"Reclaiming" offensive words

[Invincible Summer]

I was thinking about this topic the other day... what's the deal with some groups in society trying to "reclaim" words that have been traditionally used to discriminate against them?

For instance, black people using the word "nigger," or homosexuals calling themselves "queer," "gay," and I've even heard "fag."


How is this supposed to be "progressive" or "empowering?" Could someone explain it to me?

[Plagueround]

I think the idea is that letters and sounds aren't actually offensive, just what we make them to be, and by taking an offensive word and claiming it in such a way you're saying "I'm not afraid to be called this and it's not a negative thing therefore you have no power over me".

For what it's worth, I hang out with a crowd (or rather, did before I moved and will one I get back home) that has quite a few LBGT people and they use the word "fag" more than anyone else I know. Personally I don't know that this is effective, if anything I think it helps perpetuate the idea that it's ok for anyone to use these types of words. Mileage may vary.

[Black Dagger]

I guess because language is defined largely by use - and it's an attempt to alter the connotation of these terms? So to take the 'power' or control over this meaning away from the bigots and to put it in the hands of the oppressed. In short, to make it 'our' word instead of 'their' word.

[Invincible Summer]

I think the idea is that letters and sounds aren't actually offensive, just what we make them to be, and by taking an offensive word and claiming it in such a way you're saying "I'm not afraid to be called this and it's not a negative thing therefore you have no power over me".

For what it's worth, I hang out with a crowd (or rather, did before I moved and will one I get back home) that has quite a few LBGT people and they use the word "fag" more than anyone else I know. Personally I don't know that this is effective, if anything I think it helps perpetuate the idea that it's ok for anyone to use these types of words. Mileage may vary.


I guess because language is defined largely by use - and it's an attempt to alter the connotation of these terms? So to take the 'power' or control over this meaning away from the bigots and to put it in the hands of the oppressed. In short, to make it 'our' word instead of 'their' word.


I see, interesting.

While it's true that language is defined by use, words like "nigger" and "faggot" have so much negative baggage attached to them that it seems almost impossible to make it "our" word

[Yazman]

I see, interesting.

While it's true that language is defined by use, words like "nigger" and "faggot" have so much negative baggage attached to them that it seems almost impossible to make it "our" word

Not to mention that when a group does try to "reclaim" it, it is still only ever acceptable for them to say it. There's too much baggage attached to them to make them benign in society at large.

[Black Dagger]

Not to mention that when a group does try to "reclaim" it, it is still only ever acceptable for them to say it.

Well yeah... i'm not sure what else you would expect? That's the point of reclaiming it - it's a specific group 'reclaiming' a term.

[karambit]

I say "whats up my nig" to my fellow black friends and they do the same thing with me all the time; and I'm white:cool:. As a faggot myself I actually don't say faggot in my day to day existence. :lol:

[Sean]

Well as a Taig, I like to use the word when I can to desensitize people to it entirely. Language is constantly changing, and if you're not going to change it yourself, then someone else will. To say hat it can never be someone else's word isn't really true, you've all been calling me an offensive term for Irish Catholics for months now, and I've managed quite well and so have you. It won't work for other people I'm sure, but I'm comfortable with it.

[Yazman]

Well as a Taig, I like to use the word when I can to desensitize people to it entirely. Language is constantly changing, and if you're not going to change it yourself, then someone else will. To say hat it can never be someone else's word isn't really true, you've all been calling me an offensive term for Irish Catholics for months now, and I've managed quite well and so have you. It won't work for other people I'm sure, but I'm comfortable with it.

The difference in this scenario is that I just thought "taig" was a nickname that you made up, so my mental association with it was with you. Had I known it was some sort of derogative term it might have been different.

[Killfacer]

Being a killfacer, i have had to get used to a lot of insults. I have reclaimed the insult "doddering childish fuckwitt" and now call all my other killfacer mates that aswell.

Seriously though: I think people find it empowering because it makes a mockery of the insult. Although, Black Dagger explained far better than i ever could.

