URGENT: need advices!

[Archzie]

I will go straight to the point: I'm looking for the perfect anti-fascist text to send to a fascist (a short one if possible, with not too much complicated words, English is not her native language).

That someone is a girl I went out with recently. She's back where she lives and we're exchanging e-mails. In the last one, she send me the address of her blog...
A nazi blog. I'm telling you: it's not funny at all (and I swear this is not a joke). I liked this girl. We talked for hours and hours and she never said anything about that, probably afraid of my reaction. I told her about my political positions early on so she knows already that we are opposite at 100%.
I don't believe in Father Christmas anymore so I know I will probably not change her. And of course, dating a far right girl is not an option for me (and her blog was really nazi, not even "far right" or "fascist", really nazi).
But she is VERY young and she had a difficult life apparently: she has excuses and maybe she could change one day. I wrote an e-mail to tell her what I think but I didn't send it yet. Because that e-mail is not enough: I need the ultimate anti-fascist text to plant the seed of truth in her mind. She probably won't care. She probably won't change right now. But she likes me very much and she'll read it. Maybe, it will be the only time she get the chance to read something like that. And a great philosophical text can go a long way inside someone's mind through the years.
Do you understand how important this is?
Please, help me.

[Pogue]

I will go straight to the point: I'm looking for the perfect anti-fascist text to send to a fascist (a short one if possible, with not too much complicated words, English is not her native language).

That someone is a girl I went out with recently. She's back where she lives and we're exchanging e-mails. In the last one, she send me the address of her blog...
A nazi blog. I'm telling you: it's not funny at all (and I swear this is not a joke). I liked this girl. We talked for hours and hours and she never said anything about that, probably afraid of my reaction. I told her about my political positions early on so she knows already that we are opposite at 100%.
I don't believe in Father Christmas anymore so I know I will probably not change her. And of course, dating a far right girl is not an option for me (and her blog was really nazi, not even "far right" or "fascist", really nazi).
But she is VERY young and she had a difficult life apparently: she has excuses and maybe she could change one day. I wrote an e-mail to tell her what I think but I didn't send it yet. Because that e-mail is not enough: I need the ultimate anti-fascist text to plant the seed of truth in her mind. She probably won't care. She probably won't change right now. But she likes me very much and she'll read it. Maybe, it will be the only time she get the chance to read something like that. And a great philosophical text can go a long way inside someone's mind through the years.
Do you understand how important this is?
Please, help me.

If you know her in real life then just hang around with her and tyr to convince her. If she is young and troubled then you don't need to go 'SCUMBAG NAZI' and never talk to her again or anything. I think this is a case of someone who has abhorent views who is most definately worth talking too, as I expect its just something she's gone too because she is troubled, and if you get on with her your influence, i.e. real life efforts, could change her.

[New Tet]

Unless I know more about you (besides your implied claim that you are anti-fascist) I could not offer any advise that would help you.

[Archzie]

If you know her in real life then just hang around with her and tyr to convince her.
I met her "in real life", like you said. But, like I said, she's back where she lives. Holidays are over and I will not see her "in real life" for a long time.
My intention is to send her my e-mail and the text I'm looking for, and then I'll see how she reacts.

[Archzie]

Unless I know more about you (besides your implied claim that you are anti-fascist) I could not offer any advise that would help you.
You don't get it: it's not about me, it's about her.
If you want to know, but it's no use to anyone, I am an anti-fascist and a member of a party that is as far away to fascism as can be. But I'm not here to talk about my general political opinions, I'm here to find the perfect antifascist text to send to that girl.

[Plagueround]

Moved to Anti-Fascism forum.

[New Tet]

You don't get it: it's not about me, it's about her.
If you want to know, but it's no use to anyone, I am an anti-fascist and a member of a party that is as far away to fascism as can be.

So far away it bumped into it on the way back?

Tell us all who you are so we can give you our sincerest and best-intentioned help.

All help, depending on the urgency of the problem, has a price. You want my help, you gotta tell me who you are and what you're all about. Cheap, I'd say.

Otherwise, as my grandma used to say, "fuck off, sonny".

[Archzie]

Otherwise, as my grandma used to say, "fuck off, sonny".
I will not let you bully me, you paranoid asshole.
Who do you think you are to ask me questions like that? The Gestapo?

