why i think punk rock sucks - stupid punkers

[Guerrillache69]

WHY I THINK PUNK SUCKS BALLS
becasue its a bunch of trendy losers complaining about shit there never going to change..or even try to change.. they stand there and ***** about taxes and irs and presidnets and governments they are going to have no affect on, nazi bush doesnt sit there and say shit cheney.. the punk rockers are really makin things hard for me, i mean they complain and nithing happens.. ITS HORRABLE.. god go burn some of bushes oil save a rainforest sell a car that runs on hydrogen, warn a country hes an imperialstic americanizing fuck and to beware..that makes a differnece.. *****ing doesnt
~!!PEACE!!~

[Jaceau]

You need to stop skipping English, young man! =p

Punk rock influences a lot of young people. Personally, I'm glad it's telling them to be socially conscious and not just telling them about how much it sucks to get dumped, or how much fun the club is. A lot of punk music deals with issues that matter to a lot of people. It informs a lot of people who may have never heard of any of these topics being raised.

Personally, I was drawn into politics and social justice by Rage against the machines a long time ago, who's to say that Anti-Flag won't do the same to another kid years from now?

Granted, there's too much theory, not enough action. But, so far, it's better than no theory, and no action. Few other musical genres tackle the issues that punk rock takes on.

[mentalbunny]

What do you listen to, Guerrillache69?

[Urban Rubble]

Guerillache69, your ignorance is amazing. You complain that punkers complain too much, you say they don't get anything done. Talk about hypocrisy, your complaining, your not changing anything. What is the point of this message board ? To complain/debate.

Here's how punk bands make a difference, they educate. Would you rather have the youth listening to bands that say nothing ? Bands that influence kids to be nothing more than trend following little sheep ? If it wasn't for punk I probably wouldn't even be involved in politics, just like a majority of this country. It's easy to critisize people for not doing anything, but what are you doing besides *****ing ? Nothing.

[Guerrillache69]

well you guys made a lot of good points, and about me needing english class,it was really late and i had a head ache and i was mad.. for some reason.. well thanks for the enlightenment about some things, and by the way i reallly like rage agasint machine... o well thanks guys and sorry if i offended anyone.. well peace

[Dirty Commie]

Punk rock is ok, but too many groups sell out to corporations/record labels, etc.

[reggaetrain]

last time i checked, rage against the machine didn't change a damn thing.

[sin miedo]

Bullshit, they create awareness through their music. Not all get it, but some do. I probably wouldn't be here if their music didn't strike something inside of me. The band tried hard to wake people up, by giving them organizations to look into, like Amnesty International and such, look at their C.D. covers, they have listed websites of progressive organizations and such that are trying to make a difference.

Jesus people, what do you want these bands to do, they make music, that is what they want to do, and to create music, good music, takes a lot of time and constant practice. I didn't realize that in order to be a true activist one has to have proven that they have 'changed' things. How many of you can say this?

[Jaceau]

Rage Against the Machine turned me onto politics. They turned me onto reading Chomsky, Che, Klein, and Michael Moore. I'm 100x more socially conscious than I was before listening to Rage. If one day, I (or someone just like me) does something that changes something, would Rage not have indirectly caused that change?

I'm sure this scenario has played itself out more than once since the bands conception.

The same can be said about Anti-Flag, Propagandhi, and the good ol' Minor Threat.

[ComradeJunichi]

What? Punks sell out to big corporations?

You generalize everybody thinking they complain and whine about society and whatnot. Isn't that what you're doing now?

Warn a country? How the hell do you do that? Isn't that *****ing also?

Sounds to me you don't know much about politics and economics yourself. Or maybe I got that impression because I read some of your "English" wrong.

