The Cathedral and the Bazaar

[Blackscare]

I started as an open source supporter long before I delved into straight up communism.

Learning about the vast importance of open source software and it's place in the war against information monopoly provided me with insight into other aspects of life. I started looking critically at human relationships, wage labor in particular, and realized I couldn't morally support the way our society is structured.

My exposure to and belief in the effectiveness of free collaboration probably had a lot to do with me winding up on the anarchist side of communism as well.


So my questions are, what experience do you have with the open source movement and what do you think of it in relation to broader communist theory?

What do you think of Richard Stallman? I happen to regard him as perhaps the greatest and most influential communist leader alive right now (though he may not know it :lol:). Stallman to me is almost a new incarnation of Marx for a modern era, fighting on the frontlines of social issues that never even existed in Marx's time. As we become a more advanced society, these issues will only evolve and grow in importance, and thus Stallman's ideas will become more important.

Also, have you ever read The Cathedral and the Bazaar by Eric S. Raymond? It is probably the most influential book within the open source movement, a sort of open sourcer manifesto :D It probably had the greatest overall impact on me of all the various communist writings I've read through so far, in spite of it's seemingly narrow subject matter.

Here's the link to the book (available free, of course)
http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/

[Q]

I started as an open source supporter long before I delved into straight up communism.
Ditto. I started using Linuxfor the first time in 2003, I only came into contact with a marxist organisation at the end of 2005.


Learning about the vast importance of open source software and it's place in the war against information monopoly provided me with insight into other aspects of life. I started looking critically at human relationships, wage labor in particular, and realized I couldn't morally support the way our society is structured.

My exposure to and belief in the effectiveness of free collaboration probably had a lot to do with me winding up on the anarchist side of communism as well.
I can see where you're coming from. I think that FLOSS (Free/Libre Open Source Software) is basically communism in a software sense.


So my questions are, what experience do you have with the open source movement and what do you think of it in relation to broader communist theory?
I was active for a time in the Gentoo community (a Linux distro) and visited FOSDEM in 2006 (or was it 2007?). Now I'm not so active anymore in the community, but still use open source software almost exclusively. I'm not a zealot in the use of FLOSS, but in a practical sense it is often the better choice around. For example, Nero has since a few years published a Linux version of its cd/dvd burning software, but it simply can't compete to K3b :lol:

I think that after the revolution and finally open source Windows, people will be like "wtf is this crap?!" and just ditch it into the dustbin of history, where it belongs.


What do you think of Richard Stallman? I happen to regard him as perhaps the greatest and most influential communist leader alive right now (though he may not know it :lol:).
He indeed is very influential. He did important work with setting up the GNU foundation in the 1980's, a foundation that is still used in Linux today (and without it Linux would be pretty useless as an operating system). His ideas are regarded as a bit extreme though by many more liberal open source advocates, but I think that his GPL license and Free Software Foundation (the legal framework around the GPL) sets the right tone in making software truly free.


Stallman to me is almost a new incarnation of Marx for a modern era, fighting on the frontlines of social issues that never even existed in Marx's time.
Marx:
http://janedark.com/Marx.jpg

Stallman:
http://www.fsfeurope.org/projects/gplv3/rms-20070401.jpeg

You may be right! :lol:


As we become a more advanced society, these issues will only evolve and grow in importance, and thus Stallman's ideas will become more important.
That is certainly not a given. In fact, there was a lot of controversy around this issue in the 1990's. The more "practical" open source advocates (read: those that accept the capitalist framework) disagreed with the ideological framework of Stallman and setup the Open Source movement (as opposed to Stallman's Free Software movement).

Some articles on this issue:
Why "Free Software" is better than "Open Source" (http://www.fsf.org/licensing/essays/free-software-for-freedom.html)
Why “Open Source” misses the point of Free Software (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.html)


Also, have you ever read The Cathedral and the Bazaar by Eric S. Raymond? It is probably the most influential book within the open source movement, a sort of open sourcer manifesto :D It probably had the greatest overall impact on me of all the various communist writings I've read through so far, in spite of it's seemingly narrow subject matter.

Here's the link to the book (available free, of course)
http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/
I've never read it myself, but do know the general gist of it. I should read it some day.

[cyu]

Stallman to me is almost a new incarnation of Marx for a modern era, fighting on the frontlines of social issues that never even existed in Marx's time.
Marx:
http://janedark.com/Marx.jpg

Stallman:
http://www.fsfeurope.org/projects/gplv3/rms-20070401.jpeg

You may be right! :lol:



LOL - one of the funniest posts I've seen here :thumbup:

[Cult of Reason]

Ironically enough, Eric S. Raymond is an AnCap.

[Q]

Ironically enough, Eric S. Raymond is an AnCap.

Seriously?! Wow, that is a big disappointment.

[Blackscare]

Really... yea that is pretty shitty.


:cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing::curs ing::cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing:: cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing::cursi ng::cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing::cursing:

[Blackscare]

That is certainly not a given. In fact, there was a lot of controversy around this issue in the 1990's. The more "practical" open source advocates (read: those that accept the capitalist framework) disagreed with the ideological framework of Stallman and setup the Open Source movement (as opposed to Stallman's Free Software movement).

Some articles on this issue:
Why "Free Software" is better than "Open Source" (http://www.fsf.org/licensing/essays/free-software-for-freedom.html)
Why “Open Source” misses the point of Free Software (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.html)


Well of course there will be division, but much of the controversy surrounding the FSF is that they take things "too far", I'm arguing that over time the more moderate capitol-friendly open sourcers will give way to the FSF as events unfold and validate what Stallman has been saying.