"tea parties" nothing but astroturfing.

[Idealism]

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/13/opinion/13krugman.html
yeah i know, dont trust nyt, but it gets the point across. It's a fake grass-roots movement in the name of the ruling class to further sway the oppressed masses over to their side.

[TheCultofAbeLincoln]

Um, I don't think Paul Krugman is the right guy to honestly describe the motives between a right-wing phenomenon. Though, yes, the GOP is really talented at sinking it's own boat and has no fucking clue what do. I mean, they're practically countering the 'Part of No' tag with a "Failure IS an Option" motto.

But I have to admit I rather like the tea party idea. It has nothing to do with my tax rate, but more of what our taxes have been used to....bail out recently.

[Glenn Beck]

Paul Krugman is late to this party. The Exiled had excellent coverage of the fraudulent tea party "grassroots" movement starting like a whole month ago. Let me dig it up for y'all

http://exiledonline.com/%E2%80%9Cslick-rick%E2%80%9D-santelli-is-a-bailout-queen-tea-party-mascot%E2%80%99s-company-took-139-billion-in-bailout-funds-ge-uses-taxpayer-money-to-censor-its-critics-destroy-bailout-program-f/

http://exiledonline.com/how-freedomworks-gave-the-teabaggers-a-dirty-sanchez/

http://exiledonline.com/victory-gloat-ames-levine-serve-santellis-head-to-daily-show/

http://exiledonline.com/cnbc-*****-slaps-santelli-into-line-freedomworks-admits-it-organized-grassroots-tea-parties-jon-stewart-cancels-santelli-megan-mcardle-queefs-on-our-founding-fathers/

http://exiledonline.com/astroturf-revolution-dispatch-koch-activists-teabag-media/

[Glenn Beck]

It's complicated to maneuver ideologically in the US right now. The teabaggers (yes I refuse to call them anything else) are capitalizing on legit and just outrage over the fucking heist and fraud that is the Bush/Obama bailout plans. The way opinion polarizes in this country people either cover their ears and insist on believing that Obama is doing a great job and is in fact better than the nightmare that was Bush (my parents fall into this category). Others fall hook line and sinker for the whole producerist/libertarian narrative that is nothing but a trojan horse for the far-right and more of the same neoliberal bullshit.

[Sean]

Heres a little article from a group of astroturfers I am especially fascinated by, Bureaucrash (http://bureaucrash.com/2009/04/15/7531/). They're libertarian "activists" indirectly funded by Texaco, Ford Motors and Pfizer through their parent company (who tried to hide the link until it was discovered on tax documents), the less than fight the power sounding Competitive Enterprise Institute.
A bunch of rich marketing students getting paid to rally people around false causes.

[Iuvo]

I walked past one of the bigger rallies on my way home from work today. Was awfully disgusted and nauseous.

[Pinko Panther]

These people irritate me, but I don't think we have much to worry about. From what I can tell, all these people know is that TAXES=BAD. Just ignorance, plain and simple.

[AvanteRedGarde]

Why are you calling them ignorant? I thought these were are worker brothers and sisters. Shouldn't you be enlightening them with your radical views?

There certainly is a disparity between (a) the faith that people here put into an abstract "working class," and (b) the actual subjective state of the so-called American working class and ya'lls unwillingness to engage with them.

[Psy]

Why are you calling them ignorant? I thought these were are worker brothers and sisters. Shouldn't you be enlightening them with your radical views?

There certainly is a disparity between (a) the faith that people here put into an abstract "working class," and (b) the actual subjective state of the so-called American working class and ya'lls unwillingness to engage with them.

They are not the industrial proletariat, if you listen to the American industrial proletariat they are nowhere as ignorant as these tea bagger. While the tea baggers are complaining about government hand outs, the American industrial workers ask where the hell is their hand out, all they see is the greedy capitalists getting a hand out.

[Dimentio]

Um, I don't think Paul Krugman is the right guy to honestly describe the motives between a right-wing phenomenon. Though, yes, the GOP is really talented at sinking it's own boat and has no fucking clue what do. I mean, they're practically countering the 'Part of No' tag with a "Failure IS an Option" motto.

But I have to admit I rather like the tea party idea. It has nothing to do with my tax rate, but more of what our taxes have been used to....bail out recently.

