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Philanthropist
23rd June 2009, 20:52
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehpPPPiqMc4

http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/06/18....e-a-revolution/ (http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/06/18/cia-has-distributed-400-million-dollars-inside-iran-to-evoke-a-revolution/)

CIA has Distributed 400 Million Dollars Inside Iran to Evoke a Revolution

Former Pakistani Army General Mirza Aslam Beig claims the US Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) has distributed 400 million dollars inside Iran to evoke a revolution.

In a phone interview with the Pashto Radio on Monday, General Beig said that there is undisputed intelligence proving the US interference in Iran.

“The documents prove that the CIA spent 400 million dollars inside Iran to prop up a colorful-hollow revolution following the election,” he added.

Pakistan’s former army chief of joint staff went on to say that the US wanted to disturb the situation in Iran and bring to power a pro-US government.

He congratulated President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on his re- election for the second term in office, noting that Pakistan relationship with Iran has improved during his 4-year presidency.

“Ahmadinejad’s re-election is a decisive point in regional policy and if Pakistan and Afghanistan unite with Iran, the US has to leave the area, especially the occupied Afghanistan,” Beig added.

http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/06/21....in-the-streets/ (http://pakalert.wordpress.com/2009/06/21/us-official-the-cia-bribed-iranian-government-officials-businessmen-and-reporters-and-paid-iranians-to-demonstrate-in-the-streets/)

US Official: The CIA bribed Iranian government officials, businessmen, and reporters, and paid Iranians to demonstrate in the streets

Stephen Kinzer’s book, All the Shah’s Men: An American Coup and the Roots of Middle East Terror, tells the story of the overthrow of Iran’s democratically-elected leader, Mohammed Mosaddeq, by the CIA and the British MI6 in 1953. The CIA bribed Iranian government officials, businessmen, and reporters, and paid Iranians to demonstrate in the streets.

The 1953 street demonstrations, together with the Cold War claim that the US had to grab Iran before the Soviets did, served as the US government’s justification for overthrowing Iranian democracy. What the Iranian people wanted was not important.

Today, the street demonstrations in Tehran show signs of orchestration. The protesters, primarily young people, especially young women opposed to the dress codes, carry signs written in English: “Where is My Vote?” The signs are intended for the western media—not for the Iranian government.

More evidence of orchestration is provided by the protesters’ chant, “death to the dictator, death to Ahmadinejad.” Every Iranian knows that the president of Iran is a public figure with limited powers. His main role is to take the heat from the governing grand Ayatollah. No Iranian, and no informed Westerner, could possibly believe that Ahmadinejad is a dictator. Even Ahmadinejad’s superior, Khamenei, is not a dictator, as he is appointed by a government body that can remove him.

The demonstrations, like those in 1953, are intended to discredit the Iranian government and to establish for Western opinion that the government is a repressive regime that does not have the support of the Iranian people. This manipulation of opinion sets up Iran as another Iraq ruled by a dictator who must be overthrown by sanctions or an invasion.

On American TV, the protesters who are interviewed speak perfect English. They are either westernized secular Iranians who were allied with the Shah and fled to the West during the 1978 Iranian revolution or they are the young Westernized residents of Tehran.

Many of the demonstrators may be sincere in their protest, hoping to free themselves from Islamic moral codes. But if reports of the US government’s plans to destabilize Iran are correct, paid troublemakers are in their ranks.

Some observers, such as George Friedman, believe that the American destabilization plan will fail. However, many ayatollahs feel animosity toward Ahmadinejad, who assaults the ayatollahs for corruption. Many in the Iranian countryside believe that the ayatollahs have too much wealth and power. Amadinejad’s attack on corruption resonates with the Iranian countryside, but not with the ayatollahs.

Amadinejad’s campaign against corruption has brought Grand Ayatollah Hossein Ali Montazeri out against him. Montazeri is a rival to ruling Ayatollah Khamenei. Montazeri sees in the street protests an opportunity to challenge Khamenei for the leadership role.

