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khad
22nd July 2009, 02:28
I had to change the title because I do not want folks to spin a positive message out of this.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article6721176.ece


From The Times
July 21, 2009
Laying down the law: US tries to make policemen of the 'robbers in uniform'

Tom Coghlan in Garmsir

Bananaman, Super Mario, Popeye, Timmy and Doctor Frankenstein may not know it, but the hopes of the international community weigh heavy on their shoulders. With nicknames bestowed by their US Marine trainers, all are members of the Afghan National Police force entrusted with turning the ground seized around Garmsir during the continuing American offensive in Helmand into something approaching a governable state.

It is a huge challenge for a force known to locals as “the robbers with uniforms” — one that pits American can-do spirit against the long-established bad habits of a rag-tag force better known for its incompetence, illiteracy and alleged criminality.

“People in Garmsir hate the police because they don’t fight the Taleban. They just steal from the people and disturb the people,” said Ghulam Nazir, 34, a local man, reflecting a sentiment that has made the Afghan police a potent propaganda weapon for the Taleban.

With the American military plan promising to govern by and through Afghan security forces, senior officers acknowledge that there is also a “critical shortfall” in Afghan police and army units.

Given their paucity in numbers, police entry standards have been necessarily liberal. Twenty per cent of the entire 84-man Afghan police unit in the newly liberated district of Garmsir have some sort of physical disability, according to their American mentors: the policeman nicknamed Popeye, for instance, is deaf in one ear and blind in one eye. More than 90 per cent of the police are also illiterate.

The Garmsir force recently emerged from a costly two-month stint of remedial training under an American-run programme called Focused District Development. Five American mentors did the course alongside them to help to develop a rapport with the Afghans. The programme is supposed to be followed by a period of mentoring by Western troops to ensure that the police do not slip back into old habits.

However, as has happened elsewhere, their mentors do not see any immediate sign of being able to leave their charges to fend for themselves.
“If you want a legitimate government, you need legitimate police,” said Lieutenant Justin Grieco, 25, who leads the 3rd platoon of the military police company attached to 5th battalion, 10th Marines.

There is jovial camaraderie between the Marines and the Afghan police, who also have nicknames for the American mentors. There is also an abundance of US determination to overcome innumerable frustrations. For two days this week the police trained for a proposed raid on a Taleban safe house. Sweating under the Afghan sun, they practised clearing rooms with menacingly pointed fingers to simulate weapons while Timmy, the unit clown, was deputed to play a Taleban defender, which he did with theatrical aplomb.

At the end of the training, the mentors concluded wearily that the police were more likely to endanger their own and American lives than the Taleban. The raid was cancelled.

However, the US military police see many positives. The Afghans have shown improvement, they say, since remedial training and the arrival of the 23-man Marine mentoring team that took over from a forlorn contingent of two British police mentors.

“They were paid attention to, given equipment, dressed like policemen and treated like policemen. So they started to act like policemen,” Lieutenant Grieco said of the recent training. The local community trusted the police more, he said, while Lance-Corporal Greg Deputy, who spent a year training Iraqi police in Anbar province in 2007, compares the Afghans favourably in terms of motivation. “The Afghans have more of a work ethic. Here it might be 30 per cent that want to learn. In Iraq it was maybe 15-20 per cent who worked hard and 60 per cent who were just in it for a paycheck.” The remark is made sincerely.

The levels of education in Afghanistan are much lower than in Iraq. And while there are only 84 police in Garmsir, the police commander, Colonel Ghuli Khan, says that he needs at least 200 men.

While no accusations of theft from motorists at checkpoints have been made against the Garmsir police since their retraining, they are frequent against border police units operating in the same area. And there are darker allegations. An American unit in Garmsir was approached this week by a distressed and battered shopkeeper who said that he had fought off a border police unit that tried to abduct his adolescent son for sex.
There have been improvements in the police in Kabul in the past year, but across the south of the country the situation gives less cause for hope. There is also a threat that the existing Afghan police force in Helmand will wither away.

On Friday the mentors learnt that three of the recently retrained police had quit while on leave. On Saturday Bananaman, real name Hattiqullah, a lean, moustachioed young man with a fondness for yellow civilian clothing, also threatened to go.

The policemen complained that their 9,000 Afghani (£128) a month salary had been mysteriously cut by a third. The Americans promised to investigate but the decision appeared to have been taken within the Afghan Government.

“We never have any rest and it is too hot for us to fight the Taleban for this salary,” Hattiqullah said. “The people are laughing at us. I can get 6,000 Afghani from gardening. Why would I put myself in danger for this money?”

There are few volunteers coming forward to augment their numbers, and one who did approach the Garmsir police station on Saturday quickly left again when told of the reduced pay.

