Tupac Shakur - Musical revolutionary

[Dan Majerle]

This man was a genius. His lyrics were inspiring, confronting, funny, serious, satirical and down-right truthful. Not all his songs are about warfare though that was a big part of his life due to his childhood and life amongst thugs and the underprivileged. His life was ended at only 25 years of age. Gunned down. He was passionate and self-educated. Arguably the greatest rapper but not a rapper about girls and money though that certainly was a part of his rappings, but about helping people and the need for change.

"Peace will only come when we get a piece"

"Dear Mr. President, you want us to fight your wars? What the f*ck am i fighting for?"

"I'd rather die like a man than live like a coward"

"I"m running out of suits homie, running out of tears"

"The good die young"

"God Bless the Dead"

All this are from a posthumous album only. He was truly a brilliant man whose life was filled with success tainted by sadness and violence. RIP.

P.S. Keep your head up

[reggaetrain]

Tupac was a genius, imho. RIP.

[Palmares]

Pac was genius, just like Biggie Smalls. Their beef brought their downfall.

Now Nas is alone as the only true MC...

[Zombie]

Even though I'm a rock nd metal fan, I enjoy listening to 2pac's rap. it's very real, unlike most of the mainstream shit you get these days..

just one question, what does MC mean?

.Z.

[Palmares]

Quote: from Zombie on 3:22 pm on May 1, 2003
Even though I'm a rock nd metal fan, I enjoy listening to 2pac's rap. it's very real, unlike most of the mainstream shit you get these days..

just one question, what does MC mean?

.Z.

Master of Ceremonies

[Jaceau]

ie, the guy with the mic at any sort of stage show

I don't really dig his music, but he stood for some cool things. It's just unfortunate how he, and other black people, have to grow up.

[Umoja]

The mostly white media in the United States seems to have started most of the troubles, which further provoked the level of self hate in the black community. Not a fun thing.

[Dirty Jersey]

i think suge wasnt exactly helping the situation. i hope suge burns and rots in hell.

[Jaceau]

Right.

[Dan Majerle]

Has anybody seen the Tupac and Biggie documentary? I want to see it especially for the Suge interview. Snoop got ambushed a couple of weeks ago and survived an assassination probably ordered by Suge. Death Row were the best but Suge needs to let go now. Also why was Nas on Thugz Mansion when 2pac hated him. Why would he add himself to it?

[Palmares]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 6:59 pm on May 4, 2003
Has anybody seen the Tupac and Biggie documentary? I want to see it especially for the Suge interview. Snoop got ambushed a couple of weeks ago and survived an assassination probably ordered by Suge. Death Row were the best but Suge needs to let go now. Also why was Nas on Thugz Mansion when 2pac hated him. Why would he add himself to it?

You need to back track for a minute.

Tupac only hated Nas when he started to hate everyone (at end of his career). I'm not sure when "Thugz Mansion" was recorded, but I think Nas did work with Tupac sometime when he was alive (because he has always admired Tupac, but never mentioned him as sometime he wanted to work with that he hadn't). It seems like this song was edited by Nas after Tupac's death (afterall, Nas' mother died after Tupac did).

But to my point, Tupac eventually did not hate Nas. On the last album Tupac did before his death (even though it was released after his death) he dissed everyone who could be dissed. P Diddy, Biggie Smalls, Jay-Z, Nas, etc. But two or three days before Tupac's death, Nas organised a meeting with Tupac to settle the situation. they met, and Tupac agreed to remove the diss. They were to have another meeting a couple of days later to formalise things, but when the day came and Nas called Tupac's guys as such, he was told Tupac he passed away.

So, I ask you to withdraw what you said about Nas... please... :)

Keep it real homie! :)

[Dan Majerle]

hey i have nothing against Nas though i do think his best songs are behind him now. But the original of Thugz Mansions is not with Nas and it isn't acoustic though i have to admit the acoustic sounds better. Nas added himself to it. Are you sure about this meeting with Nas and 2pac. B/C i have the vibe biography of 2pac with all interviews and everything and it includes one that was conducted i think a week or 2 before his death and he really has a military mind in it to the point that it is pretty scary cause he has been constantly pushed to the limit and provoked. Like a metamorphasis with no sympathy and read for anything that comes. I don't know it's weird. If i was wrong then i'll retract what i said.

Order of the best rappers

Snoop= 1
2pac = 2
Warren G = 3
Dre = 4
Kurupt = 5
These are the greatest rappers ever

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 5:14 am on May 1, 2003
Pac was genius, just like Biggie Smalls. Their beef brought their downfall.

Now Nas is alone as the only true MC...



Are you Def

Every hear of Mos Def or Talib Kweli


or Blackthought? Or Malik B?



Nas the only MC? Granted he's good but he's not alone

[Umoja]

Askari X is deeper then all of them. This guy realesed his first album when he was 16 and in prison, and he's political. That's deep.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Umoja on 10:09 pm on May 5, 2003
Askari X is deeper then all of them. This guy realesed his first album when he was 16 and in prison, and he's political. That's deep.

MCin aint got shit to do with bein deep

granted it counts. All the guys I talked about are deep specially Kweli and Mos


however bein an MC is a fuckin package

let me break it down.

MC=Master of Ceremonies

meaning you bring more than just lyrics, you are able to keep a crowd hype

wen hip hop first started rappers rapped for hours on end no stopin


look at this

Mos Def is fuckin renesance man. He can rap, act, and above all else do spoken word.

He's artisticaly deep


Kweli has the greatest flow out there currently.

PLus he can go from being political to making a song perfect for clubs.


Malik B. he flow is incredible. He can rap circles around practicaly everyone out there.


Blackthought. No one and I repeat no one puts on a show like him.

Beat boxing, rapping, freestyling,break dancing,scatting.


This nigga can do it all.


Thats what it takes to be an MC...not just conciousness

[Palmares]

Firstly, I just want to give some more details to the Tupac - Nas situation.

The album I was referring to was 'Makavelli' and the diss of Nas was not removed because the second meeting which was to finalise things was prevented from happening (that is, Tupac died).

Anyway, in regards to Larndlad95.

I don't think much of Talib Kweli (who is the guy on here who is obsesses with him? I swear there was one...) He a good MC, but not to my taste. Just doesn't flow for me.
Haven't heard much of Mos Def and Malik B, but what I have didn't inspire me much either (but any recommendations wouldn't hurt). Never heard anything by Blackthought...

I don't think Nas' best stuff is behind him. Really depends what style you like, coz if youl ike his old school style more, I guess I could agree.

Dan... WTF is with your fav rappers? Snoop, Warren G and Kurupt are wack, Dre is past it, but I do agree that Tupac is great.

My list is morel ike this;

Nas
Biggie Smalls
Tupac
KRS-One
Chuck D

(No specific order, but I did put Chuck D last for a reason)

[B] RESPECT...

"Represent'n is ILLMATIC."
- Nas

[Umoja]

Kweli has an annoying lisp.

[Dan Majerle]

Snoop is the biggest monster ever! Doggystyle is the greatest rap album in the history of rap! The is undeniable. I mean lodi dodi, what's my name, gin and juice, so many classics. Warren G and the regulator album, plus take a look over your shoulder which is alright but his third album i think it's called having things is also mad. Dre and his Chronic album? Even 2001 is amazing. That guy left rap for 10 years, decided to conquer it again and did it without breaking a sweat! Kurupt as a lyricist, nobody surpasses. Seriously though Snoop has lost the plot with no limit, his new stuff is good and his old stuff on Chronic, Doggystyle and Doggfather is the best. 2pac for obvious reasons though i found makavelli too dark and gloomy for me. Songs like hail mary scare the crap out of me!

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 12:46 am on May 6, 2003
Firstly, I just want to give some more details to the Tupac - Nas situation.

The album I was referring to was 'Makavelli' and the diss of Nas was not removed because the second meeting which was to finalise things was prevented from happening (that is, Tupac died).

Anyway, in regards to Larndlad95.

I don't think much of Talib Kweli (who is the guy on here who is obsesses with him? I swear there was one...) He a good MC, but not to my taste. Just doesn't flow for me.
Haven't heard much of Mos Def and Malik B, but what I have didn't inspire me much either (but any recommendations wouldn't hurt). Never heard anything by Blackthought...

I don't think Nas' best stuff is behind him. Really depends what style you like, coz if youl ike his old school style more, I guess I could agree.