[Invader Zim]

Well as a Taig, I like to use the word when I can to desensitize people to it entirely. Language is constantly changing, and if you're not going to change it yourself, then someone else will. To say hat it can never be someone else's word isn't really true, you've all been calling me an offensive term for Irish Catholics for months now, and I've managed quite well and so have you. It won't work for other people I'm sure, but I'm comfortable with it.


I suspect that for many on this board - being international - the connotations of the name you have given yourself will mean little.

[Bilan]

What is taig?

[Sean]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taig

EDIT: Actually, Bilan, thanks for asking, although I have the wiki article in my signature, I've never read it.



Teague has been reclaimed by some Irish nationalists as an ironic self-identifier in the same fashion that other terms of disparagement (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Term_of_disparagement) have been adopted by certain people they describe. In contemporary sources, the difference in spelling between taig and teague often indicates a difference in connotation akin to the difference between nigger (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigger) and nigga (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigga).[3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taig#cite_note-taig-2)
I did not know this, and I've never heard other Irish people using it in such a way. Glad to know I'm not the only one!

[Bitter Ashes]

Reclaiming words is a very very long and drawn out process. The main stalling point is usualy that as long as somebody takes offence to a word, it still has the potential to be harmful.
I personaly see it as a bit futile as if you remove one word that bigots like to use from thier vocabulary, they will simply pick another one. Never underestimate the creativity of a twisted mind.

[hammer and sickle]

No I dont like the idea at all! These words should be eliminated altogether not "reclaimed".

[Sean]

No I dont like the idea at all! These words should be eliminated altogether not "reclaimed".
There's a definate Orwellian aura that surrounds hacking out chunks of language. As with the majority of my posts in descrimination where I take an opposing stance and seemingly side with the pejorative, I only do so because if you set a precident with good intentions, negative oppressive intervention on the same basis too is quick to take full advantage. If you're grant a government an excuse to destroy the sounds and words used to convey abstract thoughts, you have to be aware that, say, in America at least, "revolutionary" and "communist" would be destroyed at the same time as "nigger" and "kike".

[Bitter Ashes]

There's a definate Orwellian aura that surrounds hacking out chunks of language. As with the majority of my posts in descrimination where I take an opposing stance and seemingly side with the pejorative, I only do so because if you set a precident with good intentions, negative oppressive intervention on the same basis too is quick to take full advantage. If you're grant a government an excuse to destroy the sounds and words used to convey abstract thoughts, you have to be aware that, say, in America at least, "revolutionary" and "communist" would be destroyed at the same time as "nigger" and "kike".
Double-plus good comrade!
Ahem... anyway. Although you can damage the bigots and revolutionaries with the destruction of the language, I doubt you can totaly kill the spirit of anything by just removing the word as new words are born every day to describe specific things that do not have thier own words yet.
Given enough time new names will appear for old concepts and they will be greeted with equal hostility.

[Louise Michel]

How is this supposed to be "progressive" or "empowering?" Could someone explain it to me?


This is a good question and my answer is that it isn't at all empowering. Words have a cultural context and meaning. The fact that the group that is the target of the abuse takes on the words seems to me to be an acceptance of their own oppression. "Nigger" is an abusive, racist word rooted in slavery. African Americans using the word (as they do) just confuses the issue at best. I don't see how my referring to other women as "****" would do anything other than say to men it's not so bad to use this abusive term. I can't imagine Martin Luther King referring to himself as a "nigger".

[synthesis]

African Americans using the word (as they do) just confuses the issue at best. The last thing we need is the majority telling the minority what words they can use and what they can't. Whether or not the "N-word" is acceptable when used by black people... that's something for black people to decide amongst themselves.


I don't see how my referring to other women as "****" would do anything other than say to men it's not so bad to use this abusive term.I hear women calling each other "*****es" all the time, the same ones who would not find it acceptable to be called "*****" by a man. Again, I have no problem with this situation... it's not my place to tell you how to talk.