A new US initiative called Directed District Development is due to begin in southern Helmand at the end of the month. According to American officers, it will attempt to mix trained police with locally raised volunteers given three weeks’ training. Senior American officers stress the need to achieve “visible governance” quickly.

Such a sacrifice of quality for quantity worries the Garmsir police mentors. But ultimately some within the unit see theirs as a holding role until a younger generation of Afghans emerge.

“I’d say it is two or three years [of mentoring] for these to be sustainable,” said Steve Woods, a civilian policeman and former Green Beret working with the American mentors. “But the older police generation are lost, we won’t change them. The 19-year-olds we might change one or two. It’s the four or five-year-olds growing up. By the time they reach maturity they will be ready.”

$3 billion force with a drug problem

? The Afghan National Police (ANP) is central to Nato strategy in Afghanistan. The US military is aiming to boost recruit numbers from the current 82,000 to provide security for the national elections in August and President Obama has committed 4,000 additional troops to help to train the ANP

? The ANP has been deployed alongside Nato forces against the Taleban, losing 1,504 officers since 2007. Germany began training the ANP in 2002 but spent only $87 million. The US has spent $3.3 billion retraining the force

? The ANP remains dogged by problems. The Washington Post reported recently that the new US commander in Afghanistan, General Stanley McChrystal, had concluded that the ANP was far below strength and behind in training. Narcotics abuse remains a serious issue among policemen.
Now before anyone else comments on this, I will preempt something that I expect to come up:

"How dare you say this about the Afghan police! They're just working class blokes who are raping and robbing their country safe for their white imperialist working class brothers! You shall not divide the Afghan working class! You shall not divide the global working class!"

LOLseph Stalin
22nd July 2009, 07:30
Now before anyone else comments on this, I will preempt something that I expect to come up:

"How dare you say this about the Afghan police! They're just working class blokes who are raping and robbing their country safe for their white imperialist working class brothers! You shall not divide the Afghan working class! You shall not divide the global working class!"

I'm not going to say that, but I can say that the Afghan police force is unique in a sense. Because they're illiterate, that makes them even more easy to manipulate. The Bourgeoisie wouldn't hestistate to use this to their advantage. Why spend all that money training smart cops that are hard to manipulate when you can do it much easier with the illiterate? Also, having outside Imperialist forces training them doesn't help alot either. The Imperialists are also part of the Bourgeoisie so would want those cops to act in situations that would protect the interests of these imperialists. Once again, why? It's easy, plus it's money so the families of these Afghanis can put food on their table. They do the job or don't eat. Canada is involved in this training btw and as far as I know they don't have any plans to withdraw.

Guerrilla22
22nd July 2009, 08:39
It's a common imperialist tactic, create a native enforcement organization of some sort to keep the locals under control. The US is basically using them to do their dirty work, keeping the Afghan people in check, so they can concentrate on wiping out the Taliban. And usually these "police" forces take advantage of their privelleged status and resort to raping and pillaging.

khad
22nd July 2009, 10:16
It's a common imperialist tactic, create a native enforcement organization of some sort to keep the locals under control. The US is basically using them to do their dirty work, keeping the Afghan people in check, so they can concentrate on wiping out the Taliban. And usually these "police" forces take advantage of their privelleged status and resort to raping and pillaging.
B-bu-but, they are working class blokes! We should be showing them solidarity because they are just poor exploited victims of the bourgeoisie!

Drug peddling child rapists are people too.... :crying:

PRC-UTE
23rd July 2009, 01:43
B-bu-but, they are working class blokes! We should be showing them solidarity because they are just poor exploited victims of the bourgeoisie!

Drug peddling child rapists are people too.... :crying:

The only thing that needs to change is the Afghan police should join the IWW. so that they can join the mass syndicalist movement that is about to overthrow capitalism across the world and install a stateless, marketless international society overnight.

More than a few anarchists already think that sex with little boys is just fine. so it works out okay.

LOLseph Stalin
23rd July 2009, 01:47
If these cops are working class we could educate them and get them on our side. Might take a bit more, but at least then they'll realize they're just puppets for the Bourgeoisie.

khad
23rd July 2009, 01:53
If these cops are working class we could educate them and get them on our side. Might take a bit more, but at least then they'll realize they're just puppets for the Bourgeoisie.
I think Marx's analysis would be that they are lumpenproletariat, demoralized rabble who are dependent upon the capitalist state for their survival and who are parasitic upon the rest of the community. Many of these Afghan national army and police types are folks who have been kicked out of their villages for criminality. You can hear the commentary from the Afghan officer in this news report:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmU6S_0HVS8

"They've recruited totally the wrong type of men. They're all stupid and ignorant. These young men are a bunch of delinquents. They're only here because they've been driven out of their villages for misbehaving."