I only ask for a convincing text (nothing funny) and a lot of people can help me with that, so NO I'm not "asking for YOUR help", you moron.
I'm asking for the help of human beings, with human feelings, who can understand what kind of tricky situation I'm dealing with right now.

[Manifesto]

This is not really the thing that you can just text or even e-mail someone in order to change her mind. If it is possible it will have to be very convincing.

[New Tet]

I will not let you bully me, you paranoid asshole.
Who do you think you are to ask me questions like that? The Gestapo?

I only ask for a convincing text (nothing funny) and a lot of people can help me with that, so NO I'm not "asking for YOUR help", you moron.
I'm asking for the help of human beings, with human feelings, who can understand what kind of tricky situation I'm dealing with right now.

So you want someone here, possibly me, to compose for you an anti-Fascist love letter to a girl you describe as Fascist, right?

Okay, here it goes:

"Dear Ms. Fascist:

I love you.http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon14.gif

"I want to squeeze the Fascism right outta ya. And unless you come around to my point of view about matters such as these I will punch you in the face next time I see you.http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon9.gif And then you will love me.http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon11.gif

Your Most Ardent Admirer And Prospective Loverhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gif,

Archzie Bonkerz"http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon6.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon6.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon6.gif

[eyedrop]

If you don'r have anything worthwhile to say shut the fuck up New Tet.

Does asking for an antifascist text deserve that much scorn? And why the hell should he give up personal info on the web?

[Manifesto]

Well anyways you should probably tackle the Fascism first and work your way to the racism/Nazism with valid arguments and try not to seem like you are trying to change her or she probably will not take anything to heart (it is like trying to turn a Communist into a Nazi). Or alternatively just try to go with what you wanted and create an ultimate anti-fascist text so I'll try to think one up but she will have to like you a whole damn lot to change her views from one text.

[The Essence Of Flame Is The Essence Of Change]

Why must you fucking mock and bully away everyone who dares to ask a question New Tet??What do you gain from that?And what the fuck is this??
All help, depending on the urgency of the problem, has a price. You want my help, you gotta tell me who you are and what you're all about. Cheap, I'd say.
You do realise how anti social and false that arguement is right?I used to hear things like these when I was arguing about communism with other people..well I got news for you,not everything in life is a trade, only right-winger hacks support ideas like these

[The Bear]

disco stu does everything for free :D

anyway i think you should quit the girl

she is probably top loaded with nazi crap for years

tell her you know where she lives :lol:

[OneNamedNameLess]

I will not let you bully me, you paranoid asshole.
Who do you think you are to ask me questions like that? The Gestapo?

I only ask for a convincing text (nothing funny) and a lot of people can help me with that, so NO I'm not "asking for YOUR help", you moron.
I'm asking for the help of human beings, with human feelings, who can understand what kind of tricky situation I'm dealing with right now.

I know he is being out of order but he has a point. I am suspicious of people who find this site and make first posts like this. I am sorry if I am wrong. Perhaps you should link us her blog?

[Archzie]

This is not really the thing that you can just text or even e-mail someone in order to change her mind.
Of course, I said that in my post: she will probably not change. I just want to make her think. And maybe one day, she will change. I will probably not stay in touch long enough to see it but I still think it's worth it. And sending a very intelligent text with my next personal e-mail seems like a good idea, no?
At least, I need to give it a try.
It's more about changing minds than about anything else. We are not in love, we just liked each other.

By the way, I didn't send her anything yet. Still looking for the right text.

[Archzie]

So you want someone here
You know how to read? So read my first post, because obviously you never did.

[Archzie]

Well anyways you should probably tackle the Fascism first and work your way to the racism/Nazism with valid arguments and try not to seem like you are trying to change her or she probably will not take anything to heart
I already wrote something (didn't send it yet) and I'm telling her the truth: I'm not hiding that I want to change her. It would be ridiculous, she already knows about my political opinions. I'm sure she's expecting me to defend my point of view.


Or alternatively just try to go with what you wanted and create an ultimate anti-fascist text so I'll try to think one up
I created something personal, something built on what we agreed on when we met (anticapitalism,...) but confronting what we disagree on now that I know (everything else...)
But it's still pretty lousy, not good enough. I read in my life some better things!


she will have to like you a whole damn lot to change her views from one text.
Like I said, I don't really think she will change (even if you never know, she's young), I just want to show her a different point of view. I'm not optimistic, she's too much into that shit to get it out just like that.

