British Fascists who sell Fenian tunes...

[Holden Caulfield]

Given the BNP's longstanding antipathy to Irish republicanism, and to the IRA in particular, it is surprising to see them selling a CD (Cu Chulainn - Over an Hour of Irish Folk) featuring 'Back Home in Derry', by Bobby Sands.

The CD also includes 'The Fields of Athenry', 'The Foggy Dew', about the Easter Rising, and 'Only Our Rivers Run Free'.

Another CD, A Feast of Irish Folk, includes 'Grace', about the marriage immediately before execution of Joseph Plunkett, after the Easter Rising, and 'Gallipoli', lamenting the death of an Irishman fighting for England. Hardly the sort of ballads you'd associate with the BNP!

Curiously, the BNP don't stock CDs of loyalist music - there's not a rendition of 'The Sash' or 'The Famine Song' to be bought.

We wonder what BNP supporters, more associated with chants of 'no surrender to the IRA' than singing 'The Soldier's Song', will make of this. Excalibur manager Arthur Kemp may face some awkward questions in the weeks ahead.

www.antifa.org.uk (http://www.antifa.org.uk)

[brigadista]

sorry this is not very intellectual but ROFPMSL!!!!:lol:

[Dr Mindbender]

i dont think this was a mistake on the bnp's part actually.

Certain elements in the far right, especially in ireland have made efforts to appeal to beourgiose republicanism to sell their ideas to white working class catholics possibly in an effort to lead them away from the left.

[brigadista]

i dont think this was a mistake on the bnp's part actually.

Certain elements in the far right, especially in ireland have made efforts to appeal to beourgiose republicanism to sell their ideas to white working class catholics possibly in an effort to lead them away from the left.

i think you are correct here ..but the irony is great. hence my laughter :)

[PRC-UTE]

very strange, especially as british nationalists, it's suspected they were C18- not too long ago carried out violent attacks on a nationalist pub in the 6c of Ireland in cooperation with loyalists there. they slit a man's throat if I remember correctly

[Melbourne Lefty]

very strange, especially as british nationalists, it's suspected they were C18- not too long ago carried out violent attacks on a nationalist pub in the 6c of Ireland in cooperation with loyalists there. they slit a man's throat if I remember correctly


Yes well the BNP and Combat 18 have not got along for.... I dunno 15 years or so?:rolleyes:

The BNP has moved beyond Loyalism, if you check their website and goals they seek a reconcilliation [and eventual reunification] between Eire and the United Kingdom.

Also they want to appeal to Irish Immigrant workers in the north or England as well. Check out their website today [no I wont link] and see the stories about Everton, the Liverpool BNP have an Irish flag on their banner and proclaim "The british isles in one country".

Id say the BNP has radically reviewed its ideological views in this sector, after all did they ever gain anything out of being Orange?

[PRC-UTE]

Yes well the BNP and Combat 18 have not got along for.... I dunno 15 years or so?:rolleyes:

The BNP has moved beyond Loyalism, if you check their website and goals they seek a reconcilliation [and eventual reunification] between Eire and the United Kingdom.

Also they want to appeal to Irish Immigrant workers in the north or England as well. Check out their website today [no I wont link] and see the stories about Everton, the Liverpool BNP have an Irish flag on their banner and proclaim "The british isles in one country".

em, I only said they were suspected to be C18.

right, I know they'd like a reunification with Ireland, that's why it's odd they would promote republican ballads.



Id say the BNP has radically reviewed its ideological views in this sector, after all did they ever gain anything out of being Orange?

what other mass base is there for fascism in Ireland? atm, it's only the loyalists.

I think this would have more to do with appearing respectable and so keeping their distance from loyalist elements than ditching the orange. their long term goals are not incompatible with unionism.

[Dr Mindbender]

what other mass base is there for fascism in Ireland? atm, it's only the loyalists.

.

Au contrare.

As i've said, despite their near negligible size there have been neo-fascist groups operating in the republic that like to wrap themselves in the green white and orange.

Although i've lost the link, i once read on their blogs that they consider the loyalist lobby and orange order to be 'leftist-marxist-zionists' because of their stern support for Israel.

[PRC-UTE]

Au contrare.

As i've said, despite their near negligible size there have been neo-fascist groups operating in the republic that like to wrap themselves in the green white and orange.

Although i've lost the link, i once read on their blogs that they consider the loyalist lobby and orange order to be 'leftist-marxist-zionists' because of their stern support for Israel.

I said 'mass base'

fascist in the south are in tiny bands that are ignored- partially because their political ideology can't lay claim to the republican tradition. their biggest attempt in the form of the blueshirts was a complete flop.

[Devrim]

fascist in the south are in tiny bands that are ignored- partially because their political ideology can't lay claim to the republican tradition.

The BNP in the UK doesn't have a mass base either though it might have a few more adherents.