Dan... WTF is with your fav rappers? Snoop, Warren G and Kurupt are wack, Dre is past it, but I do agree that Tupac is great.

My list is morel ike this;

Nas
Biggie Smalls
Tupac
KRS-One
Chuck D

(No specific order, but I did put Chuck D last for a reason)

[B] RESPECT...

"Represent'n is ILLMATIC."
- Nas



Malik B and Blackthought are from the roots

aint never heard mos Def...

I suggest you pick up Kweli's and MOs' first album Blackstar

when they were underground

very gritty but good

and have you heard reflection eternal? Kweli made an instant classic on that one.



Also Umjoa....what lisp?

[Umoja]

I dunno LL, he just has some type of lispy sound when he raps. Maybe I listen to much. :biggrin:

[Palmares]

Warren G was okay back in his 213 days, but I don't think much of his MC'n. Snoop is similar, but has a more annoying sound/voice. I also don't like Talib Kweli's voice much either, but I didn't notice a lisp.

I'll keep an eye out for the roots.

Dre is still pretty good I guess, but he can never return to his NWA days. I also forgot to metion Rakim as an awesome MC, though he went downward a while back. He didn't return to the top like Nas.

[Dirty Jersey]

i agree with lardlad that blackstar and train of thought were classics. but dan seriously what the fuck is wrong with you thinking kurupt is anywhere near the top 5? you might as well have said master p or lil wayne. that shit is just laughable. i love biggie but he has no place in the top 5 either. nas is great but illmatic was his best work. new york state of mind was a great song. and krs is a living legend.

[Dan Majerle]

This is my top 5 that includes mainly West coast rap. I've never listened to biggie, roots, etc. Kurupt is a legend though. His lyrics are so well written and he "smashes mc's on the mic". Download New York, New York and Trilogy to find out how good this guy is. Snoop is wonderous. I don't know why everyone doubts him. This guy was gangsta rap and people like Jay Z were polishing his gold plated shoes in his dogghouse. Warren is a wonderful producer though his raps aren't that good. 2pac is 2pac, ie GOAT and Dre pioneer and legend. The guy doesn't even try and produces smash hits. He took 10 years off! LOL Came back as if nothing changed.
Seriously west coast rap, the death row era was unbelievable. Modern rap is crap though the roots, jurassic 5 and all them are crticially acclaimed but i haven't heard them. Nas is alright too.

[Sandanista]

2pac presents black youths, or any youth for that matter from underprivaliged backgrounds with a very negative image. He imprisoned for rape, and all he rapped about was guns, money ho's and weed.

He was and always will pathetic.

[Dirty Jersey]

thats bullshit. he rapped about his mother, teanage pregnancy, opression, police brutality, poverty, rape, and all kinds of things. have you ever listened to an entire tupac album sandanista? youre just ignorant man. he truly was the rose that grew from concrete.

[Palmares]

"Nas is ILLMATIC"

So... "Stillmatic" isn't a good album? How about "The Lost Tapes"? "God's Son" is pretty good aswell, but not as good as the previous two (and especially not ILLMATIC).

What do people think of "The Source" magazine? Didn't it vote "ILLMATIC" as the greatest album of all-time?

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 1:39 am on May 8, 2003
"Nas is ILLMATIC"

So... "Stillmatic" isn't a good album? How about "The Lost Tapes"? "God's Son" is pretty good aswell, but not as good as the previous two (and especially not ILLMATIC).

What do people think of "The Source" magazine? Didn't it vote "ILLMATIC" as the greatest album of all-time?


Greatest album of all time?

It's on my top ten but no way in hell it beats Exodus-Bob Marley

or Things Fall Apart-The Roots


(things fall apart is my favorite hip-hop album cuz it's the album that made me love hip hop, before that I really never listened to music)

The Lost tapes was incredible though

(Edited by Lardlad95 at 11:58 am on May 8, 2003)

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Umoja on 12:29 pm on May 6, 2003
I dunno LL, he just has some type of lispy sound when he raps. Maybe I listen to much. :biggrin:


No he just raps fast plus he has that brooklyn accent

[Umoja]

Yeah, the rapping fast and the brooklyn thing make sense.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Umoja on 12:20 pm on May 8, 2003
Yeah, the rapping fast and the brooklyn thing make sense.

Listen to "Four Women" by Talib Kweli

it's hard to find on it's own cuz it was a hidden track on Reflection Eternal


or if not just listen to number 20 on reflection eternal

teh intro is kinda long but the song is incredible

[Urban Rubble]

ATTENTION DAN MAJERLE

TURN OFF YOUR RADIO !!!!!!

Those guys are good rappers no doubt, but best of all time ? Not even close. Here are some better ones (In my opinion).

Mos Def
Talib Kweli
All the Jurassic 5 mc's
Guru
The Roots
De La Soul
Tash and Defari
Sadat X
I hate to say it, but Eminem, I don't agree with what he says but you got to admit the guy can rap

Anyway, the list goes on and on.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 11:30 pm on May 9, 2003
ATTENTION DAN MAJERLE

TURN OFF YOUR RADIO !!!!!!

Those guys are good rappers no doubt, but best of all time ? Not even close. Here are some better ones (In my opinion).

Mos Def
Talib Kweli
All the Jurassic 5 mc's
Guru
The Roots
De La Soul
Tash and Defari
Sadat X
I hate to say it, but Eminem, I don't agree with what he says but you got to admit the guy can rap

Anyway, the list goes on and on.

THe man knows of what he speaks

[Umoja]

If your gonna say Saddat X, how can you forget Lord Jamar? Or Grand Puba? You gotta get all of Brand Nubian in there.

[Palmares]

I just wanted to state (especially to Landlad95) that ILLMATIC is the greatest RAP album of all-time, not of all genres.

Is it me, or are many of you completely ignoring the magnificent MC'n talent of Nas, Biggie, Tupac and KRS-One?

[B]Nas is the best lyricist.

[Lefty]

Am I the only only person that likes Del that funky homosapien here? Deltron 50-50? Anybody?

Enh. Oh, the roots and everything Lardlad likes. I checked out that Little Brother CD, and it was extremely "tight." That's right, a whiteboy from suburban Iowa just said tight.

*prepares to be "capped"*

[Dan Majerle]

One work with various meanings. DOGGYSTYLE. DOGGYSTYLE people. Come on you all know better than that. It is the greatest rap album. Snoop made it when he was 19 living the real gangsta life and he has so mnay classics. There is not one bad song on this album and it was and still is the best rap album iwth the best rap tunes. I remember the days of going to parties and when i could hear Doggystyle from the speakers i knew i had come to the right place. No better place to be with girls then in the House that Snoop built. Even the comedy skits on it are funny as. Snoop is the master. Doggystyle is the greatest...EVER. :)

Another great tupac quote that somebody's signature reminded me of:

"It's funny when it rains and pours they've got money for wars but can't feed the poor".
Gold

[Palmares]

ILLMATIC was made back when Nas was still a brother livin in the projects, Queensbridge. That album is true to life, about his struggle on the streets, losing friends and enemies. This album alone, convinced the rap public who the best lyricist was... Nas.

Fuck gangsta... Stereotyping this shit is wack!

I got a cool Tupac quote;

"Fuck Jay-Z" :biggrin:

[Dan Majerle]

lol damn right
i have another tupac quote, in fact many of them that can be found in "against all odds" - makavelli. ;)
Just joking. Seriously though what happened to Nas. In the start he was good. THen he became fat and materialistic and now he is back to stage 1. Can anybody explain this change?

[Urban Rubble]

I like Snoop cause he seems like a cool guy more than for his rapping skills. I'll agree, Doggystyle was amazing, but more in a catch your ear pop type way than a real "raw" hip hop way.

[Palmares]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 3:40 pm on May 19, 2003
lol damn right
i have another tupac quote, in fact many of them that can be found in "against all odds" - makavelli. ;)
Just joking. Seriously though what happened to Nas. In the start he was good. THen he became fat and materialistic and now he is back to stage 1. Can anybody explain this change?


What do you mean by "Stage 1"?

