(UK) Northerners die 20 years earlier than Southerners

[Bitter Ashes]

I've actualy taken this from a couple of posts I made in another discussion and thought it'd be good for a more indepth discussion.

I live in the UK and I'm a Northerner. I guess a lot of it comes from my upbringing that I was always told that we'll always get the short end of the stick for as long as the South governs us. As I got older I explored the differences more and more and it became pretty aparant early on that there's a definate double standard in goverment support and numerous prejudices held against us. Instead of going into the whole lot of it all at once (which would be everything ranging from the discrimination against Northern accents in job interviews to how all public services are hijacked for use down South if they're needed there and never the other way around), I'd like to stick to probably the most worrying display of the consquences of the North/South divide.

Life expectancy for even most deprived parts of London is 73. In parts of Glasgow, it's 54.
(sources)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2006/jan/21/health.politics
http://www.lho.org.uk/Download/Public/8811/1/Health_Inequalities_Report_4.pdf

Where I am, West Yorkshire, there's a 15 year difference between the life expectancy of the rich fenced communities (usualy holiday homes for Chelsea residents) and the rest of us workers everywhere else.
(source)
http://www.awya.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/B6329914-24DA-4023-BDD5-8558CB5BEBDA/0/Health_LLA_report_101207.pdf

And on top of that all, there's of course the news that one Stafford NHS hospital has decieded to kill 300 of its patients to cut costs to meet goverment targets and as the news rolled in afterwards, they were not alone.

I've got my own theories about how these massive differences in our life expectancies came about that I'll go into after the thread develops a bit.

[JohannGE]

Surely these discrepancies are related to dispararities in wealth distribution and not directly to geography. The inequalities in wealth distribution and the opportunities it brings producing health affecting reduction in educational prospects, health care, housing, environment etc.

Personally after being born and raised in the north, then spending 25 years in rural sussex, moving back north for 10 years and now contemplating a move even further north, I obviously think it's worth the price. ;) Anyway, it could be seen as ironic justice that the soft southern shandy drinkers be made to suffer 15 or 20 years longer in middle class purgatory as punishment for their shamefull discrimination against their fellow citizens.

:)

[Zurdito]

Surely these discrepancies are related to dispararities in wealth distribution and not directly to geography. The inequalities in wealth distribution and the opportunities it brings producing health affecting reduction in educational prospects, health care, housing, environment etc.

Personally after being born and raised in the north, then spending 25 years in rural sussex, moving back north for 10 years and now contemplating a move even further north, I obviously think it's worth the price. ;) Anyway, it could be seen as ironic justice that the soft southern shandy drinkers be made to suffer 15 or 20 years longer in middle class purgatory as punishment for their shamefull discrimination against their fellow citizens.

:)

yes, Tower Hamlets or Newham are so much more middle class than anywhere in northern england. :rolleyes:

[Bitter Ashes]

lol.
Well, I agree on the wealth distribution bieng the primary cause.
With good healthcare bieng diverted towards the high priced private sector and all the food that is actualy any good for you bieng prohibitably priced for Northern pockets. Not to mention that the closer towards poverty you get, the higher the rates of drinking and drug use to try cope with the stress inflicted on them by the capitalists. It's little wonder we die in our 40's and 50's.
It's not as if we have a pension to look forward to anyway. The private pensions are vanishing as the bourgeois scuttle thier companies and ride off into the sunset liek bandits with the pension fund and state pension bieng phased out. If captitalism's still on its feet in 2050, when I'll be at retirement age, I sure hope I'm not around to see it.

[Bitter Ashes]

yes, Tower Hamlets or Newham are so much more middle class than anywhere in northern england. :rolleyes:
Ah yes, the exception that proves the rule.:rolleyes:
As stated in the original post though, that life expectancy of 73 is for the most deprieved areas of London. I'm not talking about Chelsea here when I say 73. I'm talking about places like Newham and Brixton. Chelsea's life expectancy is over 80 if I remember right.

[Zurdito]

Ah yes, the exception that proves the rule.:rolleyes:
As stated in the original post though, that life expectancy of 73 is for the most deprieved areas of London. I'm not talking about Chelsea here when I say 73. I'm talking about places like Newham and Brixton. Chelsea's life expectancy is over 80 if I remember right.

Actually I wasn't arguing with your post, but with the post I quoted. I agree that the facts you posted are disgraceful (but not surprising). But one thing is the fact that workers in London might have better access to services than workers in the north, and another is to compare the "working class north" and the "middle class south". I don't resent workers for not dying younger!

Likewise those statistics could have a lot to do with the fact that there is so much wealth in London, that the averges get pushed up - i.e. borugeoisification of some parts of Tower Hamlets, etc. You have great wealth and poverty (in european terms) living side by side. It would be interesting to see life expectancy by income.

I lived in England for quite a long time and saw quite a lot of it, and the "north-south" division is not a class division. It is not just that there are "some" workers in the south and "some middle classes" in the north. London has some of the countries most productive industry. It is also fact that some of poorest parts of the country are in London, and in fact the poorest region in the whole country, by GDP per capita is Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly.

The fact that a huge relatively well-off "lower middle class" based on services and congegrated around the southeast, is not some reason to glorify the north against the south. These people need to be key allies in the class struggle. London is by far the most ethnically diverse part of Britain, most sexually liberal, etc. For that reason I think that, in most countries, hatred of the metropolis and love of the provinces, usually only helps reactionaries, and is not helpful to the left.

[Dean]

And on top of that all, there's of course the news that one Stafford NHS hospital has decieded to kill 300 of its patients to cut costs to meet goverment targets and as the news rolled in afterwards, they were not alone.

WTF are you talking about? Seriously? Why haven't I heard of this - it would be a public relations disaster and int'l news for sure?

[JohannGE]

Actually I wasn't arguing with your post, but with the post I quoted.

Arguing with an obvious and indicated joke!

[The Idler]

I've actualy taken this from a couple of posts I made in another discussion and thought it'd be good for a more indepth discussion.

I live in the UK and I'm a Northerner. I guess a lot of it comes from my upbringing that I was always told that we'll always get the short end of the stick for as long as the South governs us. As I got older I explored the differences more and more and it became pretty aparant early on that there's a definate double standard in goverment support and numerous prejudices held against us. Instead of going into the whole lot of it all at once (which would be everything ranging from the discrimination against Northern accents in job interviews to how all public services are hijacked for use down South if they're needed there and never the other way around), I'd like to stick to probably the most worrying display of the consquences of the North/South divide.

Life expectancy for even most deprived parts of London is 73. In parts of Glasgow, it's 54.
(sources)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2006/jan/21/health.politics
http://www.lho.org.uk/Download/Public/8811/1/Health_Inequalities_Report_4.pdf

Where I am, West Yorkshire, there's a 15 year difference between the life expectancy of the rich fenced communities (usualy holiday homes for Chelsea residents) and the rest of us workers everywhere else.
(source)
http://www.awya.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/B6329914-24DA-4023-BDD5-8558CB5BEBDA/0/Health_LLA_report_101207.pdf

And on top of that all, there's of course the news that one Stafford NHS hospital has decieded to kill 300 of its patients to cut costs to meet goverment targets and as the news rolled in afterwards, they were not alone.

I've got my own theories about how these massive differences in our life expectancies came about that I'll go into after the thread develops a bit.Private welfare would be expected to produce different life expectancies, the scandal is that Britain's underfunded public welfare system does it too depending on where you live.