"Loutish" behaviour, "binge drinking" ect ect

[El Rojo]

Just had a revoltingly middle class conversation with my parents, about the state of the UK, specifically the whole binge drinking shebang.

Apparently, some 60% of A+E cases are alcohol fueled. And there are a lot of young lads getting hurt for no good reason.

My rents blame a greater disposable income, but it seems obvious to me that capitalism is inherantly at fault. but i can't exactly draw the links or quite put it. I feel that there are links with materialism, and the fact that a large slice of the UK population wants to reduce the world to a blurry haze can't be good, but thats all I got. Anyone got a better way of putting it, please do, coz the above is wank lol

[Pogue]

I think its silly to try and blame capitalism for every single problem around.

[El Rojo]

true, but it sure is fun :D

seriously though, i think it does point to the apathetic, depressed state of society.

if not, what is your argument?

[Pogue]

Well for example when your looking into alcohol and loutish behaviour. I don't think the economic system comes into it. I have friends who act 'loutishly' from similar backgrounds as me. I don't think the economic system is what makes them act this way, I think its personal attitudes. Obviously indirectly the economic system affects everything but when I hear about someone I knew from school whospent a night in a cell for kicking a door in while pissed I don't think 'Capitalism', I think of someone who wasn't brought up right.

[rednordman]

For me capitalism does actually play its part on this. People are depressed as they are bread to be competitive, yet all fail in one part of life at least. Nobody is faultless, just we are raised to feel bad about our faults and envy others with more than us, rather than work to our strengths and not keep comparing ourselves subconciously to the person next.

Of course its a lot more complicated than that and sex also has to be mentioned, but in the bourgoise media, people are told to believe that women find men with money attractive, and men find women who are 'sexy' and 'easy' (words of the media not mine), so there is always going to be a resentment there aswell (and that does have something to do with capitalism). Whether the media is spot on is one to be debated though.

I suppose alchohol just loosens inhibitions to break 'persumed' social and class constructs to go and chat up the 'other', but on the flip side also enhances intense emotions and perceptions to cause violence. This is usually a result of jealous paranoias, as people want to look strong infront of the 'other' and thier collegues.

It helps people loosen of the shock of the past week and prepare themselves for the next miserable failure, I presume?

I dont know, Im probably looking into this too deeply.

Pretty good topic to be fair.

[rednordman]

Obviously indirectly the economic system affects everything but when I hear about someone I knew from school whospent a night in a cell for kicking a door in while pissed I don't think 'Capitalism', I think of someone who wasn't brought up right.mmm. Dont know about that one, I think that alchohol can make the most placid people into total pricks if they drink the wrong amount. I seen it with my own eyes, very strange to behold, and a pain in the ass trying to keep them from fighting with others, or simply drinking themselves sick. Alot of these incidents have happened with kids from richer and conservative backgrounds than me, and well raised. So i find peoples upbringing to be a little bit of side issue on this. Mainly, its as if they want to take out their short-commings from the real-world out on somebody, or thing.

[punisa]

Just had a revoltingly middle class conversation with my parents, about the state of the UK, specifically the whole binge drinking shebang.

Apparently, some 60% of A+E cases are alcohol fueled. And there are a lot of young lads getting hurt for no good reason.

My rents blame a greater disposable income, but it seems obvious to me that capitalism is inherantly at fault. but i can't exactly draw the links or quite put it. I feel that there are links with materialism, and the fact that a large slice of the UK population wants to reduce the world to a blurry haze can't be good, but thats all I got. Anyone got a better way of putting it, please do, coz the above is wank lol

There is a link, and a very strong one.
Binge drinking you mention has little to do with "regular" alcohol consumption.
Its a practise of forcing alcohol to provide same effects as drugs (better off doing drugs I say) - total forgefulness of your reality.

And capitalism is definetely the reason for it.

No, I'm not the one to blame capitalism for ALL bad that happens. Say my wife cheats on me, little do with capitalism. She just happens to like someone else :laugh:

As for binge drinking.. Young people are doing it because slowly they are aware of the system which oppresses them. They may not be knowledgable about oppresion as we socialists are, BUT they do feel it.
Many of us *discovered* Marx, communism and socialism in general by looking for an answer to our feelings of despair that surronds us.
Just as some found communist manifesto, some find booze.