Nas was 'real' on ILLMATIC, but after the success of it he fell for the very things he was against (Gangsta, hos, money, cars, whatever...). This reflected in his next three LPs, the much anticipated "It was Written", inwhich many said he went mainstream after having the duet on "If I ruled the world" with Lauren Hill. I disagree, but the album was shit. Then there was "Nastradamus" and "I am". I don't think too much of them, just bling bling bullshit. Having a song with Genuwine was the worst!!! But I thought there was something left in him, and "Stillmatic" proved it. I'm not really sure what changed him back to his old ('real') ways, but I have the feeling his beef with Jay-Z might have been a contributing factor. Before that, he really wasn't up to much. But when Jay-Z dissed Mobb Deep and continued on to Nas, he got a wake up call. Though Nas says he never went mainstream, I think he was just in denial. It's like the old cliche about power (i.e. corruption). But what really matters is that he is back (not the same, but like a newer version).

"They thought I'll make another "Illmatic",
but it's always forward I'm moving,
never backwards stupid here's another classic."
- Nas

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 3:59 am on May 12, 2003
I just wanted to state (especially to Landlad95) that ILLMATIC is the greatest RAP album of all-time, not of all genres.

Is it me, or are many of you completely ignoring the magnificent MC'n talent of Nas, Biggie, Tupac and KRS-One?

[B]Nas is the best lyricist.


Who said I didn't like any of those guys?

I love nas, I love Krs. However in my opinion there are better MCs

Illmatic was great, but Things Fall Apart brought me to hip hop

so obviously the roots hold a place musicaly for me that nas can't fill

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Lefty on 9:00 pm on May 16, 2003
Am I the only only person that likes Del that funky homosapien here? Deltron 50-50? Anybody?

Enh. Oh, the roots and everything Lardlad likes. I checked out that Little Brother CD, and it was extremely "tight." That's right, a whiteboy from suburban Iowa just said tight.

*prepares to be "capped"*


I could never cap you..murk you maybe, but enver cap.


I told you Little Brother's album was "tight"

[Dan Majerle]

Seriously this has gone on long enough.
DOGGYSTYLE
ALL EYEZ ON ME
CHRONIC
REGULATORS
2001

that is it. Doggystyle please. Seriously if you don't have it buy the album, look at every song, every lyric, every beat, every skit, it is the epitome of greatness. It will never be surpassed. Snoop Doggy Dogg created rap. Before him there was not rap. After him there will be no rap. He is our great leader.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 4:58 pm on May 22, 2003
Seriously this has gone on long enough.
DOGGYSTYLE
ALL EYEZ ON ME
CHRONIC
REGULATORS
2001

that is it. Doggystyle please. Seriously if you don't have it buy the album, look at every song, every lyric, every beat, every skit, it is the epitome of greatness. It will never be surpassed. Snoop Doggy Dogg created rap. Before him there was not rap. After him there will be no rap. He is our great leader.

The fuck were you smokin

There may not have been rap before or after him but there was definitely hip hop before and after

[Palmares]

I gotta agree with Landlad95 here (except on All eyes on me).

I think more like;

ILLMATIC
Stillmatic
Enter The Wu-Tang
It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back
Ready to Die
All Eyez on Me

I might how fucked that up (missed some, I dunno, just not thinking straight at the mo).

When I really think about it, Stillmatic is probably my fav LP. ILLMATIC is the best, but I get sick of the style sometimes. Stillmatic I can play all the time, no matter my mood.

[Dan Majerle]

Alright let's hear it. What is everybody's beef with the Dogg? Is it his success? His freestyle ability? What? Talk to me i need to know. He might not rap about the black cause or whatever but his raps are incredible. All his songs are tight except for some crappy ones but every artist is entitled to that. Let's hear an argument against him. I expect it to be very short!

[Umoja]

A Tribe Called Quest, upon listening to them again, really ranks up there. The Low End Theory is easily one of the best Albums ever.

[Urban Rubble]

Marleje, you're fucking insane. Snoop created rap ? Now you're even more clueless than I thought. I don't have "beef" with Snoop, I like his shit, I simply realize that he isn't the greatest rapper of all time, not even of the 90's. Claiming Snoop is the best rapper ever is laughable, fucking ridiculous.

I'm not sure which comment is more off base, there was no rap before him (KRS-one) or that there will be no rap after him (I'm not going to put a name because I could list a million).

The bottom line is he doesn't make the beats, the lyrics are about the same repetitve bullshit, a 10 year old could write those "skits", and his freestyle skills are mediocore at best. It's cool if he's your favorite, but don't try to say he's the best.

You are fucking crazy and you have ALOT to learn about hip hop. And this is coming from a kid who considers himself a punk.

Quite simply, you are wrong.

[Palmares]

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 1:18 pm on May 23, 2003

Quite simply, you (Dan Marleje) are wrong.

Well said! :)

[Dan Majerle]

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 3:18 am on May 23, 2003
Marleje, you're fucking insane. Snoop created rap ? Now you're even more clueless than I thought. I don't have "beef" with Snoop, I like his shit, I simply realize that he isn't the greatest rapper of all time, not even of the 90's. Claiming Snoop is the best rapper ever is laughable, fucking ridiculous.

I'm not sure which comment is more off base, there was no rap before him (KRS-one) or that there will be no rap after him (I'm not going to put a name because I could list a million).

The bottom line is he doesn't make the beats, the lyrics are about the same repetitve bullshit, a 10 year old could write those "skits", and his freestyle skills are mediocore at best. It's cool if he's your favorite, but don't try to say he's the best.

You are fucking crazy and you have ALOT to learn about hip hop. And this is coming from a kid who considers himself a punk.

Quite simply, you are wrong.



Nice reply apart though i have to clear up one thing. I was joking when i said he created rap and stuff like that. It is like the official title of the North Korean leader and that is why i ended it with he is out great leader. The rest i said is all true. Snoop is the best ever.
Chenthar you are just angry i allied with IHP!!!!!! ;) Seriously Nas though? come on the guy has made one album. Big deal. Snoop basically retired from the rap game after doggystyle and is still the greatest. Just like Dre lol Came back after 10 years and claimed it again with 2001.

[Palmares]

Nas, one album?

Have you heard of Stillmatic? The Lost Tapes? God's Son was pretty good too.

Personally, I don't give a fuck about snoops Doggyshit! He was never IN the game from the beginning. Dre is cool though (better in NWA days though).

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 5:18 am on May 23, 2003
Nas, one album?

Have you heard of Stillmatic? The Lost Tapes? God's Son was pretty good too.

Personally, I don't give a fuck about snoops Doggyshit! He was never IN the game from the beginning. Dre is cool though (better in NWA days though).


Lost Tapes was ill though


But Kweli, Mos, and the Roots still my top three nas somewhere between 5 and 7.

Even Little Brother gettin up there with him

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 2:17 am on May 23, 2003
Alright let's hear it. What is everybody's beef with the Dogg? Is it his success? His freestyle ability? What? Talk to me i need to know. He might not rap about the black cause or whatever but his raps are incredible. All his songs are tight except for some crappy ones but every artist is entitled to that. Let's hear an argument against him. I expect it to be very short!


Son kweli, Nas, Thought, would eat Snoop in a freestyle

[Urban Rubble]

Snoope basically retired after Doggystyle ? Are you fucking serious ? No, he didn't retire, he made like 5 shitty albums after that. The DogFather was o.k but the rest of that shit sucked.

Seriously Dan, turn off the radio, take some suggestions for your comrades on this board and open up to some new music.

[Dirty Jersey]

I'll admit Doggystyle was alright in its day but not anymore. And I love Dre but he came back for about 6 months and that would have never happened if it wasnt for his little white *****. Nobodys blastin 2001 on the radio today. Get over the whole West coast scene. It had a good run but most of it was fucking garbage. And all Snoops work on No Limit was garbage as well.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dirty Jersey on 7:54 am on May 24, 2003
I'll admit Doggystyle was alright in its day but not anymore. And I love Dre but he came back for about 6 months and that would have never happened if it wasnt for his little white *****. Nobodys blastin 2001 on the radio today. Get over the whole West coast scene. It had a good run but most of it was fucking garbage. And all Snoops work on No Limit was garbage as well.

Hey Dialated Peoples is west coast they aight

[Dan Majerle]

That's it if you are bagging west coast rap, west coast rap that encompasses Snoop, Dre, Tupac, then i'm going to bag east coast rap.
First Nas? He has one well made album, the rest are mediocre. I mean Nastradamus? LOL come on!
Biggy only made 2 albums and he copied his style from 2pac. 2pac taught him how to rap and gave him his breaks and not to mention stole his wife ;)
Puff well we don't need to discuss him
Mase? lol
The roots and all them i don't listen to so i can't comment.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 1:33 pm on May 24, 2003
That's it if you are bagging west coast rap, west coast rap that encompasses Snoop, Dre, Tupac, then i'm going to bag east coast rap.
First Nas? He has one well made album, the rest are mediocre. I mean Nastradamus? LOL come on!
Biggy only made 2 albums and he copied his style from 2pac. 2pac taught him how to rap and gave him his breaks and not to mention stole his wife ;)
Puff well we don't need to discuss him
Mase? lol
The roots and all them i don't listen to so i can't comment.



