The current state of the NHS in the UK today

[rednordman]

Just today, there has been a damning report about the current state of the NHS in the UK. It has been reported that some of the hospitals within the midlands are at such as poor standard that it literally has cost lives. To cut to the chase, people are now asking the questions of what to blame this on, and a lot of people come up with that of ‘targets’ that have been set by the government. This also applies to a lot of other public services at the current moment within the UK. Without wanting to sound very stupid, what is it exactly meant by these ‘targets’ ?
A lot of people In opposition to the NuLabour government label this as something socialistic, but if they work in the way I think, I do not see how (more the other way if you ask me).
What in your opinions has gone or is going wrong with the NHS in the UK? And also what has targets got to with it? Plus, If you do not think that the NHS is so bad (at least we have a sort of nationalised health service) then what is most peoples problem with it?

More info:http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/staffordshire/7948293.stm

[Pogue]

Just today, there has been a damning report about the current state of the NHS in the UK. It has been reported that some of the hospitals within the midlands are at such as poor standard that it literally has cost lives. To cut to the chase, people are now asking the questions of what to blame this on, and a lot of people come up with that of ‘targets’ that have been set by the government. This also applies to a lot of other public services at the current moment within the UK. Without wanting to sound very stupid, what is it exactly meant by these ‘targets’ ?
A lot of people In opposition to the NuLabour government label this as something socialistic, but if they work in the way I think, I do not see how (more the other way if you ask me).
What in your opinions has gone or is going wrong with the NHS in the UK? And also what has targets got to with it? Plus, If you do not think that the NHS is so bad (at least we have a sort of nationalised health service) then what is most peoples problem with it?

More info:http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/staffordshire/7948293.stm

I could sum it up in 2 reasons:

Under funding

Shit management.

Thats basically it.

Thats why there are some problems in the NHS.

[MikeSC]

I don't think it's so much that the NHS is under-funded for it's purpose. But it has to work within capitalism- the costs that the funding has to meet are massively overinflated by the profiteering capitalists.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Who-Owns-You-Corporate-Philosophy/dp/1405187301/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231100900&sr=8-13

The NHS is pretty much held to ransom by the capitalist class. One of my first posts on this website was on this very topic :D I'll have a look for it-


Another good book- very recent, if you're interested. I can't post links yet, it's called "Who Owns You?: The Corporate Gold Rush to Patent Your Genes"


It details the strangle-hold capitalism has over medical research in a specific setting. They pay people to discover new genes, and then patent them. They do nothing with this patent- they don't do any costly further research themselves. They use it to make a profit out of and stifle the research of others.

One example is cancer research- the researchers have to search for and test a multitude of genes- which is resource-heavy anyway, but with each one patented by various capitalists it becomes even more so. The capitalist drives up the cost of cancer research to as high as s/he can- extorting as much as possible out of hospitals and labs- which the hospital/laboratory has to pay if they want to do the research. And they have to pay every time they do something in relation to that gene.

The capitalist grows richer at the expense of charities, the taxpayer, the patients- doing nothing, having never done anything except be lucky enough to start off with enough money to fund someone elses preliminary research. And where did this funding come from originally? Seizure by the state of natural resources owned collectively, as in all early civilisation.

EDIT: Note, the original researcher doesn't get any of this extorted cash, as if that would make it okay anyway- in exactly the same way that a worker doesn't share in the profit of the produce s/he makes. The capitalist/researcher relationship is actually a textbook example of Marx's ideas in the first volume of Capital.

Not saying it's the only reason, but it's definately significant.

EDIT: And the management thing- the dominance of the financial sector could be a reason? Enticing people with the skills away from where they'd be of some us?

[Pogue]

I don't think it's so much that the NHS is under-funded for it's purpose. But it has to work within capitalism- the costs that the funding has to meet are massively overinflated by the profiteering capitalists.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Who-Owns-You-Corporate-Philosophy/dp/1405187301/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231100900&sr=8-13

The NHS is pretty much held to ransom by the capitalist class. One of my first posts on this website was on this very topic :D I'll have a look for it-



Not saying it's the only reason, but it's definately significant.

EDIT: And the management thing- the dominance of the financial sector could be a reason? Enticing people with the skills away from where they'd be of some us?

I'd have to disagree. They're constantly making cuts in funding and refusing to build whole new hospitals when its needed, and the staff are paid piss-poor wages. Quite simply not enough money is going in, or the money that is going in is going to the wrong people, i.e. the useless managers. I don't think we can really put a cap on how much money should go into the NHS because obviously the more money they get the better services they can provide, if they put the money where its needed. I say this with a great deal of personal experience and insider knowledge.

[MikeSC]

I'd have to disagree. They're constantly making cuts in funding and refusing to build whole new hospitals when its needed, and the staff are paid piss-poor wages. Quite simply not enough money is going in, or the money that is going in is going to the wrong people, i.e. the useless managers. I don't think we can really put a cap on how much money should go into the NHS because obviously the more money they get the better services they can provide, if they put the money where its needed. I say this with a great deal of personal experience and insider knowledge.

I was kinda making the same point- the funding that there is is inadequate for the inflated costs, from the NHS having to work within the markets. There are a lot of costs that they have to meet that they otherwise wouldn't. I can't see how there'd would ever be adequate funding under capitalism- the more money in the NHS the more the drugs companies and patent-holders extort.

EDIT: I'm not saying to cap funding or anything like that. We want the best we can get while under capitalism- but while still under capitalism it's never going to be as good as it could be.

[rossith]

Just today, there has been a damning report about the current state of the NHS in the UK. It has been reported that some of the hospitals within the midlands are at such as poor standard that it literally has cost lives. To cut to the chase, people are now asking the questions of what to blame this on, and a lot of people come up with that of ‘targets’ that have been set by the government. This also applies to a lot of other public services at the current moment within the UK. Without wanting to sound very stupid, what is it exactly meant by these ‘targets’ ?
A lot of people In opposition to the NuLabour government label this as something socialistic, but if they work in the way I think, I do not see how (more the other way if you ask me).
What in your opinions has gone or is going wrong with the NHS in the UK? And also what has targets got to with it? Plus, If you do not think that the NHS is so bad (at least we have a sort of nationalised health service) then what is most peoples problem with it?

More info:http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/staffordshire/7948293.stm

For info on the current state of the NHS, research Thatchers/the Conservative reforms of the NHS in the '80s.

Peace. Compassion. Liberty. X

[brigadista]

I could sum it up in 2 reasons:

Under funding

Shit management.

Thats basically it.

Thats why there are some problems in the NHS.

all devices for the so called governrment to justufy privatisation on american lines..UK always inports the shit that fails in the USA

[Killfacer]

The NHS is fine. Stop whinging.

[Bitter Ashes]

The NHS is fine. Stop whinging.
Surely, you cannot be serious? :ohmy:
400 people were killed so that Fred Goodwin could have a £700k pension from taxpayers money for failing???