Well, that strategy was extremely successful before, so it must be it now I think is their strategy.

[redSHARP]

if we are smart, we should high-jack these protests under the banner of libertarian socialism.

[Hoxhaist]

It seems that this entire charade was promoted by Fox News and various corporate interests that want to play this for all its worth to get lower taxes the websites sponsoring and announcing these "protests" are funded by Freedom Works and Club for Growth, conservative PACs. The "protesters" are only representatives of the people who dont wait to pay a responsible share of taxes and those people who Fox News has brainwashed into the "Obama is a Socialist/Fascist" hype (that idea of equating Socialism with Fascism drives me CRAZY!!!)

[Enragé]

Well, what leftists could do in the US is start a campaign against certain taxes, and in favour of others, e.g:

Instead of support for the poor being a voluntary charity, make it a tax, and turn the taxes which go to the military into a voluntary charity. I'd think this would resonate with alot of people in the US.

Point is, we have to take advantage of the anti-taxes mood which seems to be ingrained into the people in the US. Following the social-democratic model simply doesnt seem a realistic option on the short term.

[Psy]

Well, what leftists could do in the US is start a campaign against certain taxes, and in favour of others, e.g:

Instead of support for the poor being a voluntary charity, make it a tax, and turn the taxes which go to the military into a voluntary charity. I'd think this would resonate with alot of people in the US.

Point is, we have to take advantage of the anti-taxes mood which seems to be ingrained into the people in the US. Following the social-democratic model simply doesnt seem a realistic option on the short term.
Taxes is a red herring. Actually the best the left could do is mobilize the industrial proletariat and massive surplus army of labor (the unemployed) to protest the US government for jobs like during the great depression. When you have large protests of workers and unemployed demanding jobs they will drown out the reactionary voices.

[SocialismOrBarbarism]

It's not too big of a jump from being mad about having your money appropriated through taxes to being mad about having your value appropriated by a capitalist. We need to make people realize that they're losing far more to capitalist profit than to taxes and that if we had a socialist economy they could work like half the time while maintaining the same standard of living.

[AvanteRedGarde]

Well SoB, if it is that easy, lead the way.

[Hoxhaist]

Taxes is a red herring. Actually the best the left could do is mobilize the industrial proletariat and massive surplus army of labor (the unemployed) to protest the US government for jobs like during the great depression. When you have large protests of workers and unemployed demanding jobs they will drown out the reactionary voices.
Maybe protests truly defining socialism and rejecting its being equated with fascism and revealing the real nature of exploitation.

We should point out the exploitation that is a part of the economic processes that we take for granted such as starving "Third World" farmers as result of "First World" subsidies, factory workers working under labour laws that are a throwback to the worst excesses of the Industrial Revolution. We should show the faces and tell the stories of victims of all forms of imperialism: First Nations, Palestine, Iraq, and Afghanistan. The contradictions of First World rhetoric should be made known: Afghan rape law, no democracy in Israel especially in the Occupied Territories, ignorance of the exploitation and oppression in the DRC, Uganda, Mexico.

[SocialismOrBarbarism]

Well SoB, if it is that easy, lead the way.

Did I say anything indicating that I thought it was easy? I just don't see it as a big leap from the libertarian stance against appropriating peoples money through taxes without them having a choice, and our stance against capitalists appropriating value created by workers because of their stranglehold on the means of production. Libertarians like to talk about parasitism by the government and people on welfare..well, we need to point out that the biggest parasites are capitalists, and that in socialism people will receive only according to how much they contribute.


Maybe protests truly defining socialism and rejecting its being equated with fascism and revealing the real nature of exploitation.

We should point out the exploitation that is a part of the economic processes that we take for granted such as starving "Third World" farmers as result of "First World" subsidies, factory workers working under labour laws that are a throwback to the worst excesses of the Industrial Revolution. We should show the faces and tell the stories of victims of all forms of imperialism: First Nations, Palestine, Iraq, and Afghanistan. The contradictions of First World rhetoric should be made known: Afghan rape law, no democracy in Israel especially in the Occupied Territories, ignorance of the exploitation and oppression in the DRC, Uganda, Mexico.

People seem to respond better when you appeal to their interests instead of their emotions. I seem to convince more people when I tell them about how they will have guaranteed employment, will have a better standard of living for the same amount of work, etc.