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skki
18th April 2009, 19:01
What function does direct democratic action have in a Leninist society? Considering we have a vanguard, are they elected? Do they control the means of production?

I understand that quite a few discrepancies arise when comparing and contrasting the state Lenin proposed in 'State and Revolution', and the one he actually set about creating. Rather than debate why this is, I would like to know which political philosophy you adhere to. The one he proposed, or the one he created?

No Stalinists please. Trot's answers are valid.
LOLseph Stalin
18th April 2009, 19:14
What function does direct democratic action have in a Leninist society? Considering we have a vanguard, are they elected? Do they control the means of production?

I understand that quite a few discrepancies arise when comparing and contrasting the state Lenin proposed in 'State and Revolution', and the one he actually set about creating. Rather than debate why this is, I would like to know which political philosophy you adhere to. The one he proposed, or the one he created?

No Stalinists please. Trot's answers are valid.

The vanguard is only for the revolution. They lead the revolution and then there's Democracy. If the masses don't want the leader of the party leading them they can vote him/her out of power. And no, the vanguard doesn't control the means of production. The workers do. The vanguard is strictly revolutionary.
Incendiarism
18th April 2009, 19:31
They lead the revolution and then there's Democracy.

Lenin = Blanqui?
ComradeOm
18th April 2009, 20:29
Lenin = Blanqui?No. As I show here (http://www.revleft.com/vb/russian-revolution-bolshevik-t105275/index.html) the Bolshevik party of 1917 was a thoroughly democratic organisation
Tower of Bebel
18th April 2009, 21:30
I think ComradeOm's action is the best example of how the Bolshevik party worked. The vanguard does not differ from the proletariat, it is not separated from it. If it does, it can only be a sect that claims to be the vanguard. Therefor the vanguard gets elected to various positions and they do controle some means of production since they belong to a class which is supposed to control the means of production.
LOLseph Stalin
19th April 2009, 01:47
I think ComradeOm's action is the best example of how the Bolshevik party worked. The vanguard does not differ from the proletariat, it is not separated from it. If it does, it can only be a sect that claims to be the vanguard. Therefor the vanguard gets elected to various positions and they do controle some means of production since they belong to a class which is supposed to control the means of production.

Yep. As i've said the vanguard can be voted out of their positions at will while in Bourgeois democracy we have little control over which candidate gets elected. If we don't like them then it's too bad for us. :( Since the vanguard is chosen by the workers they should be acting in their best interests.