[Felicia]

guerrillache69
Don't worry about your english, it's fine. It's a lot better than several others' on this board. So no apologies needed :)

[Organic Revolution]

Quote: from Guerrillache69 on 10:51 am on April 28, 2003
WHY I THINK PUNK SUCKS BALLS
becasue its a bunch of trendy losers complaining about shit there never going to change..or even try to change.. they stand there and ***** about taxes and irs and presidnets and governments they are going to have no affect on, nazi bush doesnt sit there and say shit cheney.. the punk rockers are really makin things hard for me, i mean they complain and nithing happens.. ITS HORRABLE.. god go burn some of bushes oil save a rainforest sell a car that runs on hydrogen, warn a country hes an imperialstic americanizing fuck and to beware..that makes a differnece.. *****ing doesnt
~!!PEACE!!~


what do u think wwe do... we ***** about things that we will so called never change. FUCK U

[187]

It's not just the lyrics but it's the style of music(the sound and speed) that people are attracted to. And Jesus, this is music with an actual message behind it, and you complain! Punk inspires people to do the good things you talk about, it makes people aware, and the feeling of the music gets you pumped. It gets you fired up whether you're at a show(combat dancing!!) or a rally.

[kiwisocialist]

Dirty Commie is spot on. When punk came back on the scene again bands like The Offspring were good punk bands (pre smash). They became popular and now look at them.

This in turn has sprung up manufactured crap like 182 posing as punk. I bet Joe Strummer died just so he could turn in his grave.

[Urban Rubble]

If you people would turn off your fucking radios and actually listen to some punk you would know it's still going strong.

There is more to punk than Blink 182 and the Offspring. Godamn, you people have alot to learn.

[ComradeJunichi]

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 11:32 pm on June 11, 2003
If you people would turn off your fucking radios and actually listen to some punk you would know it's still going strong.

There is more to punk than Blink 182 and the Offspring. Godamn, you people have alot to learn.

Cheers to that.

[kiwisocialist]

My statement is about Pop Punk music generally.

It's more style than substance without exception. If you can point me in the direction of a modern day Clash then I would appreciate it. Americans trying to sing in Cockney accents sound like Scousers trying English out for a day.

[Urban Rubble]

Ya, most pop punk sucks, although there are a few good ones. None of the radio shit though.

A modern day Clash ? Well, it depends on what type of the Clash's music you like. Do you want me to recomend some straight up punk like the Clash's early stuff ? Or do you want ska laced stuff like on London Calling and Sandanista! ?

The Clash were a unique band, they tried out alot of different kinds of music, punk, ska, reggae, funk, even rap (Magnificent 7), there aren't alot of bands like that today. However, if you enjoy the Clash I'm sure you'd like alot of punk.

Also, why are you assuming all punk is American ? There are punk bands in damn near every country on earth, I tend to like punk bands from the U.K better, that's not to say American punk isn't great.

Tell me what your musical tastes are and I'll recommend what I think you'd like.

[FatFreeMilk]

I love Good Charolette.

[Organic Revolution]

GOOD CHAROLETTE SUCKS SO HARD.

[FatFreeMilk]

j/k. don't beat me up for saying that.

[Organic Revolution]

umm.. ok.. lol nice sig.

[Urban Rubble]

Were you joking ? I fucking hope so, no wonder you think punk sucks.

Good Charlotte, I can't believe people call that punk. Mohawks and eye makeup don't make a band punk, nor do songs about going to the mall or picking up chicks.

[mentalbunny]

I love anti-flag, they rule. Check them out now! I've only got Underground Network, but it's great. They do great sleeve notes as well, cos most of their songs are about certain events and they do notes on them, it's really interesting!

[Urban Rubble]

I thought it was cool that Howard Zinn wrote some shit in their liner notes.

[Irish Republican]

Quote: from Urban Rubble on 4:41 am on June 12, 2003
Ya, most pop punk sucks, although there are a few good ones. None of the radio shit though.

A modern day Clash ? Well, it depends on what type of the Clash's music you like. Do you want me to recomend some straight up punk like the Clash's early stuff ? Or do you want ska laced stuff like on London Calling and Sandanista! ?

The Clash were a unique band, they tried out alot of different kinds of music, punk, ska, reggae, funk, even rap (Magnificent 7), there aren't alot of bands like that today. However, if you enjoy the Clash I'm sure you'd like alot of punk.

Also, why are you assuming all punk is American ? There are punk bands in damn near every country on earth, I tend to like punk bands from the U.K better, that's not to say American punk isn't great.