So, once again, as so many times in history, the ambitions of one person might seal the fate of the Iranian state.

Khamenei knows that the elected president is an underling. If he has to sacrifice Ahmadinejad’s election in order to fend off Montazeri, he might recount the vote and elect Mousavi, thinking that will bring an end to the controversy.

Khamenei, solving his personal problem, would play into the hands of the American-Israeli assault on his country.

On the surface, the departure of Ahmadeinjad would cost Israel and the US the loss of their useful “anti-Semitic” boggy-man. But in fact it would play into the American-Israeli propaganda. The story would be that the remote, isolated, Iranian ruling Ayatollah was forced by the Iranian people to admit the falsity of the rigged election, calling into question rule by Ayatollahs who do not stand for election.

Mousavi and Ayatollah Montazeri are putting their besieged country at risk. Possibly they believe that ridding Iran of Ahmadeinjad’s extreme image would gain Iran breathing room.

If Mousavi and Montazeri succeed in their ambitions, one likely result would be a loss in Iran’s independence. The new rulers would have to continually defend Iran’s new moderate and reformist image by giving in to American demands. If the government admits to a rigged election, the legitimacy of the Iranian Revolution would be called into question, setting up Iran for more US interference in its internal affairs.

For the American neoconservatives, democratic countries are those countries that submit to America’s will, regardless of their form of government. “Democracy” is achieved by America ruling through puppet officials.

The American public might never know whether the Iranian election was legitimate or stolen. The US media serves as a propaganda device, not as a purveyor of truth. Election fraud is certainly a possibility–it happens even in America–and signs of fraud have appeared. Large numbers of votes were swiftly counted, which raises the question whether votes were counted or merely a result was announced.

The US media’s response to the election was equally rapid. Having invested heavily in demonizing Ahmadinejad, the media is unwilling to accept election results that vindicate Ahmadinejad and declared fraud in advance of evidence, despite the pre-election poll results published in the June 15 Washington Post, which found Ahmadinejad to be the projected winner.

There are many American interest groups that have a vested interest in the charge that the election was rigged. What is important to many Americans is not whether the election was fair, but whether the winner’s rhetoric is allied with their goals.

For example, those numerous Americans who believe that both presidential and congressional elections were stolen during the Karl Rove Republican years are tempted to use the Iranian election protests to shame Americans for accepting the stolen Bush elections.

Feminists take the side of the “reformer” Mousavi.

Neoconservatives damn the election for suppressing the “peace candidate” who might acquiescent to Israel’s demands to halt the development of Iranian nuclear energy.

Ideological and emotional agendas result in people distancing themselves from factual and analytical information, preferring instead information that fits with their material interests and emotional disposition.

The primacy of emotion over fact bids ill for the future. The extraordinary attention given to the Iranian election suggests that many American interests and emotions have a stake in the outcome.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehpPPPiqMc4

REDSOX
23rd June 2009, 21:00
It looking like another imperialist backed color coded revolution to me. The imperialists it would seem have been backing the Liberal bourgeoisie to overthrow the CONSERVATIVE CLERICAL BOURGEOISIE. No wonder the working class has stayed out of this as this uprising does not represent their interests. If they enter the arena i pray they are not used by either faction and instead act in their own interests and not the bourgeois factions and the imperialists and their schemes. Looking unlikely though

Pogue
23rd June 2009, 21:01
I agree, the working class have nothing to gain in overthrowing a dictator, what value do things such as freedom and justice have anyway :rolleyes:

And of course, we all know periods of struggle have no potential whatsoever to develop :laugh:

Philanthropist
23rd June 2009, 21:08
I agree, the working class have nothing to gain in overthrowing a dictator, what value do things such as freedom and justice have anyway :rolleyes:

And of course, we all know periods of struggle have no potential whatsoever to develop :laugh:
Your post is ridiculous. What good is this "revolution" if it is not organised by the working class and turns out to be orchestrated by the CIA to suit the capitalist agenda of America? It has seemed ever likely that America would focus solely on Iran ever since they decided to deal their oil sales in Euros. This may be a covert way for the CIA to overthrow the current government, using the people to put in place a government that will work for the American capitalist agenda, and what good will that be for the people of Iran?