LOLseph Stalin
23rd July 2009, 01:56
I think Marx's analysis would be that they are lumpenproletariat, demoralized rabble who are dependent upon the capitalist state for their survival and parasitic upon the rest of the community.

I don't think they are though. They're just in a vulnerable position because of their illiteracy. They're doing the dirty work of the bourgeoisie believing it to be an actual job. They don't know much better since they're in a desperate situation. You have to remember that Afghanistan is one of the poorest countries in the world and has limited infrastructure. They need to get money for their families somehow and many see this as a way to do that.

khad
23rd July 2009, 02:01
I don't think they are though. They're just in a vulnerable position because of their illiteracy. They're doing the dirty work of the bourgeoisie believing it to be an actual job. They don't know much better since they're in a desperate situation. You have to remember that Afghanistan is one of the poorest countries in the world and has limited infrastructure. They need to get money for their families somehow and many see this as a way to do that.
I don't think many of these kids even have families that care about them. A good many of them are already anti-social types who feel like they have an axe to grind against their communities.

LOLseph Stalin
23rd July 2009, 02:09
I don't think many of these kids even have families that care about them. A good many of them are already anti-social types who feel like they have an axe to grind against their communities.

I can agree with the fact that many of them don't have families because, well many of them don't since Afghanistan is war-torn. I'm sure I would be a pretty messed up child if I was surrounded by nothing but war. War can no doubt damage a person in several ways therefore I don't think they intentionally act the way they do. As I said, alot of it is probably that they're desperate for decent meals(or some for attention for that matter thus proving your point that some may be lumpenproletariat).

gorillafuck
23rd July 2009, 02:11
The only thing that needs to change is the Afghan police should join the IWW. so that they can join the mass syndicalist movement that is about to overthrow capitalism across the world and install a stateless, marketless international society overnight.

More than a few anarchists already think that sex with little boys is just fine. so it works out okay.
Where the fuck did that come from?:confused:

Agrippa
23rd July 2009, 03:11
Where the fuck did that come from?:confused:

Hakim Bey, Bob Black, "Aragorn", etc.

Agrippa
23rd July 2009, 03:12
Also, would literate criminal police be better?:lol:

the last donut of the night
23rd July 2009, 03:18
More than a few anarchists already think that sex with little boys is just fine. so it works out okay.

Rape =/= consensual sex.

Agrippa
23rd July 2009, 03:28
Rape =/= consensual sex.

Are you suggesting that "consentual" adult-child sex exists?

I mean, I could get a young child to "consent" to giving me a 20$ bill by convincing him a broken button is worth more money...

gorillafuck
23rd July 2009, 03:32
Hakim Bey, Bob Black, "Aragorn", etc.
Still seems like a random thing to say.

Agrippa
23rd July 2009, 03:36
Still seems like a random thing to say.

It's our fault for allowing our movement to harbor advocates of child-rape such as Bey and Black, and even hold them in esteem. Of course it will reflect poorly on us as a whole. If these folks were Leninists, we would be throwing rocks at them.

PRC-UTE
23rd July 2009, 04:14
Where the fuck did that come from?:confused:

There's a tendency amongst some ultra lefts to ooze with sympathy for imperialist soldiers. But if those soldiers then went over to anti-imperialism and/or evil Leninism, they become "nationalist sectarian gangster state capitalists", and lots of other meaningless rhetoric is thrown at them.

Read some of their posts- to them movements or states which attempt to redress injustice or advance the interests of the proletariat, but fall short of global stateless communism are actually vile counter-revolutionaries.

There's also a tendency for some ultra lefts to claim children shouldn't be protected from adult sexual advances.

So I combined these two reactionary opinions into one satirical post.

Guerrilla22
23rd July 2009, 05:24
If these cops are working class we could educate them and get them on our side. Might take a bit more, but at least then they'll realize they're just puppets for the Bourgeoisie.

I don't even see them a legit police force, if there is such a thing. The typical police force will at least screen the people they're hiring to make sure they aren't criminals and train them. This national police force just amounts to thugs picked out from the various militias that have a government mandate.

LOLseph Stalin
23rd July 2009, 05:29
I don't even see them a legit police force, if there is such a thing. The typical police force will at least screen the people they're hiring to make sure they aren't criminals and train them. This national police force just amounts to thugs picked out from the various militias that have a government mandate.

Of course not. It's just the Imperialists doing dirty work. They don't care. They use them because it's easy. They're willing to do the job without second thoughts.

the last donut of the night
26th July 2009, 15:53
Are you suggesting that "consentual" adult-child sex exists?

I mean, I could get a young child to "consent" to giving me a 20$ bill by convincing him a broken button is worth more money...


No. I wasn't suggesting that, at all.