Tell me what your musical tastes are and I'll recommend what I think you'd like.

I like the Clashs first album, what dyou recommend?

[jjack]

I love Anti-Flag, too. They're my all time favorite because they don't just say shit. On their website and mailing list they've been promoting, going to and organizing a lot of protests. Also, like someone said, they work really hard to get the word out and influence kids. We complain a lot about no one ever doing anything but talking about it...but until enough people are talking about it, we don't really have any power. I think our goal right now should be to influence as many people as possible, and that's why punk bands are important.

[Urban Rubble]

Well, if you like their 1st album then I will recomend some good straight up punk.

That album was recorded in the 70's so I'm recomend some old English punk.

NeverMind the Bollocks, Here's the Sex Pistols (buy this)
Anything from Sham 69
Stiff Little Fingers
U.K Subs
The BuzzCocks

Those are old English punk bands that played with the Clash alot. I have a hard time telling you what to check out because I don't know your musical tastes. Buy the Sex Pistols album.

[mentalbunny]

Yeah, but the sex pistols were really manufactured.

[ComradeJunichi]

Just a few of my favorite bands:

Angelic Upstarts, Blitz, GG Allin, Oxymoron, GBH, The Virus, US Bombs, A Global Threat, Anti-Nowhere League, The Unseen, Skewdriver, Stiff Little Fingers, Cock Sparrer, Sham 69, The Exploited, The Defects, US Bombs, A Global Threat, ect.

[Hesh]

Uhh....Skrewdriver? Aren't they...you know....Nazi? http://www.resistance.com/skrewdriver/
Weiss über Alles, anyone?

[mentalbunny]

You know it's really hard tofind Anti-flag where I am, it's really annoying.

Joon, I'll look out for those bands, but at the mo I'm spending way too much money!

[hillofthedead]

There are shit loads of awesome punk bands, and I'm pretty involved in the punk scene where I live. My personal favorite punk band is the Subhumans. When it comes down to it, what do you expect punk bands to do? What can they do except support the scene and look out for each other? Let's be practical, as long as the ignorant masses are willing to be slaves for the rich and greedy politicians, not much can be done.

[Urban Rubble]

Ya, I like those bands too Joon, I was just trying to give him some bands that may sound like the Clash's 1st CD.

Never Mind the Bollocks is possibly the greatest punk album of all time, take it back MentalBunny, take it back.

Hillofthedead, I saw the SubHumans here in Seattle about 2 months ago, it was great.

[Urban Rubble]

Woah Woah Woah, I didn't even see that Joon had put SkrewDriver. Do you really listen to these pieces of shit ?

Here are a few of their words of wisdom.

"We look with caution to the east
We can see the red flag on the beast
Countless millions have died at the Marxists' hands
We would fight and die to keep our land



Marxists' greedy hands around our throats
Bankers buying up your lives and sitting back to gloat
We should fight to control our people's fate
Europe never was no puppet state "

"And now the situation has changed in many ways
The Allies want to let him go, they've decided he has paid
The Red scum in the Kremlin with their kosher values try
To keep a proud man locked away until the day he dies

(chorus)

He's a prisoner of peace
Kept there at the will of the Marxists in the east
He's a prisoner of peace
Kept there at the wishes of the Marxists in the east"

" Waiting for the weekend, on a left-wing afternoon
Reds are gonna lose their power, skinheads gonna call the tune
Pushing through the Red scum, feeling pretty good
The pride of being White men, go for commie blood

(chorus)
All that pent up anger that goes pouring through your head
Streetfight in the city, the Reds are gonna end up dead
Allright now!

The time is nearly here, the tension starts to build
Communists all over, Jubilee Gardens are all filled
Reds are pretty worried about the skinheads at the show
Sheep they fly their Red flag, but the skinheads have their own (White Power!) "

"Throughout the ages certain men have stepped up at the proper times to guide the Aryan race from it's destructive course
and lead it down the path to salvation. Adolf Hitler, Commander George Lincoln Rockwell and Dr. William Pierce
are all important examples, however no one has ever been able to open as many youthful eyes as Ian Stuart Donaldson"

[ComradeJunichi]

I knew everyone would start a fuss because I listen to some Skrewdriver. I never said they had good lyrics, I said I liked listening to them. It's good music. My favorite song is Skinhead by Skrewdriver.