First off don't fuck with East Coast cuz we started this shit.

Second Nas made Illmatic,Stillmatic,Lost Tapes all some of teh best albums in hip-hop ever

Biggie's flow was better than Pac's, pac was deep but in a battle biggie woulda ate him.


And who the fuck listen's to MAse and Puffy



The Roots represent philly which besides new york has some of the best rappers on eath.

Kweli and Mos two of the best rappers out today.

Sit down son before you hurt yourself


(Edited by Lardlad95 at 6:53 pm on May 24, 2003)

[Rastafari]

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 1:55 pm on May 24, 2003
The Roots represent philly which besides new york has some of the best rapers on eath.


I knew someone would leave out a "P" sometime, so now I strike (knowing nothing about Rap in general, just the raping aspect therein :)).
There are also good rapers on the west coast, mostly in places like San Quentin

[Dan Majerle]

Biggie? Come on Lardlad you know Pac was the realest and the greatest. 2pac was far superior to Biggie, i mean this guy is one of the greatest. He made numerous albums all with great songs. Biggie made 2 albums so you can't say he was all that when he hardly even extended himself. Furthermore biggie hung with Puffy, PUFFY!!!!!!!!!!!!
CASE CLOSED

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 3:06 pm on May 24, 2003
Biggie? Come on Lardlad you know Pac was the realest and the greatest. 2pac was far superior to Biggie, i mean this guy is one of the greatest. He made numerous albums all with great songs. Biggie made 2 albums so you can't say he was all that when he hardly even extended himself. Furthermore biggie hung with Puffy, PUFFY!!!!!!!!!!!!
CASE CLOSED


And Pac hung out with Suge Knight....SUGE KNIGHT

[Dirty Jersey]

Hey I only said most West Coast rap was garbage. I love Dialated Peoples. And I've been known to bump the Liks as well as Tash's solo shit. Pac was from the East Coast people. Your whole West Coast style was begun by an East Coaster so enough of this 'West is the best' bullshit. And the East Coast has some shit too, but I can name a hundred real emcees from the east coast and I struggle to think of ten real West Coast emcees. Yall only invented gangsta rap which died in like 95'. Conscious rap has been around from the first time KRS picked up a mic until present, so its clear what coast is better.

[Palmares]

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 11:55 pm on May 24, 2003

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 1:33 pm on May 24, 2003
That's it if you are bagging west coast rap, west coast rap that encompasses Snoop, Dre, Tupac, then i'm going to bag east coast rap.
First Nas? He has one well made album, the rest are mediocre. I mean Nastradamus? LOL come on!
Biggy only made 2 albums and he copied his style from 2pac. 2pac taught him how to rap and gave him his breaks and not to mention stole his wife ;)
Puff well we don't need to discuss him
Mase? lol
The roots and all them i don't listen to so i can't comment.



First off don't fuck with East Coast cuz we started this shit.

Second Nas made Illmatic,Stillmatic,Lost Tapes all some of teh best albums in hip-hop ever

Biggie's flow was better than Pac's, pac was deep but in a battle biggie woulda ate him.


And who the fuck listen's to MAse and Puffy



The Roots represent philly which besides new york has some of the best rappers on eath.

Kweli and Mos two of the best rappers out today.

Sit down son before you hurt yourself


(Edited by Lardlad95 at 6:53 pm on May 24, 2003)


Word

East Coast beats the shit out of West Coast, Tupac was the last true MC from there. East has Nas, Biggie (he did not copy Pac's style!), and others who are just under them.

SNOOP IS FUCKING WACK!

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 6:53 am on May 26, 2003

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 11:55 pm on May 24, 2003

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 1:33 pm on May 24, 2003
That's it if you are bagging west coast rap, west coast rap that encompasses Snoop, Dre, Tupac, then i'm going to bag east coast rap.
First Nas? He has one well made album, the rest are mediocre. I mean Nastradamus? LOL come on!
Biggy only made 2 albums and he copied his style from 2pac. 2pac taught him how to rap and gave him his breaks and not to mention stole his wife ;)
Puff well we don't need to discuss him
Mase? lol
The roots and all them i don't listen to so i can't comment.



First off don't fuck with East Coast cuz we started this shit.

Second Nas made Illmatic,Stillmatic,Lost Tapes all some of teh best albums in hip-hop ever

Biggie's flow was better than Pac's, pac was deep but in a battle biggie woulda ate him.


And who the fuck listen's to MAse and Puffy



The Roots represent philly which besides new york has some of the best rappers on eath.

Kweli and Mos two of the best rappers out today.

Sit down son before you hurt yourself


(Edited by Lardlad95 at 6:53 pm on May 24, 2003)


Word

East Coast beats the shit out of West Coast, Tupac was the last true MC from there. East has Nas, Biggie (he did not copy Pac's style!), and others who are just under them.

SNOOP IS FUCKING WACK!


*throws up east coast sign*

[Umoja]

Don't forget Conscious rap seems to only come off the East Coast.

[Dan Majerle]

Suddently "Hit em up" begins to blare through my speakers!!!!!!!!!
Nah i have no beef with east coast rap. I was never against it. I just said i liked SNoop and tupac and dre and warren. Then somebody said let go of west coast rap and how it sucks so i retaliated.
I have no beef with a side of rap, merely particular rappers. This is like what the media did and what ended up killing 2pac and biggie. This stupid east vs west rivalry that never existed. I have "It was written" by Nas though that isn't that good of an album.........

WEST COAST MOTHER F*CKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
;)

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 4:35 pm on May 26, 2003
Suddently "Hit em up" begins to blare through my speakers!!!!!!!!!
Nah i have no beef with east coast rap. I was never against it. I just said i liked SNoop and tupac and dre and warren. Then somebody said let go of west coast rap and how it sucks so i retaliated.
I have no beef with a side of rap, merely particular rappers. This is like what the media did and what ended up killing 2pac and biggie. This stupid east vs west rivalry that never existed. I have "It was written" by Nas though that isn't that good of an album.........

WEST COAST MOTHER F*CKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
;)

Far West I go is Midwest and North Carolina and thas still easternish

All I'm sayin is fuck West Coast

*gets boys brandishing baseball bats, brass knuckles, chains, and knives*

[Urban Rubble]

First off let me just say I think this debate over East vs West is ridiculous. It's so stupid to try and judge a rapper by what side of the country he lives on.

With that said, Dan Marleje, you are starting to sound like you discovered hip hop a week ago when you turned to MTV and saw a video off 2001. The fact that you said you couldn't comment on the Roots because you don't listen to them says it all. You don't have to love the Roots, but you should acknowledge that they could rap circles around Snoop and ESPECIALLY Dre. Biggie was easily the rapper that Pac was, how you can think someone was less of a rapper based on the number of albums he made escapes me. Anyway, I'm not trying to be a dick, but I think you may be a lost cause.

Since you like West Coast so much, let me give you a "to listen to" list.

Jurrasic 5
Tash
Defari (a.k.a Tha Alkoholiks)
Dialated Peoples
the DJ Babu solo album

Start with that, if you still think Snoop is the greatest rapper then I don't know what to do.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 8:30 pm on May 26, 2003
First off let me just say I think this debate over East vs West is ridiculous. It's so stupid to try and judge a rapper by what side of the country he lives on.

With that said, Dan Marleje, you are starting to sound like you discovered hip hop a week ago when you turned to MTV and saw a video off 2001. The fact that you said you couldn't comment on the Roots because you don't listen to them says it all. You don't have to love the Roots, but you should acknowledge that they could rap circles around Snoop and ESPECIALLY Dre. Biggie was easily the rapper that Pac was, how you can think someone was less of a rapper based on the number of albums he made escapes me. Anyway, I'm not trying to be a dick, but I think you may be a lost cause.

Since you like West Coast so much, let me give you a "to listen to" list.