Joe Hill's Ghost
23rd June 2009, 21:12
Eh I'd gladly take the CIA's money and funnel it towards unions and leftist organizations. I mean honestly people, does anyone here not remember the CIA's record of funding and arming their future enemies? *cough* mujaheddin.

MilitantWorker
23rd June 2009, 21:14
I agree, the working class have nothing to gain in overthrowing a dictator, what value do things such as freedom and justice have anyway :rolleyes:

Are you actually implying that Ahmadinejad is a dictator? Are you saying he wasn't democratically elected? You sound like Sen. John McCain!!

Even beyond that. Are you actually implying that isolated protests backing a member of the Iranian ruling class will bring the Iranian working class "freedom and justice?"


And of course, we all know periods of struggle have no potential whatsoever to develop :laugh:

Well, maybe thats because we read Marx. And not Blanqui.
What "struggle" are you fucking talking about? The struggle within the Iranian bourgeoisie of one faction trying to gain power over the other?

Go join the weathermen.

REDSOX
23rd June 2009, 21:18
The CIA will no doubt calculate that this time it will be different and that they will not create another Frankenstein monster!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:) Anyway the last thing we need is the imperialists to decide these matters. We need independent proletarian struggle to liberate the masses not artificial oppositions created, encouraged and funded by the west.

manic expression
23rd June 2009, 21:23
Eh I'd gladly take the CIA's money and funnel it towards unions and leftist organizations. I mean honestly people, does anyone here not remember the CIA's record of funding and arming their future enemies? *cough* mujaheddin.

That was in order to destroy a progressive government in Afghanistan which was instituting reforms for women's rights and land redistribution (among other things), and the CIA still brags about how they eventually accomplished this. More to the point, the CIA will fund future enemies only because every ally of the CIA is a temporary and disposable one (Saddam Hussein, Batista, Noriega, the Mujaheddin, etc.), and they serve the CIA's immediate interests; these are ever contrary to the interests of the working class.

KC
23rd June 2009, 21:26
Former Pakistani Army General Mirza Aslam Beig claims the US Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) has distributed 400 million dollars inside Iran to evoke a revolution.

That's the key here.

We all know that the state is attempting to portray this as completely caused by the US/Israel. What's the point of posting that here?

Wanted Man
23rd June 2009, 21:26
Eh I'd gladly take the CIA's money and funnel it towards unions and leftist organizations. I mean honestly people, does anyone here not remember the CIA's record of funding and arming their future enemies? *cough* mujaheddin.
And that ended in socialism, right? No, it fueled the same kind of clerical reactionaries that run Iran now. Poor comparison.

Anyway, quite obviously, there's a difference between the mass movement on the streets, and the usual "reformers and dissidents" flush with American cash. All the more reason to support the former, and hope the latter doesn't get the upper hand.

Luckily, that's pretty obvious to most people, but apparently there are still a few who will jump on this kind of stuff to denounce the entire movement going on...

Wakizashi the Bolshevik
23rd June 2009, 21:52
This is no surprise I must say. Iran may be a conservative capitalist theocracy, but at least it isn't a slave of the the USA.
That's why the US is willing to do everything to enslave Iran.

Joe Hill's Ghost
23rd June 2009, 21:56
manic expression

The CIA views Islamic extremism with almost as much fear as soviet backed state capitalism. They had no fucking idea that they were going to reap the whirlwind. The CIA was/is concerned about American global dominance, pure and simple. They attacked the soviet regime, because it offered them an opportunity to throw a monkey into Moscow's sphere of influence. They couldn't fathom a USSR collapse with the US as an undisputed hyperpower. They never thought that far ahead, in their minds a bunch of islamic radicals would be useful against the Soviets, they would never target the US.