What we must remember is that oppressive language is merely a symptom of an oppressive society. The language ceases to be oppressive when divorced from the oppression in which it originated. Furthermore, eliminating oppressive language does not address oppressive ideas, and in fact it often creates obstacles to doing so.

[h0m0revolutionary]

If i can just concentrate on one, and take from that what you will :P

The word 'Queer' by definition means something extra-ordinary, something strange and/or out of place. That according to any dictionary is it's one denotation

Now of course we all know that it means other things, infact many people confuse it's actual meaning for it's most common useage - that of a derogatory term for homosexuals. So Queer, by definition isn't something necessarily offensive, i therefore can understand fully why it could be self-empowering to reclaim the word, and destroy that false connotation the word has come to accomodate.
It's certainly in my lexicon for example.

Furthermore there is now a whole branch of thought called Queer theory and as a consequence many LGBTQ individuals have labelled themselves Queer with it's own distinctive meaning*. i think this is a very progressive movement, i mean it's been painfully obvious for some time that there exists sexual and gender relations that come outside of the LGB or T binary.

* For those unaware Queer has come to mean those indivudals who whom sexuality and gender are both fluid concepts. One may self-identify as male for example, but share none of the traits identified with males - masculinity, 'male' genitalia etc, they may also be attracted to a whole range of different peoples, boys, girls, femmes, macho, trans, androgynes etc. Alternatively they may not identify with either of the rigid deffiniations of male or female; masculine nor feminime.

Clearly concepts of sexuality and gender can be fluid and for many people who believe themselevs to come otuside of the gender and sexual binary, Queer is their preferred term.

:)

[9]

I was raised Jewish and I still have a strong cultural identity. In the states, the Jews have done this to a degree with a progressive Jewish magazine entitled "Heeb", Heeb being a slur against Jews. Personally, I find this method effective (though I don't see it as being particularly effective if the use of such terms is restricted to the group that's the target, though certainly that is the group that has to want to "reclaim" the word in the first place). There is something liberating about being able to laugh in the face of someone who comes up to me and calls me a "kyke" or a "Heeb" or a "lampshade" (or what have you) - I am taking the power of the slur away from the bigot - he can no longer use it as a weapon because I won't react to it the way he wants me to. At least, that's how I look at it.

[ibn Bruce]

I call myself a 'splodey-dope' or a 'kamikaze-nazi' sometimes, just to try and distract myself from the sentiments behind such things. Similarly I make jokes about the Moz-lems as a 5th column... I do not think in all cases it is indicative of a conscious attempt to reclaim words, rather it is an instinctive self defence mechanism.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

I was thinking about this topic the other day... what's the deal with some groups in society trying to "reclaim" words that have been traditionally used to discriminate against them?

For instance, black people using the word "nigger," or homosexuals calling themselves "queer," "gay," and I've even heard "fag."


How is this supposed to be "progressive" or "empowering?" Could someone explain it to me?

Well the word "queer" is not so much offensive as it is describing that which is simply not of the hetero-norm. It's no more offensive than "strange", "different" or any other term subject to context.

I do not recall the term "gay" being originally offensive. I know it has been used negatively, but that was long after it had been used by us gay people.

Even terms that have been blatant negative words like "fag" can be used endearingly amongst gay guys like myself in a way of subtly discrediting the use of the word in the negative context. It's like mocking the bigots.

I know some of us Mexicans use the word "mojado" which is a term that literally translates into "wet" as in the term 'wetback' but is a term used amongst our selves.

I've spoken of the three terms that apply in my concern, as a Mexican Gay Boy.

[Bitter Ashes]

Hiya, it's worth pointing out that the word queer tends to have more of a stigma in the UK than the US.

Also, there's the pretty well known differences in the usuage of the word "fag" on either side of the Atlantic. It's almost never used here as slur.

[dez]

I guess because language is defined largely by use - and it's an attempt to alter the connotation of these terms?

I agree with this, hence I quote it.

I also would like to add that to the next generations, if words that were once offensive are incorporated to daily language in a non-discriminatory way, it would mean nothing if a word that they use normally had a negative connotation once.

