Communication with other movements possible before it gets worse?

[RadioRaheem84]

I have always noticed that if there was to be ANY revolution in this country that it would be a right wing one not a left wing one.

But what most Americans are not understanding is that their fight is not with the left, but with the bourgeois liberal establishment that runs this country like a heredital oligarchy/aristocracy.

The only thing favorable about the massive unrest in this nation is that its populist, granted it's right populist, but at least its not extremely libertarian. Most if not all of the movements on the right that are trying to mobilize that I speak to are economic nationalists, in that they want the country to abandon free trade and have capitalism in one country, protectionism, etc. It's a start, I guess?

I think that we should open communications with some of the lesser rabid and crazed movements before they go off the deep end and dive off into outright fascism. I think the times are exactly like that of the early twenieth century before WWII, because globaliztion and lassiez-faire is AGAIN proven to be wrong and there is a bitter split between nationalist/right and communists/socialist/left camps.

[Axle]

I agree that this is the only way to achieve our revolution, but we need to get the left completely united first.

[Pogue]

I agree that this is the only way to achieve our revolution, but we need to get the working class completely united first.

Fixed

[RadioRaheem84]

Agree with both.

[Axle]

Fixed

The working class needs a strong left movement to get behind before they're unified.

Right now there's a distinct lack of confidence in the radical left in America.

[RadioRaheem84]

The working class needs a strong left movement to get behind before they're unified.

Right now there's a distinct lack of confidence in the radical left in America.


That's mostly due to misconceptions Americans have of the left because of the right wing pundits.

If we're not careful and seek out stronger communication with these groups then I see something similar happening in America like what happened in the Weimer Republic. Right Wing movements like the Friekorps killed and fought hundreds of people on the left because they deemed they were at fault for the downfall of Germany, when it was the LIBERAL government of the Weimer Republic. Many Germans couldn't tell the difference between liberal and left, it was all the same to them. We lost the Spartacus League because of these men and their misconceptions. In fact, many liberal politicians in the government conspired with Friekorp members to take out the rival Marxist factions.

[Robocommie]

Well, we can probably communicate with the right and also unify the left and the working class at the same time, that is, expend our efforts to all of that simultaneously, no need to prioritize it.

The question is, what groups do we speak to? Who are some of the more rational right-wing populist groups? Which ones are sincere, and which are corporate fronts?

And then we'd have to decide, what do we want to say to them, and on whose behalf?

[RadioRaheem84]

Well, we can probably communicate with the right and also unify the left and the working class at the same time, that is, expend our efforts to all of that simultaneously, no need to prioritize it.

The question is, what groups do we speak to? Who are some of the more rational right-wing populist groups? Which ones are sincere, and which are corporate fronts?

And then we'd have to decide, what do we want to say to them, and on whose behalf?


The problem is that so many of them have been indoctrinated with the idea that liberalism = left and vise versa. To them, working with leftists is contrary to what their mission is; stopping the liberals from becoming outright "leftists".

The first step would be to have them understand the true leaders of status quo; upper class neo-liberal proponents.

I suggest starting with groups that are against free trade. Maybe Buchananite groups that are in favor of protectionism and economic nationalism. Anything funded by corporations, William F. Buckley, Coors Family, and even right wing pundits are obvious corporate fronts.

There is also the split with the right wing radio hosts. More populist radio listeners of Michael Savage and Glenn Beck, not Hannity or Limbaugh. Some of them tend to be lower working class and involved with outside groups. John Birch Society tend to be anti-globalist.

Groups to avoid: KKK, Civil War revisionists, Faux-Right Business supported groups.

Groups to engage: Right Wing conspiracy advocates that are at least aware of the damage Wall Street has done, understand the Federal Reserve as a sham bank, and know that politicians in power in favor of free markets are simply corporatists. There is at least some common ground to work with.

Bascially, my proposition is to engage these people and identify the neo-liberal establishment as the real enemy. Secondly, if there was any chance of an uprising in the near future, I would let them know that I personally was in favor a Republican form of government (like the Spanish Republic) in which socialists, leftists were allowed to seek office and hold political power. This again is where I would compromise. Dont know about everyone else.

[Robocommie]

Well, I suppose we should take a step back and ask ourselves what we would really want to accomplish, because sooner or later, we're going to bump into irreconcilable differences. Our mutual contempt for the establishment will only carry us so far, especially when our disagreements about who is included in "the establishment" start popping up.

The truth is, we can't make concessions to capitalism, which sooner or later, they'd want.

Some of these groups too, I don't think are really open to anything we'd have to say about anything. The John Birch Society is almost by definition anti-Communist, and Glenn Beck has been ranting and raving about Socialist totalitarianism for months.

[RadioRaheem84]

Well, I suppose we should take a step back and ask ourselves what we would really want to accomplish, because sooner or later, we're going to bump into irreconcilable differences. Our mutual contempt for the establishment will only carry us so far, especially when our disagreements about who is included in "the establishment" start popping up.

The truth is, we can't make concessions to capitalism, which sooner or later, they'd want.

Some of these groups too, I don't think are really open to anything we'd have to say about anything. The John Birch Society is almost by definition anti-Communist, and Glenn Beck has been ranting and raving about Socialist totalitarianism for months.
Yeah but when you listen to what they think the outcome of a "socialist" or "communist" America would look like it most always looks like a crooked corporate state, like China or something. Their basic assumption is that it would be lazy people mooching off of the worker. They actually think globalism, in the neo-liberal sense, is a commie idea.

That is how screwed up their way of thinking is about Socialism. If we don't apply any sort of broad communication with them, we could be facing a barrel of a gun before an open debate. I would at least like for them to know that we are NOT the enemy and that leftists have NOTHING to do with the current crisis. We do not promote the bailing out of large corrupt financial firms.

[Robocommie]

What I will say is that I think a lot of people in this country are WAY more open to socialist ideals and concepts than they would ever even realize. I remember years ago talking to my grandparents, who have always been poor dirt farmers, and they were under no illusion about how rich people just stay rich and poor folks stay poor. Because that was their story, too. They just weren't the types to get mad about it, to them it was just the way of the world.

And over the years, I've met so many people who were working poor or at least blue collar who were completely cynical about the system, they were just also politically apathetic because they had simply accepted that the government just wasn't going to really help them.

I suppose right-wingers tend to capitalize on this working class frustration with Classic Liberalism by telling them that government is bad and ineffective. I think we can counter that with our own message. I introduced my cousin to Socialism because I explained his frustrations with being stuck in poverty had a name.

The point is, I think working class people are actually much more Socialist than they think.

[RadioRaheem84]

The point is, I think working class people are actually much more Socialist than they think.


Ofcourse they are. They are much more protectionist, populist and publicly minded then what most people assume. The current right wing mania in the US is just a propaganda storm enacted by the corporate right in this nation. The working people of the US have ALWAYS been democratic and populist. Remenents are still left over. For instance, the working class even if right wing, are still very much class conscious; they see an obvious liberal elite. Secondly, they are very pro-public expenditures, i.e. public schools, the military, police, fire stations, community organizations, protectionist policies ,etc. Last, they have just been swept into a political malaise. If we can organize an effective campaign to help them understand that their issues are with corporate neo-liberals and not socialists, they might want to form an alliance.

It is just that now, communism has been totally run through the mud in the US. No working class person sees that as a viable option. Considering the massive cold war campaign against communism well over half a century old, I dont think there is any legitimate way of gathering the working class to support a communist cause.
Socialism, maybe. Left Wing Democratic Populism....yes. I think right now we should move the surging populist movement over to the left from the right.

A Huey Long type of politician would sweep away any election.