[Urban Rubble]

I agree, it is good music, I just hope you don't BUY that shit and support those guys.

[kiwisocialist]

The buzzcocks are excellent. Although I went to see them a few months ago and they were average at best.

The Sex Pistols probably appear "manufactured" because heaps of people try to copy them and they are manufactured.

[mentalbunny]

No, sex pistols were basically manufactured by malcolm maclaren cos he knew he'd make money from it, and he has. I refuse to take back my comment about the sex pistols.

Hillofdead, where do you live?

[hillofthedead]

To: Urban Rubble-I am so jealous that you got to see the Subhumans, I didn't even find out about the show in Minnesota until the week after.
To:Mental Bunny-I live in Oshkosh, WI

[El Brujo]

I like some Skrewdriver too, but I try to avoid songs where they actually say racist/fascist shit. I like tracks such as "Boots & Braces" and "Anti-Social"

Anyhow, people must move away from MTV's modern definition of "punk". I used to think of "punk" as bands like MxPx, Blink 182, Good Charlotte, etc. as well (I consider new Green Day and Offspring alternative) and while there are newer punk bands that play older-style stuff, they don't get nearly as much recognition as the pop-punkers. Go out and pick up some albums from the following punk, oi! and hc bands:

The Misfits, Bad Brains, Negative Approach, Red Alert, 4-Skins, GG Allin, The Clash, Anti-Hero's, Agnostic Front, Black Flag, Madball, Warzone, Reagan Youth, Decibelios, Comando Suicida, The Stooges, MC5, Bane, Warzone, The Exploited, etc.

[Urban Rubble]

Fuck yeah, Regan Youth.

MentalBunny, do I need to give you a rundown of Sex Pistols history ? Johnny Rotten and Malcom McLaren formally came up with the idea for the band after Malcom caught Johnny shoplifting from his sex botique. They began looking for members and thus the Sex Pistols were born. The only thing manufactured was the idea to start a band.

[hillofthedead]

MDC(Millions Of Dead Cops) and CONFLICT are examples of actual hardcore-punk bands. Rage Against The Machine are lame corporate created millionaires. They sit and count their millions, while you the consumer spend $15 on their CD. I don't know what major label Rage... is on, but to consider them a "punk" band is laughable. They're the perfect example of shopping-mall punk. P.S. READ ALL PETER KROPOTKIN!!!

[mentalbunny]

Where's that from urban Rubble. I might be wrong but even so I'm not sure.

By the way I now adore the mad caddies, even if they aren't exactly straight up punk. I heard one of their tracks on the radio, i'd heard it before but never truly appreciated it's brilliance...

[Urban Rubble]

I don't know where it's from, I've read a few books about the Sex Pistols.

I also just realized I like the Mad Caddies. For melodic poppy type punk, they are actually pretty good.

[SlimJin]

I Dont know if you guys ever realized this RATM ISN'T Punk Rock they are a rock/ hip hop infusion! With the rhyming flows on the mic to the rock ballads!

[Urban Rubble]

Ya, I don't understand where these people that say Rage is a punk band are coming from.

Anyway, anyone ever heard Common Rider ? It's Jesse from Operation Ivy's new band.

[mentalbunny]

I never thought RATM were punk in sound, but mayeb they are a little in attitude, which is no bad thing :)

[truthaddict11]

Zach was in a punk band before RATM called Inside Out I got thier album

[El Brujo]

They were an sXe hardcore band to my understanding, right?

[Guardia Bolivariano]

I think punk has been so badly defined because most new bands that suck claim to br punk to save what little fan base they have left.

Personally I like NOFX the first punk I evetr listened to.

[Red Comrade]

Man, I love Millions of Dead Cops, as well as some Conflict (it seems that their songs are either pure genius or pure crap).

On SkrewDriver, they're a bunch of losers, but they have good songs. I just don't like the racist shit. I just download there music, so they don't get a single red dime from me.