[Archzie]

anyway i think you should quit the girl
We're not "together", I've just gone out with her during her vacations and we stayed in touch by e-mails since she's back home. I don't want anyone like that around me, but I liked her enough to make a big effort in my next e-mail.

[New Tet]

If you don'r have anything worthwhile to say shut the fuck up New Tet.

Does asking for an antifascist text deserve that much scorn? And why the hell should he give up personal info on the web?

Scorn!? Personal info!? Where have I shown scorn or demanded our lovestruck "anti-fascist" reveal any of his "personal info"?

This guy comes here and gives us as introduction a teeny-bopper story that says nothing about his real intentions or political affections and demands we provide him with an emergency text to woo the girl of his nightmares? And none of us has the balls to corner this person with some simple questions. What are you retarded?

At the very least, out of respect for the purpose of this forum and its users, this "anti-fascist" fella' should tell us a wee little bit more about his political views and intentions before any one of us goes out of his way to help him influence a teen-age girl.

It's a reasonable demand, I think.

[New Tet]

You know how to read? So read my first post, because obviously you never did.

Yes I can read. Also, I can write the "perfect anti-fascist" text that would induce multiple orgasms in people over the age of 18. This girl you're telling us about, if she's at least 18, will swoon at every "anti-fascist" word that I throw at her (of course in your behalf, my lord).

All that I require from you is that you tell us more about yourself. Things like what's your political affiliation, why you're an "anti-fascist", how old you are, etc., etc. How about it, hot shot? Are you game?

[New Tet]

Why must you fucking mock and bully away everyone who dares to ask a question New Tet??What do you gain from that?And what the fuck is this??

It is a complete falsehood to say that I "mock and bully away everyone who dares to ask a question". Look at my other posts



You do realise how anti social and false that arguement is right?I used to hear things like these when I was arguing about communism with other people..well I got news for you,not everything in life is a trade, only right-winger hacks support ideas like these

Only a shameless opportunist would demand that others work for his own personal benefit for free and refuse to meet some very simple and cost-free demands.

You should have your maturity meter checked.

[New Tet]

I know he is being out of order but he has a point. I am suspicious of people who find this site and make first posts like this. I am sorry if I am wrong. Perhaps you should link us her blog?

You may not have noticed, but this thread was originally posted in Chit-Chat. Why it was moved here to Anti-Fascism, is beyond me. It does not merit this space, especially in light of our hero's reluctance to reveal anything about himself beyond vague assertions about his affiliations and near to nothing about his true intentions.

My intervention in this thread is in no way "out of line", comrade.

[Archzie]

To everyone: just ignore the rants from the mad man, "New Tet". It would confuse you because he doesn't know how to read apparently and is saying bullshit about what I said (I never talked about "love" or "teenagers" but he must be a pedophilia or something like that).
He's on his planet, where altruism doesn't exist and where you should lose your time telling all about yourself to crazy trolls just to find a good antifascist text...

I'm not asking for a lot, just some help from fellow antifascists and there is absolutely no way sending me a good antifascist text could help the fascists!

[New Tet]

We're not "together", I've just gone out with her during her vacations and we stayed in touch by e-mails since she's back home. I don't want anyone like that around me, but I liked her enough to make a big effort in my next e-mail.

Actually, It's someone else (maybe me) who's going to make that "big effort" in your next e-mail.

If you're such a big "anti-fascist" what's keeping you from writing the damned thing yourself?

[Archzie]

If you're such a big "anti-fascist" what's keeping you from writing the damned thing yourself?
I already said everything about that, read my answer to Manifesto (reading is looking at the letters and understanding what the guy is saying, you should try it at least once in your life).
And stop trolling, it's exhausting to everyone.

[New Tet]

I already said everything about that, read my answer to Manifesto (reading is looking at the letters and understanding what the guy is saying, you should try it at least once in your life).
And stop trolling, it's exhausting to everyone.

Ten posts and you're tired already!? I think you need some vitamin supplements.

But seriously, sir, why not just do the right thing and admit that you started here with a wrong attitude and too great an expectation.

Sit still for a while, read other people's posts; follow the links to anti-fascist sources, read them, study them and learn more about what it is you claim to support and then write about it here, in Revleft. Something good may come from it.

[The Essence Of Flame Is The Essence Of Change]

It is a complete falsehood to say that I "mock and bully away everyone who dares to ask a question". Look at my other posts
I've seen you speak in an ironic tone in every thread I've stumbled upon you.If they were the rare exceptions then sorry.