Jurrasic 5
Tash
Defari (a.k.a Tha Alkoholiks)
Dialated Peoples
the DJ Babu solo album

Start with that, if you still think Snoop is the greatest rapper then I don't know what to do.


Yeah BAbu's Solo Album was gangsta

and J-5's album was tight


And to Dan, BlackThought and Malik b. from the roots are two of the most diverse rappers on earth.

You want proof download these songs to hear both of them.

I remain Calm, Respond React, Sections, Adrenaline


And BlackThought can rap on practicaly everystyle of music. Jazz,Hip Hop, Rock, Blues

lIsten to: Proceed(whichincludes Malik B), Glitches, The Next Movement, Dynamite(ft. Elo), Rolling with Heat (ft. Talib Kweli), and the Seed 2.0



when searching for these songs for artist put the Roots


(only BlackThought and Malik rap , the rest just play instruments, though Malik has been gone for a while do to personal deamons and a drug problem)

[Palmares]

I think the West Coast has some skill, of course Tupac when he was around, Xzibit and Eminem have some skill (but both need to improve their lyrics), Jurassic 5 are pretty ILL, the Alkaholiks are okay from what I've heard of them. Ice Cube is one of the really good MC's, but I still don't think much of Snoop and Warren. Dre is cool though.

Even though there really isn't a West Coast versus East Coast beef, I still reckon East Coast shit is better. But hey, that's just me! :biggrin:

[Dan Majerle]

"Everywhere i go niggas holla at me, keep it real g, and my reply till they kill me, is act up if you feel me i wasn't born to make it but i did, the tribulations of a ghetto kid, still i rise"

FREAK 2PAC IS THE BEST!!!!!!!!!
(behind the S N OO P D O GG Y D O GG ;))

[Palmares]

[B] "Ain't no best."
- Nas

[Urban Rubble]

True, there is no best, but there definately is a NOT best and Snoop falls under that catergory.

O.K, I realize if there is no best then everyone is not best, but still, Snoop is mediocore at best.

[Dan Majerle]

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 6:01 am on May 28, 2003
True, there is no best, but there definately is a NOT best and Snoop falls under that catergory.

O.K, I realize if there is no best then everyone is not best, but still, Snoop is mediocore at best.

LOL
BEST you keep your mouth shut! ;)
Chenthar, how did a white Aussie male like you from tassie get into rap?

[Urban Rubble]

I was wondering the same about the Aussie.

Anyway, Dan, I'll forgive your taste in music only because I like you nick, Dan Marleje is the man, the Flying Cracker I used to call him.

[Palmares]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 8:30 pm on May 28, 2003

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 6:01 am on May 28, 2003
True, there is no best, but there definately is a NOT best and Snoop falls under that catergory.

O.K, I realize if there is no best then everyone is not best, but still, Snoop is mediocore at best.

LOL
BEST you keep your mouth shut! ;)
Chenthar, how did a white Aussie male like you from tassie get into rap?


I agree with Urban Rubble. Snoop ain't the best (close to the worse side).

Dan M (did you get that name from the NBA player?), I'm not a whitey. I'm half white, half Philipino. I'm a latin fucka boy, a fuckin Asiatic!

But anyway, I got into rap back in grade 9 or 10 (I'm grade 12 now). I think it was coz my friend was into it, but we were into shit rap back then. But over time I have matured into being able to distinguish the difference.

How bout you homies?

[Lardlad95]

Greatest Rappers or Rap groups out today

The Roots
Little Brother
BlackaLicious
Mos Def and Talib Kweli
Dialated peoples
Outkast
Nas
Field Mob(just cuz they be funny)

[Urban Rubble]

God I fucking love Dialated, Evidence's voice is so good.

[Palmares]

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 1:05 pm on May 29, 2003
Greatest Rappers or Rap groups out today

The Roots
Little Brother
BlackaLicious
Mos Def and Talib Kweli
Dialated peoples
Outkast
Nas
Field Mob(just cuz they be funny)


WORD IS BOND

I don't know as much bout them as you, but overall I agree (especially with Nas, but maybe you are missing some...)

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 6:54 am on May 29, 2003

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 1:05 pm on May 29, 2003
Greatest Rappers or Rap groups out today

The Roots
Little Brother
BlackaLicious
Mos Def and Talib Kweli
Dialated peoples
Outkast
Nas
Field Mob(just cuz they be funny)


WORD IS BOND

I don't know as much bout them as you, but overall I agree (especially with Nas, but maybe you are missing some...)

oh you are right

I missed K-OS

(no i don't mean KRS-1)

[Hampton]

K-Os' album was hot.

[Dan Majerle]

I am an 18 year old Greek Australian, Melbourne boy and got into rap in year 6 i think it was through my mate nussy. He introduced me to Doggystyle, he had it on tape. He told me to listen to it. I thought it was the biggest load of crap ever. He told me to listen to it again. And then i became part of the Dogg pound. From there i was introduced to West Coast rap especially Death Row but also NWA. I don't listen to political rap strangely enough like PE and all of todays rappers cause my friends don't and i can't be bothered finding out new rappers any more. I am so lazy i can't even be bothered finding out lyrics to todays songs. I like the Strokes and i have there album but i don't know the words to any of their songs. All the meaning and everything is lost on me lol. Oh well. Yeah so that is how i started. Rappers today suck like Jay- Z, Puff Daddy, Ja Rule. I don't mind 50 cent though. Eminem i don't like. :)

[Dan Majerle]

Oh i forgot,

Thanks for that Urban Rubble and Chenthar. I like basketball and both of you. :) Freak we had a tough loss today. I am angry at myself cause i don't take control of situations. I am too unselfish, i know that sounds really vein but my team is weak and i am the best player so i need to take more shots. We only scored 14 points tonight, i only scored 2 i missed 3 easy threes i am angry at myself. I got 8 rebounds though i think. Freak anyways boys keep the NBA and 2pac bumping. That guy alone makes life worth living. What he had to put up with, everything that happened to him and it all ended at 25. 25! That is sad. Keep ya head up though so we can get through everything, nothing worse then ending your life or someone elses, we all have a place on earth and let's make the most of it.
Peace.

[Palmares]

I'm in the same boat about rap (and music). I just can't be bothered much finding out about new stuff. If anything, I find out new studd by old homies.

BTW, [B]Landlad95...

KRS-ONE

YOU MISSED HIM!!!

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 12:49 am on May 30, 2003
I'm in the same boat about rap (and music). I just can't be bothered much finding out about new stuff. If anything, I find out new studd by old homies.

BTW, [B]Landlad95...

KRS-ONE

YOU MISSED HIM!!!

Mufucka my name is LARDLAD

not LANDLAD

aint no n in my screen name

and the people i mentioed are better than Krs-One


I mean KRS is tight an all but still

[CubaVictoria1983]

I agree with lardlads list of current best rap artists. I don't know who k-os is....but krs-1 is really good and should not go unmentioned.

:cool:

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from CubaVictoria1983 on 2:10 am on May 30, 2003
I agree with lardlads list of current best rap artists. I don't know who k-os is....but krs-1 is really good and should not go unmentioned.

:cool:


K-os is like this Rapper who mixes in acid jazz sprinkled with neo-soul and in his latest video he dresses up like Fidel Castro...and he actually looks like a black Fidel Castro in real life

[Dan Majerle]

Okay i have to ask...
Who do you guys think killed 2pac?
There are theories from Suge, the police, gang warfare, biggie, etc
Also who and why was biggie killed?

[Urban Rubble]

I wish I could find a link, that case is basically solved.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 5:19 am on June 4, 2003
Okay i have to ask...
Who do you guys think killed 2pac?
There are theories from Suge, the police, gang warfare, biggie, etc
Also who and why was biggie killed?


i shot pac cuz he owed me two dollars and thirty eight cents

and i shot biggie cuz htat mufucka bought the big mac at that mcdonalds just before it closed

[Umoja]

Trillz.

Haha. Seriously, the government got Tupac! Biggie was just some messed up boys from Cali though.

[Danton]

Been reading the thread and thought I would add my two pence worth,

2pac & Biggie Smalls - Overated 3rd wave Gangster lite who got what they deserved.

Most things on Rawkus are cool, for me Mos Def's made the best shit in recent years & Mike Ladd's weirdness is a welcome progression. I guess I'm more old school but I feel Hip Hop's mainstream appeal has diluted it to the point where people think Eminem, Nas and the rest are doing something new, i'ts bollox. Doggystyle was an important album (important, not good) but the thousand imitations it spawned degrade it and that whole west coast style is so tired.