[Fat Tire]

None of us own words to reclaim in the first place. We all have the right to say any word that we desire.

[cleef]

i remember hearing something said by Lenny Bruce which summed it up nicely for me...



Are there any niggers here tonight? Could you turn on the house lights, please, and could the waiters and waitresses just stop serving, just for a second? And turn off this spot. Now what did he say? "Are there any niggers here tonight?" I know there's one nigger, because I see him back there working. Let's see, there's two niggers. And between those two niggers sits a kike. And there's another kike— that's two kikes and three niggers. And there's a spic. Right? Hmm? There's another spic. Ooh, there's a wop; there's a polack; and, oh, a couple of greaseballs. And there's three lace-curtain Irish micks. And there's one, hip, thick, hunky, funky, boogie. Boogie boogie. Mm-hmm. I got three kikes here, do I hear five kikes? I got five kikes, do I hear six spics, I got six spics, do I hear seven niggers? I got seven niggers. Sold American. I pass with seven niggers, six spics, five micks, four kikes, three guineas, and one wop. Well, I was just trying to make a point, and that is that it's the suppression of the word that gives it the power, the violence, the viciousness. Dig: if President Kennedy would just go on television, and say, "I would like to introduce you to all the niggers in my cabinet," and if he'd just say "nigger nigger nigger nigger nigger" to every nigger he saw, "boogie boogie boogie boogie boogie," "nigger nigger nigger nigger nigger" 'til nigger didn't mean anything anymore, then you could never make some six-year-old black kid cry because somebody called him a nigger at school.

[Nulono]

It's to take the power out of strokes of a pen or vibrations of the air.

[Cooler Reds Will Prevail]

I know some of us Mexicans use the word "mojado" which is a term that literally translates into "wet" as in the term 'wetback' but is a term used amongst our selves.

Lmao, no mames!! I haven't really noticed it but I'll keep an ear out... It's probably more common among recent immigrants than Chicanos. Regardless, it's not a word that I would use since a) I was born here and b) I'm a very light-skinned Mexican and it would kind of have racist connotations.

But yeah, I support the idea of reclaiming words, though I don't think they're acceptable to use outside of that oppressed group. If girls want to say "*****", I could care less, but I get really annoyed when guys use it. If Black people want to say "nigga", all good, but White, Asian and Latino people shouldn't say it unless it's within a close group of friends that have given them permission.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

Lmao, no mames!! I haven't really noticed it but I'll keep an ear out... It's probably more common among recent immigrants than Chicanos. Regardless, it's not a word that I would use since a) I was born here and b) I'm a very light-skinned Mexican and it would kind of have racist connotations.

But yeah, I support the idea of reclaiming words, though I don't think they're acceptable to use outside of that oppressed group. If girls want to say "*****", I could care less, but I get really annoyed when guys use it. If Black people want to say "nigga", all good, but White, Asian and Latino people shouldn't say it unless it's within a close group of friends that have given them permission.

I get my skin tone from the Iberian peninsula (maybe a tad bit darker) and I have mexica facial features. I too am chicano, though I'm first generation born in the U.S.. But I use the word (mojado) at times.

[mikelepore]

It's not only the baggage. It's the fact that there's no underlying good in such references no matter how they are interepreted.

The word "faggot" came from the old days when homosexuals were burned at the stake. There's nothing useful in that derivation that people might want to reclaim.

"Nigger" is a mispronunciation of the Spanish word for "black." Even if racist connotations had never been associated with it, it would still make no more sense than calling white people "blankers", which is a mispronunciation of the Spanish word for "white" that I just made up.

The word "****" relays only one thought. A person who uses that word is saying that a woman is categorized as a vagina with a lot of other superfluous stuff surrounding it, namely, a person. That's why the word is used in the context of anger and bigotry: because the person who says it is charging, "You are a worthless example of a person, but you do have just one minimal aspect that is worthy of being mentioned, namely, the item that I'm now calling you." There's nothing in that etymology that is worth saving.