Only a shameless opportunist would demand that others work for his own personal benefit for free and refuse to meet some very simple and cost-free demands.
Do not put words in my mouth please,that was not my point.My point was that you are following the same line of thought the supporters of capitalism do when you try to put a price in every action.The whole point of constructing a communist society is that we have belief that there are other incentives for one to act than purely the hunt of profit,aka greed.People often help others simply because they feel so,because they would like to be helped too in times of need,no matter how repressed this is in a capitalist society.Now I get that you can be suspicious of a new guy popping up and asking things out of the blue without having mentioned anything about him but in the specific occassion its not like he is able to do anything harmful with that information:rolleyes:

[Forward Union]

link me to the blog.

[Holden Caulfield]

@ New Tet:

In this forum you can only get away with abusing newbies if you do it in a funny way, you didn't. So shut up or I will start lashing out infractions. As fun as paranoia is, ours is usually based on a little more than this, maybe he is embarrassed at knowing so little and is trying to learn, maybe not, maybe he is a suspect character, maybe he isnt, either way we value his question so try to be nice or if you aint got nothing nice to say don't say nothing

@ the guy who posted the thread:

I don't know of any such one article that exists, or any short ones that will perfectly wrap things up but here are a few related articles some are long some are less wordy but I'll post them all see what you think:

''Fascism-what it is and how to fight it'' by Leon Trotsky (http://www.anonym.to/?http://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/works/1944/1944-fas.htm)
"Class War not Race War" (http://www.revleft.com/vb/class-war-not-t107048/index.html?p=1422307)
Some Questions Answered (antifa england) (http://www.revleft.com/vb/some-questions-answered-t102216/index.html)
Interview with an Antifascist (antifa england) (http://www.antifa.org.uk/interview.htm)

[New Tet]

@ New Tet:

In this forum you can only get away with abusing newbies if you do it in a funny way, you didn't. So shut up or I will start lashing out infractions. As fun as paranoia is, ours is usually based on a little more than this, maybe he is embarrassed at knowing so little and is trying to learn, maybe not, maybe he is a suspect character, maybe he isnt, either way we value his question so try to be nice or if you aint got nothing nice to say don't say nothing


Who is this royal "we" that "values" the question?

And why should it be funny or allowable because [it] is "funny" to abuse anyone, including a "newbie"?

Oh, and one more thing: Any verbal warning coming from you I expect to be posted here, with the offending post in quotes. Otherwise, comrade, keep your peace.

[KarlMarx1989]

How is "Hitler is Dead!"? It's short, to the point. I have used this before on many people in christian-America and they get the point therefore become angry.

[Archzie]

I don't know of any such one article that exists, or any short ones that will perfectly wrap things up
Thank you very much for the examples. That's what I was looking for since my first post!
Maybe something from a great writer could be more emotional?
I don't think that pure political theory can easily change the heart of someone. I need to be convincing, so I need some theory, but I also need to disgust her from her sick ideas and playing on her soft side (she got one, I know that for sure...)


''Fascism-what it is and how to fight it'' by Leon Trotsky
Too complicated, too long, too "Trotsky" (she won't even read it)


"Class War not Race War"
Great text! But too long, I will need to cut it short.


Some Questions Answered (antifa england)
Interview with an Antifascist (antifa england)
She's not British so I cannot use these texts just like that. But that's the kind of things I'm talking about: "Traditionally fascist parties have used ethnic minorities as a scapegoat for the problems created by capitalism."
Everybody can understand things like that, even someone's very young and without real political culture.
Thank you very much for them. I can make something out of that.

[Fietsketting]

@ New Tet:

In this forum you can only get away with abusing newbies if you do it in a funny way, you didn't. So shut up or I will start lashing out infractions. As fun as paranoia is, ours is usually based on a little more than this, maybe he is embarrassed at knowing so little and is trying to learn, maybe not, maybe he is a suspect character, maybe he isnt, either way we value his question so try to be nice or if you aint got nothing nice to say don't say nothing

@ the guy who posted the thread:

I don't know of any such one article that exists, or any short ones that will perfectly wrap things up but here are a few related articles some are long some are less wordy but I'll post them all see what you think:

''Fascism-what it is and how to fight it'' by Leon Trotsky (http://www.anonym.to/?http://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/works/1944/1944-fas.htm)
"Class War not Race War" (http://www.revleft.com/vb/class-war-not-t107048/index.html?p=1422307)
Some Questions Answered (antifa england) (http://www.revleft.com/vb/some-questions-answered-t102216/index.html)
Interview with an Antifascist (antifa england) (http://www.antifa.org.uk/interview.htm)

Holden, how did such a nice guy end up being a Trotskyist? :laugh:

[Archzie]

Still arguing with her...
Don't know if I should try to make her turn 360° from far-right to far-left by explaining to her how the world really works or if I should just try to fight her prejudices and her wrong political ideas by consensual texts from great authors.

Still looking for other good antifascist texts.

[StalinFanboy]

To the OP, perhaps instead of trying to convince her she's wrong, you could just ask her questions about why she believes the way she does. A lot of times neo-nazis hold their beliefs without any real understanding because it's something concrete in their lives, and it gives them somewhere to belong.


So you want someone here, possibly me, to compose for you an anti-Fascist love letter to a girl you describe as Fascist, right?

Okay, here it goes:

"Dear Ms. Fascist:

I love you.http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon14.gif

"I want to squeeze the Fascism right outta ya. And unless you come around to my point of view about matters such as these I will punch you in the face next time I see you.http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon9.gif And then you will love me.http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon11.gif

Your Most Ardent Admirer And Prospective Loverhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon10.gif,

Archzie Bonkerz"http://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon6.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon6.gifhttp://www.revleft.com/vb/images/icons/icon6.gif


Grow the fuck up, will you?

[choff]

She's as likely to move from a political ideology with one clever and hard-hitting quote as you would be, mate. The way to "plant the seed of truth" is through lengthy and meaningful conversation. A philosopher's words may enhance yours, but they shouldn't serve as the bulk. Try sending her whatever it was you had drafted before making your original post, and then - after gauging her reply and maybe exploring the method Godstomper proposed - you could look for some quotes. I imagine simply googling "anti-fascist quotes" would yield a handful of results.

[Killfacer]

Still arguing with her...
Don't know if I should try to make her turn 360° from far-right to far-left by explaining to her how the world really works or if I should just try to fight her prejudices and her wrong political ideas by consensual texts from great authors.

Still looking for other good antifascist texts.

Good luck. For me, if you know her on a more personel level, then perhaps sending her anti-fascist literature isn't the best idea. Perhaps talk with her about the reasons she turned to fascism, perhaps that way you can talk her down on a more emotional level.

Like i said, good luck, you're probably gonna need it.

[New Tet]

Don't listen to any of these guys. If you're really intending to make friends with this "fascist girl". Just make friends with her without all the political posturing.

[Archzie]

Don't listen to any of these guys. If you're really intending to make friends with this "fascist girl". Just make friends with her without all the political posturing.
The troll did it again...
Like I already said, I don't intend to "make friend" with her, we first met, got to like each other, and then I discovered her political ideas. And now, I'm trying to make her think about her prejudices and her incoherent political ideas. I don't see why it's such a problem for you.
You should come into the real world sometimes.

[Archzie]

if you know her on a more personel level
We went out together when she was there.


perhaps sending her anti-fascist literature isn't the best idea.
It's not the only thing I'm doing, it's a plus.


Perhaps talk with her about the reasons she turned to fascism
I did, she explained me a lot of things.
But we cannot "talk", we're just exchanging e-mails because she's back in her country and phone is expensive.


good luck, you're probably gonna need it.
I'm not expecting any miracle, I just want to do the right thing.

But I want to add that her e-mails were really interesting and that I learned more in a few weeks about how people turn to far right ideas than in these last 10 years.

[Archzie]

She's as likely to move from a political ideology with one clever and hard-hitting quote
That's not what I was asking for. I'm looking for texts with substance.


The way to "plant the seed of truth" is through lengthy and meaningful conversation.
That's what I'm doing.


Try sending her whatever it was you had drafted before making your original post, and then - after gauging her reply and maybe exploring the method Godstomper proposed - you could look for some quotes.
I already wrote her a lot of things, including some great quotes. I'm looking for more and better.

By the way, I could use a text against statism and against the fascination for a strong state.

[Holden Caulfield]

I'll move this to learning see if you get any better responses there, not as many ppl peruse antifascism as learning who are nice people and willing to help