the march to go down Haight St. to protest the gap. Millions of Iraqis are being murdered, BUT THERE IS A GAP WITHIN WALKING DISTANCE OF AMOEBA RECORDS OH NOES!!!

[KurtFF8]

*to be clear I am in absolute solidarity with any protester, regardless of tactics, that gets beaten, gassed, arrested etc.

I would like to echo this as well. While I'm not necessarily a supporter of the tactic, I'm obviously quite a big supporter of people who oppose capitalism and want to replace it with any form of socialism as people to stand in solidarity with. Even though I think that their tactics do result in further police repression, it certainly doesn't justify that repression.

I'm always for building more bridges in the left than the burning them down via silly sectarian battles.

[bcbm]

Actually, it happens quite a bit. The problem is that it is isolated, white anarchist youth playing '68 dress up, and not a spontaneous manifestation of a mass movement (hence it is substitutionist). It is not the emergence of a US intifada, or anything.

In my experience actual conflict with the police is incredibly rare. I don't think it has anything to do with "white anarchist youth" wanting to play dress up. Ugh... don't really feel like going into this fully right now, sorry, but there are plenty of communiques from various historical black blocs spelling out why they do what they do.


Yea but like...they have to be organized, right? People didn't just happen to all wear black that day, right?

Sure, but anarchists typically play a large role in organizing other aspects of large protests as well. They've certainly played a key role in logistics at the pass few mass mobilizations.

[redasheville]

Sure, but anarchists typically play a large role in organizing other aspects of large protests as well. They've certainly played a key role in logistics at the pass few mass mobilizations.

Yea, sure I wouldn't deny that, sorry if that was implied.

[1billion]

I went to the protests, police were brutal, absolute insanity

[bcbm]

Pretty sure I just heard over the police radio that they're sending some military to investigate some groups of people in black on the street... fucking a.

[Salyut]

I went to the protests, police were brutal, absolute insanity

What was the LRAD like? O_o

[1billion]

What was the LRAD like? O_o

loud as hell, awful lol

[1billion]

Pretty sure I just heard over the police radio that they're sending some military to investigate some groups of people in black on the street... fucking a.
it was crazy, cops were just doing w/e they wanted, they had their masks on so they were just faceless people doing w/e, lol, craziness.

[bcbm]

group of 100 people are still on the streets. no word what they're up to but a mobile force of swine is on the way. sounds like the piggies couldn't find the groups of people in black mentioned previously. i'm interested to see how tomorrow is going to go. during the rnc last year the pigs were pretty vicious following the first day after shit went down, i wonder if the pittsburgh ones will do the same. tomorrow is supposed to be a mass, permitted, peaceful march.

[KurtFF8]

This is quite interesting, one protestor was arrested in an unmarked car in a way that seems like kidnap style:

G8CNa_viKg0

[Mindtoaster]

Reddit, I had to create an account to post about what just happened on my campus. I go to the University of Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh... G20, you know. President Obama's dinner for the delegates happened just off campus, within eyesight of us -- usually. When people grouped up by the street that would lead to the Phipps Conservatory, they were met with armored police.
For a while the students and locals just stood and talked while the police line faced us. Some people sang and had signs. Others just watched. Slowly, the line of locals began to advance. A police officer with a megaphone stepped out several times and told us to leave the area, but as we weren't doing anything wrong, most people didn't leave.
That's when they shot a canister of gas at us. Reddit, sprinting away from armored police who looked like Storm Troopers from Star Wars, hearing that hissing sound while one of my favorite spots on campus filled with smoke... it was terrifying.
When the smoke cleared the crowd was still there.
This standoff lasted several hours. Around 10:30, the atmosphere had changed. The police had advanced far up the road toward students, who were kept back to a grassy area called Schenley Plaza. Students were singing and dancing. It was very peaceful. Someone said something to a cop.
Suddenly the guy was grabbed and thrown on the ground. The crowd AT ONCE surrounded the cops and started chanting LET HIM GO! LET HIM GO! LET HIM GO!
There was a dumpster lit on fire further up the road, so I went up there to see what I could see, and suddenly there were tons of people sprinting down the sidewalk away from the fire. SWAT vans and six or seven major police cars pulled up to Schenley Plaza.
Reddit, the next two hours were complete chaos. My campus was invaded by armored police officers. They threw actual tear gas into crowds of students. They SHOT students with rubber bullets. They beat slower-moving students with a baton. I saw a group of cyclists being herded down the sidewalk. A cop reached out and pushed a woman on a bike. She turned around and pushed her bike at the cop. Next thing we knew, he grabbed her by the face and slammed her down on the concrete.
They slowly advanced us back down Forbes Avenue, toward the major freshman dorms. Several protesters broke storefront windows. I'd guess 20 protesting, about 1,000 students watching (if that.) The police fired Sound Cannons at us, a new weapon never before used on US citizens, which plays a sonic pulse that gives major headaches. They fired more tear gas at the students.
Then riot squads came running up behind us and forced us into the Litchfield Towers Lobby. People who did not make it into the lobby before the riot squads got to the doors were grabbed, thrown to the ground, beaten, and arrested.
Here is the part where I felt most violated -- The riot cops then ENTERED our dormitory and shouted that students needed to return to their rooms immediately. Anyone arrested, they said, would be expelled from the University of Pittsburgh, no questions asked.
Reddit, is that legal? Would police be able to force someone on the sidewalk back in their home and make them barricade themselves in their basement?
Here's another part that got me -- I saw students try to get in the doors closest to their dorm building (there are 3 towers), and the door was LOCKED. These students did not have time to run around the building. And they were grabbed.
We don't know what to do. We're shocked. BECAUSE THE DEPUTY POLICE CHIEF RELEASED A STATEMENT CLAIMING THEY WERE SECURING THE AREA FROM ANARCHISTS AND THAT "SOME" STUDENTS "PROBABLY GOT CAUGHT UP" IN WHAT HAPPENED.
So, in the news, you'll hear that police secured the campus from anarchists. Not that students were attacked by security forces supposedly there to protect them. PLEASE, help me get the word out. I'll be around all day tomorrow for questions.