Let these horrible words go. Don't try to make anything new out of them. It took us many years to get to the point where it is now understood almost universally that such terms are badges of ignorance. Now that we are there, fine, leave it at that.

Progressive people, if you do say these words, then the next time a bigot say them, with the excuse that you said it first, you will have nothing to complain about.

[Black Dagger]

Progressive people, if you do say these words, then the next time a bigot say them, with the excuse that you said it first, you will have nothing to complain about.

Well that's the logic bigots use, sure - but that's because they conveniently ignore context ... so... what about context?

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

"Nigger" is a mispronunciation of the Spanish word for "black." Even if racist connotations had never been associated with it, it would still make no more sense than calling white people "blankers", which is a mispronunciation of the Spanish word for "white" that I just made up.


And the word "black" is offensive? Or is it just because the word is derived off spanish word roots as opposed to anglo word roots?

[mikelepore]

And the word "black" is offensive? Or is it just because the word is derived off spanish word roots as opposed to anglo word roots?

Are you asking me why I hate the word "nigger"? Historically, it was and is the preferred term of those who hate and want to lynch people. I can't imagine why a non-racist would feel compelled to say, "Oh, so that's the terminology used by a gang that hates and lynches people? Hey, let's adopt their terminology for our own use!" What's the point of doing that?

However, I don't like the terms "black" and "white" either. It's not difficult to speak scientifically, and note that all human beings on earth are various shades of brown. If someone wanted to paint their bedroom a darker brown and their living room lighter brown, would they go to the paint store and ask for some black and some white? Of course not. I don't know why the subject of skin pigmentation makes people suddenly incapable of correctly naming colors. The unscientific language perpetuates the myth that various people are "different" below that top 0.001 millimeter.

[Black Dagger]

I don't think 'science' is really a good source for language to describe people, not only is scientific language inherently 'behind the times', it has a very poor track record on social issues, and in terms of daily usage seems stilted, cold, alien and lacks history.

[Module]

Are you asking me why I hate the word "nigger"? Historically, it was and is the preferred term of those who hate and want to lynch people. I can't imagine why a non-racist would feel compelled to say, "Oh, so that's the terminology used by a gang that hates and lynches people? Hey, let's adopt their terminology for our own use!" What's the point of doing that?

However, I don't like the terms "black" and "white" either. It's not difficult to speak scientifically, and note that all human beings on earth are various shades of brown. If someone wanted to paint their bedroom a darker brown and their living room lighter brown, would they go to the paint store and ask for some black and some white? Of course not. I don't know why the subject of skin pigmentation makes people suddenly incapable of correctly naming colors. The unscientific language perpetuates the myth that various people are "different" below that top 0.001 millimeter.
Whilst I agreed with your earlier post, I think this must be just purposeful naievity because it's quite obvious that the terms 'black' and 'white' are not just relevant to a person's skin colour, but essentially like the term 'nigger' carry a whole heap of racist baggage. Of course they're not racial slurs but they're still terms used to divide people along racial lines. Being a 'dark enough shade of brown' to be considered black has the potential to put somebody in a totally different social position than if they were a light enough shade of brown to be considered white.
Of course racial classifications are unscientific, but to act like social groups defined by this unscientific concept don't exist or are no longer relevant is just ignorance, and that helps nobody.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

Are you asking me why I hate the word "nigger"? Historically, it was and is the preferred term of those who hate and want to lynch people. I can't imagine why a non-racist would feel compelled to say, "Oh, so that's the terminology used by a gang that hates and lynches people? Hey, let's adopt their terminology for our own use!" What's the point of doing that?

However, I don't like the terms "black" and "white" either. It's not difficult to speak scientifically, and note that all human beings on earth are various shades of brown. If someone wanted to paint their bedroom a darker brown and their living room lighter brown, would they go to the paint store and ask for some black and some white? Of course not. I don't know why the subject of skin pigmentation makes people suddenly incapable of correctly naming colors. The unscientific language perpetuates the myth that various people are "different" below that top 0.001 millimeter.

