Soviet Story

[Sarah Palin]

I'm gonna try and finish it. For those who don't know, it is probably the most anti-communist film ever made. Here's what the back of the case says:

(You can't make this up)- "THis is a story of an Allied power, which helped the Nazis to fight the Jews and which slaughtered its own people on an industrial scale.
Assisted by the West, this power triumphed on May 9th, 1945. Its crimes were made taboo, and the complete story of Europe's most murderous regime has never been told. Until now."

It was gifted to me by someone who was deeply offended by comments I made and the fact that I own a Soviet flag. I'll have a review for y'all when I'm done. Wish me luck.

[Misanthrope]

You'll enjoy the description of class warfare lol..:laugh: it is a comedy

[Pogue]

Well the Soviet Union did help the Nazis kill Jews in Poland. That was more indiscriminate killing of Polish people than anti-semetic genocide but it was despicable. Alot of people were mutdered by Stalin as well too, so its not shocking.

I don't understand the rage Stalinists feel when the Soviet Union is criticised. It was a bourgeoisie state, what do you really expect, principles and socialism?

[Sarah Palin]

I just finished the movie. I'll call it a movie because that's what it is. A low quality production, void of any coherence and facts to back up its rediculous claims. Absolutely terrible. (I'd use film for a factual documentary; something this is not.)
The majority of this 2 hour movie was spent juxtaposing Hitler's National SOCIALIST(they really felt it important for you all to know that it was a marxist party, inspired by the teachings of Marx and Engles. They had no concrete evidence, though, just people saying "Hitler supported Marxism.") Party to the Soviet Union under Lenin and Stalin. Claiming that Hitler's holocaust was inspired by the Ukrainian famine, we see the same footage over and over and over again, of bodies being thrown into holes. I actually think I saw the same footage in the film my history teacher showed me on the holocaust. However the movie made no reference to the fact that famine conditions were caused by imperialist powers trying to crush the new Soviet state in the early 20's. The movie also neglects the sabotage of Ukrainian farms by the Kulaks, claiming that "Stalin wanted to systematically destroy the people of Ukraine." It then showed the same, undocumented pictures shown in every anti-communist publication,movie, or website. Then the movie went off on a new tangent, disecting Marx himself. They successfully twist his words to make him into a nationalistic, genocidal, racist, interview some proffesor who thinks that the lax attitude towards Marx's philosophy will lead to a new era of fascism, and cut to some teens flying a hammer and sickle flag in London. The movie also addresses the left outside of Russia's support for Nazi Germany. French Communists, Spanish Anarchists, and an English playwright are all lumped together as advocating the genocide of inferior races.
After the "genocide," this joke brought us to Act II, World War II. Throughout these scenes, the movie falls back on its mantra, "Hitler learned from the Soviet Union," and even adds some new flare in an exciting title sequence showing the similarities between Nazi and Soviet propaganda. But there was no factual evidence to back up their insane claims. They talked about the Soviets allowing Nazis to use their military bases and ports to launch an attack on Europe. The film doesn't depict the USSR as an allied power until 1943 (somehow after the battle of Stalingrad, between the USSR and Nazi Germany...).
And Act III couldn't come quick enough. These scenes address post-Soviet Russia and are the most blatantly insane in the entire show. The producer of this crap had the gall to say that neo-nazism and bigotry in modern Russia is the result of Vladimir Putin not suppressing Soviet history enough and that neo-nazism is radical leftist and blah blah blah.
This movie was shit. I wish I could convey to you all better how angered I was by it. It is a damn shame that this thing exists.

[Pogue]

More tremuous whining. I don't see anyone thanking the Soviet Union for saving a whole shitload of Poles (including Jews) by allowing them to flee to the safer occupation zone.

You call it whining. I call it revealing the reality of bourgeois states. I think your anlaysis is so immature that you honestly beleive bourgeois states can be good. I think the Soviet Union was clearly up there with the rest of them, and Stalin certainly didn't see himself being above a little bit of slaughter. The Soviet Union, as an entity, never acted for benevolent reasons. Imperialist capitalism never acts in such a manner.

[OneNamedNameLess]

You call it whining. I call it revealing the reality of bourgeois states. I think your anlaysis is so immature that you honestly beleive bourgeois states can be good. I think the Soviet Union was clearly up there with the rest of them, and Stalin certainly didn't see himself being above a little bit of slaughter. The Soviet Union, as an entity, never acted for benevolent reasons. Imperialist capitalism never acts in such a manner.