The sountrack to my misspent youth included..

Schooly D
Kool Keith
Grandmaster Flash
Affikka Bambatta
Stetsasonic
Brand Nubians
All Native tounge except Queen Latifah
X-clan
Public Enemy
KRS-1
Special Ed

etc etc..



"pppressure pppressure ppressure what? pressure cooker, I'm leaving the party with a massive amount of hookers" - fudge the pudge

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Danton on 1:31 pm on June 5, 2003
Been reading the thread and thought I would add my two pence worth,

2pac & Biggie Smalls - Overated 3rd wave Gangster lite who got what they deserved.

Most things on Rawkus are cool, for me Mos Def's made the best shit in recent years & Mike Ladd's weirdness is a welcome progression. I guess I'm more old school but I feel Hip Hop's mainstream appeal has diluted it to the point where people think Eminem, Nas and the rest are doing something new, i'ts bollox. Doggystyle was an important album (important, not good) but the thousand imitations it spawned degrade it and that whole west coast style is so tired.

The sountrack to my misspent youth included..

Schooly D
Kool Keith
Grandmaster Flash
Affikka Bambatta
Stetsasonic
Brand Nubians
All Native tounge except Queen Latifah
X-clan
Public Enemy
KRS-1
Special Ed

etc etc..



"pppressure pppressure ppressure what? pressure cooker, I'm leaving the party with a massive amount of hookers" - fudge the pudge


Oh this mufucka goin way old school

On Some Affrikka Bambata shit...much ups son

[Dan Majerle]

2pac and biggie got what they deserved? Hold it right there, chief. Go as old school as you bloody want but don't say things like that.

[Danton]

I didnt know you were related, live by the sword die by the sword, sorry but I dont empathise one bit with two overblown thugs who probably created a thousand little monsters and creeps who idealise that kind of lifestyle; I repeat THEY GOT WHAT THEY DESERVED.
It is possible to create funky good beats and maintain street cred whilst expounding a positive message ie KRS etc;;; Lack of punctuation due to Arabic keyboard
Sorry Dan but you are very disturbed with what you consider to be revolutionary when it comes to Hip Hop;
No im not Arabic just typing this in a cafe in Morroco;
Wont be able to reply till wednesday if you want to argue.


"Victoria o muerte"

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Danton on 5:20 pm on June 11, 2003
I didnt know you were related, live by the sword die by the sword, sorry but I dont empathise one bit with two overblown thugs who probably created a thousand little monsters and creeps who idealise that kind of lifestyle; I repeat THEY GOT WHAT THEY DESERVED.
It is possible to create funky good beats and maintain street cred whilst expounding a positive message ie KRS etc;;; Lack of punctuation due to Arabic keyboard
Sorry Dan but you are very disturbed with what you consider to be revolutionary when it comes to Hip Hop;
No im not Arabic just typing this in a cafe in Morroco;
Wont be able to reply till wednesday if you want to argue.


"Victoria o muerte"




Get em son get em

[Hampton]

two overblown thugs who probably created a thousand little monsters and creeps who idealise that kind of lifestyle; I repeat THEY GOT WHAT THEY DESERVED.

Ouch, when you say that though, you're forgetting some of Pac's best songs which were ones of hope, critique of the government, a intelligent social observations by a young black man.

[scott thesocialist]

2pac gave people hope and made them feel a little better for a short time, in my opinion 2pac save alot of people gave them a sense of belonging even if it was to another hommie its better than being alone. you should read The Rose That Grew From Concrete 2pac wrote it before he was invloved in all that gangster shit. Death Row turned him into what some poeple remember him a thug for life , the truth is he was an artist of many talents.
R.I.P
TU-PAC SHAKUR
GOD BLESS THE DEAD

[Dan Majerle]

Danton, you cannot deny the significance and brilliance of 2pac. If you think that he only rapped about killing people and stuff then that just shows you know nothing about the man and what he stood for. You have to understand his upbringing, context, life. He was shot 5 times by people he sought set him up so of course he wanted revenge. He didn't want to kill them but just wrote about how that effected him and about how experiences like losing friends and poverty effected him. 2pac was a revolutionary.
Lardlad what is your beef with me? Seriously sometimes you seem really haughty cause the music you listen to is positive and all that, etc etc. Sometimes in life you need things like Pac and Snoop rapping about girls and the good times and sex etc so that you can relate and feel good about yourself. What is life when you are getting bogged down with all heavy sh#t. Chill. Don't look down on me cause i don't live my life through the Roots and everyone you listen too. We have different tastes bro.
I think alot of people here are simply underestimating 2pac's contribution to music and to the American dream. He made rap realer than what it ever was and was not afraid to say what he wanted. Saying he only rapped about guns and stuff is like saying all Che did was start wars and kill people. Scratch the surface.
Scottthesocialist and Hampton i agree with you btw.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Dan Majerle on 12:56 pm on June 13, 2003
Danton, you cannot deny the significance and brilliance of 2pac. If you think that he only rapped about killing people and stuff then that just shows you know nothing about the man and what he stood for. You have to understand his upbringing, context, life. He was shot 5 times by people he sought set him up so of course he wanted revenge. He didn't want to kill them but just wrote about how that effected him and about how experiences like losing friends and poverty effected him. 2pac was a revolutionary.
Lardlad what is your beef with me? Seriously sometimes you seem really haughty cause the music you listen to is positive and all that, etc etc. Sometimes in life you need things like Pac and Snoop rapping about girls and the good times and sex etc so that you can relate and feel good about yourself. What is life when you are getting bogged down with all heavy sh#t. Chill. Don't look down on me cause i don't live my life through the Roots and everyone you listen too. We have different tastes bro.
I think alot of people here are simply underestimating 2pac's contribution to music and to the American dream. He made rap realer than what it ever was and was not afraid to say what he wanted. Saying he only rapped about guns and stuff is like saying all Che did was start wars and kill people. Scratch the surface.
Scottthesocialist and Hampton i agree with you btw.

never said I don't like pac, or that I didn't listen to pac.

I don't just listen to positive rap.

I listen to Feild Mob, Jay Z, eminem, Outkast, etc.

Those people/groups aren't positive.

However I feel positive rap is superior to them.


Also the Roots, most of there shit isn't positive, it has no messege what soever.

Granted some of their songs have positive messeges, but for the most part there songs are just music, good music, but music with no purpose other than being music

[Umoja]

Camp Lo is the shit, and they don't say anything..... I mean, they just talk about dancing to Jazz....

[scott thesocialist]

Music whatever kind is about, releaseing the pressure of life and the troubles it brings i'm taking about good music and pop crap, people write songs which have affects on them and the poeple around them, 2pac told it like it was/is you can't say he didn't speak the truth. true music makes you think about yourself and others which 2pac did, good music makes an impact on the listener which 2pac does.
Respect 2 ma brother 2pac.

[GWF]

Tupac's lyrics were very good (some of them), but I don't really like the r&b side of his music, I prefer other kinds of hiphop.

[Palmares]

Did someone say KRS-ONE?

I can see where someone could deduce that Pac and Biggie 'got what they deserved', in that they had som really violent, negative themes. However, it is not entirely their fault.

You know what Pac said, "Yeah I'm gonna call myself a thug, coz I grew up in the gutter and I'm still here."

I might have a word or two wrong there, but you understand the fundamentals.

[B]BTW, sorry bout the mistaken name Landlard95... :)

(Edited by Cthenthar at 1:08 pm on June 16, 2003)

[Hampton]

It's Tupac's birthday tommrow(16th). He would have been 32.

[synthesis]

Heh, seeing as Lefty still hasn't gotten a response, Del is the shit. I saw him live not too long ago. He was really good.

Oh - anyone else listen to Atmosphere?

That was one of the best live shows I've ever been to - and I've been to a lot of kick-ass concerts.

[El Brujo]

Here is an MIM Review on Tupac: http://www.etext.org/Politics/MIM/bookstor...iphop/2pac.html (http://www.etext.org/Politics/MIM/bookstore/music/hiphop/2pac.html)

He was a great artist indeed. Far superior to all the "cash-money" mainstream-rap shit (P Diddy, Eminem, Ja Rule, Jay-Z, etc.) that is the trend today.

[Umoja]

Southern Rap is the worse. Makes me ashamed to be Southern.