[mentalbunny]

I heard about conflcit for the first time the other day, what would you recommend? and i need anti-flag recommenations cos I have to get that ordered in if I want to buy it.

[Organic Revolution]

antiflag cds??? the best on to me is mobilize and then die for the government.

[Red Comrade]

Bleah, I personally don't like Anti-Flag. I suggest buying the Millions of Dead Cops CD (I think it's titled More Dead Cops or something like that) that has all the cops in blue in front of it. Almost every track on that CD is freaking awesome.

Also, Minor Threat, Black Flag, Circle Jerks, TSOL, and DRI (DRI I think you might like the most).

[mentalbunny]

Um I assume TSOL and DRI are acronyms, what do they stand for? I'll buy some more cd's when I've got some cash! I'm basically skint at the moment.

[Red Comrade]

TSOL stands for True Sounds of Liberty

DRI stands for Dirty Rotten Imbeciles.

Use Kazaa to get their songs.

[mentalbunny]

I can't at school and my sound drives are bust at home.

[sglb]

Dead Kennedys = greatest punk band ever.

[elijahcraig]

I like the Velvet Underground, the first punk band.

[Urban Rubble]

The Velvet Underground weren't punk. They had alot of similarities, but the first REAL punk band is a tie between the Sex Pistols and the Ramones.

[elijahcraig]

I don't what to say except that you're just wrong. Punk is punk, it doesn't matter when it happened. You've got Captain Beefheart, Stooges, MC5, Frank Zappa, VU, etc. They are punk, and the New York Dolls were before the Ramones also. Punk is the attitude of rebellion.

"Punk rock means freedom."
-Kurt Cobain

Rebellion, Nirvana was punk, John Cage was punk, you can't put it into an era. You'd have to trace punk rock through the veins of rebellion, through John Lydon to David Bowie to Lou Reed to William S. Burroughs to James Joyce, Friedrich Nietzsche, Bakunin, and Marx. Punk is rebellion, it is not closed to one era, that would be going against the movement itself.

[Urban Rubble]

Woah Woah Woah, I disagree, completely.

We're talking about punk rock here, not rebellion. Did you actually just call Karl Marx a punk ? Jesus Christ.

The spirit of rebellion is a juge part of punk rock, but it is much much more than that. Sure, all the people you mentioned held alot of the charechteristics of a punk, they may have been called punk if they were around in those times, but they aren't.

The Grateful Dead were rebelious, and also had many of the same features that a punk would, but are you also going to call the Grateful Dead punk ?

I agree, punk means freedom, but there has to be some defining factors. Greg Graffin of Bad Religion said it best, "It is important to define what makes us punks, otherwise it means nothing to call yourself a punk".

He also said this :

"Punks are a subset of the human family, the ones who can overcome their fears and turn their passion for questioning authority into action. The result is a social awareness that goes against the current of prevailing opinion and forms a sort of subculture. Not all people can do, or be part, of that."

While ALOT of people can hold these traits, I think it is crazy to call someone like Karl Marx, Noam Chomsky, Martin Luther King, or Che Guevara a punk.

The Velvet Underground was art rock. MC5 could be called early punk, Zappa is not punk.

The Sex Pistols invented the PUNK ROCK movement, the look, and most importantly THE SOUND.

You could say a million historical figures, bands or activists were alot like punks, but there has to be some defining nature. Style, attitude, music, political views, all kinds of things.

[Blibblob]

When you throw a band into punk you look at the sound and style. Punk is unsynthisized, it's a guitar plugged into an amp. It was a change from the 70s music at the time, which was all synthizised to get the waa waa without the trembol stick. Sex Pistols stopped screwing around with the sound of the guitar and just plugged in. That is the music of punk. The attitude is different, people can play punk, and not be punks, that would be the new pop-punk bands, which most are emo(shitty watered down emo), which was another sharp change in the sound and style, where they stopped singing about politics, and fell back to what music used to be, whining about your lost loves.
On the attitude of punk, Graffin said it best. And Bad Religion kicks ass, birth of pop/skater-punk, and the only good pop-punk band ever. And Dead Kennedys are now nothing more than a sold out shit band that died when Ray sued Jello. "They are the world's greediest kareoke band", in his words. Jello better win the new lawsuit, and get DK's music out of the hands of large corporations and back to his tiny company. :biggrin:

[elijahcraig]

Velvet Underground are punk, pure and simple. You can't put limits on this, it is rebellion. Punk can't fit trends because it is anti-trend. Your attitude on the minds of millions has put the punk rock scene where it is today: unoriginal and boring. Defining punk rock kills the attitude, it is useless.