The CIA is a shortsighted organization. They're not terribly good at nuance. Intimidation, violence, proxy wars,...sure! But long term political solutions evade them, and always have. These guys thought they could set up a popularly legitimate regime in Afghanistan by backing a bunch of down on thier luck warlords. They installed the Shah only to see that grow an Islamic theocracy 20 years later. So of course now they're trying to fix Iran with the same foolish tactics. I see no reason to think that a bunch of savy leftists could run off with some of thier cash, if they played thier cards right. The CIA and OSS has backed all sorts of random groups, trade unions included. They want the regime toppled, and so does the CIA. The Iranians just won't talk about what comes next after the Ayatollahs are hanging by piano wire in Revolution square.

manic expression
23rd June 2009, 22:24
manic expression

The CIA views Islamic extremism with almost as much fear as soviet backed state capitalism.

Ignoring the state capitalism argument (because it's irrelevant here), I disagree. The principles of socialism threaten the very foundation of American capitalist society, whereas Islamic extremism takes hold first and foremost in already-oppressed nations on the other side of the world. Sure, there may be Islamic fundamentalist terrorists in America and Europe now and again, but do they constitute a concrete threat to capitalism? Not at all.

The capitalist state held extensive witch trials to try to root out communists from every nook and cranny of American life; today, they simply sit bemused as racists attack Sikhs and other innocents. Islamic fundamentalists are a scapegoat, communists rock the boat.


They had no fucking idea that they were going to reap the whirlwind. The CIA was/is concerned about American global dominance, pure and simple. They attacked the soviet regime, because it offered them an opportunity to throw a monkey into Moscow's sphere of influence. They couldn't fathom a USSR collapse with the US as an undisputed hyperpower. They never thought that far ahead, in their minds a bunch of islamic radicals would be useful against the Soviets, they would never target the US.

I'm not so sure. Islamic radicals had just captured the attention of the entire country in the Iran hostage crisis that came to a close just as Reagan began sending the Afghan feudalists even more support. Of course they knew that fundamentalists could target the US if their prized client state was just overrun by such a force.

Aside from all that, this still shows that the CIA views reactionary forces as its asset against the workers of all nations. Are we discussing the CIA's funding of genuine working-class movements? No, because they would never do such a thing. Socialism cuts to the bone of capitalism, Islamic fundamentalism does not.


The CIA is a shortsighted organization. They're not terribly good at nuance. Intimidation, violence, proxy wars,...sure! But long term political solutions evade them, and always have. These guys thought they could set up a popularly legitimate regime in Afghanistan by backing a bunch of down on thier luck warlords. They installed the Shah only to see that grow an Islamic theocracy 20 years later. So of course now they're trying to fix Iran with the same foolish tactics. I see no reason to think that a bunch of savy leftists could run off with some of thier cash, if they played thier cards right. The CIA and OSS has backed all sorts of random groups, trade unions included. They want the regime toppled, and so does the CIA. The Iranians just won't talk about what comes next after the Ayatollahs are hanging by piano wire in Revolution square.

Like I said, CIA hacks will still brag about their "success" in Afghanistan, they have few regrets about what happened there. It's partially because they simply don't care if Afghanistan was dragged into a society that was reactionary by bronze-age standards, and it's partially because they know damn well that the US invaded for oil and geopolitical considerations. Like I said, the CIA is well aware that its assets and allies are disposable, and their use of the term "asset" simply illustrates this; assets are used and tossed aside.

And like I said, when was the last time the CIA funded actual leftists? The OSS might have during World War II, but that was in adherence to the imperialist cooperation with the Soviet Union during that conflict. Such niceties died with Hitler. Not surprisingly, the CIA's done everything in its power to crush any remotely progressive movement since then.

