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Die Neue Zeit
23rd April 2009, 01:44
Moments ago, I read what seemed to be an off-topic philosophical blog on Slavoj Zizek. Part of the blog mentions the role of rentiers:


But the same writers are quick to inform us, often in spite of their own recent myopia regarding capitalism's failures, that there is no alternative. Any elaboration on this juxtaposition is completely lacking, except for the employment of platitudes. I think Zizek is hinting that the repressed thought here goes like this: when such commentators speak of no alternative to capitalism, they are really saying that there is no alternative to capitalism unless we can spontaneously and rapidly adapt to the level of freedom which any removal of capitalism (which so effectively meets needs, but so implacably makes new, often unanticipated demands, and while it conditions us to seek out new sources of freedom, or at least seeming satisfactions) will require of us. And, for once, I must agree with these people: it's almost impossible to see us doing this. But it doesn't make it less necessary, especially given the environmental reckoning.

Zizek also notes with some tongue-in-cheek perplexity the fact that the most advanced capitalist economies are relying more and more on rent-seeking forms of revenue than on profits from sales (or generation of surplus value, or even exploitation). In strict Marxian terms, this is odd: society should be moving toward intensifying competition with technological advances, not on protection of existing means of production. Like the resuscitation of absolute surplus value (longer working hours), however, it is an indisputable part of the most advanced economies or, again, it was until the crisis hit. In this vein, Zizek cites all the usual suspects: the vast swathes of corporate America, from financial firms which patent their "innovative" investments and business practices to pharmaceutical firms which do the same with life-forms themselves, and on to the advertisers, media and software firms which are being relied upon more and more to balance our still ridiculously high consumption levels (70% of GDP, down only 2% from before the crisis) internationally. Here, I wish Zizek had mentioned another phenomenon, the seeming revival of something corresponding to primitive accumulation, too. He actually did refer to one of the main documentary sources for this phenomenon, Naomi Klein's The Shock Doctrine.

Now, before ICC left-communists pop in with potential "I told you so" remarks, I would like to point out that all of the above occurred well after the ICC's magic year of 1914. So, what are the implications in terms of rebuilding a politico-ideologically independent worker-class movement? Programmic implications?

Hoxhaist
23rd April 2009, 02:41
the decadence of capitalism is shown in the extravagance of the elite in comparison with the degrading lifestyle of the workers who make that life possible. Decadent societies outsource the lowest of the roles to workers in the economic colonies of the nation

Niccolò Rossi
23rd April 2009, 08:06
Firstly, I don't see the relevancy of the quote you provided for the the topic at hand. I understand that I maybe useful to quote material for the purposes of providing a basis of discussion and debate, however there is no need to quote irrelevant material for no reason, which is what I think you have done here.


Now, before ICC left-communists pop in with potential "I told you so" remarks

Sorry, Jacob, this is a fantasy of yours. You won't see any of that from anyone here.


I would like to point out that all of the above occurred well after the ICC's magic year of 1914.

There is no need to be rude about it. Beside I have discussed "the year of 1914" with you a number of times before via MSN. Why do you insist on repeating this?


So, what are the implications in terms of rebuilding a politico-ideologically independent worker-class movement? Programmic implications?

I'll take your question without the jargon to mean: what are the political implications of capitalisms decadence for the working class?

However, before we can deal with this question we need to deal with another more fundamental matter, namely, what are the economic, social and political implications of decadence for the capitalist mode of production (or any mode of production in general terms)? In other words, what does the decadence of capitalism even mean in the first place?

I think these questions are big, and due to me not having the time at the moment I will not go into them here. For all those interested however, I would very highly recommend you check out the currently ongoing study group of the ICC's pamphlet "The Decadence of Capitalism", in particular the current thread's section: "Decadence in Capitalism" (the thread can be found here (http://www.revleft.com/vb/decadence-study-decadence-t105322/index.html)).

I'll leave the actual question of the political implications of capitalism's decadence to others for the moment. I don't have the time for the moment. I'd be interested to hear what other users who do not identify with left communism of the ICC have to say about this.

Devrim
23rd April 2009, 08:42
I would like to point out that all of the above occurred well after the ICC's magic year of 1914.

It isn't a 'magic year'. We don't say that capitalism became a decadent system in 1914, but that it had become one by 1914. The opening of the First World War and the support of this war by the so-called workers parties only demonstrate this tendency. They are not the reason why we decided that capitalism was decadent.

Also it is not just an invention of the ICC. The Communist International also recognised that capitalism was a decadent system. In fact that is where we take it from.

Devrim

ZeroNowhere
23rd April 2009, 09:08
First Imperialist War
This is a horribly misleading term.


Also it is not just an invention of the ICC. The Communist International also recognised that capitalism was a decadent system. In fact that is where we take it from.
Well, to be fair, the ICC adheres in general to Luxemburg's decadent theory, which, while most 2nd Internationalists did have one, wasn't especially popular, IIRC.

Devrim
23rd April 2009, 09:29
This is a horribly misleading term.

Changed


Well, to be fair, the ICC adheres in general to Luxemburg's decadent theory, which, while most 2nd Internationalists did have one, wasn't especially popular, IIRC.

Are you talking about the 2nd or do you mean 3rd here?

Devrim