[canikickit]

You're not southern you New Jersey bastard.
Quiet Hampton, I only opened this thread so I could tell people that. You made me insult Umoja for no reason now.

What about that song, "Hit Em Up"? I like it, lots of emotion.

[Hampton]

Who did what now? New Jersey in the hizouse!

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Hampton on 2:29 am on June 17, 2003
Who did what now? New Jersey in the hizouse!


Fuck Jersey, Iladelph, Milwuakee, Chicago in this peice mufucka

[Umoja]

I'm from a southern family thank you very much..... My dad was born in Alabama, and my Mother's family came from the Gullahs.

Yeah, but don't think I'm not reppin' NJ. Deertee Jeeerzee!

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Umoja on 6:57 pm on June 17, 2003
I'm from a southern family thank you very much..... My dad was born in Alabama, and my Mother's family came from the Gullahs.

Yeah, but don't think I'm not reppin' NJ. Deertee Jeeerzee!


Oh shit you know GUllah? I lied in SC for five years, rep teh Gullah

[Danton]

OK.. back on the whole 2pac thing, right.. Hip Hop is subjective and I really just have deep misgiving's about the whole gangster vibe whether it be NWA 2Live crew, bigge, pac whoever - so yeah I guess i'm prejudiced and can appreciate others have differing tastes....
My point was that the title of your thread implied 2pac was revolutionary - Grandmaster Flash was revolutionary Public Enemy also and many others but 2pac & bigge, no sir. They were merely regurgitating(albiet in a well produced style) a west coast dynamic that many had done better maybe 6-8 years before. When I say they got what they deserved, even they would agree - if they could, these guys were no angels and if you play with fire......

Dont even get me started on EMINEM - the most potent symbol of right wing America alive today.

"Creemos en Fidel y en la revolucion"

[Umoja]

Anudah t'ing bruh Laa'd Lahd, know'um de Gullah?

Haha. Just kidding....

(Edited by Umoja at 2:27 pm on June 18, 2003)

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Umoja on 2:26 pm on June 18, 2003
Anudah t'ing bruh Laa'd Lahd, know'um de Gullah?

Haha. Just kidding....

(Edited by Umoja at 2:27 pm on June 18, 2003)




Nah I ainr Gullah myself but I'll sure as hell fuck up some Shrimp and grits, or she crab soup

[SlimJin]

Like in Jay-Z and Eminem's song "Renegade" "Do you listen to the Music or do you just skim through it" Just because you didn't realize that that Tupac existed until his death Danton doesn't mean that his music wasn't revolutionary. I know every Mufucka in the Ghetto was influenced by Pac, You Cant fuck wit that man, I dont think you know! You can say that Bruce Springsteen is revolutionary I have listened to his music but have no interest in it so I wouldnt say shit cuz I dont know about that! Maybe you should think about that the next time you speak to save yourself the times that you waste posting about shit you dont know and dont understand! A'ight Mufucka!!!

(Edited by SlimJin at 3:36 pm on June 24, 2003)

[scott thesocialist]

Danton i agree Grandmaster Flash was a revolutionary, he brought with him a new style, flavour of beats and Sugarhill Gang was in on it too. but you can diss. 2pac his music was a dream of hope and a lifeline to alot of brothers in the projects and hoods. just because he didn't start anything doesn't mean he wasn't a major player in the game. for the he got what he deserved well i don't know about that, imean do you know the history with 2pac where he came from what he did before ganster rap?

[Danton]

Slim Jim,

So you know every "Mutha fucka" in the Ghetto? Where is your exact Ghetto? From your tone I would hazard that you are in fact in the opposite demographic as your Hip Hop heroes. You sound like every other angry young generation x whiteboy rebelling against a middle class upbringing. The typecast Eminem/2pac fanbase.

I was well aware of Tupac before his death and of Gangster rap before you grew balls, again I'm assuming from your tone that your a teenager or younger. Tupac's death ensured his iconaclism and an endless money-printing machine for his estate releasing and rerelasing endless dirge he never intended to put out. As I already stated there is much to admire within the production of both he and Biggie Smalls output and I never denied their abilities, it's just a shame they used them to promote violence,misogyny,decadence and hatred. Prompting hopeless little fools like you to emulate their language and behaviour.

But high gloss production and vocal dexterity dont make you revolutionary, Pig fucker. Dont fucking preach to me about Hip Hop, Iv'e known it since 83 - have your opinion, agree/disagree just dont come the large one when your knowledge of the subject is so one-dimensional, Hip Hop is bigger than two dead thugs. So go check your hiphophistory before spouting off again.

Scott, your right he was very important - I never disputed that but revolutionary is a term reserved for true originality is it not?



"The revolution will not be televised, it will be no re-run brothers - the revolution will be live" Gill Scott Heron

[SlimJin]

***** you dont wanna talk to me about being a rebellious white boy from a middle class family go ahead and read my post on The Middle Class. I was born in the ghetto but Im not gonna grow up bragging about it like some people who claim they were Im not gonna say Yeah I was born in the ghetto and lived it for a few years its nothing to be proud of you can only expect stupid shit like that from somebody who actually knows nothing about a life in poverty! So dont talk to me about that Faggot And trust me just cuz I think that Tupac Was a Revolutionary, doesn't mean that you have to come back talking about me being some white boy wishing I lived that life. Tupac was a revolutionary. Please tell me of another political rapper that was mainstream and reaching out to everybody? Pac was unlike anybody else! Til then don't speak to me about hip hop until you realize that this isnt your place to be speaking. Im not even White but say I was what would make you better than me or more knowldgeable as far as Hip Hop?!?!?! What exactly are you? So I can try to cut you down becaus eof your race!

(Edited by SlimJin at 6:28 pm on June 24, 2003)

[Obsolete Truth]

I lived in the projects when I was younger, I know that shit man. My mom and Dad got a hit with their jobs and the money rolled in likes a skater on turnpipes.

Pac is cool, but he got real emotional issues man. He and Biggie screwed their shit with their gangsta wack shit beef.

I think Nas is more revolutionary, he is trying to open the brothers and sisters of the hood to the concept of being more than a stereotype, fuck gangsta, fuck being a ho!

Nas' brethren ill Will was fuck'n killed in his face man!

P.S. I only have an Eminme quote coz he has changed from his dope shit rap.

P.P.S. Some of you guys need to chil out, we are in this shit together!

[Palmares]

Good point(s) OT.

Nas is the man, he is over the gangsta shit, he has the real shit in his music now.

[Danton]

Slin Jin,

(Love your edit)

Yes you can perch there on your high chair dishing out grief, water off a ducks back mate, but Faggot? I dont happen to be gay but I find that ugly and a further indicator of your immaturity. (Did 2pac teach you homophobia also?)

I dont give a rats cock be you white or black, live in a palace or pigsty, point is you come over all spoilt brat - in everything of yours I had the misfortune to read. No sembalance of constructive debate only expletives and dissmissals, failure to address the point merely a rambling insistance of your "Ghettoness" which if genuine confirms you as a perpetuator of a stagnent stereotype - much like 2pac was. Mmm sexual assault, thats revolutionary!
Refer to my previous list and add...

Arrested Development, Fugees, Lightnin rod, Gill Scott Heron, BDP Scott La Rock(rip) The Younger Generation, Kid Frost, TCQ, Jungle Bros, Caveman, Intelligent Hoodlum etc...

That's off the top of my head, no they didn't rake in as much cash as your man or indulge in the grotesque materialism of gold chains, fat rides, *****es, guns etc..
But they made Hip Hop when it was subversive and yes revolutionary not the pop it is today.

If you again descend into cretinous insults in your retort I wont bother replying, there are more important issues than getting into a protracted slanging match with some misguided kid.....Adios putito...


"Creemos en Fidel y en la revolucion"

[scott thesocialist]

Danton i totally agree with you, a revolutionary is the original player and its all started back way back before gangster rap was about.

[Danton]

Word!

That's all I'm saying, people have differing tastes musically, That's cool. My problem was with the word revolutionary being mis-used. Then people start slagging me off and getting all heated - I should'nt bother, we are all on this site to disscuss and debate, not row. I think we all vaguely share a certain ideology..... I allowed myself to get drawn into a meaningless argument and got a bit pissed off at the personal insults.....anyway fuck it, bring the peace!