[Urban Rubble]

Your comments sound so much like that wishy washy bullshit all the new punker kids try to feed me.

You're wrong, punk can be defined. You're chasing some fantasy shit you've made up in your head, while I respect your imagination, you're wrong.

Like I said, Velvet Underground definately has the punk attitude and minset, BUT THEY ARE NOT PUNK ROCK. PUNK ROCK IS A STYLE OF MUSIC.

[kalakbay]

my man u dont realize what u have just said maybe u should go and rethink it,
Punk as it is, is better than any prepackaged stuff that u stuff urself with.
go and try it for yourself u might just realize sumtin
Punk is not just music its a way of life.
_-peace-_

[Urban Rubble]

"Punk as it is, is better than any prepackaged stuff that u stuff urself with."

First off, it's you, not u. It's yourself, not urself. It's something, not sumtin.

Spelling like that makes it hard for me to take you seriously. You sound like a 14 year old girl that just bought her first Good Charlotte Cd.

"Punk as it is, is better than any prepackaged stuff that u stuff urself with."

Oh really ? Do you know me ? Have we ever met ? Then how the fuck do you know what I "stuff" myself with. What do you mean by prepackaged ? I thought every album came in a package.

I understand punk is a way of life, but at it's core it is music.

It's pointless trying to argue with you because I don't even get what you're trying to say.

One thing though, please don't try to tell me what punk is, I'm well aware. I have been in this scene since I was about 6 years old. I saw Operation Ivy's last show when I was 7. I've skated with Duane Peters and drank with Mickey Fitz. Now that doesn't make me some kind of punk legend, and I apologize for name dropping, but I feel like you people think I'm some kind of teeny punker when in fact I have devoted my life to this shit.

Fuck you all.

[elijahcraig]

I guess we'll have to disagree, we don't need to get mad over this.

[Fabi]

I guess the point a lot of you seem to be making is that, and I totally agree, 'punk rock' is utterly stuck, conservative, narrow-minded pop-music.

It kind of reminds me of something Jiddu Krishnamurti said about love: When you name it, you kill it. Trying to define it means crippling it, putting it into boundaries that work against its growing and evolving nature... The same pretty much goes for punk: How can the music of 'protest' be so conservative? Why is it that 'Punk rock' sounds SO MUCH like the 'rock' music it was fighting in the first place....

Oh well, now flame me if you feel like it. :-/

[Urban Rubble]

Where do you get this shit that punk rock is conservative ?

I get the feeling that you guys are talking about something different than me. I am tlaking about punk rock, you guys seem to be talking about pop punk.

I'm not discussing bands like Blink 182, Good Charlotte, New Found Glory, Simple Plan or any of those shitty pop punk bands. I am talking about real punk rock, not radio shit.

I also don't get how you think that punk sounds like regular rock.

[Fabi]

Essentially punk rock is rock, hence the 'rock' part.
You said punk/punk rock had to be defined. Defining it, means crippling it.

"Punk is unsynthisized, it's a guitar plugged into an amp. It was a change from the 70s music at the time, which was all synthizised to get the waa waa without the trembol stick. Sex Pistols stopped screwing around with the sound of the guitar and just plugged in. " How is it not limiting to stick to a fairly limited number of instruments? I think the fact that you can actually tell when something is 'punk rock' is proof enough of the fact that there seem to be a lot of, by now, conservative rules involved in the making of this music.

[Fabi]

I do not mean conservative in their approach to politics/society, but in their approach to music... I hope this clears things up. :-)

[Fabi]

And that does not mean that I have something against punk rock... I think you should just be honest about the fact that it is not all that unconventional.