http://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/9nxw2/armored_police_seize_university_of_pittsburgh/

These pigs will get what they have coming one day...

http://blogchef.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/crispy_bacon_1.jpg

[Farther Lee]

This sight is looking more and more like a dialog between smart duplicitous (lying) CIA/ MI5/6 agents etc, and the unavoidably naive but revolutionary youth who are correctly looking for leadership.
Advice: Just read the original authors- then apply the best of it to your own situation. Always be suspicious of anything other than your own best leadership.

[bcbm]

Delicious summary of yesterday from CrimethInc here (http://www.crimethinc.com/texts/recentfeatures/g20.php).

[bcbm]

http://www.pittnews.com/sites/default/files/RIOT4_VW_0.jpg

[dez]

You don't see the point in trying to gain the advantage in riot situations and attempting to quell police aggression? This is a board of revolutionaries right?

I don't see the problem with someone enjoying their direct action tactics either. I wish I was there myself.

Real revolutionary / conspiratorial tactics involve concealing ones identity and being able to show who you are and what you want to talk at the same time.
Clashing with the police has other goals than gathering the support of the collective.


But hey, good luck on getting your point accross.

[ellipsis]

Regardless if people smash windows, burn dumpsters, throw rocks etc., regardless if they are "true anarchists"(I thought anarchists were anti-hierarchy but apparently not, some anarchists are better/more authentic than others) do you think that the capitalist media would ever a)accurately portray the message/intent/actions of the protesters and b) ever cover the story in depth rather that "police and protesters clashed at hte g20, 66 people were arrested, in other news Barack Obama declared victory on the global financial crisis."?

[What Would Durruti Do?]

Real revolutionary / conspiratorial tactics involve concealing ones identity and being able to show who you are and what you want to talk at the same time.
Clashing with the police has other goals than gathering the support of the collective.


But hey, good luck on getting your point accross.

Uhm, what? You think they're voluntarily clashing with the police or something?

These are protesters who are TRYING to get their point across and the police state isn't letting them. What's your problem with people defending their free speech rights?

[ls]

Perhaps this tactic would be more effective if it were a)part of a broader mass struggle and b) were deployed in a sustained manner, thus creating a state of urgency within a given society.

While some black bloc protests are simply all a black bloc, many are not and break away from the main group of protestors (kind of wise as other protestors are going to get hurt if they don't). Your second point makes no sense, please elaborate.

[redwinter]

Obama:

President Obama, in an interview with the Toledo Blade (http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009909200322), cautions would-be protesters of the upcoming G20 Summit that while such protests are "are a sign of a healthy democracy," they're not likely to have much of a net impact:
"I was always a big believer in - when I was doing organizing before I went to law school - that focusing on concrete, local, immediate issues that have an impact on people's lives is what really makes a difference and that having protests about abstractions [such] as global capitalism or something, generally, is not really going to make much of a difference."


Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/21/obama-calls-g-20-protests_n_293620.html

An abstraction? (shakes head)

This sounds just like the economists who label themselves "socialist" or "communist" in the US...(it's no wonder that so many of them endorsed/gave "critical support" to Obama). They usually bring up arguments like this when someone is arguing for the need to spread communist theory or actually talk about socialism etc., or to organize any kind of meaningful resistance. Also reminds me of the charity types who think working in a soup kitchen is more important than revolutionary organizing...

[ellipsis]

Your second point makes no sense, please elaborate.

A sense of urgency/emergency among the populace demonstrates that the government can no longer maintain order and rule of law, that it has a powerful opposition and is weak. Delegitimizing the capitalist regime is very important to garner popular support for a revolution.

Also it helps create a revolutionary milieu which both empowers the existing movement and helps with recruitment efforts among members of the left and proletariat as a whole.

[ls]

A sense of urgency/emergency among the populace demonstrates that the government can no longer maintain order and rule of law, that it has a powerful opposition and is weak. Delegitimizing the capitalist regime is very important to garner popular support for a revolution.

Also it helps create a revolutionary milieu which both empowers the existing movement and helps with recruitment efforts among members of the left and proletariat as a whole.

In some places, black blocs have been sustained for quite a while, there's only so long you can go on before the bloc gets broken up if you get what I mean.

It is a good point nonetheless, I'm sure that groups do choose to voluntarily end protesting after they feel tired out, but you do have to remember that it's extremely hard to keep going like that for hours and hours on end.....

[cop an Attitude]

I was down there as a documentor and citizen jornalist. They where totally out of line gassing us in that neighborhood! Everyone was coming out of their houses to watch, most just working class people that actully supported us or just didn't care. Then came the warning. People went inside but once the canasters flew inside wasn't good enough. I saw a grandmother clentching her banaster screaming, children and reporters running and gaging. This is not how to handle peaceful crowds at all, but sadly their is little to do about a balltalion of 300 hockeyplayers with guns marching down your alleyways and avenues. When i met Cindy Sheehan on the bus back from the peoples march I asked her to sum up the last 2 days in one sentence. "police state".

[La Comédie Noire]

I was there, I hope everyone else who went made it out okay.



It is a good point nonetheless, I'm sure that groups do choose to voluntarily end protesting after they feel tired out, but you do have to remember that it's extremely hard to keep going like that for hours and hours on end.....

Yeah we were all resting at Friendship Park, we were all wicked tired, when we heard a black bloc was coming and was being tailed by a shit load of cops. We almost got trapped in, but luckily most of the people in my group booked it down an ally. From what I heard they beat a few people.

This was my first mass action and I didn't take good care of myself so I got winded and scared really fast.

But I did meet some great people and talked to them about HM! :)

[Red Rebel]

KurftFF8 can probably attest to this better than anyone here on RevLeft but I am no where close to an anarchist or anti-statist. I am highly critical of many anarchist tactics.

That being said about my background, I was highly impressed by many of my comrades at the G-20. I was only there for Thursday but after the police attacked us with tear gas and a sound cannon (first time ever used in the United States) ~200 of us went through the working class community of Lawrence. Some comrades disciplined others and told them not to ruin workers lives and their community. That group only targeted banks mainly. And in return a few local residence even joined the march.

Still by no means an anarchist but serious respect earned that day. Snaps to my brothers and sisters there.

[Oneironaut]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXXiO7hssKI

That is a video of the student protest. Shit looks so fucked up. There is no way that people can justify these pigs actions. But I've been proven wrong reading comments underneath the video... "Liberal pussies need to grow up"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZT3O5m0EIs&feature=related

I found this one too.

[ellipsis]

It is a good point nonetheless, I'm sure that groups do choose to voluntarily end protesting after they feel tired out, but you do have to remember that it's extremely hard to keep going like that for hours and hours on end.....

Yes it would be very hard, I get tired just walking around all day. I guess I meant that in a situation of continued protest and social unrest, over the periods of weeks and months, a sustained black bloc movement could have serious potential.

[ellipsis]

after the police attacked us with tear gas and a sound cannon (first time ever used in the United States)

What's next being zapped with the Active Denial System? Or the one that makes you feel like you are shitting yourself. What happened to the good days of live ammo, batons, german shepherds and fire hoses?

[Guerrilla22]

I'm glad the police managed to quell the threat of unarmed students. :rolleyes:

[The Douche]

I'm glad the police managed to quell the threat of unarmed students. :rolleyes:

Not only unarmed, but also, uninvolved. Wouldn't want pesky innocent witnesses would we?

[Pawn Power]

Probably only funny for those who were there,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dm1kSMSDJBw