Hey, what do you expect from defensive Stalinists? :D

[Kwisatz Haderach]

The majority of this 2 hour movie was spent juxtaposing Hitler's National SOCIALIST(they really felt it important for you all to know that it was a marxist party, inspired by the teachings of Marx and Engles. They had no concrete evidence, though, just people saying "Hitler supported Marxism.") Party to the Soviet Union under Lenin and Stalin.
There has been a concerted effort by the right-wing over the past decade or so to whitewash the history of fascism by trying to eliminate all mention of the ties between fascists and capital, and by ridiculously exaggerating any similarity they could find between Stalin's USSR and Nazi Germany.

This movie is only the most recent episode in that ongoing campaign, and its claims are particularly absurd - given that Hitler curses Marxism in Das Kapital in almost every single paragraph and blames it for all Germany's problems - but it is an issue we can no longer afford to ignore.

A lie repeated often enough becomes accepted as truth. We need to start actively attacking the lies being told in right-wing propaganda about fascism, lest they become accepted as truth.

[khad]

Hey, what do you expect from defensive Stalinists? :D
Yes, your shrill voices are amusing to me, since you guys don't have a leg to stand on. Next!

[danyboy27]

the question is, why starting this thread in opposing ideology?

i dont give a damn about some lame ass anti communist movie , and i dont see in what we should be concerned about that.

if the initial goal was to make us whine about stalin and then being bashed by anti revisionist you failed.

[Sarah Palin]

the question is, why starting this thread in opposing ideology?

i dont give a damn about some lame ass anti communist movie , and i dont see in what we should be concerned about that.

if the initial goal was to make us whine about stalin and then being bashed by anti revisionist you failed.

I posted it in the OI because all of my thoughts are regarding an OI...

[Bud Struggle]

FWIW: Last night, quite by accident, I saw the great Communism/Anarchist movie of all time. It was pretty funny they were saying all these lines about cooperation and no government and I'm thinking--THAT'S GACKY TALKING! Anyway, the movie is Gas! -Or- It Became Necessary to Destroy the World in Order to Save It. it's a bit old--from 1971 but directed by the great Roger Corman.

It's an interesting view of what life would be like under Anarchism.

[rednordman]

This movie is only the most recent episode in that ongoing campaign, and its claims are particularly absurd - given that Hitler curses Marxism in Das Kapital in almost every single paragraph and blames it for all Germany's problems - but it is an issue we can no longer afford to ignore.

A lie repeated often enough becomes accepted as truth. We need to start actively attacking the lies being told in right-wing propaganda about fascism, lest they become accepted as truth.Truth be told! This is indeed something that is becoming more and more obvious as well as time goes on. Part of me wonders whether or not the associations responsible for all this sensasionalist rubbish, acutally have something to hide themselves. Like they are trying to provide a bit of a smokescreme for something. I'll just say that its interesting you mentioned how they are trying to hide the ties between fascism and captial, and then throw almost everything that has gone wrong in the world at the feet of the then soviet union.

Funniest thing is that this wasnt produced by a couply of hicks in a bedroom, it was produced (or just funded) by a part of the conservative side of the European Parliment. If it told straight facts, that would be fine, but it has elaboratly come out with some of the most stupid lies about the left (even the most ardent right-wingers could see this), taking it for granted that people will hang on to their every word. Clearly, they do not take the public for very much, do they.

[Kwisatz Haderach]

Truth be told! This is indeed something that is becoming more and more obvious as well as time goes on. Part of me wonders whether or not the associations responsible for all this sensasionalist rubbish, acutally have something to hide themselves. Like they are trying to provide a bit of a smokescreme for something. I'll just say that its interesting you mentioned how they are trying to hide the ties between fascism and captial, and then throw almost everything that has gone wrong in the world at the feet of the then soviet union.
Of course they have something to hide. The political parties who sponsored this movie are borderline fascist. In the Baltic states, they have instituted a policy of discrimination against the Russian minority that would immediately have them labeled as Nazis if they were Germans and did it to Jews. Russians in the Baltic states were stripped of their citizenship and have to jump through all sorts of legal hoops and tests if they want to get it back.


Funniest thing is that this wasnt produced by a couply of hicks in a bedroom, it was produced (or just funded) by a part of the conservative side of the European Parliment. If it told straight facts, that would be fine, but it has elaboratly come out with some of the most stupid lies about the left (even the most ardent right-wingers could see this), taking it for granted that people will hang on to their every word. Clearly, they do not take the public for very much, do they.
No, their lies were not stupid at all. They were lies about things that most people only know vaguely - 70 year old history and the writings of Karl Marx. Of course, if you've read Marx or studied history, you can tell how outrageous their lies are, but the movie is not targeted at people who read Marx or studied history. In fact, the whole purpose of the movie is to persuade public opinion that no one should ever read Marx or study the history of the USSR too closely.