[187]

Punk rock is a music style, not an attitude.

If I sang about a lost girlfriend over an op ivy song it would still be punk rock...it just wouldn't have the punk attitude.

[Urban Rubble]

"You said punk/punk rock had to be defined. Defining it, means crippling it."

No, I never said it HAD to be defined, I said it could be defined, loosely defined, but still, you can tell when something fits the punk rock catergory. Everything in the world can be loosely defined, punk rock is no different.

"I think the fact that you can actually tell when something is 'punk rock' is proof enough of the fact that there seem to be a lot of, by now, conservative rules involved in the making of this music. "

Of course you can somewhat tell if something is punk. Technically, Blink 182 would be classified as a punk band, but they aren't really what punk represents, still their music fits the punk "format". Take a band like Nirvana, most people would consider them a punk band, however some would not, this is what I mean by loosely defined. They had all the punk ethics, more than almost any "punk" band at the time, yet their music tended to be, at times, more metal sounding. Punk cannot be completely defined, yet there is a basic structure, just like anything else in life.



(Edited by Urban Rubble at 12:48 pm on July 16, 2003)

[Fabi]

Which is why I think it is unnecessarily limiting itself musically. Far too many music styles are being limited to the way they are supposed to sound instead of their content or the concept and ideas/philosophies behind the creation of the music.
Like Van Gogh... He had ideas/philosophies/concepts behind his painting that are just as important to me as the way his paintings actually look.

edit:
( I was refering in this post to the person before urban rubble's last post, who said that punk rock was a music style, which explains its sound...)

(Edited by Fabi at 4:58 am on July 16, 2003)

[Fabi]

"Everything in the world can be loosely defined, punk rock is no different. "

The question is just how you define something, and while the sound of music can of course be used to describe it, it isn't necessarily enough to define it. Defining music solely by how it sounds mainly leads to sonic incest, I think.

[187]

Fabi, I don't clearly see how what you said ties in to (my point) there being a difference between punk the sound of the music and punk the attitude. Could you maybe elaborate a little further on what you're trying to say?

[elijahcraig]

For instance, Lou Reed had punk attitude: meaning rebellion. Now The Sex Pistols too had punk attitude: rebellion. The Sex Pistols played the "punk" sound...now Blink 182 too plays the "punk" sound...yet they have no attitude. Definitions destroy the whole purpose of punk.

[Urban Rubble]

Again, you can't completely define punk, but you can loosely define it. I do not think that having the punk "attitude" is enough to call one punk. Johnny Cash had the attitude of a punk, but to call Johnny Cash a punk rocker is ridiculous. Like the guy who mentioned Karl Marx, he was a rebel, a misfit even, but he was not a punk.

[187]

"I do not think that having the punk "attitude" is enough to call one punk."

Did you mention what is enough somewhere?

If the mindset is rebellion, then it's punk attitude. It has absolutley nothing to do with the music style. Punks made punk-rock, not the other way around.

(Edited by 187 at 1:26 am on July 17, 2003)

[elijahcraig]

Johnny Cash has had the attitude of punk, therefore he can be considered a punk.

[Fabi]

Exactly, I think it doesn't matter how you implement punk philosophy, by 'thinking' punk what you do becomes punk.

[Fabi]

And congratulations to your 1000th post, Urban Rubble. :)

[Urban Rubble]

I think this my 1000th post.

Anyway, I think we've said all we need to about this.

Go buy the new Dropkick Murphys cd, right fucking now, you won't regret it.

[robotic]

;_; i personally believe that you don't need music to educate your mind.

that's really all i have to say.

[Raziel88]

Hi!
everyone who said punk music is bad i think iT's the best music! It's my own.

[Comrade Raz]

There is plenty of good new original punk around you just have to search for it.

Personally I recommend King Prawn as the best punk band at the moment as they have so many styles.

Check out Someone to Hate for Hip-Hop sort of thing.
Dominant View and Racist Copper for SkaPunk and American Funded Genocide for Hardcore Punk.

They may not have been the first of there sort of style but whoever was i solute them.