I don't find this move surprising at all. Most European fascist organisations have always supported Irish Republicanism seeing them as good nationalists. I think that the English fascists nationalism was in many ways particularly English with hangovers from the days of Empire rather than the modern European 'third positionist' argument for a 'Europe of a hundred flags'.

One would expect a more modern BNP to drop the Empire throwback politics.


what other mass base is there for fascism in Ireland? atm, it's only the loyalists.

I would imagine the same potential mass base as in any other country.


I think this would have more to do with appearing respectable and so keeping their distance from loyalist elements than ditching the orange. their long term goals are not incompatible with unionism.

I think that you can't really conceive of a far-right 'British' nationalism that isn't 'English'. I think that dumping connections with unionism is a smart move for them. They still aren't over their empire hangovers, and the idea of reunification reflects this. We will see how far they will go with this.

Devrim

[Melbourne Lefty]

I don't find this move surprising at all. Most European fascist organisations have always supported Irish Republicanism seeing them as good nationalists. I think that the English fascists nationalism was in many ways particularly English with hangovers from the days of Empire rather than the modern European 'third positionist' argument for a 'Europe of a hundred flags'.


yup, it certainly seems like thats the case.

Most neo-fash on the continent have supported republicanism. The BNP never will but a softening of its position as more and more of the "Nouvelle Droit" ideology sinks into them was inevitable.

[Holden Caulfield]

yup, it certainly seems like thats the case.

Most neo-fash on the continent have supported republicanism. The BNP never will but a softening of its position as more and more of the "Nouvelle Droit" ideology sinks into them was inevitable.

emphasis mine, but yeah I agree

[PRC-UTE]

I don't find this move surprising at all. Most European fascist organisations have always supported Irish Republicanism seeing them as good nationalists. I think that the English fascists nationalism was in many ways particularly English with hangovers from the days of Empire rather than the modern European 'third positionist' argument for a 'Europe of a hundred flags'.


no euro fascists support Irish Republicans in any concrete way, some of them do mistake them for nationalists you are correct about that. however, any that investigate are soon put off by republicanism's politics and sympathy for other anti imperialists.

[Devrim]

no euro fascists support Irish Republicans in any concrete way,

Well yes, but most Trotskyists don't support Irish Republicans in any meaningful way. I am not suggesting that there are any actual organisational connections here, but there are 'Euro-fascists' who 'support' Irish republicanism.


some of them do mistake them for nationalists you are correct about that.

An interesting choice of words, I said that the see them as nationalists.


however, any that investigate are soon put off by republicanism's politics and sympathy for other anti imperialists.

Except that there are 'Euro fascists' who actually support so-called 'anti-imperialists':


n Italy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italy), the Third Position was developed by Roberto Fiore (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roberto_Fiore), along with Gabriele Adinolfi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriele_Adinolfi) and Peppe Di Mitri (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Peppe_Di_Mitri&action=edit&redlink=1), in the tradition of Italian neo-fascism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-fascism). Third Position’s ideology is characterized by a militarist formulation, an extreme nationalism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationalism) looking favourably to national liberation movements (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_liberation_movements), support for racial separatism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racialism) and the adherence to a soldier style of life. In order to construct a cultural background for the ideology, Fiore looked to the ruralism of Julius Evola (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Evola) and sought to combine it with the desire for a cultural-spiritual revolution and the creation of a omul nou (new man) as called for by Corneliu Zelea Codreanu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corneliu_Zelea_Codreanu). He adopted some of the positions of the contemporary far right (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Far_right), notably the ethnopluralism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnopluralism) of Alain de Benoist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alain_de_Benoist) and the Europe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe)-wide appeal associated with such views as the Europe a Nation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe_a_Nation) campaign of Oswald Mosley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oswald_Mosley) (amongst others). Fiore was one of the founders of the Terza Posizione (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terza_Posizione) movement in 1979. Third Position ideas are now represented in Italy by New Force (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Force), led by Fiore.


Look at the Forza Nuova (http://www.forzanuova.org/) web page, scroll down and note the poster with the Palestinian flag on on the left hand side of the page (the caption says 'Listen to the Bombs on Gaza').

Devrim

[Melbourne Lefty]

no euro fascists support Irish Republicans in any concrete way, some of them do mistake them for nationalists you are correct about that. however, any that investigate are soon put off by republicanism's politics and sympathy for other anti imperialists.

Most european fascist/neo-fascist groups, especially the non parliamentary ones, would describe themselves as anti-imperialist and also firm supporters of Irish republicanism.

Just off the top of my head...

NPD
Autonome nationalisten [in Germany and elsewhere]
FN Italy as well as a host of smaller italian groups
Identitaires movement [france, francophone switzerland and Belgium]

Naturally Irish republicans have stayed away from these people with a very long stick, but mostly that doesnt bother them.

Neo-fascism looks inwards, its a defensive rather than imperialist ideology and as such applauds defensive action on the basis of race or ethnicity elsewhere.

This theory is why the BNP no says that white people had no right to be in Africa in the first place [but of course that also means that africans have no right to be in europe, get it?:rolleyes:].