Lastly, I'm afraid you've taken to wishful thinking. It might be comforting to think that this situation will lead to revolutionary destruction to the Islamic Republic, but think for a minute. Who's behind these demonstrations? Mousavi, who was already the Prime Minister of the Islamic Republic and who's to the right of Ahmedinejad; Rafsanjani, one of Iran's richest men, who is as reactionary (if not moreso) as the present Supreme Leader. Green isn't red, just as these protests are not revolutionary.

Guerrilla22
23rd June 2009, 22:35
I'm wondering how a former Pakastani general happens to know for fact that the CIA is distributing money inside Iran (it's likely but not provable) let alone the exact amount. The CIA doesn't share info with the Pakastani government, they don't trust their intelligence service.

KC
24th June 2009, 01:09
The government earlier in the day alleged that the US had paid 400 million dollars to people in order to organize unrest in Iran.From Green Brief #6 (http://iran.whyweprotest.net/news-current-events/1966-green-brief-6-niteowl.html).

So this was straight from State Media. You couldn't get a less reliable source than that.

( R )evolution
24th June 2009, 02:25
Your post is ridiculous. What good is this "revolution" if it is not organised by the working class and turns out to be orchestrated by the CIA to suit the capitalist agenda of America? It has seemed ever likely that America would focus solely on Iran ever since they decided to deal their oil sales in Euros. This may be a covert way for the CIA to overthrow the current government, using the people to put in place a government that will work for the American capitalist agenda, and what good will that be for the people of Iran?

I believe Haywood's Fingers post was meant to be sarcastic.

Dimentio
24th June 2009, 02:47
Iran's ideology is closer to right-wing extremism than to any serious anti-imperialism. I feel ashamed that I see so many leftists and self-declared progressives defend a regime which if triumphant in the Middle East would cleanse it of all progressive movements.

( R )evolution
24th June 2009, 02:55
Iran's ideology is closer to right-wing extremism than to any serious anti-imperialism. I feel ashamed that I see so many leftists and self-declared progressives defend a regime which if triumphant in the Middle East would cleanse it of all progressive movements.


I could not agree more. It seems to me that a large number of leftists have this mindset that if anyone raises a voice against American interests then they should be defended, even when those leaders are apart of capitalism and thus apart of the problem. Lenin said it well:


With regard to the more backward states and nations, in which feudal or patriarchal and patriarchal-peasant relations predominate, it is particularly important to bear in mind the need to combat Pan-Islamism and similar trends, which strive to combine the liberation movement against European and American imperialism with an attempt to strengthen the positions of the khans, landowners, mullahs, etc.Supporting any leader of a capitalist nation, is supporting oppression of the people. No war but class war!

Q
24th June 2009, 06:46
The CIA funding and arming a bunch of farmers in Afghanistan to fight a guerrilla war against the USSR is one thing, to take this as an example and claim that the CIA is behind the mass movements in Iran is absurd.

AvanteRedGarde
24th June 2009, 09:52
I agree, the working class have nothing to gain in overthrowing a dictator, what value do things such as freedom and justice have anyway :rolleyes:

And of course, we all know periods of struggle have no potential whatsoever to develop :laugh:

It's amazing how happily the so called 'revolutionary left' marches in lockstep with the CIA.

Glenn Beck
24th June 2009, 11:12
I agree, the working class have nothing to gain in overthrowing a dictator, what value do things such as freedom and justice have anyway :rolleyes:

And of course, we all know periods of struggle have no potential whatsoever to develop :laugh:

So according to you the workers have no side in bourgeois conflicts, except when there's a liberal faction to side with? You're a tremendous hypocrite.

The working class is 'behind' nationalist movements in Ireland etc. that you vehemently oppose in the same sense that they are 'behind' the movement against the theocratic dictatorship in Iran. You scoff at the claim that a bourgeois-democratic struggle can institute progressive reforms and/or develop into a revolutionary one in some cases and then make the exact same argument in others. Why?