No I'm asking why the language of the word's origin had any relevance. What relevance does it have that it came from spanish roots?

[9]

I can't imagine why a non-racist would feel compelled to say, "Oh, so that's the terminology used by a gang that hates and lynches people? Hey, let's adopt their terminology for our own use!" What's the point of doing that?

These sorts of slurs are used by bigots as psychological weapons. As with any repeating assault, the victim will seek effective ways to defend him/herself from further attacks. That is the main purpose for "reclaiming" the slur - to sabotage the bigot's gun so when he comes to shoot you, it either doesn't fire or, better yet, it backfires in his face. Reclaiming a slur that is directed at you, and redefining it so that it no longer contains the intended venom, deprives a hateful person of a powerful weapon - that is the point. And, in my personal experience, it is a very effective strategy.

[mikelepore]

No I'm asking why the language of the word's origin had any relevance. What relevance does it have that it came from spanish roots?

I'm saying that people shouldn't use a word that they know is a mispronunciation of another word, mispronounced by others because of their ignorance. But "mispronunciation of" is a prepositional phrase that has to refer to an object. Do you want me to go out of my way to avoid indicating the object of a preposition? If an astronomer said "Pluto has been measured to be colder than some other thing", wouldn't have been better form to name the object that the prepositional phrase "colder than" refers to? Colder than what? Mispronunciation of what?

[Josef Balin]

I see, interesting.

While it's true that language is defined by use, words like "nigger" and "faggot" have so much negative baggage attached to them that it seems almost impossible to make it "our" word
While faggot arose out of homophobia, I don't think it's a word used mostly to oppress or even an offensive term to shout out anywhere in the world except for gay districts/areas with a reputation for homosexual culture. And I wouldn't say "faggot" is completely an inproper word (as compared to nigger, theres no such thing as a bad word and on a few occassions I'm sure it's proper/funny to say nigger over something else, but never in general conversation), it's pretty widely known to connotate "bad" when not specifically referring to a homosexual male.

And I think Louise Michael posted that **** is a bad word, and I'd just like to say it isn't because "bad words" is a ridiculous concept unless you're a child.

[Josef Balin]

Are you asking me why I hate the word "nigger"? Historically, it was and is the preferred term of those who hate and want to lynch people. I can't imagine why a non-racist would feel compelled to say, "Oh, so that's the terminology used by a gang that hates and lynches people? Hey, let's adopt their terminology for our own use!" What's the point of doing that?

However, I don't like the terms "black" and "white" either. It's not difficult to speak scientifically, and note that all human beings on earth are various shades of brown. If someone wanted to paint their bedroom a darker brown and their living room lighter brown, would they go to the paint store and ask for some black and some white? Of course not. I don't know why the subject of skin pigmentation makes people suddenly incapable of correctly naming colors. The unscientific language perpetuates the myth that various people are "different" below that top 0.001 millimeter.
What? All people on earth are shades of brown? Either no one ever taught you colors, you only know of the existence of the African, American, and Australian continents, or you took a decent point and took it to an absurd extreme.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

I'm saying that people shouldn't use a word that they know is a mispronunciation of another word, mispronounced by others because of their ignorance. But "mispronunciation of" is a prepositional phrase that has to refer to an object. Do you want me to go out of my way to avoid indicating the object of a preposition? If an astronomer said "Pluto has been measured to be colder than some other thing", wouldn't have been better form to name the object that the prepositional phrase "colder than" refers to? Colder than what? Mispronunciation of what?

You are aware that mispronunciations of words is how you get most modern languages. A good portion of Spanish words are derived from Latin. I'd venture to say that all language is perpetually evolving.

I really have mixed opinions on this as I do on many things though.

[Jazzratt]

What? All people on earth are shades of brown? Either no one ever taught you colors, you only know of the existence of the African, American, and Australian continents, or you took a decent point and took it to an absurd extreme.

I've never met a white preson who is actually white (I've seen albinos on television but that's as far as it gets). I suspect though "white" was selected as a descriptor because "pale yellowish-brown" is a bit unwieldy.