As a young adult you are becoming aware that life is stringed around a single line : study - get work - start family - work your ass off - retire - die
(Sure you could discard "the LINE", but then must be prepared to live as an outcast. Not something many would love to do)

If you look at that dreadful bolded line and *somehow* could replace "work your ass off" with "work with pride" it would suddenly be all different, wouldn't it?

people are not generally lazy as some say, people want to be productive and want their lifes to be fullfild with that.
But working to barely survive is not fun at all.
But you must, otherwise you would die.

On top of that if you catch yourself drifting away from religion and spirituality (as many young people today do) you realise that LIFE is only what spans between the begining and the end of that line.

So.. I'm young, have that single life ahead of me. Just one life. The most precious element I have.
I guess I, as a person, as a human being.. I had to wait for maybe 100 million years to get a chance to live.

And now I need to waste all of my tiny years on being an exploitable worker?? All my adult life I need to strive to survive? I need to change as a person, become more manipulative and evil, just in order to get ahead?
That is all I fuc***g get?

--------------------------------------------------------------

Doesn't that small bit make you take the bottle right now? :lol:
Anyway, kids know all of this, but they don't *get* it. But you bet as hell they know it and feel it.
They see it all around, especially in their home. Their parents struggling.

So, to answer your question - yes capitalism does destroy people in many ways. Binge drinking is just one of them.
The other one is suicide, which increased heavily.

Remeber that socialism is never just economy, it deals with human as beings too.
Inter human relationships and socialising is at its lowest low in capitalism.
And the capitalism system always profits of it.

More drinkers, more unhappy people, more potential customers.

Same goes for socialising, the very core of human being, now thrown to virtual networks like Faceshit and similar. But that's a different topic all togeather..

[punisa]

Obviously indirectly the economic system affects everything but when I hear about someone I knew from school whospent a night in a cell for kicking a door in while pissed I don't think 'Capitalism', I think of someone who wasn't brought up right.
This is also very true

[PRC-UTE]

Another way of looking at it is that work is the curse of the drinking class.

[punisa]

Another way of looking at it is that work is the curse of the drinking class.
:laugh:

[*Viva La Revolucion*]

Though I think capitalism is at fault, I also think it has more to do with the attitudes and values that a capitalist society instills. It's not fair to just blame capitalism, though. Upbringing is a major factor. And there has been a gradual erosion of community ever since a woman called Thatcher said 'there is no such thing as society, there is only the individual.' :rolleyes: As a non-binge drinking teenager, I've still been tempted to go out and get really drunk just because I felt what can only be described as a kind of mini-existential crisis. I'm sure lots of people feel the same way, but I'm not really sure what's causing it.

[Pogue]

Though I think capitalism is at fault, I also think it has more to do with the attitudes and values that a capitalist society instills. It's not fair to just blame capitalism, though. Upbringing is a major factor. And there has been a gradual erosion of community ever since a woman called Thatcher said 'there is no such thing as society, there is only the individual.' :rolleyes: As a non-binge drinking teenager, I've still been tempted to go out and get really drunk just because I felt what can only be described as a kind of mini-existential crisis. I'm sure lots of people feel the same way, but I'm not really sure what's causing it.

Alot of it is just hwat we feel as teenagers. I just see getting drunk as a really fun thing to do, I like the confidence you get from it and the feeling generally. It also obviously serves as an escape from everyday life/troubles.

[rednordman]

Though I think capitalism is at fault, I also think it has more to do with the attitudes and values that a capitalist society instills. It's not fair to just blame capitalism, though. Upbringing is a major factor. And there has been a gradual erosion of community ever since a woman called Thatcher said 'there is no such thing as society, there is only the individual.' :rolleyes:So true that is. Thing is no-one seems to get the link either, they just end up blaming newlabour for it all, even though they just kept the ball rolling for her. No wonder Mr Brown welcomed her so warmly on the visit to downing street.