"The fiend behind the fiend behind the fiend"

[scott thesocialist]

agreed ,
Increase The Peace

[SlimJin]

If you were a true Commie why would you call me a putito? Sounds kinda backwards huh? I wasn't talking about my ghettoness thats the thing Im trying to get away from I don't want to have to live in society where I have to worry about my life every time I step out the door. All Im saying is, is that Tupac brought the political problems to the hood where people were unaware of them because of the crooked fucking school system. He may not have changed anything except for making the people aware of what was going on. But please tell me, you don't think there were revolutionaries who fought for the same stuff as Che before Che but don't get recognized because they werent as succesful? Thats All Im saying, you know I just got pissed when I read your post and went off in my reply but basically all Im saying is that nobody brought it so close to the people as hard and as succesfully as Pac did.

[Dan Majerle]

Quote: from SlimJin on 7:47 pm on June 27, 2003
If you were a true Commie why would you call me a putito? Sounds kinda backwards huh? I wasn't talking about my ghettoness thats the thing Im trying to get away from I don't want to have to live in society where I have to worry about my life every time I step out the door. All Im saying is, is that Tupac brought the political problems to the hood where people were unaware of them because of the crooked fucking school system. He may not have changed anything except for making the people aware of what was going on. But please tell me, you don't think there were revolutionaries who fought for the same stuff as Che before Che but don't get recognized because they werent as succesful? Thats All Im saying, you know I just got pissed when I read your post and went off in my reply but basically all Im saying is that nobody brought it so close to the people as hard and as succesfully as Pac did.


word!

[Lardlad95]

Would yall get of Nas' Jock?


For the longest he was on some bullshit

only recently has he returned to his former glory.

I like him

but there are MC's who are better than him

[Dan Majerle]

word!
lol sorry just thought one more wouldn't hurt :)

[Danton]

Slimjin,

Who said I was a "Commie?"....
"Putito" is mild compared to your "Mutha fucker ho ***** faggot" & thou didst cast the first stone, but enough of this petty bickering....we are agreed that 2pac was an important figure in Hip Hop's movement from counter culture to pop culture, he had to a limited extent some positive message amongst the macho posturing and gross materialism - I'm not convinced of his revolutionary contribution & I can't convince you or Dan otherwise... so.. let it rest or thrash it out with someone else...this thread is wearing thin. In fact, i'ts safe to say that like 2pac...i'ts dead.





"Creemos en Fidel y en la revolucion"

[SlimJin]

LOL I think Tupac is alive its the 7th year, its the year of his return!

[pastradamus]

Tupac was the greatest gangsta rapper ever.

I wouldnt go on to say he was a revolutionary but he did have a few anti-government lyrics such as

"they say when it rains it pours,they got money for wars but cant feed the poor".

[Palmares]

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 5:33 pm on June 29, 2003
Would yall get of Nas' Jock?


For the longest he was on some bullshit

only recently has he returned to his former glory.

I like him

but there are MC's who are better than him


Commie what? That last sentence is yo wackist shit, up there with your anti-KRS-One propaganda.

Maybe there are other good MC's, but none better. Perhaps as good, but 'aint no best', or for the matter, 'better'.

I think some of you are forgetting about Biggie Smalls, Brooklyn's finest. Just because Pac was more popular, doesn't mean he was better than Notorious.

"They used to call me fatso, now they call me Castro."
- Christopher Wallace

[Dan Majerle]

Just recently saw "Babyboy" with Tyrese and Snoop. Freak Snoop is a demi-God. "That niggas a *****!", lines like that throughout the movie he plays the ultimate gangster in Rodney. Tyrese is the biggest beast ever. Even the song by SNoop, Babyboy, is the best. Who can continue to doubt Snoop Dogg? Lol He is so good.

[scott thesocialist]

lets not forget
'EAZY E'
R.I.P
what a way to go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
in this crazy fucked up world!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Umoja]

"Gimme that nut..."

[MegatroN]

Biggy Small's is Brooklyns finest? Why do people keep leaving out the mighty Mos and Talib Kweli? Shit, I'll let Lardlad handle it.

[Umoja]

Megatron, is your name a reference to an obscure NYC gang from the 80's? Or just the cartoon?

[MegatroN]

I guess that's up to you.

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 3:48 am on July 3, 2003
[quote]Quote: from Lardlad95 on 5:33 pm on June 29, 2003
Would yall get of Nas' Jock?


For the longest he was on some bullshit

only recently has he returned to his former glory.

I like him

but there are MC's who are better than him


Commie what? That last sentence is yo wackist shit, up there with your anti-KRS-One propaganda.

Maybe there are other good MC's, but none better. Perhaps as good, but 'aint no best', or for the matter, 'better'.

I think some of you are forgetting about Biggie Smalls, Brooklyn's finest. Just because Pac was more popular, doesn't mean he was better than Notorious.




I'm sorry where did say Krs-one was bad?



buy Train of Thought by Reflection Eternal

nas aint got shit on Kweli

[Palmares]

Biggie is the greatest from Brooklyn, Mos and Kweli suck balls, you guys are in denial. The same goes with Nas, unlike Kweli, Nas has stopped his wack shit.

[ovrproofmentalz]

i didnt read this whole thread, but i read the first 3 pages.... IN MY OPINION THERE IS NO SINGLE ONE HIP HOP ARTIST WHO CAN BE LABELED AS THE BEST OF ALL TIME.... EACH ARTIST BRINGS THEIR OWN STYLE AND CONTENT, WITHOUT THE PREVIOUS TEACHERS/PIONEERS ALL THESE NEWER RAPPERS WOULD NOT BE CASHING ROYALTY CHECKS.... if you people are on here tossing around the title, look at political aspects of hip hop, i have yet to seen the name grandmaster flash (the messgae - the original political track) and rakim who brought conscious lyrics back into the game during the mid 80's.... without these two heads NOBODY would have a style or image to promote, because these individuals dropped the foundation for hip hop today....

plus i didnt see no mention of:

Jeru the Damaja
Paris
poor righteous teachers
x clan


guidance

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Cthenthar on 4:30 am on July 9, 2003
Biggie is the greatest from Brooklyn, Mos and Kweli suck balls, you guys are in denial. The same goes with Nas, unlike Kweli, Nas has stopped his wack shit.



I"m sorry u must have never listened to Train of Thought


your knowledge of rap is about as much as your IQ -19

[Palmares]

Quote: from ovrproofmentalz on 7:28 am on July 14, 2003
i didnt read this whole thread, but i read the first 3 pages.... IN MY OPINION THERE IS NO SINGLE ONE HIP HOP ARTIST WHO CAN BE LABELED AS THE BEST OF ALL TIME.... EACH ARTIST BRINGS THEIR OWN STYLE AND CONTENT, WITHOUT THE PREVIOUS TEACHERS/PIONEERS ALL THESE NEWER RAPPERS WOULD NOT BE CASHING ROYALTY CHECKS.... if you people are on here tossing around the title, look at political aspects of hip hop, i have yet to seen the name grandmaster flash (the messgae - the original political track) and rakim who brought conscious lyrics back into the game during the mid 80's.... without these two heads NOBODY would have a style or image to promote, because these individuals dropped the foundation for hip hop today....

plus i didnt see no mention of:

Jeru the Damaja
Paris
poor righteous teachers
x clan


guidance


Look on page eight. You will see this:


Quote: from Cthenthar on 12:14 pm on May 28, 2003
[B] "Ain't no best."
- Nas

[Umoja]

Paris is more amazing for what he does outside of rapping. "What would you do?" is a great song, but some of the articles he has written (or other peoples articles he posts) on his site are quite amazing. He's quite the writter.

[kalakbay]

2pac the poet of the thug life a real revolutionary who sought to open the eyes of his fellowmen

[capitalistpigdog]

Have any of you seen the recently released documentary 'Biggie and Tupac'?

If so, whatta ya reckon?

[Palmares]

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 9:45 am on July 14, 2003

Quote: from Cthenthar on 4:30 am on July 9, 2003
Biggie is the greatest from Brooklyn, Mos and Kweli suck balls, you guys are in denial. The same goes with Nas, unlike Kweli, Nas has stopped his wack shit.



I"m sorry u must have never listened to Train of Thought


your knowledge of rap is about as much as your IQ -19


Wrong. My IG is between 110 and 130.

Your rap knowledge is about as long as a piece of string. :o

[scott thesocialist]

we shouldn't be arguing, but sharing the good music from the streets of the world, its like saying this is better than that, its all in the individual's taste.

[Umoja]

Wrong. My IG is between 110 and 130.

*Cough*