And the group in the European Parliament that funded the movie - the UEN - was dominated by hardline conservative parties from Poland and the Baltic states. These parties are fanatically anti-communist and exist in an environment with no left whatsoever (not even reformists, not even "third way" social democrats - nothing). It is easy to tell the most insane lies about the left in places where there are no leftists to fight back or challenge your claims. They could probably even get away with smearing social democracy as a racist threat to human civilization, and there would be no outcry.

By releasing this movie to a Western audience, they've gambled that Western leftists are going to either stay silent or just yell "right-wing propaganda!" without bothering to refute it. And their gamble seems to have paid off. :(

It's about time for the Left group in the European Parliament to start funding its own propaganda movies.

[Sarah Palin]

And the group in the European Parliament that funded the movie - the UEN - was dominated by hardline conservative parties from Poland and the Baltic states.

I thought it was odd how they concentrated on the Baltic region so much. Now I know it's because they paid for the whole thing. There was at least 30 minutes on how there was an "unknown genocide far worse then the holocaust that went on in the Baltic states." Yet oddly enough, no factual evidence to back up their claims...

[Wanted Man]

It's about time for the Left group in the European Parliament to start funding its own propaganda movies.
If so, they'll probably be anti-communist propaganda movies, as they are transforming towards a 100% anti-communist coalition. Check: http://inter.kke.gr/News/2009news/2009-04-hungarian and http://kne.gr/817.html

They want to denounce all experiences of socialism (just like the conservatives and fascists behind the film "Soviet Story", I guess), stop opposing the EU itself, invite all sorts of opportunist and reformist parties into their coalition, they want a "new European political culture" rather than consistent anti-capitalism, etc.

It's an all-out reformist project, and if the left (in a meaningful sense of the word, rather than just those who want to "reform away" the "excesses of capitalism") is to have any future success, it's not going to be in this opportunist coalition that only wants to sit in parliament and validate the "democratic" institutions of the EU... :(

[Arlekino]

Hello comrades

Is anybody heard about Lithuanian “Forest of Brothers” guerrilla warfare it was fight against Soviets some collaborated with Nazis some are not. There is little issues about that. Actually they killed locals but now they are in Lithuania classified as heroes.

[Pogue]

Yes, your shrill voices are amusing to me, since you guys don't have a leg to stand on. Next!

Next what? You haven't even responded.

[Sarah Palin]

Next what? You haven't even responded.

Not to pick sides in this, but I'm no stalinist. I was just commenting on how the movie didn't present all of the facts, just their skewed bias.

[danyboy27]

Not to pick sides in this, but I'm no stalinist. I was just commenting on how the movie didn't present all of the facts, just their skewed bias.


nothing new, everyone play this game all of the time.
its always about how the side x could portray the side y has evil rapist/babies killer.

[Kwisatz Haderach]

If so, they'll probably be anti-communist propaganda movies, as they are transforming towards a 100% anti-communist coalition. Check: http://inter.kke.gr/News/2009news/2009-04-hungarian and http://kne.gr/817.html
That's not anywhere close to being a "100% anti-communist coalition." It's just further proof that they are reformists, which we already knew.

However, reformists are still capable of producing perfectly good pro-Marxist propaganda. And they have more money than us (that comes with being friendly to capitalism). Just because their actions are worthless, that doesn't mean their words can't still be useful.


They want to denounce all experiences of socialism (just like the conservatives and fascists behind the film "Soviet Story", I guess)
The important thing is to have propaganda that improves the public image of socialism and communism. It does not matter if this is achieved by defending the Soviet experience or by denouncing it as "Stalinist." The USSR is gone; defending or attacking the memory of the USSR cannot do any practical good or harm to anyone. It is only a matter of propaganda now.

I believe that the Soviet experience was overall positive, and that it deserves to be defended. But, if it is easier to persuade a group of people to become communists by denouncing the Soviet Union as a horrible anti-communist nightmare, then I will denounce the Soviet Union as a horrible anti-communist nightmare.

The dead do not care what we say about them. We must say whatever is most likely to improve the lives of the living.


It's an all-out reformist project, and if the left (in a meaningful sense of the word, rather than just those who want to "reform away" the "excesses of capitalism") is to have any future success, it's not going to be in this opportunist coalition that only wants to sit in parliament and validate the "democratic" institutions of the EU... :(
Of course. But I wasn't talking about practical success in the effort to emancipate the working class. I was talking about a much more modest goal: the best and fastest way to get a leftist propaganda film made.